ESPN: Sources: Gonzaga in talks with Big 12 about joining conference

[425cougfan]

Sources: Gonzaga in talks on joining Big 12

Gonzaga is in talks with the Big 12 about the possibility of joining the conference, sources told ESPN.

www.espn.com

Reading between the lines, this sounds like a leak by Gonzaga or someone in the Big 12 to try to push the Pac-12 to pursue Gonzaga when it otherwise wouldn't. That said, the Pac-12 needs to remain mindful of Yomark's comments about a fourth time zone. Acting on the basis of FOMO isn't a great way to go about things, but the Pac-12 needs to ask whether it wants to wake up one day to a headline about SDSU and UNLV joining the Big 12, with Gonzaga joining as basketball-only. If not, then the Pac-12 needs to consider what, if anything, to do to prevent it.

 

[ttowncoug]

The money is in football. I think adding SDSU is already done. I think what's holding up other schools is the UCLA situation. I think that ship has sailed this round, but a return to the Pac could be the story line when the current Big-10 deal ends.

If this was leaked by Yomark's team, it does seem very self-serving. I think when it's all said and done, Yomark's achievements will be nothing more than BS and pot stirring.

 

[PeteTheChop]

425 and T-Town, wouldn't Gonzaga in the new Pac-12 be a total win-win for WSU?

In addition to restoring and enhancing an historic local rivalry, might also it fire up the Cougar fan base, sell tickets, drive sports talk radio, etcetera?

Wouldn't two "Power Conference" programs make the Greater Spokane metro area even more of a basketball hotbed than it is already?

 

[ttowncoug]

They say basketball doesn't really drive much TV revenue. I think the value (economic) is likely in getting people to buy the conferences network in a subscription deal. Does Gonzaga move the needle enough? Not sure.

From the Gonzaga perspective, and WSU hoops, it probably helps WSU more than Gonzaga. I've always felt the Zags pretty much are a tournament lock in their league and the added competition in league play, doesn't really help them overall in terms of seeding, etc.

 

[PeteTheChop]

They say basketball doesn't really drive much TV revenue. I think the value (economic) is likely in getting people to buy the conferences network in a subscription deal. Does Gonzaga move the needle enough? Not sure.

From the Gonzaga perspective, and WSU hoops, it probably helps WSU more than Gonzaga. I've always felt the Zags pretty much are a tournament lock in their league and the added competition in league play, doesn't really help them overall in terms of seeding, etc.

Thanks.

Gotta think the atmosphere in Beasley Coliseum would be bonkers for a Cougs-Zags conference game in Jan/Feb

 

[425cougfan]

Agree with TTown's takes on that, Pete. I'll just say that I can accept Gonzaga in some kind of "new" Pac-12, especially if basketball-only, if that's the price of maintaining something close to the status quo or in holding things together as a P5/P6 conference if UW and Oregon bail. I will not be a happy camper if, in 10 years, Gonzaga is in a power conference -- even if it's basketball-only silliness -- and WSU isn't. Definitely the case if Gonzaga somehow could start a football program. I don't see that happening for innumerable reasons, but if it did somehow and Gonzaga was playing power conference football and WSU wasn't, I don't know if I could survive it. Even if WSU was in some kind of reconstituted Pac-12/MWC hybrid that ostensibly was P5 and Gonzaga was in that conference or in the Big 12, with football, that would suck big-time for WSU.

 

[Loyal Coug1]

Agree with TTown's takes on that, Pete. I'll just say that I can accept Gonzaga in some kind of "new" Pac-12, especially if basketball-only, if that's the price of maintaining something close to the status quo or in holding things together as a P5/P6 conference if UW and Oregon bail. I will not be a happy camper if, in 10 years, Gonzaga is in a power conference -- even if it's basketball-only silliness -- and WSU isn't. Definitely the case if Gonzaga somehow could start a football program. I don't see that happening for innumerable reasons, but if it did somehow and Gonzaga was playing power conference football and WSU wasn't, I don't know if I could survive it. Even if WSU was in some kind of reconstituted Pac-12/MWC hybrid that ostensibly was P5 and Gonzaga was in that conference or in the Big 12, with football, that would suck big-time for WSU.

F- this entire thread. Gonzaga is a one trick pony. A basketball team with a what - Tier 3 or 4 college attached?

And Pete - have you been to a Gonzaga-WSU game in Beasley? I was there when Benneet's (and Baynes') Cougs took them down.

 

[CougPatrol]

Initially, this didn’t make sense to me, but I now see why Gonzaga would consider it. It maintains their recruiting advantage out West while allowing them to play in one of the top basketball conferences in the Nation.

