Another curious Rolo decision RE: kick returns

[ttowncoug]

Word is he wanted to give Harris "a rest" (yet Harris was disappointed) to give Hobert a shot.

Rolo dismissed the decision as "it's not like he's not going to play their again..."

Best man in practice earns the starting spot.

Competition always.

Gonna lose the culture Leach built REALLY quick if they aren't sticking to the script.

I'm not a fan of this.....

 

[etowncoug]

If Harris needs a breather, it should be taken on offense. This is basic stuff. Harris can impact the game more with a return than he can running his routes plus it gives Hobert much needed reps which helps should he get forced into a larger role.

The way playing time gets handed out on offense is atrocious. We aren't developing any depth. Same 11 players. Game over after the first quarter? Let's leave those same starters in to take every snap until the 4th quarter. Then we'll rotate in a few backups every couple of snaps. Clay Markoff was the only non starter to be targeted.

 

[BiggsCoug]

Harris is a pro. He needs all the film he can get. Playing special teams is in his future at the next level.

I’d be mad too if my reps were cut to take a breather.

I understand the argument that if you’re getting smoked in the first quarter it’s time to rotate some guys in. I also understand the idea that if your starters are getting smoked there is value is playing them so they get better. Unless it was a close contest between the starter and the backup, leave the starter in. He needs the reps.

 

[fingerdisco]

If Harris needs a breather, it should be taken on offense. This is basic stuff. Harris can impact the game more with a return than he can running his routes plus it gives Hobert much needed reps which helps should he get forced into a larger role.

The way playing time gets handed out on offense is atrocious. We aren't developing any depth. Same 11 players. Game over after the first quarter? Let's leave those same starters in to take every snap until the 4th quarter. Then we'll rotate in a few backups every couple of snaps. Clay Markoff was the only non starter to be targeted.

So take one of our most productive receivers off the field to rest him for what amounts to less than a handful of touches?

The new kicking rule has taken away the big play on the kickoff for the most part, but we should be risking disrupting a drive and turning the ball over to the opponent on downs so our receiver/kickoff returner can a) take a touchback or b) bring it out to the 25? And then you throw in probability of injury on returns...

 

[CougPatrol]

This is an insignificant issue, imo.

 

[fingerdisco]

This is an insignificant issue, imo.

Exactly. Nitpicking for nitpicking's sake.

 

[etowncoug]

So take one of our most productive receivers off the field to rest him for what amounts to less than a handful of touches?

The new kicking rule has taken away the big play on the kickoff for the most part, but we should be risking disrupting a drive and turning the ball over to the opponent on downs so our receiver/kickoff returner can a) take a touchback or b) bring it out to the 25? And then you throw in probability of injury on returns...

All I said is if he needs a rest, it should be on offense. He's one of five options offensively. Taking him out on special teams is crazy because he can and has popped enough big returns in two years to demonstrate his value. If the opponent boots it out of the end zone, that doesn't put any strain on the kid. If he does return it and we give him a couple of plays off, he can still be out on the field for 3rd or 4th down. I just think the offense is better served with the superior field position Harris likely gets over Hobert.

 

[COUGinNCW]

I doubt Harris needs a rest but obviously Rolo would have a better idea than me. The offense is running down the play clock on most snaps and not running at blurr pace.
Harris may be more of a weapon than Borgi in my opinion from a return, catch and run the ball perspective. I know that’s heresay but the kid can play. Get him the rock!

 

[Coug90]

This is an insignificant issue, imo.

NFL teams fill roster spots on their much smaller rosters with guys who can return kicks and contribute little elsewhere. This is extremely important not only for big play possibilities but the difference in field position of starting at the 12 vs starting at the 30 with an inexperienced vs a seasoned guy.
I agree Rolos decision was curious here and based on the results was a bad decision.

 

[Glad Cougar]

The Super Bowl champs have perhaps the best return man in the NFL yet he doesn't get the chance to return kicks anymore because he's too valuable as an every down receiver. I have no doubt Tyreek Hill would enjoy taking punts and kickoffs, and no doubt he would be a threat every time he touched the ball on returns. But if he gets hurt running back a punt or kickoff, the Chiefs have just lost a great receiver as well.


Glad Cougar

 

[Cougsocal]

If Harris was kicking arse and taking names, I'd been concerned, but his longest return of the year thus far is 21 yards, 8 yards less than he averaged in 2018. I just don't see the same KO guy out there this year. If you are no longer fearless, you aren't a good KO man, end of story.

 

[spongeandshoot]

Would people rather continue the sub pattern last yr where Travell was our 4th or 5th option on offense?

 

[Coug90]

If Harris was kicking arse and taking names, I'd been concerned, but his longest return of the year thus far is 21 yards, 8 yards less than he averaged in 2018. I just don't see the same KO guy out there this year. If you are no longer fearless, you aren't a good KO man, end of story.

The blocking doesn’t appear to be stellar either so there’s that. Not really surprising considering the trickle down to special teams of having 4-5 guys starting on defense who wouldn’t be. There’s probably several guys on ST who wouldn’t be on the field at all.

