Paul Wulff's hypothetical return to WSU?

[PeteTheChop]

There were obviously some rough spots from 2008 through 2011, but what would people here think of Paul Wulff coming back home to Washington State in a different role, say as a coordinator or director of football operations? His NFL experience with the 49ers and his stint as OC at South Florida would help, right?

Ran into a couple Coug diehards over the weekend who said they'd really like to see CPW back at his alma mater in some capacity if/when Mike Leach leaves Pullman. Don't know how widespread that support is at this time, but it does exist.

 

[dgibbons]

There were obviously some rough spots from 2008 through 2011, but what would people here think of Paul Wulff coming back home to Washington State in a different role, say as a coordinator or director of football operations? His NFL experience with the 49ers and his stint as OC at South Florida would help, right?

Ran into a couple Coug diehards over the weekend who said they'd really like to see CPW back at his alma mater in some capacity if/when Mike Leach leaves Pullman. Don't know how widespread that support is at this time, but it does exist.

No thanks.

 

[wsucoug51]

I'd be happy to let him buy me a beer at The Coug. It's the least he could do.

 

[wulffui]

No.

 

[wazzucougs96]

There were obviously some rough spots from 2008 through 2011, but what would people here think of Paul Wulff coming back home to Washington State in a different role, say as a coordinator or director of football operations? His NFL experience with the 49ers and his stint as OC at South Florida would help, right?

Ran into a couple Coug diehards over the weekend who said they'd really like to see CPW back at his alma mater in some capacity if/when Mike Leach leaves Pullman. Don't know how widespread that support is at this time, but it does exist.

Jeezus tap dancing Christ. It's like Cougs want to be a laughingstock.

 

[BigCat97]

There were obviously some rough spots from 2008 through 2011, but what would people here think of Paul Wulff coming back home to Washington State in a different role, say as a coordinator or director of football operations? His NFL experience with the 49ers and his stint as OC at South Florida would help, right?

Ran into a couple Coug diehards over the weekend who said they'd really like to see CPW back at his alma mater in some capacity if/when Mike Leach leaves Pullman. Don't know how widespread that support is at this time, but it does exist.

Bro, that's a clown question

 

[Coug95man2]

There were obviously some rough spots from 2008 through 2011, but what would people here think of Paul Wulff coming back home to Washington State in a different role, say as a coordinator or director of football operations? His NFL experience with the 49ers and his stint as OC at South Florida would help, right?

Ran into a couple Coug diehards over the weekend who said they'd really like to see CPW back at his alma mater in some capacity if/when Mike Leach leaves Pullman. Don't know how widespread that support is at this time, but it does exist.

Jeezus tap dancing Christ. It's like Cougs want to be a laughingstock.

Holy mannequin love!!!?

Bumplestisquin!!?

Holy crapper!!!

For the love of Pete!!!! (kinda lame)

Just trying to beat out 96 for the best exclamation… I know… I failed. "tap dancing" thats awesome...

 

[spongebob11]

Well...he could eat some Waseem gumbo and blow up the opposing teams bathroom during halftime.

That one never gets old.

At the end of the day, I don't hate the guy like everyone else here does. He was a Coug..and I don't think he was ready to be a head coach at the Pac 12 level.

 

[wulffui]

Well...he could eat some Waseem gumbo and blow up the opposing teams bathroom during halftime.

That one never gets old.

At the end of the day, I don't hate the guy like everyone else here does. He was a Coug..and I don't think he was ready to be a head coach at the Pac 12 level.

But do you want him back as a contributing member of your football program?

Odd, I've never heard anyone say they hate Wulff. Think he's a catastrophic failure as a football coach, that's a given... But not the personal hate you describe.

 

[wazzucougs96]

Bro, that's a clown question

Kudos the correct answer, if if it was slightly misquoted.

 

[PeteTheChop]

I know some people think Paul Wulff was an unmitigated disaster, but a long-time Brand X subscriber insists Mike Leach will go down as THE WORST coach in WSU history if the Cougars end up with four wins or less in 2015.

I don't have a good guess on how many games Leach will will this fall.

