Kind of disappointing...

[wulffui]

... to see how many people are "advocating" for the idea that Simmons should have been deceptive about his future so that we could have gotten a one year bump from recruits who wanted to play for a team with him on staff.

I don't like seeing the class torpedoed, but I like less the idea that grown men on here want a grown man like Simmons to lie to teenagers, for the benefit of us as fans.

 

[ElComanche]

I may be wrong on this but i read somewhere where UCLA s defensive coordinator stayed until after NSD?

 

[CougEd]

Grown men, coaches, lie to recruits all the time...it is part of the game

Wulff hung on to Etherige just long enough to secure Gonzales and Jacobson.

It happens all the time. What you are asking is for Leach to play by Bill Doba's ethics and rules, while everyone else is playing a whole different game.

Why go to a gun fight with a steak knife?

 

[CrimsonWazzu]

Originally posted by wulffui:
... to see how many people are "advocating" for the idea that Simmons should have been deceptive about his future so that we could have gotten a one year bump from recruits who wanted to play for a team with him on staff.

I don't like seeing the class torpedoed, but I like less the idea that grown men on here want a grown man like Simmons to lie to teenagers, for the benefit of us as fans.

I see you have not lost your innocence.

 

[kayak15]

Re: Grown men, coaches, lie to recruits all the time...it is part of the game


I will refrain from making a comment about losing our *********.

That said I can't really muster any anger directed toward Simmons. Stoops changed his offensive philosophy towards more of a passing style. This opened up a spot for Simmons. The timing sucked but it is what it is. The timing created a no-win situation for us/Leach/Simmons. Should Simmons pass up an opportunity for career advancement and a chance to go back home at a higher salary? Or should he secretly take the offer and then lie to the kids he was recruiting about his intentions?

This may be the way the big boys do it but, quite frankly, it is sleazy and I do not want to see this type of behavior at dear old Wazzu. We do not need to be naïve babes-in-the-woods but a reasonable ethical standard would be nice. There is a line somewhere and flat out lying is over it. Spin the facts a bit in your favor, put your best foot forward and all that but dishonesty and Toshian coffee cups etc. is something that I would hope most of us would not tolerate. "Little white lies", exaggerations and embellishments I understand and am fine with. Big Boy sleaze, no thank you.

Maybe in some parts of the country this previously mentioned ethical lapse is taken for granted but in this neck of the woods this sort of recruiting comes back to bite the perpetrator in the ass. High school coaches and prospects quickly realize that so-and-so can't be trusted any further than you can shot put him. I am unable to imagine Leach ever putting us in that position. He has a reputation for frankness and honesty. This probably cost up the Rypien (sp?) kid. I strongly believe that he told him that it would take some time to master the air raid and his chances of starting as a freshman were rather minimal. But I notice that other recruits have commented on the staff's honesty and appreciated it. Without any evidence whatsoever to support it I suspect that this has been a recruiting advantage for the staff.

Let us keep on recruiting the way we have. It may cost us some commits but will, I suspect, attract an equal number of others.

 

[Coug1990]

Re: Grown men, coaches, lie to recruits all the time...it is part of the game

Originally posted by kayak15:

I will refrain from making a comment about losing our *********.

That said I can't really muster any anger directed toward Simmons. Stoops changed his offensive philosophy towards more of a passing style. This opened up a spot for Simmons. The timing sucked but it is what it is. The timing created a no-win situation for us/Leach/Simmons. Should Simmons pass up an opportunity for career advancement and a chance to go back home at a higher salary? Or should he secretly take the offer and then lie to the kids he was recruiting about his intentions?

This may be the way the big boys do it but, quite frankly, it is sleazy and I do not want to see this type of behavior at dear old Wazzu. We do not need to be naïve babes-in-the-woods but a reasonable ethical standard would be nice. There is a line somewhere and flat out lying is over it. Spin the facts a bit in your favor, put your best foot forward and all that but dishonesty and Toshian coffee cups etc. is something that I would hope most of us would not tolerate. "Little white lies", exaggerations and embellishments I understand and am fine with. Big Boy sleaze, no thank you.

