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FB but off topic - Papa John's and Louisville

Loyal Coug

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This seems a little extreme to me. So Papa John's founder made a comment last year that he thought NFL players should stand for the national anthem, and that his NFL-sponsoring business was suffering due to the negativity surrounding the kneeling. He took a ton of heat, and the NFL's sponsorship deal with Papa John's was soon terminated. While I don't agree with his perspective, it was a helluva lot more tame than what our POTUS spewed out, saying that those NFL players should be fired and maybe didn't belong in our country. This is important - a citizen expresses his opinion and gets villified, the POTUS says much worse and goes along his merry way.

So now, in an internal conference call, he was defending himself, and made an ill-advised comment that Colonel Sanders used the N-word and didn't face any backlash. Since Sanders has been dead since 1980, this reference (if true) was from a looong time ago.

Ok - so Papa John (Schnatter) said the N-word, but in reference to what some other guy supposedly said 30 or 40 years ago. He didn't use the word himself in describing anyone.

Now he has had to resign as Chairman, Louisville wants to change their stadium name, and his name and face are being removed from various places in his hometown.

Is it just me, or is that more than a little much?

http://www.espn.com/college-sports/...n-schnatter-resigns-louisville-board-trustees
 
This seems a little extreme to me. So Papa John's founder made a comment last year that he thought NFL players should stand for the national anthem, and that his NFL-sponsoring business was suffering due to the negativity surrounding the kneeling. He took a ton of heat, and the NFL's sponsorship deal with Papa John's was soon terminated. While I don't agree with his perspective, it was a helluva lot more tame than what our POTUS spewed out, saying that those NFL players should be fired and maybe didn't belong in our country. This is important - a citizen expresses his opinion and gets villified, the POTUS says much worse and goes along his merry way.

So now, in an internal conference call, he was defending himself, and made an ill-advised comment that Colonel Sanders used the N-word and didn't face any backlash. Since Sanders has been dead since 1980, this reference (if true) was from a looong time ago.

Ok - so Papa John (Schnatter) said the N-word, but in reference to what some other guy supposedly said 30 or 40 years ago. He didn't use the word himself in describing anyone.

Now he has had to resign as Chairman, Louisville wants to change their stadium name, and his name and face are being removed from various places in his hometown.

Is it just me, or is that more than a little much?

http://www.espn.com/college-sports/...n-schnatter-resigns-louisville-board-trustees

Agree 100% that this is the equivalent to the old joke about the NCAA putting South Dakota State on probation because Oklahoma got caught committing recruiting violations.

What baffles me about Trump is that the people that support him are so blind to the blatant lying and racism. He joked last year that he could shoot someone in the middle of the street and he could get away with it.......and he's right. Of course, because there is so much rage and anger in our country right now, someone has to get punished and in this case, it's ol' Papa John himself.

I will say that it's hard to feel sorry for the guy. He's a billionaire (or should be) and he brought all of this on by not knowing when to keep his mouth shut on a divisive issue.
 
The guy is probably getting railroaded in the current frenzy of "well, you didn't REALLY say or mean that but it could be considered offensive anyway so let's be outraged and demand resignations".

That said, it speaks to having a booster sugar daddy and the headaches associated with managing thereof to the university.
 
Agree 100% that this is the equivalent to the old joke about the NCAA putting South Dakota State on probation because Oklahoma got caught committing recruiting violations.

What baffles me about Trump is that the people that support him are so blind to the blatant lying and racism. He joked last year that he could shoot someone in the middle of the street and he could get away with it.......and he's right. Of course, because there is so much rage and anger in our country right now, someone has to get punished and in this case, it's ol' Papa John himself.

I will say that it's hard to feel sorry for the guy. He's a billionaire (or should be) and he brought all of this on by not knowing when to keep his mouth shut on a divisive issue.
First I don't think he was joking. I firmly believe he could come into my small suburbia town, pull out a guy and shoot me in the face and claim I walked in front of the bullet. And no doubt someone on the street would claim that is what they saw. It is an incredible talent.
 
First I don't think he was joking. I firmly believe he could come into my small suburbia town, pull out a gun and shoot me in the face and claim I walked in front of the bullet. And no doubt someone on the street would claim that is what they saw. It is an incredible talent.

You realize of course that some among us (not me) would consider this to be a public service........:p
 
You realize of course that some among us (not me) would consider this to be a public service........:p
Maybe even enough to change your vote in 2020 : )
But what you may have already picked up, my head is hard so what Trump would fired from pee shooter would simply bounce off like it was a rubber bullet.
 