But ... Wulff hasn't been gone five years and there are those at another WSU fan site who proclaim a bad season in 2015 means Leach's coaching legacy in Pullman would be worse than that of his predecessor.

I don't think it's too big of a reach to say there is a segment of fans who'd like to see CPW get another chance at WSU in some capacity.

 

[wulffui]

I know some people think Paul Wulff was an unmitigated disaster, but a long-time Brand X subscriber insists Mike Leach will go down as THE WORST coach in WSU history if the Cougars end up with four wins or less in 2015.

I don't have a good guess on how many games Leach will will this fall.

But ... Wulff hasn't been gone five years and there are those at another WSU fan site who proclaim a bad season in 2015 means Leach's coaching legacy in Pullman would be worse than that of his predecessor.

I don't think it's too big of a reach to say there is a segment of fans who'd like to see CPW get another chance at WSU in some capacity.

Well, if there's a Flat Earth Society in the US, there's probably one in Canada, too.

 

[spongebob11]

But do you want him back as a contributing member of your football program?

Odd, I've never heard anyone say they hate Wulff. Think he's a catastrophic failure as a football coach, that's a given... But not the personal hate you describe.

Well, maybe 10 yrs down the road if he has had success, then maybe. I don't think its a good idea to have the previous head coach around.

As to the hate, you must not be paying ATTN.

 

[Coug95man2]

Well, maybe 10 yrs down the road if he has had success, then maybe. I don't think its a good idea to have the previous head coach around.

As to the hate, you must not be paying ATTN.

Naw. Come on Sponge. If there is anyone that has shown literal hate towards him, it was met with silence. Not support.

But with the continual arguing, I can see how the passion behind it all could be misconstrued as such?

 

[wazzucougs96]

I know some people think Paul Wulff was an unmitigated disaster, but a long-time Brand X subscriber insists Mike Leach will go down as THE WORST coach in WSU history if the Cougars end up with four wins or less in 2015.

I don't have a good guess on how many games Leach will will this fall.

But ... Wulff hasn't been gone five years and there are those at another WSU fan site who proclaim a bad season in 2015 means Leach's coaching legacy in Pullman would be worse than that of his predecessor.

I don't think it's too big of a reach to say there is a segment of fans who'd like to see CPW get another chance at WSU in some capacity.

Now you are just trolling. Piss off.

 

[Coug95man2]

I know some people think Paul Wulff was an unmitigated disaster, but a long-time Brand X subscriber insists Mike Leach will go down as THE WORST coach in WSU history if the Cougars end up with four wins or less in 2015.

I don't have a good guess on how many games Leach will will this fall.

But ... Wulff hasn't been gone five years and there are those at another WSU fan site who proclaim a bad season in 2015 means Leach's coaching legacy in Pullman would be worse than that of his predecessor.

I don't think it's too big of a reach to say there is a segment of fans who'd like to see CPW get another chance at WSU in some capacity.

Sounds like a "gotcha" kinda situation. CML doesn't do well, they look like they know what they're talking about. If CML does well, he can always fall back on "Well I'm so glad I was wrong!" schtick. But the starting point for this kind of argument is they don't like him to start with.

As far as CML's legacy being worse than his predecessor, pulease. And here's with all due respect to Ed and Sponge, CPW was, by all standards, the worst 4 year coach in NCAA history. Those are hard fact numbers. CML has already surpassed him. So emotionally, to that poster, fine. Reality, no way.

And I'll also use the great divide you see on this site and others as proof… CPW is a lightning rod. Like him or not, doesn't matter. He's a lightning rod. He'll never be hired at WSU again strictly because of this. Factor in his record at WSU and it's just a done deal…

This poster is just wishing, for whatever reason. Not reality, there.

 

[Coug95man2]

There were obviously some rough spots from 2008 through 2011, but what would people here think of Paul Wulff coming back home to Washington State in a different role, say as a coordinator or director of football operations? His NFL experience with the 49ers and his stint as OC at South Florida would help, right?

Ran into a couple Coug diehards over the weekend who said they'd really like to see CPW back at his alma mater in some capacity if/when Mike Leach leaves Pullman. Don't know how widespread that support is at this time, but it does exist.

