Would he resign?
- Thread starter FedWayCoug
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Re: Would he resign? really ?
the season was disappointing. but even Joey Harrington last night pointed to the young taLent on this team and he can see the future looks positive.
the season was disappointing. but even Joey Harrington last night pointed to the young taLent on this team and he can see the future looks positive.
Not even close. Look at another Cougar sport in women's basketball. June Daugherty had a terrible record for a long time. It took her until her seventh year to have a winning record. Remember that WSU has long been one of the worst teams in women's basketball going back decades. Last season the LadyCougs were 9-9 in conference. This season, they are 5-2 and over the weekend knocked off 8th ranked Maryland.
Good coaches are good coaches. It tool June a long time to teach the Cougars how to win. Teaching a team how to win is one of the hardest things to do. Leach is a good coach. Fortunately, Moos is not a fan that thinks emotionally. Moos will be patient and so should you. We all will look back in a few years and laugh that some thought Leach was in over his head.
To answer the original question
Hell No. At least I hope not. That would put this program in a tail spin we'd NEVER recover from. Could you imagine
The perception wouldn't be, "CML can't get it done". It would be "WSU is such a dive, even the international vaunted CML couldn't save it." We'd be screwed in every way, sideways. To further that point, do we know that this wouldn't be the perception if next year we still suck and we fire CML? I'm telling you, we need patience. Like it or not, we are all in, with CML. You don't have to like it, but understand it.
To react to 1990: This year was NOT a good year. All year there seemed to be promise behind every game. Then with the last 3 games or so, there just didn't seem to be that "hope" or "feel" behind the games. Now we all look at the record and forget the way some of those games went down.
The COMPLETELY unacceptable games, IMO, are Rutgers, Nevada and UW. Beyond that, all I saw was promise, good playing with head-scratchers mixed in OK young team. The wheels started to fall off with our ST. Our Defense was never good this year, but it seemed our Offense was able to get us sooooo close, some started blaming the O when the D was the negative impetus. But those unacceptable games were just that, unacceptable.
The wild-card now, IMHO, is obviously whom will be our DC. If we can find a coach that can bring these players together Look out.
Because I look at it this way. Yeah, we lost to Cal while they scored every time they possessed the ball (as I recall) in the second half of the game. But if we could have made ONE stop That would have given our Offense another opportunity to score! TWO stops, guess what, we score again. Offense feeds off stops by the D. Without stops, Offense can only do so much. It's a boat race, which is what we saw in the middle of the season. So I guess I'm completely bummed, not happy, and yes critical of our program right now. But I don't know what CML could do that he hasn't done.
The real question is what 1990 brought up is he a good coach? Does anyone REALLY doubt that? Look at his past. He's done superb at every stop he's been at. So now he's working on THIS program. We all know WSU has a horrible, recent past. We also know WSU has certain characteristics that some perceive as challenging. So I'm looking at those 2 major influences, with multiple smaller facets after that, that they are working on. I'm patient.
I will say this, and I've preached this from day 1 I started posting here. Expectations (aka crystal ball crap) are a bitch. Some are getting bit by that bug right now. I DO expect improvement and I see SOME improvement in areas but overall this was a down-tick season. Thus I'm critical, just not Armageddon style.
To react to 1990: This year was NOT a good year. All year there seemed to be promise behind every game. Then with the last 3 games or so, there just didn't seem to be that "hope" or "feel" behind the games. Now we all look at the record and forget the way some of those games went down.
The COMPLETELY unacceptable games, IMO, are Rutgers, Nevada and UW. Beyond that, all I saw was promise, good playing with head-scratchers mixed in OK young team. The wheels started to fall off with our ST. Our Defense was never good this year, but it seemed our Offense was able to get us sooooo close, some started blaming the O when the D was the negative impetus. But those unacceptable games were just that, unacceptable.
The wild-card now, IMHO, is obviously whom will be our DC. If we can find a coach that can bring these players together Look out.
Because I look at it this way. Yeah, we lost to Cal while they scored every time they possessed the ball (as I recall) in the second half of the game. But if we could have made ONE stop That would have given our Offense another opportunity to score! TWO stops, guess what, we score again. Offense feeds off stops by the D. Without stops, Offense can only do so much. It's a boat race, which is what we saw in the middle of the season. So I guess I'm completely bummed, not happy, and yes critical of our program right now. But I don't know what CML could do that he hasn't done.