 

[SaveFerris]

Few's not going to be around forever. They need a conference. I would prefer anywhere but here.

 

[mikalalas]

425 and T-Town, wouldn't Gonzaga in the new Pac-12 be a total win-win for WSU?

In addition to restoring and enhancing an historic local rivalry, might also it fire up the Cougar fan base, sell tickets, drive sports talk radio, etcetera?

Wouldn't two "Power Conference" programs make the Greater Spokane metro area even more of a basketball hotbed than it is already?

WSU is already at a recruiting DISADVANTAGE.

The only counter WSU has is being a P5.

If Gonzaga becomes a P5, and more especially if they Join the Pac 12, it will be EXTREMELY BAD for WSU recruiting.

 

[mikalalas]

Thanks.

Gotta think the atmosphere in Beasley Coliseum would be bonkers for a Cougs-Zags conference game in Jan/Feb

Also if Gonzaga joins PAC 12, thats another UCLA, Arizona, Oregon, auto NCAA, extremely tough game, win.

It will mean WSU, instead of 20-10, 11-9, tied for 4th, alone in 5th, NCAA Bubble in bid, WSU instead gets 18-12, 9-11, tied for 5th, 6th, alone in 7th, bubble out of NCAA, into NIT.

And that's along with recruiting getting harder for WSU, if Gonzaga joins PAC 12.

If Gonzaga joins PAC 12, instead of having WSU go-to NCAA once every about 9 to 17 33 years, it goes to WSU goes to NCAA once every about 25 to 50 to 75 to 85 years, IF Gonzaga joins PAC 12, and if WSU doesn't have Tony Bennet, Smith.

 

[kougkurt]

Basketball and baseball

 

[Coug90]

The money is in football. I think adding SDSU is already done. I think what's holding up other schools is the UCLA situation. I think that ship has sailed this round, but a return to the Pac could be the story line when the current Big-10 deal ends.

If this was leaked by Yomark's team, it does seem very self-serving. I think when it's all said and done, Yomark's achievements will be nothing more than BS and pot stirring.

I’ll admit I don’t know all of the financials here but even though football is king for TV$ the NCAA tourney brings in quite a bit too. In that case think Gonzaga would be a good short term bet at least, right? Would be curious to see where the tourney weekends stack up against football weekends. And football is one day where the tourney is 4 so you effectively get a football season in 3 weekends.

 

[95coug]

I’ll admit I don’t know all of the financials here but even though football is king for TV$ the NCAA tourney brings in quite a bit too. In that case think Gonzaga would be a good short term bet at least, right? Would be curious to see where the tourney weekends stack up against football weekends. And football is one day where the tourney is 4 so you effectively get a football season in 3 weekends.

This gives a summary of how teams get money from the tournament. While it’s worth $1B to the NCAA, compared to football it’s not a big bump for the individual schools.

It probably would be a bump for Gonzaga to move, since the WCC only gets one automatic berth and occasionally an at-large bid. The money earned gets divided between all the conference teams, so with only 1 or 2 qualifiers, it gets diluted pretty fast. The Big 12 probably gets more teams in, with deeper runs, so the payout gets bigger as long as they don’t overexpand enough to water it down.

Not sure what the media deal for hoops looks like, but it’s not going to be in the same league as the football deal. probably better than what they have, but maybe not by that much.

I don’t think it would be too surprising to see Gonzaga make this move. but, the biggest advantage is the potential payday. Competitively, they’re already able to make tournament runs by playing some tough non-conference games. Do they really want to play a bunch of top-level conference opponents? Maybe it gives them the toughness to finally bring home a title, but maybe it just knocks them down a peg and turns them into a #3-4 team in a good conference. The negative seems more likely than the positive.

Then again, only one team finishes with a win in March, even though they all start with that goal. Might as well go all in and chase the trophy.

https://nevadasportsnet.com/news/re...ake-off-this-years-ncaa-tournament-it-depends

 

[Flatlandcoug]

It doesn't make sense for Gonzaga to make this move until very close to the end of Few's career. They are the big fish in a small pond and they control their OOC schedule. Wichita State is a good example of the dangers of stepping up the level of difficulty in basketball. They were kings of the Missouri Valley Conference, making deep runs in the NCAA tournament and looking great. They joined the AAC and immediately became mediocre. There were other factors in play and Gonzaga is better than the Shockers....but a weekly grind takes a toll. Gonzaga and Few are better off on an island for now.

That said, if Few is a year or two out from retiring (and he might be), they should think about jumping ship if they can get in a better financial situation. Of course, Wichita State might still be winning conference championships if they hadn't moved. It's all about your goals as a program. Is it about the money or is it about the best situation for your program to be successful?