Maybe in some parts of the country this previously mentioned ethical lapse is taken for granted but in this neck of the woods this sort of recruiting comes back to bite the perpetrator in the ass. High school coaches and prospects quickly realize that so-and-so can't be trusted any further than you can shot put him. I am unable to imagine Leach ever putting us in that position. He has a reputation for frankness and honesty. This probably cost up the Rypien (sp?) kid. I strongly believe that he told him that it would take some time to master the air raid and his chances of starting as a freshman were rather minimal. But I notice that other recruits have commented on the staff's honesty and appreciated it. Without any evidence whatsoever to support it I suspect that this has been a recruiting advantage for the staff.

Let us keep on recruiting the way we have. It may cost us some commits but will, I suspect, attract an equal number of others.

I agree. It sucks that Simmons left, but he did what he thought was best for himself and family. I wish he would have thought what was best was to stay in Pullman. But, I don't know all the particulars of the situation. He may have gotten an offer he could not refuse.

It was unfortunate that every one of his recruits flipped. But, it shows that many of those players were really not wanting to be at WSU.

 

[YakiCoug]

Re: Grown men, coaches, lie to recruits all the time...it is part of the game

Originally posted by Coug1990:

Originally posted by kayak15:

I will refrain from making a comment about losing our *********.

That said I can't really muster any anger directed toward Simmons. Stoops changed his offensive philosophy towards more of a passing style. This opened up a spot for Simmons. The timing sucked but it is what it is. The timing created a no-win situation for us/Leach/Simmons. Should Simmons pass up an opportunity for career advancement and a chance to go back home at a higher salary? Or should he secretly take the offer and then lie to the kids he was recruiting about his intentions?

This may be the way the big boys do it but, quite frankly, it is sleazy and I do not want to see this type of behavior at dear old Wazzu. We do not need to be naïve babes-in-the-woods but a reasonable ethical standard would be nice. There is a line somewhere and flat out lying is over it. Spin the facts a bit in your favor, put your best foot forward and all that but dishonesty and Toshian coffee cups etc. is something that I would hope most of us would not tolerate. "Little white lies", exaggerations and embellishments I understand and am fine with. Big Boy sleaze, no thank you.

Maybe in some parts of the country this previously mentioned ethical lapse is taken for granted but in this neck of the woods this sort of recruiting comes back to bite the perpetrator in the ass. High school coaches and prospects quickly realize that so-and-so can't be trusted any further than you can shot put him. I am unable to imagine Leach ever putting us in that position. He has a reputation for frankness and honesty. This probably cost up the Rypien (sp?) kid. I strongly believe that he told him that it would take some time to master the air raid and his chances of starting as a freshman were rather minimal. But I notice that other recruits have commented on the staff's honesty and appreciated it. Without any evidence whatsoever to support it I suspect that this has been a recruiting advantage for the staff.

Let us keep on recruiting the way we have. It may cost us some commits but will, I suspect, attract an equal number of others.

I agree. It sucks that Simmons left, but he did what he thought was best for himself and family. I wish he would have thought what was best was to stay in Pullman. But, I don't know all the particulars of the situation. He may have gotten an offer he could not refuse.

It was unfortunate that every one of his recruits flipped. But, it shows that many of those players were really not wanting to be at WSU.

Perhaps a bigger question is WHEN did Oklahoma offer Simmons? Was it before or after Dahu Green committed? Did OU have any shot at Green WITHOUT Simmons? Is this akin to the UW Sarksleazian's throwing wads of cash at Cal AC Tosh Lupoi to get Shaq Thompson and other Bear recruits to come to Seattle? There are no rules against this, of course.

 

[kayak15]

Re: Grown men, coaches, lie to recruits all the time...it is part of the game


Yaki: Here is the apparent timeline:

Jan. 7 Green verbals to WSU

Jan. 13 Lincoln Riley is hired by Ok. as OC

Jan. 29 Simmons rumors start to appear.

Jan. 30 Ok. offers Green

Feb. 2 Green flips to Ok.

So it appears that Simmons was interviewed shortly prior to Jan. 29th. Two days later or thereabout they offer Green. Make that what you will.

 

[ElComanche]

Dahu Green is just the tip of the iceberg. Simmons will now be recruiting California for Oklahoma.. Of course he has already established contact with some prime recruits on coug money. It sucks but it is what it is. It is kind of like the gift that keeps giving.The loss of" innocence" happened a long time ago for Simmons who left for a better deal despite Leach s loyalty to him