I just noticed this… "Rough spots" was Chops description of 2008 and 2009… that's funny stuff… among other funny stuff on this…

 

[spongebob11]

Sounds like a "gotcha" kinda situation. CML doesn't do well, they look like they know what they're talking about. If CML does well, he can always fall back on "Well I'm so glad I was wrong!" schtick. But the starting point for this kind of argument is they don't like him to start with.

As far as CML's legacy being worse than his predecessor, pulease. And here's with all due respect to Ed and Sponge, CPW was, by all standards, the worst 4 year coach in NCAA history. Those are hard fact numbers. CML has already surpassed him. So emotionally, to that poster, fine. Reality, no way.

And I'll also use the great divide you see on this site and others as proof… CPW is a lightning rod. Like him or not, doesn't matter. He's a lightning rod. He'll never be hired at WSU again strictly because of this. Factor in his record at WSU and it's just a done deal…

This poster is just wishing, for whatever reason. Not reality, there.

Not sure why you say all due respect to Sponge..I wanted him gone. The playcalling drove me nuts. I simply defend against idiotic statements such as he ruined Gibson etc.

If you remember Go To Guys interview with Calabro when the subject of retaining Wulff came up, his response was my response.

 

[wulffui]

I simply defend against idiotic statements such as he ruined Gibson etc.

Why? Why do you NEED to defend a failure?

 

[wazzubruce]

Chops is just a udump imposter trolling, trying to stir up trouble. This initial post cannot be taken seriously.

Basically it's just crap.

 

[YakiCoug]

Sounds like a "gotcha" kinda situation. CML doesn't do well, they look like they know what they're talking about. If CML does well, he can always fall back on "Well I'm so glad I was wrong!" schtick. But the starting point for this kind of argument is they don't like him to start with.

As far as CML's legacy being worse than his predecessor, pulease. And here's with all due respect to Ed and Sponge, CPW was, by all standards, the worst 4 year coach in NCAA history. Those are hard fact numbers. CML has already surpassed him. So emotionally, to that poster, fine. Reality, no way.

And I'll also use the great divide you see on this site and others as proof… CPW is a lightning rod. Like him or not, doesn't matter. He's a lightning rod. He'll never be hired at WSU again strictly because of this. Factor in his record at WSU and it's just a done deal…

This poster is just wishing, for whatever reason. Not reality, there.

If WSU has a good season, say 8-9 wins, here's what I predict the Paulie Annas/aPaulogists will spew forth: "Well, it's only because it was a down year: no Mariota at Oregon; UW had no QB, OL, and lost too many people on defense; the Beavers had a new coach, lost Mannion; UCLA lost Hundley; USC lost too many stars; ASU lost Kelley, its best WR"... and on and on. Count on it.

 

[wulffui]

If WSU has a good season, say 8-9 wins, here's what I predict the Paulie Annas/aPaulogists will spew forth: "Well, it's only because it was a down year: no Mariota at Oregon; UW had no QB, OL, and lost too many people on defense; the Beavers had a new coach, lost Mannion; UCLA lost Hundley; USC lost too many stars; ASU lost Kelley, its best WR"... and on and on. Count on it.

I just assume when we win eight, they'll bitch about about the other four.

 

[Cougatron]

Those people that want Paul Wulff back are the people that want to help their loser brother get a job.

Just because he was a Coug he got the job, and just like any job search, hiring based on emotional feelings is bad business.

Let's evaluate him based on his credentials alone.

Was a BCS HC at only 1 destination 9-40 record fired for fielding some of the worst teams n the country/recruiting classes ranking as some of the worst.
Was some non real coaching assistant for the 49ers
Was a OC at USF for 1 year fired after posting some the worst offensive numbers in the country.
Now is the OC for the Team USA HS All star game.

Look if Harbaugh didn't get him at Michigan why should we?

Cause he's a Coug?.... No. Just because you are a coug doesn't mean you are the best for the job at hand. It would be great, but just hiring because they are a coug is stupid.