 

[roses04]

Tougher travel, more difficult places to play, much bigger arenas and more rabid fans, they will end up being a 3- 6 seed, with 5 -8 losses each year. Does that put them in a better position to win it all? And how much more money will they make?

 

[Observer11]

Odds on GU to the Big 12 - 20%
Odds on GU to the Pac 12 for bball only - 50%

Travel being the tipping point. It is a helluva long ways to W Virginia and staying in the west is essentially their current travel footprint.

Whoever posted baseball as a tag along makes sense too. And folding in to the Pac 12 makes the rest of their non revenue sports a heck of a lot more economic than flying all their athletes cross country for conference games.

 

[Stretch 74]

Odds on GU to the Big 12 - 20%
Odds on GU to the Pac 12 for bball only - 50%

Travel being the tipping point. It is a helluva long ways to W Virginia and staying in the west is essentially their current travel footprint.

Whoever posted baseball as a tag along makes sense too. And folding in to the Pac 12 makes the rest of their non revenue sports a heck of a lot more economic than flying all their athletes cross country for conference games.

I had also wondered about GU baseball also coming, which leads into other sports. Assuming both LA schools are indeed gone, then I think GU would only come into the PAC with all of their sports. Baseball, WBB, both soccer teams, volleyball (?), not sure what all sports teams they do fund.

Also, if GU is to come into the PAC, I think that would also mean that San Diego would then come into the league, as the most likely school to match up with PAC goals of academics and athletics.

If I had to bet dollar on it, I don't think that Gonzaga makes a deal with the PAC.

 

[PeteTheChop]

Agree with TTown's takes on that, Pete. I'll just say that I can accept Gonzaga in some kind of "new" Pac-12, especially if basketball-only, if that's the price of maintaining something close to the status quo or in holding things together as a P5/P6 conference if UW and Oregon bail. I will not be a happy camper if, in 10 years, Gonzaga is in a power conference -- even if it's basketball-only silliness -- and WSU isn't. Definitely the case if Gonzaga somehow could start a football program. I don't see that happening for innumerable reasons, but if it did somehow and Gonzaga was playing power conference football and WSU wasn't, I don't know if I could survive it. Even if WSU was in some kind of reconstituted Pac-12/MWC hybrid that ostensibly was P5 and Gonzaga was in that conference or in the Big 12, with football, that would suck big-time for WSU.

Never thought about the possibility of the Zags bringing back their football program. Imagine GU has quite a bit of of political pull in Spokane ... is this something the city could conceivably help with as far as building a stadium, etcetera (one of the top posters over at Brand X always talked about Spokane's Irish-Catholic mafia)?

Always figured if someone in Washington added a Division I program it would be a branch campus like WSU-Vancouver or something similar.

 

[PeteTheChop]

F- this entire thread. Gonzaga is a one trick pony. A basketball team with a what - Tier 3 or 4 college attached?

And Pete - have you been to a Gonzaga-WSU game in Beasley? I was there when Benneet's (and Baynes') Cougs took them down.

Never have had the chance, unfortunately.

I wasn't nowhere near the kind of student that could gave gotten accepted into a major university

Maybe one day I'll make it to Beasley ... although aren't Schultz and Chun looking into building a new basketball arena once they're done with the fieldhouse and other football-centric upgrades?

 

[PeteTheChop]

Odds on GU to the Big 12 - 20%
Odds on GU to the Pac 12 for bball only - 50%

Wow, sounds more likely than not that Few is rubbing elbows with the big boys during conference play in the future.

Observer, DGibbons, Loyal, Biggs, Ed, T-Town, etc.: How does this impact the WSU-GU rivalry among Spokanians if the two local DI schools are suddenly playing in the same conference?

Would any of the bandwagon Zag fans jump back on WSU's side if Few and Kyle Smith are going head-to-head twice each season?

 

[CougPatrol]

It may not yield big profits, but purely from a marketing standpoint, adding programs like Gonzaga, SDSU, and UNLV for basketball and baseball is worth exploring.

 

[Observer11]

Wow, sounds more likely than not that Few is rubbing elbows with the big boys during conference play in the future.

Observer, DGibbons, Loyal, Biggs, Ed, T-Town, etc.: How does this impact the WSU-GU rivalry among Spokanians if the two local DI schools are suddenly playing in the same conference?

Would any of the bandwagon Zag fans jump back on WSU's side if Few and Kyle Smith are going head-to-head twice each season?

I don't know a single Spokane Coug who has ever cheered at anything less than 100% for the Cougs when GU/WSU play one another.