But...that’s where it’s important to have a guy with some experience not trying to take a kick out 2 yards deep and running into a sea of the wrong jersey at the 10.

 

[etowncoug]

If Harris was kicking arse and taking names, I'd been concerned, but his longest return of the year thus far is 21 yards, 8 yards less than he averaged in 2018. I just don't see the same KO guy out there this year. If you are no longer fearless, you aren't a good KO man, end of story.

Meh. It's a sample size of 5 returns. He finds a crease on his next return and houses it from 95 yds out and his average is way up again. He has the potential to do things Hobert just doesn't and should be returning kicks. If he needs a break to manage workload there are other plays to have him take off.

 

[dgibbons]

Would people rather continue the sub pattern last yr where Travell was our 4th or 5th option on offense?

Well, comparing last year to this year is kinda dumb. Patmon, Winston, Martin and Arconado are gone.

 

[dgibbons]

Meh. It's a sample size of 5 returns. He finds a crease on his next return and houses it from 95 yds out and his average is way up again. He has the potential to do things Hobert just doesn't and should be returning kicks. If he needs a break to manage workload there are other plays to have him take off.

Or even out to the 40 or 50 it would boost his average. If it's all about average.

 

[Brent H.]

If Rolovich sucks, he'll get fired. And last I check Leach left us, we didn't fire him. A school like Wazzu will be limited on who we hire because we have more keyboard cowboys than donors.

Rolovich was our best choice, we weren't going hire Harsin, we weren't going to hire Grinch. My choice was Brent Brennan, but no way WSU could hire a dude that won 8 games in 3 years at SJSU with all these keyboard cowboys we have. It appears that I was right because he's a stud and won't be at SJSU much longer. Rolovich won 18 games at Hawaii and took over a decimated program. The hire made sense, but we have about of people that just can't accept that their girlfriend broke up with them.

 

[Cougsocal]

Meh. It's a sample size of 5 returns. He finds a crease on his next return and houses it from 95 yds out and his average is way up again. He has the potential to do things Hobert just doesn't and should be returning kicks. If he needs a break to manage workload there are other plays to have him take off.

In this day and age returners decide when to run and when to take it at the 25. So we can assume those 5 attempts were returns Harris thought were opportunities to start beyond the 25, right? And he failed to make to the 25 on 5 of 5 attempts, right? Prior to this year Harris had 58 return attempts and averaged 25.5 yards per, i.e. less perceived opportunities and 9 yards less per attempt, this year. And you bitching because Rolo decided to shake things up, right?

Well, maybe the coaching staff, after reviewing the game film, came to believe that Harris could be playing better on kick team? Players not playing to their perceived potential are frequently given "rest" in football.

 

[spongeandshoot]

Well, comparing last year to this year is kinda dumb. Patmon, Winston, Martin and Arconado are gone.

Yeah, but the model was the same, Rotate the receivers...let everyone get touches.

 

[Stretch 74]

In this day and age returners decide when to run and when to take it at the 25. So we can assume those 5 attempts were returns Harris thought were opportunities to start beyond the 25, right? And he failed to make to the 25 on 5 of 5 attempts, right? Prior to this year Harris had 58 return attempts and averaged 25.5 yards per, i.e. less perceived opportunities and 9 yards less per attempt, this year. And you bitching because Rolo decided to shake things up, right?

Well, maybe the coaching staff, after reviewing the game film, came to believe that Harris could be playing better on kick team? Players not playing to their perceived potential are frequently given "rest" in football.

*************************

Without having the opportunity to talk directly to Harris or Rolo, those of us hanging around here won't know what's going on, why Harris was not returning the kicks. That's just a fact, so we get to guess and speculate. And I am thinking that perhaps he was trying hard to make a big play to spark up the team and thus returned a kick or two that he shouldn't have. And that a big reason he should not have returned those kicks is due to poor blocking on the returns, with young and inexperienced guys. If that is indeed the case then not having Harris continue returning kickoffs makes some sense, right? And if so, let's hope that Hobert learns quickly to let the kick go or call a fair catch and start from the 25 yard line.

 

[WASH ST A&M FAN]

Yeah, but the model was the same, Rotate the receivers...let everyone get touches.

Having to prepare for 8-10 guys with different skill-sets catching a pass all over the field is a hellava harder to prep for vs. 2 guys.

 

[spongeandshoot]

Having to prepare for 8-10 guys with different skill-sets catching a pass all over the field is a hellava harder to prep for vs. 2 guys.

So would you like to rotate Bell and Harris out of the lineup?

 

[cr8zyncalif]

I prefer to view this whole thing through the lens that Hobert must have been showing good things in order to get this opportunity. And I am happy about that.

Let the competition continue.

 

[etowncoug]

So would you like to rotate Bell and Harris out of the lineup?

I don't think they are so good they should be playing every snap. The more they play the more you risk injury and you aren't developing depth to replace them should they get hurt. It's a recipe for losing in November.

I think you can get away with riding four WR's in the Mountain West. They don't hit as hard and you have a few complete creampuffs on the schedule each year. Rolo will eventually figure out he'll need more depth to survive a conference schedule. He's smart enough to adjust. Come to think of it, most of my frustrations with Rolovich will work themselves out when he realizes he's not competing against the MWest any more. He'll recruit differently. He'll stop going for 2 in the first quarter. He'll stop with the onside kick attempts.