 

[CougEd]

There were obviously some rough spots from 2008 through 2011, but what would people here think of Paul Wulff coming back home to Washington State in a different role, say as a coordinator or director of football operations? His NFL experience with the 49ers and his stint as OC at South Florida would help, right?

Ran into a couple Coug diehards over the weekend who said they'd really like to see CPW back at his alma mater in some capacity if/when Mike Leach leaves Pullman. Don't know how widespread that support is at this time, but it does exist.

It's a been there done that on both sides. Nothing would be gained. Wulff needs to hook on with someone like Bone did at Montana. Wulff is a coach. He can't serve in a the athletic department even if he left on teh best of terms with Moos. It is probably why it is a bad idea to coach your alma mater. Rick N and Karl Dorrell both coached at UCLA and nothing good came from it. Eric Bienemy at CU. Not sure there is a win win season. But there is nothing good that would come from it.

 

[longtimecoug]

There were obviously some rough spots from 2008 through 2011, but what would people here think of Paul Wulff coming back home to Washington State in a different role, say as a coordinator or director of football operations? His NFL experience with the 49ers and his stint as OC at South Florida would help, right?

Ran into a couple Coug diehards over the weekend who said they'd really like to see CPW back at his alma mater in some capacity if/when Mike Leach leaves Pullman. Don't know how widespread that support is at this time, but it does exist.

maybe there is a janitor job open

 

[MikeFingLeach]

How could we afford Wulff's massive Team USA buyout?

 

[dgibbons]

maybe there is a janitor job open

No thanks.

 

[Coug1990]

maybe there is a janitor job open

Are you nuts? Heck no. He would blame the previous janitor for the mess he left behind. He would tell everyone that he is cleaning better than anyone has ever cleaned before. After four years, he would be fired and leave a worse mess than what he had when he began. On the way out, he would kick the cleaning bucket over spilling dirty soapy water everywhere and proclaim that "WSU had lost it's innocence".

 

[425cougfan]

Amazed anyone is taking this seriously. Obvious UW troll.

 

[425cougfan]

If WSU has a good season, say 8-9 wins, here's what I predict the Paulie Annas/aPaulogists will spew forth: "Well, it's only because it was a down year: no Mariota at Oregon; UW had no QB, OL, and lost too many people on defense; the Beavers had a new coach, lost Mannion; UCLA lost Hundley; USC lost too many stars; ASU lost Kelley, its best WR"... and on and on. Count on it.

Agreed. They'll also say these things:

1. This is what we should be expecting in year 4.
2. Paul Wulff could have done the same thing if he was paid Leach's salary, had his budget for assistants, and had the facilities Leach has.

If Leach fails, they'll love it. If he's mediocre, they'll love it. If he succeeds, they'll make excuses and claim Wulff could have done the same thing, either straight up or when graded on a curve (i.e., if one imagines Wulff in WSU's current situation ... disregarding, of course, facilities and other resources for everyone in the conference improving).

 

[Cougsocal]

I know some people think Paul Wulff was an unmitigated disaster, but a long-time Brand X subscriber insists Mike Leach will go down as THE WORST coach in WSU history if the Cougars end up with four wins or less in 2015.

I don't have a good guess on how many games Leach will will this fall.

But ... Wulff hasn't been gone five years and there are those at another WSU fan site who proclaim a bad season in 2015 means Leach's coaching legacy in Pullman would be worse than that of his predecessor.

I don't think it's too big of a reach to say there is a segment of fans who'd like to see CPW get another chance at WSU in some capacity.

Let's face facts. It would be extraordinarly difficult to go down as a worse coach than Paul Wulff. Wulff maybe the worst coach to have ever walked the conference sidelines. He turned a mediocre team into the worst Cougar team ever in one off season, for christ sake.

However, if Leach continues to flounder Bill Moos will likely go down as the Paul Wulff of ADs. Why? Because he will have been handed checks totalling more than 200 million, spent 95% of it on football and its infrastructure, and accomplished diddly squat.

Leach will only be seen as one of the litany of coaches who were unable to turn chicken shite into chicken salad. Moos however, will be seen by the faithful as the idiot as squandering our TV revenue dividend.