 

[95coug]

Never thought about the possibility of the Zags bringing back their football program. Imagine GU has quite a bit of of political pull in Spokane ... is this something the city could conceivably help with as far as building a stadium, etcetera (one of the top posters over at Brand X always talked about Spokane's Irish-Catholic mafia)?

Always figured if someone in Washington added a Division I program it would be a branch campus like WSU-Vancouver or something similar.

I don't see GU bringing back football, and I don't think that they would be able to do it at the FBS level.

Football is expensive. Money from a media deal could offset it for them, but I don't think either the Big 12 or the Pac 12 would be willing to make them a full share partner to establish a football program.

There were preliminary moves to set up D3 competition in Tri-Cities a few years back that were quickly shut down. WSU athletics was very clear that intercollegiate athletics live in Pullman, and Pullman only. They've allowed intramural and club sports at the other campuses, but were very clear that they will oppose competitive/sanctioned athletics at any level at any other campus.

 

[dgibbons]

Sources: Gonzaga in talks on joining Big 12

Gonzaga is in talks with the Big 12 about the possibility of joining the conference, sources told ESPN.

www.espn.com

Reading between the lines, this sounds like a leak by Gonzaga or someone in the Big 12 to try to push the Pac-12 to pursue Gonzaga when it otherwise wouldn't. That said, the Pac-12 needs to remain mindful of Yomark's comments about a fourth time zone. Acting on the basis of FOMO isn't a great way to go about things, but the Pac-12 needs to ask whether it wants to wake up one day to a headline about SDSU and UNLV joining the Big 12, with Gonzaga joining as basketball-only. If not, then the Pac-12 needs to consider what, if anything, to do to prevent it.

No football means no Power 5. Plain and simple in my mind.

"Basketball only" would be extremely temporary.

 

[SaveFerris]

I don't know a single Spokane Coug who has ever cheered at anything less than 100% for the Cougs when GU/WSU play one another.

It was rumored Few would get upset for Coug games in K2 because a lot of Zag seats suddenly were wearing Crimson.

 

[COUGinNCW]

It was rumored Few would get upset for Coug games in K2 because a lot of Zag seats suddenly were wearing Crimson.

Not a rumor at all. Fact

but I think there are some Cougs who have completely switched allegiances, even if they were playing each other.

 

[ttowncoug]

ON the Zags bringing back football, would be costly. Every football scholarship (85?) would have to have an equal amount of women's non-revenue generating scholarships. Stadium and facility investments as well.

I think Gonzaga's hoop niche is likely where they stay.

 

[95coug]

ON the Zags bringing back football, would be costly. Every football scholarship (85?) would have to have an equal amount of women's non-revenue generating scholarships. Stadium and facility investments as well.

I think Gonzaga's hoop niche is likely where they stay.

YEah, they'd have to award a minimum of 77 football scholarships to be FBS, and minimum 200 athletic scholarships total...and they'd have to maintain a balance between mens' and womens' scholarships. So they'd either have to add womens' sports, or they'd have to cut the number of scholarships to men in other sports....and we know they're not cutting anything to basketball. Maybe they drop mens golf & tennis (although those are low cost sports) and pick up womens' softball.

And, there's still an attendance requirement. They have to average 15,000 attendance at least 1 out of every 2 years, which I'm not sure they can do consistently, especially in the first couple years. If they did, it would be because of opponents' fans traveling.

 

[425cougfan]

Thanks for all the good points in here, guys, about Title IX and otherwise. Good stuff. I hope this is just noise.

 

[Observer11]

As to Gonzaga fielding a football team, not gonna happen. Their brand is hoops and Spokane is Hooptown USA.

And as for the city of Spokane helping build a stadium, never ever going to happen. The city just demolished a 25,000 seat stadium.

 

[SaveFerris]

Not a rumor at all. Fact

but I think there are some Cougs who have completely switched allegiances, even if they were playing each other.

Those weren't Cougs.

 

[cr8zyncalif]

I have to disagree with some of the prevailing wisdom. GU may not want to be in a major conference before Few leaves...mostly because staying in their current conference makes the path to the Big Dance easier. They will probably need that in the first few (or rather, "non-Few") years of a new coach (OK, I had to say it that way!).

No way does anybody start a new P5 football program going forward (at least on the west coast) with both the expense and potential liability issues looming on the horizon. And if you are not P5, then there is no good rationale for doing it at all.

When it comes to Cougs vs. Zags, Spokane will remain divided. Zags have more bandwagon folks, but there are more actual Coug alums. Not many alums on either side will switch allegiances. Some, but not a lot.

