Watching Florida State vs Georgia Tech with fans in the stands and the WIAA won’t even allow cross country.
Just ridiculous
- Thread starter kougkurt
- Start date
Yes, it is absolutely stupid. I'm sick of all this shit...
I thought watching games with no fans there would be boring. But remembered I still watch when the Cougs play the Cali schools on the road, and it’s still fun to watch
Stuff like tennis and golf and cross country should be able to go ahead. Anything solo and outdoors is perfectly safe, the only issues are travel logistics and stuff
I'm serious.
For the people who get sick from COVID but don't die, the multi-organ disease goes on and on. Months later they are still on oxygen, and we are just starting to hear about the neurologic and cognitive effects. The cardiac and thromboembolic consequences are a little better described, but not understood. This is really different than other viruses, and being careful at this point in time makes sense.
And there will be lawsuits, that will not be winnable for schools regardless of how many waivers have been signed.
For the people who get sick from COVID but don't die, the multi-organ disease goes on and on. Months later they are still on oxygen, and we are just starting to hear about the neurologic and cognitive effects. The cardiac and thromboembolic consequences are a little better described, but not understood. This is really different than other viruses, and being careful at this point in time makes sense.
And there will be lawsuits, that will not be winnable for schools regardless of how many waivers have been signed.
For the schools to be liable you'd need to demonstrate participation in the sport caused them to get Covid. Despite not having organized team activities, 53 student athletes have contracted the illness since August. People are going to get the bug, but giving them the regular testing that comes with participating in sports will likely reduce the likelihood they contract the disease.
Perhaps for people that get hospitalized. Certainly not for people that get sick. I know five people that got sick. None of them are experiencing or experienced what you describe here.
FYI, in California we have been back and forth (Not sure where we are at this moment) on whether covid is automatically a workers comp case, because if you are working then it is assumed that you got covid as a function of work exposure. I suspect that participation in college sports would fall within that guideline.
It is pretty clear at this point that there are long term consequences for many in having had covid. How many have long term consequences? That simply is not known yet, but there are enough examples to know that it is not statistically insignificant. Does that mean a temporary or a permanent disabilty? Again, we don't know. Some of the damage is likely to pass if nothing permanent is done pretty quickly...the blood clots, for example. If you dodge a stroke or organ damage within the first few months, maybe the clots stop forming. If they do, then maybe you are OK from then on. For other things, the cause & effect relationship is not well enough understood at this point to know. A few things are obvious, however. Cross country runners in a pack, breathing hard, would likely infect each other, just as choir practice did in Mt. Vernon. Sure, you could stagger start a cross country run sufficiently to avoid that level of people density, and if you were going to do it at all you would need to do that much. Probably have to have a really wide trail, as well. Eventually you have to ask yourself if it is worth it, and at what point you have minimized the risk enough to justify the exposure. Playing football with bubbled teams and officials in an empty stadium is a similar deal. But having screaming fans in the stands is just plain stupid.
It’s not pretty clear whether there are long term effects. We are six months in on this.
Get a year or two in and there will accumulate enough data to begin to determine patterns. There may or may not be - but it’s way premature to make conclusions on a data set that has no longevity.
Get a year or two in and there will accumulate enough data to begin to determine patterns. There may or may not be - but it’s way premature to make conclusions on a data set that has no longevity.
Or to live your life based on what ifs... a miserable existence.
I read a story this morning on just this issue. There could be many issues that we find out about in years. But, currently there are people that have recovered, but are not really recovered. They call themsevles, "long haulers".
Here are a few paragraph's from the article:
"Here’s what it feels like. My cough and fever disappeared after two weeks. But I was left unable to participate in my normal life. I woke up most days with severe pain in my limbs, like broken bones. I was so short of breath I could not make it up the two flights of stairs in the house without gasping. Severe headaches would come and go. Complex mental tasks were impossible. I’d find myself reading and re-reading the same email, unable to make sense of it.
Worst was the crushing fatigue. Every afternoon I would stagger to my couch and collapse asleep for hours in the middle of the day, regardless of what impact it had on my work or my family. I might feel better for a day or two, but I would inevitably crash again. I’d send hastily scribbled emails to cancel meetings before I passed out. The food I’d bought to cook my family for dinner rotted in the fridge."
Here is the link for the entire article:
The loneliness of long-haul COVID: My son and I have battled the coronavirus for six months | Opinion
We struggled to find doctors who took us seriously, but there are thousands of Americans like us.
www.inquirer.com
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I read a story this morning on just this issue. There could be many issues that we find out about in years. But, currently there are people that have recovered, but are not really recovered. They call themsevles, "long haulers".