 

[Coug95man2]

Let's face facts. It would be extraordinarly difficult to go down as a worse coach than Paul Wulff. Wulff maybe the worst coach to have ever walked the conference sidelines. He turned a mediocre team into the worst Cougar team ever in one off season, for christ sake.

However, if Leach continues to flounder Bill Moos will likely go down as the Paul Wulff of ADs. Why? Because he will have been handed checks totalling more than 200 million, spent 95% of it on football and its infrastructure, and accomplished diddly squat.

Leach will only be seen as one of the litany of coaches who were unable to turn chicken shite into chicken salad. Moos however, will be seen by the faithful as the idiot as squandering our TV revenue dividend.

Interesting take. With hindsight, what should Moos be doing, or have done, differently to avoid this perception of failure?

 

[chinookpirate]

Agreed. They'll also say these things:

1. This is what we should be expecting in year 4.
2. Paul Wulff could have done the same thing if he was paid Leach's salary, had his budget for assistants, and had the facilities Leach has.

If Leach fails, they'll love it. If he's mediocre, they'll love it. If he succeeds, they'll make excuses and claim Wulff could have done the same thing, either straight up or when graded on a curve (i.e., if one imagines Wulff in WSU's current situation ... disregarding, of course, facilities and other resources for everyone in the conference improving).

If Leach wins 8 games this year... beating Vegas by three games... accomplishing what few other football teams in WSU history have done... Leach will have proven concept. Cougar fans will respond in kind.

To think otherwise is foolish, in this Cougs opinion

 

[CrimsonWazzu]

Pete's troll game is strong to quite strong.

 

[wazzubruce]

Pete's a troll.... a dolt with 19 posts..... I'm LOL. Idiot.

 

[Cougsocal]

Interesting take. With hindsight, what should Moos be doing, or have done, differently to avoid this perception of failure?

If Leach wins 10 games in year 5, Moos will be seen as a sage. But by putting all his eggs in one basket, Moos does not have a real fallback position if the Leach experiment fails. What should Moos have done? -- spread the wealth around some. It would have been a hedge in the event that the football tide doesn't float all ships, as he professed. It was a gutsy gutsy move on his part. And who knows, Ernie may prove to be a miracle worker (I'm not holding my breath). But right now WSU athletics is at its lowest ebb in my memory. (Is there a less competitive major college sport program out there?) We either start heading up soon, or Moos will be blamed, particularly in light of the $200 credit line he has given.

 

[dgibbons]

If Leach wins 10 games in year 5, Moos will be seen as a sage. But by putting all his eggs in one basket, Moos does not have a real fallback position if the Leach experiment fails. What should Moos have done? -- spread the wealth around some. It would have been a hedge in the event that the football tide doesn't float all ships, as he professed. It was a gutsy gutsy move on his part. And who knows, Ernie may prove to be a miracle worker (I'm not holding my breath). But right now WSU athletics is at its lowest ebb in my memory. (Is there a less competitive major college sport program out there?) We either start heading up soon, or Moos will be blamed, particularly in light of the $200 credit line he has given.

I don't see it as gutsy. I see it as the only move he could make. Sterk pinching pennies wasn't working. The department was running at a deficit before Moos took over.

 

[Coug1990]

If Leach wins 10 games in year 5, Moos will be seen as a sage. But by putting all his eggs in one basket, Moos does not have a real fallback position if the Leach experiment fails. What should Moos have done? -- spread the wealth around some. It would have been a hedge in the event that the football tide doesn't float all ships, as he professed. It was a gutsy gutsy move on his part. And who knows, Ernie may prove to be a miracle worker (I'm not holding my breath). But right now WSU athletics is at its lowest ebb in my memory. (Is there a less competitive major college sport program out there?) We either start heading up soon, or Moos will be blamed, particularly in light of the $200 credit line he has given.

There is always blame no matter what. People always like to take credit and blame others. I don't think it was gutsy move at all. It was the smart move. Only one sport really drives revenue at WSU and that is football. It is like the old saying, "Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day, teach a man to fish and he eats for a lifetime".

Moos has already invested in the infrastructure of the football program, soccer program (with more to do this summer) and the basketball program (with also more to do this summer).