 

[Loyal Coug1]

As to Gonzaga fielding a football team, not gonna happen. Their brand is hoops and Spokane is Hooptown USA.

And as for the city of Spokane helping build a stadium, never ever going to happen. The city just demolished a 25,000 seat stadium.

Thank you. This thread was getting ridiculous.

 

[Wazzubrooz]

GU has the sweetest deal they’re ever going to have in the WCC. They are pretty much guaranteed a 20 win season just by showing up. They own the conference and the NCAA bid that comes with it. They are sought after for big time high level games and are on TV all the time. They don’t need the Big 12 to enhance what they do. By joining the Big 12 they might find themselves in 4th or 5th place at seasons end. They would still get an NCAA birth, but it wouldn’t be as high, as they might have 6-8 loses. I just don’t see the benefit over what they what they currently own. Again, the grass is not always greener over there.

 

[Observer11]

Gonzaga has essentially become the Notre Dame of basketball. They don't have to beg for non-conference games any longer. Problem is, all their tough games are up front and by March they're cruising along with a 30 win record and not a lot of callouses built up.

Few wants a natty. If going into a tougher conference like the Big 12 or Pac 12 can sharpen their iron when the time is right, they'll do it.

The Pac 12 seems the logical fit. And somebody is doing the math on how many eyeballs GU brings for an entire season of basketball w/o football compared to, say, San Diego State. It's all about advertising impressions.

 

[SaveFerris]

GU has the sweetest deal they’re ever going to have in the WCC. They are pretty much guaranteed a 20 win season just by showing up. They own the conference and the NCAA bid that comes with it. They are sought after for big time high level games and are on TV all the time. They don’t need the Big 12 to enhance what they do. By joining the Big 12 they might find themselves in 4th or 5th place at seasons end. They would still get an NCAA birth, but it wouldn’t be as high, as they might have 6-8 loses. I just don’t see the benefit over what they what they currently own. Again, the grass is not always greener over there.

I agree and think this is probably another move on GU's part to sweeten their deal to stay in the WCC. BYU is leaving soon. GU had "talks" with the MWC a few years ago only to ultimately to stay in the WCC with a better deal.

 

[COUGinNCW]

Gonzaga has essentially become the Notre Dame of basketball. They don't have to beg for non-conference games any longer. Problem is, all their tough games are up front and by March they're cruising along with a 30 win record and not a lot of callouses built up.

Few wants a natty. If going into a tougher conference like the Big 12 or Pac 12 can sharpen their iron when the time is right, they'll do it.

The Pac 12 seems the logical fit. And somebody is doing the math on how many eyeballs GU brings for an entire season of basketball w/o football compared to, say, San Diego State. It's all about advertising impressions.

And they just got softer with BYU leaving their conference.

I really see no one they could add to their conference that would come close to replacing BYU unless a school like Seattle U has a booster that’s willing to go BIG on NIL. I don’t think it would be possible in football for a 2nd tier school to NIL their way into relevance but it could certainly happen in basketball if someone was willing to piss away a small fortune.

 

[mikalalas]

I agree and think this is probably another move on GU's part to sweeten their deal to stay in the WCC. BYU is leaving soon. GU had "talks" with the MWC a few years ago only to ultimately to stay in the WCC with a better deal.

If GU is even smarter, they should join the MWC.

The MWC is TOUGHER, BETTER then WCC, but not TOO TOUGH.

They would still win 30 games, goto NCAA, #1,2 seed. But the MWC schedule would give them callouses, make them better able to win a Natty.

The Pac 12, an or Big 12 would be bad for them, as they would lose 4,5,6,7 games, win 25 games instead of 30 and while would help them do better in NCAA tournament, the P5 conference schedule and PAC 12 tourney, might be too much of a meat grinder that tires, wears them out.

Plus it's just not good for WSU and them to have to compete with WSU, tho they would win recruiting, wins, etc.

UNLV won a Natty in the MWC, and Gonzaga can, probably would too.

The MWC has BSU, SDSU, UNLV, FRESNO STATE, which are pretty good SEMI P5 ish level bball programs.

Those program would give Gonzaga AWESOMELY SEMI TOUGH COMPETITION, without being too tough.

The MWC is where Gonzaga BELONGS not P5, and not the WEAKER WCC.

Gonzaga will probably NEVER win a NATTY in the WCC.

The MWC is the BEST FIT for Gonzaga.

But even tho Gonzaga is smart, they are probably not smart enough to join MWC.

 

[AlwaysSpokanesFault]

Few wants a natty.

Mark can't handle a natty, per the Coeur d'Alene PD.