The real question is what 1990 brought up is he a good coach? Does anyone REALLY doubt that? Look at his past. He's done superb at every stop he's been at. So now he's working on THIS program. We all know WSU has a horrible, recent past. We also know WSU has certain characteristics that some perceive as challenging. So I'm looking at those 2 major influences, with multiple smaller facets after that, that they are working on. I'm patient.
I will say this, and I've preached this from day 1 I started posting here. Expectations (aka crystal ball crap) are a bitch. Some are getting bit by that bug right now. I DO expect improvement and I see SOME improvement in areas but overall this was a down-tick season. Thus I'm critical, just not Armageddon style.
There are people that think Leach is not good. Heck, Jim Moore is one of those guys. Of course, there were people leading the charge to fire Mike Price at different times during his stay at WSU. Price didn't make a bowl until his fourth year. It took Leach two.
This was not a good year. Any year with only three wins is not good. Still, while there was bad, there were a lot of good this year too. The offense was good for most of the year. If special teams just becomes average, this team takes a big leap. If the defense is not horrible, but just bad, this team takes a huge leap.
You know
I think it is about CML's personality. I use Moore as an example. At the core of it, I agree with Jim... It has to do with that interview a few years back. Has nothing to do with CML's coaching. CML's coaching may fuel the fire but it isn't the core problem.
I think if people were honest, I'd say this is true of a lot of people that don't like CML's "coaching". The problem with CML's situation? If he was winning, these decisions would be those of the Mad Scientist. As it is, they are the "reason for the losses". I think they are the low-lying fruit, like the going for it on 4th down, The Leach Beach, the not giving out injury reports, the short answers, he's an author (thus not spending enough time with the team), etc. etc.. These decisions aren't the reason for the L, but they don't help. I truly do believe CML's personality is more the issue, not his coaching. His decisions just don't help their perception. I believe CML is one of the best coaches in the NCAA. You don't build TT into a national powerhouse on accident. That just doesn't fall into your lap. They were coached well. They bought in fully.
I think if people were honest, I'd say this is true of a lot of people that don't like CML's "coaching". The problem with CML's situation? If he was winning, these decisions would be those of the Mad Scientist. As it is, they are the "reason for the losses". I think they are the low-lying fruit, like the going for it on 4th down, The Leach Beach, the not giving out injury reports, the short answers, he's an author (thus not spending enough time with the team), etc. etc.. These decisions aren't the reason for the L, but they don't help. I truly do believe CML's personality is more the issue, not his coaching. His decisions just don't help their perception. I believe CML is one of the best coaches in the NCAA. You don't build TT into a national powerhouse on accident. That just doesn't fall into your lap. They were coached well. They bought in fully.
You ate forgetting the UA game. It was over at half.
And no, I don't think he is a good coach.
I have seen some pretty piss poor coaching here...as well as selection of staff.
His offense is dated an easy to defend. There is a reason none of his former assistants run it.
What he did at Tech can only get you so far. This is a what have you done for me lately biz.
And no, I don't think he is a good coach.
I have seen some pretty piss poor coaching here...as well as selection of staff.
His offense is dated an easy to defend. There is a reason none of his former assistants run it.
What he did at Tech can only get you so far. This is a what have you done for me lately biz.
No, they just never EVER threw the ball in the Big 12 before 1998, never mind that Leach was an OC at OU- so Leachs offense was pants pissingly terrifying.
And the Big 12 has nothing but doormats- never mind that the traditional doormats were generally pretty successful under Leach's tenure. And the 11 out of 12 years with a bowl prior to this year, that's mostly because he got an exemption to get his two and three win teams in.
And the Big 12 has nothing but doormats- never mind that the traditional doormats were generally pretty successful under Leach's tenure. And the 11 out of 12 years with a bowl prior to this year, that's mostly because he got an exemption to get his two and three win teams in.
Price knocked out of the park with his first recruiting class (1990, Erickson left after the 1989 class was signed), signing blue chippers like Bledsoe, Mobley and others. Also he was 13-20, 12-20 against D1 schools. In those days, that wasn't seen as that bad. After 2 Rosebowls and 10-10-10, 12-20, just doesn't cut it anymore. Leach has gone 9-25 against D1, has signed no blue chip recruits, and he is our first big time hire and must bear the weight of expectation that some chump from Weber State didn't have to worry about.