 

[roses04]

If the returner would have called a fair catch each time, average starting field position would have been better. With the kicking length of most kickers, and fair catch/25 yard line rule, seems like 80-90% of the returns have been eliminated. Then if you do get a decent return there is about a 38% chance of a penalty, that puts your team inside the 20. Just fair catch the damn thing, you’ll be better off a vast majority of the time.

 

[cr8zyncalif]

If the returner would have called a fair catch each time, average starting field position would have been better. With the kicking length of most kickers, and fair catch/25 yard line rule, seems like 80-90% of the returns have been eliminated. Then if you do get a decent return there is about a 38% chance of a penalty, that puts your team inside the 20. Just fair catch the damn thing, you’ll be better off a vast majority of the time.

And this is not just about receiving; the same logic applies to kicking. Dropping the kick right on the goal line, so it will be returned, rather than putting it so deep in the end zone that the choice to down the ball is obvious, can be a good defensive strategy. Drop it on or near the goal line and the guy will probably return. If your kick coverage team is fully competent, over time you will probably gain 7-10 yards of defensive field position.

 

[BiggsCoug]

And this is not just about receiving; the same logic applies to kicking. Dropping the kick right on the goal line, so it will be returned, rather than putting it so deep in the end zone that the choice to down the ball is obvious, can be a good defensive strategy. Drop it on or near the goal line and the guy will probably return. If your kick coverage team is fully competent, over time you will probably gain 7-10 yards of defensive field position.

Kick it thru the endzone and control where their offense starts. Don’t let their best athlete get a chance to return it. Remove the circus that is punt and kick returns from the game. It is costing WSU wins.... most recently Cal and UCLA games where they returned 2 kicks/punts for touchdowns.

Stop the insanity. Price called R.J. Soward the “Cougar killer” cause he was so dangerous as a returner. Pro tip: dont let him return it, problem solved.

 

[CougPatrol]

How much time have programs had to coach special teams this season in general, let alone new coaching staffs who are trying to maximize their practice time installing new offensive and defensive schemes, AND break in a true freshman QB?

Some of you are scrutinizing this season and the in-game personnel decisions the way you would any other year, which is ridiculous. Coaches haven't had any practice time to speak of, and when they have gotten things rolling, the facilities get shut down abruptly. Dozens of players are shuttled out of and back onto the active roster on a weekly basis. Games are being cancelled with less than 24 hours before kickoff.

With all of that orbiting around, you're going to start threads questioning why we're having our most promising true freshman WR take some game reps at KR? That's a "curious" coaching decision in your eyes?

 

[cr8zyncalif]

How much time have programs had to coach special teams this season in general, let alone new coaching staffs who are trying to maximize their practice time installing new offensive and defensive schemes, AND break in a true freshman QB?

Some of you are scrutinizing this season and the in-game personnel decisions the way you would any other year, which is ridiculous. Coaches haven't had any practice time to speak of, and when they have gotten things rolling, the facilities get shut down abruptly. Dozens of players are shuttled out of and back onto the active roster on a weekly basis. Games are being cancelled with less than 24 hours before kickoff.

With all of that orbiting around, you're going to start threads questioning why we're having our most promising true freshman WR take some game reps at KR? That's a "curious" coaching decision in your eyes?

Better to use a kick team with zero 1's and 2's who actually cover their lanes than put good athletes out there who have never drilled kick coverage because there wasn't time. I'd say almost the same thing for punts. People get all goo goo eyed at using the fastest & best folks for coverage, when the reality is that you need your most disciplined and field aware kids...and often those are not the same groups of folks.

 

[cr8zyncalif]

Kick it thru the endzone and control where their offense starts. Don’t let their best athlete get a chance to return it. Remove the circus that is punt and kick returns from the game. It is costing WSU wins.... most recently Cal and UCLA games where they returned 2 kicks/punts for touchdowns.

Stop the insanity. Price called R.J. Soward the “Cougar killer” cause he was so dangerous as a returner. Pro tip: dont let him return it, problem solved.

I understand your point, Biggs, and I agree if you do not have a fully competent coverage group. That is a coaching choice. You can skimp on practice time if you have a big enough leg and can always put it out of the end zone. But you'll never get a fumble, and you give up 25 yards...against the insurance against having a big return. Again, if your coverage group is not fully competent, then better to kick it out.

 

[BiggsCoug]

I understand your point, Biggs, and I agree if you do not have a fully competent coverage group. That is a coaching choice. You can skimp on practice time if you have a big enough leg and can always put it out of the end zone. But you'll never get a fumble, and you give up 25 yards...against the insurance against having a big return. Again, if your coverage group is not fully competent, then better to kick it out.

Who is the kick team made up of?

Your starters? Or your backups?

Who is their returner? Their best athlete? Or an also ran?

I think WSU is prob better off removing the return game from the game until their depth of talent is such that it can consistently make a play.

As we saw against UCLA.... nope.