Here are a few paragraph's from the article:
"Here’s what it feels like. My cough and fever disappeared after two weeks. But I was left unable to participate in my normal life. I woke up most days with severe pain in my limbs, like broken bones. I was so short of breath I could not make it up the two flights of stairs in the house without gasping. Severe headaches would come and go. Complex mental tasks were impossible. I’d find myself reading and re-reading the same email, unable to make sense of it.
Worst was the crushing fatigue. Every afternoon I would stagger to my couch and collapse asleep for hours in the middle of the day, regardless of what impact it had on my work or my family. I might feel better for a day or two, but I would inevitably crash again. I’d send hastily scribbled emails to cancel meetings before I passed out. The food I’d bought to cook my family for dinner rotted in the fridge."
Here is the link for the entire article:
The loneliness of long-haul COVID: My son and I have battled the coronavirus for six months | Opinion
We struggled to find doctors who took us seriously, but there are thousands of Americans like us.
One person's narrative is not scientific evidence. Sorry. Feel bad for her. Maybe she's a hypocondriatic. Who knows?
I'll wait. Maybe after the election we'll get some 'real 'data and multiple studies.
I'm sure some people will suffer long-term effects, just like some people suffer long-term effects from influenza. But, I don't see how the numbers would (or at least should) impact any shutdowns or policy decisions.
Since when have the numbers’ really mattered in this whole shutdown thing any way?
Did you even read the story? It was a man, not a woman. Kind of losing some credibility there with your response.
Yes, anecdotal evidence is not the strongest evidence. The story does reference that it is likely widespread and notes that there are support groups of people with this problem. I have read other stories regarding this issue as well. Heck, they stopped an entire trial based on one person maybe coming down with a condition.
Like their doctors apparently, I'm skeptical of these and similar claims. Why? Unlike polio, HIV, herpes, chicken pox or measles, which your body never fully sheds and/or impact your RNA, the same is not true Covid 19. Testing reveals that people shed the virus and test negative with 8-37 days. That is why most scientists doubt anyone will gain long term immunity. Your immune system doesn't continue fight infections that clear you system i.e. the common cold. If it no longer in your system, it isn't continuing making you ill.
Don't get me wrong Covid 19 can permanently damage organs/systems like the lungs, but you aren't going to get the equivalent of PPS, shingles or recurrent sores from it.
Frankly, the mother and son's symptoms are more typical of major depression than residuals of a viral infection. Had they continued to run a low grade fever, developed a rash, a chronic cough or other clinical signs of an ongoing infection response, then their would be something for their medical doctors to be concerned about. But you have a son still living with his mom, ... you think they might be a little emotionally beat up?
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I caught polo once...I started buying expensive ponies and wearing tight stretchy pants. It was quite unpleasant.
In turn, did you ever think about what they had to say clinically and forensically? Using what you were taught at WSU. There used to be support groups for things such as alien abduction, chemical hypersensitive, a multiple/split personal disorders. Why do you think they struggled to find a doctor who would take them seriously?
Seriously?
You haven't asked yourself AT ALL the political nature of this? Not even in a "nah..that's not even possible" kind of way?
Yet for some weird reason, the Blue states are locked up tighter than a drum and the Red states are pretty well business as usual?
That's just a coincidence......
You have way more faith than a Pentacostal if you aren't questioning WTF is going on.
Not with respect to positive results and deaths, no. Remember, this isn't just a uSA thing. Japan did postpone the Olympics and the All England club cancelled Wimbledon. It's not like the uSA came up with the idea of sheltering in place and closing bars and restaurants.
The blue state's are more populated, were affected more severely earlier and were/ are following the prevailing science. While the red state's seem to be taking their lead from the misinformation coming out of our national "leader". That's all I have to say about that.
Trump’s an asshole. So?
Do they speak in tongues at the Church of Inslee? Or pass the plate at the non socially distanced riots at Temple Wheeler?
That is a myth that red states are following Trump. They are watching the same numbers and have the same conclusions: the panic is overboatd and economic shutdowns are suicidal.
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Why do you hate Doctors Fauci and Birx? You do realize that all the "misinformation" from Trump came right from them, don't you? You do remember when Fauci said the virus was nothing to worry about, right? And I am sure you recall when Fauci said there was no reason to wear masks, correct?