This seems a little extreme to me. So Papa John's founder made a comment last year that he thought NFL players should stand for the national anthem, and that his NFL-sponsoring business was suffering due to the negativity surrounding the kneeling. He took a ton of heat, and the NFL's sponsorship deal with Papa John's was soon terminated. While I don't agree with his perspective, it was a helluva lot more tame than what our POTUS spewed out, saying that those NFL players should be fired and maybe didn't belong in our country. This is important - a citizen expresses his opinion and gets villified, the POTUS says much worse and goes along his merry way.

So now, in an internal conference call, he was defending himself, and made an ill-advised comment that Colonel Sanders used the N-word and didn't face any backlash. Since Sanders has been dead since 1980, this reference (if true) was from a looong time ago.

Ok - so Papa John (Schnatter) said the N-word, but in reference to what some other guy supposedly said 30 or 40 years ago. He didn't use the word himself in describing anyone.

Now he has had to resign as Chairman, Louisville wants to change their stadium name, and his name and face are being removed from various places in his hometown.

Is it just me, or is that more than a little much?

http://www.espn.com/college-sports/...n-schnatter-resigns-louisville-board-trustees

My guess is other members wanted him gone for whatever reason. Maybe because "Recently, Schnatter had questioned the leadership of Louisville's athletic department and the integrity of former basketball coach Rick Pitino. The criticism had left his relationship with the school frayed."

This was an opportunity to get him off the board. Straw that broke the camel's back. Is that Islamophobic?

This is interesting "In a complicated arrangement, the school's deal is with Schnatter himself, not the Papa John's brand, and provides that if he leaves the company, Schnatter can rename the building." Snowflake Stadium? The SS for short?
 
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First I don't think he was joking. I firmly believe he could come into my small suburbia town, pull out a guy and shoot me in the face and claim I walked in front of the bullet. And no doubt someone on the street would claim that is what they saw. It is an incredible talent.[/QUOTE
You realize of course that some among us (not me) would consider this to be a public service........:p

Loyal....the Russians hacked my CZone account and posted my last post to your last post .....
 
Trump has come upon the perfect formula. Be so despicable that many people cant stand him. Then claim bias by anyone who challenges him. Kind of like the old joke about the boy who murders his parents, then claims the judge is against him for not giving leniency since he is an orphan
 
Yeah, there is way more to this story than meets the eye. The Social Justice Warriors will applaud this, no doubt. But this does skirt the edge more to WTF? But I see this as a power move, not a political move. I wouldn't be surprised if whomever is pulling this power move doesn't have the exact same political leaning. It's business. He opened himself up, he's paying for it.

To those that are blaming President Trump. Meh. Maybe there's a correlation, I don't see it. The PC'ness of this world has been out of hand for quite some time. This doesn't seem too unusual to me.
 
Yeah, there is way more to this story than meets the eye. The Social Justice Warriors will applaud this, no doubt. But this does skirt the edge more to WTF? But I see this as a power move, not a political move. I wouldn't be surprised if whomever is pulling this power move doesn't have the exact same political leaning. It's business. He opened himself up, he's paying for it.

To those that are blaming President Trump. Meh. Maybe there's a correlation, I don't see it. The PC'ness of this world has been out of hand for quite some time. This doesn't seem too unusual to me.

I do have to ask 95...what does racism look like to you? Is Trump a racist, or does he have racist tendencies or actions that could be construed or misconstrued as racist? What would you have to see or hear to think someone is racist? And more importantly, should anything be done?

And yes, I think people who see Trumps behavior are emboldened and feel free to come out of the woodwork and express their opinions, in word and in action. He is the leader of the most powerful country in the world. Why has he not condemned any of these racists acts?

As for the Papa John CEO, apparently he did it on a conference call. If I understood correctly, and I could be totally incorrect, it was a conference call about racial sensitivity training.

It was interesting strictly on timing as I was at dinner last night with two very highly respected CEO's in the Seattle area. I think between the two they are in charge of 2,000 employees. One heads a publicly traded company, the other does not. The only reason I bring this up is to give a point of view of people that are in a similar position. Neither one saw it as "PC issue". Neither one thought the penalty was too harsh.

As far as being too Pc'ed....yeah I guess I am in favor of being PC and condemn "jews will not replace us", or "get out of my country", or someone getting their face slammed with a brink because of the color of someone's skin. Yeah, I like to be on the side of PC....
 
My guess is other members wanted him gone for whatever reason. Maybe because "Recently, Schnatter had questioned the leadership of Louisville's athletic department and the integrity of former basketball coach Rick Pitino. The criticism had left his relationship with the school frayed."

This was an opportunity to get him off the board. Straw that broke the camel's back. Is that Islamophobic?