The athletic program was rotting from the inside. Moos has already improved the coaches for football, basketball, track, and swimming. Probably volleyball and baseball as well.

 

[425cougfan]

I don't see it as gutsy. I see it as the only move he could make. Sterk pinching pennies wasn't working. The department was running at a deficit before Moos took over.

1. The old way of pinching pennies just wasn't tenable in the new Power 5 environment. With the money flowing into the conference--albeit, perhaps unsurprisingly, less than anticipated back when the conference secured the current media deal and expanded to 12 schools--we've seen huge steps up in facilities and other program resources (e.g., recruiting budgets), and in the capabilities/resumes of opposing coaches, at nearly all schools. We couldn't have tried to move forward as the only member of the conference without appropriate facilities and with the "old" Martin Stadium.

It just wouldn't have been tolerated for long, and the program would have had no shot at succeeding. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if Scott, hired in 2010, had some off-the-record conversations with Moos in which he said, or at least strongly implied, that WSU needed to make the Martin Stadium improvements (approved by the BOR in 2011) and/or the FOB (approved in late 2012) in order to make sure its Pac-12 standing was secure.

(And no, I'm not saying there's any realistic concern about WSU's conference standing now, nor will there be in the foreseeable future. Tradition and WSU's status as a legit research university cut strongly in favor of it being maintained, and it making the investments it has made in its athletics programs has sealed the deal.)

2. Moos' investment in Leach is highly "illiquid," if you will. Let's say that Leach doesn't work out ... there are three or four more 3-9 or 4-8 seasons and Moos has no choice but to can him. I don't think you can indict Moos' entire tenure as an AD because he made a hire (lauded as a home run at the time, particularly to a destination that was particularly unattractive at the time) that ultimately didn't work out. Other than going back in time and not hiring a guy who had a ton of qualifications on paper, and seemed to be a good fit for various reasons, what would you have Moos do differently with regard to the football program? Leach's success (or lack thereof) will have a significant impact on how Moos' tenure is viewed, but I don't think it is the only thing that matters. I also don't know what else Moos could, or should, have done differently, should Leach ultimately not work out.

 

[YakiCoug]

1. The old way of pinching pennies just wasn't tenable in the new Power 5 environment. With the money flowing into the conference--albeit, perhaps unsurprisingly, less than anticipated back when the conference secured the current media deal and expanded to 12 schools--we've seen huge steps up in facilities and other program resources (e.g., recruiting budgets), and in the capabilities/resumes of opposing coaches, at nearly all schools. We couldn't have tried to move forward as the only member of the conference without appropriate facilities and with the "old" Martin Stadium.

It just wouldn't have been tolerated for long, and the program would have had no shot at succeeding. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if Scott, hired in 2010, had some off-the-record conversations with Moos in which he said, or at least strongly implied, that WSU needed to make the Martin Stadium improvements (approved by the BOR in 2011) and/or the FOB (approved in late 2012) in order to make sure its Pac-12 standing was secure.

(And no, I'm not saying there's any realistic concern about WSU's conference standing now, nor will there be in the foreseeable future. Tradition and WSU's status as a legit research university cut strongly in favor of it being maintained, and it making the investments it has made in its athletics programs has sealed the deal.)

2. Moos' investment in Leach is highly "illiquid," if you will. Let's say that Leach doesn't work out ... there are three or four more 3-9 or 4-8 seasons and Moos has no choice but to can him. I don't think you can indict Moos' entire tenure as an AD because he made a hire (lauded as a home run at the time, particularly to a destination that was particularly unattractive at the time) that ultimately didn't work out. Other than going back in time and not hiring a guy who had a ton of qualifications on paper, and seemed to be a good fit for various reasons, what would you have Moos do differently with regard to the football program? Leach's success (or lack thereof) will have a significant impact on how Moos' tenure is viewed, but I don't think it is the only thing that matters. I also don't know what else Moos could, or should, have done differently, should Leach ultimately not work out.

Guess I'd have to double check, but I recall the most recent figures released indicated that WSU is getting $21 million in the current payout, and that seems to be very close to the original projections.