Yes, I am sure you recall all those things. Come on, man-pay attention. This thing was a huge unknown, we were lied to by China to start with and the steps that China took and did not take led to the spread of the virus throughout the world.
BTW, when Trump took early actions to limit people coming into the country from China and then Europe (the early hot spots) did you support him or support the likes of Biden, Pelosi, and Schumer when they castigated the president as just being a xenophobe?
If you care to go back and watch Fauci and his testimony before Congress (Feb 23, I believe) he made clear in his remarks about the threat " at this time", which is a reasonable conclusion to accept based on the data at that time specifically. As for masks it has been argued that the concern was for keeping them available to those who needed them most.
I rely in part on information from a web site called science based medicin and they even had articles back then questioning the effectiveness of masks in that they would be worn incorrectly, for too long and mainly might give people a false sense of security wherebynthey engage in even more risky behavior.
What you are missing I think, is that the difference between trump and these experts is that when more information came along, they adapted to that additional information, while trump went the opposite direction and then doubled down on that. Navarro and Azar both expressed grave warnings to trump in January and As made clear by his statements to Woodward, he at least understood them (although might not have believed them) and then proceeded to mislead us.
It seems you overexagerate the effects of the travel ban. In hindsight your political opponents overreacted for sure. But the ban was not total and was the boldest yet likely most insignificant things trump did unless you believe him when he says that singlehandedly saved "millions of lives". Again, remember, when New information comes to light, experts change their assessments. Trump does not. He just continues to mislead and lie. If you are comfortable in that camp, good luck to you. Tahtsat
Do they have the same conclusions? Seems the mere fact we are acknowledging there seems to a difference contradicts that? Taihtsat
People who don't want to see something aren't going to see it - they just see the politicizing as "truth".
The entire west coast is burning, with loss of life and property, and our 3 blue regents took time out of their busy schedules to tell us a) how they were personally stopping the fires and b) how global warming caused them. Far be it from any of them to let a good tragedy pass by without throwing political spin on it.
Then we agree! You missed the point if you mean to suggest I think Inslee can do no wrong. I think it's time to at least move to phase 3.
I think its reasonable to defend his actions back in March through May. But now we can maybe do both a fuller opening with certain hygienic mandates in place.
It's a tough one to be sure of. If you fully open back up and let people balance the risks for themselves I get that. But we know fatalities will spike. Who dies and who gets seriously ill we seem to know more or at least can guess better. And it sounds callous to downplay or diminish the worth of the demographics of those most likely to get infected seriously.
I go back and forth. Back neatly 1000 people are still dying per day nationwide. But then I hear of these spiked numbers in these college towns (Pullman specifically) and yet there doesn't seems to be an uptick in hospitalizations or deaths amongst that crowd. All the MLB players that tested positive and yet nothing serious came of it. I don't , mind saying I don't know. I'm okay though with still going forward with public caution. Taihtsat
Just for reference:
If King Inslee moves forward (or Queen Brown) despite having ridiculously low numbers (remember when hospitalizations and deaths were the metric, but now its "cases"... which effectively means nothing for multiple reasons), then their whole "mask up or die" propoganda will have been proven to be the horseshit it actually is.
Further - though the numbers of deaths are increasing, they are nowhere near where any person or any of the models predicted. We were told unequivocally that there would be 1MM+ deaths by this time, WITH all the precautions and masks - THATS how dangerous this virus is. They estimated 1.5MM by next March. We aren't even close.
Here's another example of fuzzy math/ modelling: the "Sturgis mass spreader" contingent estimated that the rally is going to cost$12BB in healthcare costs, based purely on modelling. This is the same modelling that gave us the 1MM dead number, and that allowed them to estimate that, despite the actual national numbers (4.3MM cases, 300k hospitalizations) there are actually 47MM cases and 1MM hospitalizations. Thats a 10x and 3.3x factor. That is insane that statistics with that much variation is being used to set and control policy.
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You mean one is being cautious while the other is throwing caution to the wind?
God forbid we try something else between full on cautious lockdown of life and full on throwing caution to the wind.
Contrary to current prevailing thought there are other options between black or white. It used to be called compromise and problem solving.
Quite imply what are our sources for the predictive models of 1 to 1.5 million deaths? And when were they made? Same for the 128 billion?
The CDC. As recently as June, when they were predicting/ modelling the second wave. "Remember, its not 'if' but 'when'."
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The Imperial College London model predicted 2.2 million dead Americans. This was in March.