This is interesting "In a complicated arrangement, the school's deal is with Schnatter himself, not the Papa John's brand, and provides that if he leaves the company, Schnatter can rename the building." Snowflake Stadium? The SS for short?

Hadn't seen that about the AD relationship. Thanks, and yeah a twist to the story. Although Papa John's the company is disassociating itself from him, so that part is unrelated.

And yeah I read the stadium thing too. Gotta be a misprint(?) - must be that the school can change the name? Looking forward to hearing more about that.

Update: Louisville is removing Papa John's from its stadium name. Wonder if they still have to pay John until 2040? Crazy part of all this is it stems from an internal corporate call per below:

The media-training company working with Papa John's opted to end its business relationship with the pizza company after the call, according to Forbes. The publication reported the objectionable behavior took place on a conference call intended as a role-playing exercise for Schnatter on avoiding racially charged mishaps in the future.

I wouldn't be hiring that company anytime soon - did they leak the information? If not, who did?

https://bleacherreport.com/articles...om&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=editorial
 
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These sorts of things are simple excuses to get rid of someone. Highly cynical. From a risk/reward stand point, it doesnt pay off to publically defend him because you risk getting hit with the racist label.

It's worth noting Harvey Weinstein got outed by his brother, who was aware of his aggregious behavior for years, after the two had a falling out and were in a power struggle for their company. Plus the botanists sexual assaults were an open secret for years before things came out. I find it hard to believe genuine concern about the casting couch was what blew the thing open. It was a political kill shot.

Also interesting. There was outrage after Shady McCoy's ex suffered a severe beating this week. The Twitter mobs were demanding he be cut that day and claimed he didnt deserve the benefit of the doubt. Turns out he didnt do it.
 
These sorts of things are simple excuses to get rid of someone. Highly cynical. From a risk/reward stand point, it doesnt pay off to publically defend him because you risk getting hit with the racist label.

It's worth noting Harvey Weinstein got outed by his brother, who was aware of his aggregious behavior for years, after the two had a falling out and were in a power struggle for their company. Plus the botanists sexual assaults were an open secret for years before things came out. I find it hard to believe genuine concern about the casting couch was what blew the thing open. It was a political kill shot.

Also interesting. There was outrage after Shady McCoy's ex suffered a severe beating this week. The Twitter mobs were demanding he be cut that day and claimed he didnt deserve the benefit of the doubt. Turns out he didnt do it.
Where do you personally draw the line . What is a fireable offense ?
 
Where do you personally draw the line . What is a fireable offense ?

In Washington, employment is at-will. In the absence of an employment contract, termination of employment is only actionable the termination is discriminatory. Meaning the employee is fired on the basis of race, creed, sex, sexual orientation, etc.

Donny T could fire a young lady because he doesn't like her face or dresses too conservatively for his tastes.
 
In Washington, employment is at-will. In the absence of an employment contract, termination of employment is only actionable the termination is discriminatory. Meaning the employee is fired on the basis of race, creed, sex, sexual orientation, etc.

Donny T could fire a young lady because he doesn't like her face or dresses too conservatively for his tastes.
Thanks but wasn’t looking for lawyer speak or what is legal and not legal . I wanted to know what is acceptable to him whether legal or not .
 
Not on stupid comments.
Hmmm . So comments can be stupid and racist and is that ok or not ok? This is a legit question which you don’t have to answer. But people say this comment is stupid or that wasn’t meant that way or it is too pc? Just wondering where words fit in for you. If the papa John ceo said “coon or tar baby” , are they just words? How about the n word? I just like to know peoples tolerance level.
 
Hmmm . So comments can be stupid and racist and is that ok or not ok? This is a legit question which you don’t have to answer. But people say this comment is stupid or that wasn’t meant that way or it is too pc? Just wondering where words fit in for you. If the papa John ceo said “coon or tar baby” , are they just words? How about the n word? I just like to know peoples tolerance level.

These comments were stupid but not racist. When you are saying we don't want to be like Colonel Sanders who said n words, thats stupid.

Racist would be saying how can we sell more pizzas to n words.

There is a clear distinction between the two in my mind. And I'd have him fired for showing such contempt for his customer base.
 
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Hmmm . So comments can be stupid and racist and is that ok or not ok? This is a legit question which you don’t have to answer. But people say this comment is stupid or that wasn’t meant that way or it is too pc? Just wondering where words fit in for you. If the papa John ceo said “coon or tar baby” , are they just words? How about the n word? I just like to know peoples tolerance level.
You don't like to know peoples tolerance level. You want to out anyone that doesn't look at things the same way you do. But I'll slide down this proverbial slippery slope of "what-if's". Papa John was quoting another person, basically. I don't find that racist, at all.