Apples and Oranges.
Anyhow, Leach ain't going anywhere ... we all know that!
He wasn't paid 2.5 mil a yr...and was 6-1(or pretty close to it) before Gossen got hurt.
Are you still going to compare Leach to Price after he wins 4 games compared to Price's 9 in yr 4?
Put down the Pom Poms tron.
Are you still going to compare Leach to Price after he wins 4 games compared to Price's 9 in yr 4?
Put down the Pom Poms tron.
I remember sitting in Martin Stadium and watching Wyoming bitch slap us in 1990 and then seeing us lose to Frenso State the very next year. In Martin. Also Price only played 11 games and 8 conference games. I would argue that their records would be quite similar after 3 years.
BH..moving forward...from 91 to 92 and 2014 to 2015 do you feel
more comfortable with Luke Falk/Peyton Bender or Drew Bledsoe. Ron Childs, Lew Bush, McClanahan, Hunter, Burns, Mobley Rushing and some pretty average to below average lineman that we knew about (Eaton hadn't played a down), heart of a lion, and mediocre Oline or Cooper, Vaelo, Pelluer, Allison, Palacio, Tuiulu, White, Brown, Falk/Bender Morrow/Wicks, and a host of receivers?
more comfortable with Luke Falk/Peyton Bender or Drew Bledsoe. Ron Childs, Lew Bush, McClanahan, Hunter, Burns, Mobley Rushing and some pretty average to below average lineman that we knew about (Eaton hadn't played a down), heart of a lion, and mediocre Oline or Cooper, Vaelo, Pelluer, Allison, Palacio, Tuiulu, White, Brown, Falk/Bender Morrow/Wicks, and a host of receivers?
Re: BH..moving forward...from 91 to 92 and 2014 to 2015 do you feel
you're using the advantage of hindsight, Ed. Hardly fair.
you're using the advantage of hindsight, Ed. Hardly fair.
Re: BH..moving forward...from 91 to 92 and 2014 to 2015 do you feel
Ed, I did not think we would win 9 games in 92 after losing the last two games by a combined score of 105-35. We lost to UCLA 44-3, UW 56-21, and Fresno State 34-30, all three teams we beat the next year. I think this team can win 7 games next year and also lose 7 games. I think they can beat, Cal, Rutgers, Wyoming, Portland State, Colorado, Oregon State and ASU in Pullman. It's funny how you mention those players, but you don't mention the players that are redshirting like LaRue, Farrar, Mata'afa, Kingston, Leniu, Hoyd, Tapa or that Aaron Porter will be here as well. I have no clue what next year will bring, but I do see a lot more talent after this year then I did after 2010. If the defense gives up 36 points a game we will lose.
Ed, I did not think we would win 9 games in 92 after losing the last two games by a combined score of 105-35. We lost to UCLA 44-3, UW 56-21, and Fresno State 34-30, all three teams we beat the next year. I think this team can win 7 games next year and also lose 7 games. I think they can beat, Cal, Rutgers, Wyoming, Portland State, Colorado, Oregon State and ASU in Pullman. It's funny how you mention those players, but you don't mention the players that are redshirting like LaRue, Farrar, Mata'afa, Kingston, Leniu, Hoyd, Tapa or that Aaron Porter will be here as well. I have no clue what next year will bring, but I do see a lot more talent after this year then I did after 2010. If the defense gives up 36 points a game we will lose.
Re: BH..moving forward...from 91 to 92 and 2014 to 2015 do you feel
+1, Brent. I also vaguely remember, at least one more transfer that will be here for the NEXT year, don't we? Or is that Porter?
I think LaRue is going to be a stud, let alone all the D boys that are coming up that you mentioned.
One selling point? Whatever DC comes in, will have a young, but talented pool of players. If they can coach worth a lick, this upcoming D class, is going to be pretty dang cool.
+1, Brent. I also vaguely remember, at least one more transfer that will be here for the NEXT year, don't we? Or is that Porter?
I think LaRue is going to be a stud, let alone all the D boys that are coming up that you mentioned.
One selling point? Whatever DC comes in, will have a young, but talented pool of players. If they can coach worth a lick, this upcoming D class, is going to be pretty dang cool.