Next.
 
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Thanks but wasn’t looking for lawyer speak or what is legal and not legal . I wanted to know what is acceptable to him whether legal or not .

If the law doesn't matter as what is a fireable offense and what is not, then your post is pointless.

But we're used to that.
 
Hmmm . So comments can be stupid and racist and is that ok or not ok? This is a legit question which you don’t have to answer. But people say this comment is stupid or that wasn’t meant that way or it is too pc? Just wondering where words fit in for you. If the papa John ceo said “coon or tar baby” , are they just words? How about the n word? I just like to know peoples tolerance level.

Should someone call for your termination based on this post?
 
You don't like to know peoples tolerance level. You want to out anyone that doesn't look at things the same way you do. But I'll slide down this proverbial slippery slope of "what-if's". Papa John was quoting another person, basically. I don't find that racist, at all.
If I may tell you you are full of it. Why would you pretend to know why I asked the question ? I asked the question because I DO want to know tolerance levels. It is easy to say what is tolerable , but no one says what isn’t tolerable .

My questioning It is no different than when I ask someone who is adament the entire Russian investigation is a nothing burger . I ask them what proof would they need to see to think there is something there to make it a burger . If it was Hillary my proof would be after months of denial about a meeting only to Chelsea admit to a meeting that would be enough for me to start inpewchment.

I could care less if you or anyone else has a different opinion about the papa John situation . I probably believe closer to loyal opinion but also get why they cut him loose
 
The guy should have enough common sense to not use this language in a public setting, regardless of the circumstances.

You can't point back 20, 30 years and defend your actions just because things were accepted that way.

I personally think he has some serious baggage and this was just the last straw...both for the Papa Johns and Louisville.
 
The guy should have enough common sense to not use this language in a public setting, regardless of the circumstances.

You can't point back 20, 30 years and defend your actions just because things were accepted that way.

I personally think he has some serious baggage and this was just the last straw...both for the Papa Johns and Louisville.

I agree but he DID NOT use it in a public setting. He was on a private conference call with a media-training company hired by Papa Johns! See below (again). And he did not do what he said Colonel Sanders did. That's the killer here. All he was doing, talking to a firm that his company hired, was saying "hey why are they picking on me, look what the Colonel said and got away with". Hell he should have said "look what the POTUS gets away with!"

The media-training company working with Papa John's opted to end its business relationship with the pizza company after the call, according to Forbes. The publication reported the objectionable behavior took place on a conference call intended as a role-playing exercise for Schnatter on avoiding racially charged mishaps in the future.

Early in my career I was in Diversity training (required for all employees). Being a young, naive hick, I said a couple of things that were very insensitive - like "jew 'em down". The trainer looked at me and was aghast. I was like, "what?". I truly did not know that this was a derogatory expression. Well, I became sensitized, and have never used the phrase again except to tell that story. I pretty much equate that to John Schnatter. In training, says something, it gets leaked inappropriately and all hell breaks loose. Geezus if a video from my training 25 years ago ever got out, I would never work again. He should be suing the training firm or whoever leaked it.

Also, he was not fired. He resigned as Chairman of the Board.
 
These comments were stupid but not racist. When you are saying we don't want to be like Colonel Sanders who said n words, thats stupid.

Racist would be saying how can we sell more pizzas to n words.

There is a clear distinction between the two in my mind. And I'd have him fired for showing such contempt for his customer base.

Does it strike anyone as insane that it has come to the fact that basically that word, "the N word", doesn't exist any longer? As in, we have to say "the N word", even if its in a referential manner? There is no permanent moratorium on any other racial epithet towards any other race, but somehow that word... THAT FCKING WORD.

An anecdote: 20 years ago I took Washington State history as required by the WA board of education or whoever makes those rules... anyway, I digress. I remember reading about the booming fishing industry in Seattle and how the local Chinese population was displaced by an automated fish processing machine, referred to colloquially as "the iron Chink." I guarantee you I was no less repulsed by that name than I would be if someone had made a cotton picking machine and called it... well, you know. (they probably did, but I can't speak to that.)
 
Does it strike anyone as insane that it has come to the fact that basically that word, "the N word", doesn't exist any longer? As in, we have to say "the N word", even if its in a referential manner? There is no permanent moratorium on any other racial epithet towards any other race, but somehow that word... THAT FCKING WORD.

An anecdote: 20 years ago I took Washington State history as required by the WA board of education or whoever makes those rules... anyway, I digress. I remember reading about the booming fishing industry in Seattle and how the local Chinese population was displaced by an automated fish processing machine, referred to colloquially as "the iron Chink." I guarantee you I was no less repulsed by that name than I would be if someone had made a cotton picking machine and called it... well, you know. (they probably did, but I can't speak to that.)

If you are black you can still use the N-word. Mostly in rap songs.

Then there is the word niggardly. This is actually pretty interesting.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controversies_about_the_word_"niggardly"
 
Does it strike anyone as insane that it has come to the fact that basically that word, "the N word", doesn't exist any longer? As in, we have to say "the N word", even if its in a referential manner? There is no permanent moratorium on any other racial epithet towards any other race, but somehow that word... THAT FCKING WORD.

An anecdote: 20 years ago I took Washington State history as required by the WA board of education or whoever makes those rules... anyway, I digress. I remember reading about the booming fishing industry in Seattle and how the local Chinese population was displaced by an automated fish processing machine, referred to colloquially as "the iron Chink." I guarantee you I was no less repulsed by that name than I would be if someone had made a cotton picking machine and called it... well, you know. (they probably did, but I can't speak to that.)
I know...seems so unfair.
 
The guy should have enough common sense to not use this language in a public setting, regardless of the circumstances.

You can't point back 20, 30 years and defend your actions just because things were accepted that way.

I personally think he has some serious baggage and this was just the last straw...both for the Papa Johns and Louisville.
Here's my thing. And this is specific to this scenario. With something as massive as racism, I don't pull that trigger too fast. Especially in these kinds of situations where I don't know the man. I don't know the full story or scope of the situation. Nada. So I'm not going to call anyone out regarding something I think is so repugnant.

But here's my back story. I've been misquoted so much, I know how words can be twisted around. Sometimes intentionally but most of the time, not. Even local news has an angle they are going into a given story with. They will use soundbites to fit that narrative. I'm not some "fake News" guy. I've had interviews, I've done interviews. I know the terrain.

So while I look through this situation, I can recognize from owning my own business to having partners and a board, I know and can recognize the politics that could be hiding behind this story. just because of this story, there will be many in this world that will paint him as a racist. And they will only use this story as basis for that assessment.

That is just as sick as someone that is truly racist, in my opinion. It's assuming someone is lesser of a person, for no reason or a reason that has no basis. Literally disgusting behavior.
 
In this instance I think this has more to do with Schnatter's long established history as s d-bag about pretty much everything than it does with this conference call. He's been a PR nightmare for the company he ran from the time he became a public figure. This looks to me like the organizations around him seizing an opportunity to toss him overboard before the next tire fire starts. It's less a specific horrible instance like the clippers owner and more part of a pattern of behavior that's costing everyone around him.
 
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If you are black you can still use the N-word. Mostly in rap songs.

Then there is the word niggardly. This is actually pretty interesting.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controversies_about_the_word_"niggardly"
I'm not advocating for the use of the word, I'm simply making a point that its just a word. Yes, its and ugly vile word with horrible connotations, but there are other racial epithets with just as bad connotations that aren't universally banned. The fact that it is still used by musicians and Quentin Tarintino (who by the way catches little to no flak over his over-use of that word).

Its just become another political football on the landscape of "if I can use this to be offended, I will."

I mean, honestly, if Papa John had said "the N word" on the conference call I suspect the outrage would be the same, simply because he's a douche. He just handed them the ammo they needed.
 
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I firmly believe Trump could come into my small suburbia town, pull out a guy and shoot me in the face and claim I walked in front of the bullet. And no doubt someone on the street would claim that is what they saw. It is an incredible talent.

Not sure it doesn’t say more about some people’s unyielding allegiance to the person they voted for.
 
I'm not advocating for the use of the word, I'm simply making a point that its just a word. Yes, its and ugly vile word with horrible connotations, but there are other racial epithets with just as bad connotations that aren't universally banned. The fact that it is still used by musicians and Quentin Tarintino (who by the way catches little to no flak over his over-use of that word).

Its just become another political football on the landscape of "if I can use this to be offended, I will."

I mean, honestly, if Papa John had said "the N word" on the conference call I suspect the outrage would be the same, simply because he's a douche. He just handed them the ammo they needed.
So I apparently am out of the loop, to a certain extent. You say he's a douche... Why? I take it he's opened his mouth before? I might be taking back everything I've written!!! :oops:
 
So I apparently am out of the loop, to a certain extent. You say he's a douche... Why? I take it he's opened his mouth before? I might be taking back everything I've written!!! :oops:
he's conservative and opposed ACA because he'd have to raise the price of pizza. get the pitchforks...
 
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