ADVERTISEMENT

WSU has a massive decision to make with Kyle Smith

CougPatrol

Hall Of Fame
Dec 8, 2006
13,489
4,337
113
Here we are, seemingly at the end of all things, and WSU has a potentially once in a lifetime coach on their payroll in a major men's sport. Kyle Smith is our version of Mark Few. We can't keep up with the power schools in football, but with a commitment to men's (and women's) basketball, we can be fixtures in elite West coast basketball. We have a campus vibe and an alumni base who will readily jump on the bandwagon if we become consistently good.

WSU had better be thinking about the future, and for the first time in my Coug fan lifetime, our future doesn't revolve around football. Sure, we'll always prioritize football, but it makes sense on so many levels to shift some money around and completely go all-in with basketball. Take a fat chunk of the settlement money and tell Kyle Smith to write his own number on the check. Build him the best house on the Palouse, get serious about a new basketball arena, and make a seismic shift in athletic focus. A sport where we can actually compete at a high level by participating regionally.

Instead of chasing football fairytales in a reshuffled ACC or Big12 conference, realize what you have in Kyle Smith and what 10 years of this would do for our campus. If he leaves because he wants to, that's his choice, but don't roll over here. Instead of trying to punch above our weight class vs. Oregon and UW in an unwinnable football spending war, settle into the G5 in football and focus hard on developing the top-5 "other programs" on campus. Men's and women's basketball, volleyball, soccer, and baseball. Youth and collegiate football on the West coast is dying. Recognize that and adapt.
 
Last edited:
Here we are, seemingly at the end of all things, and WSU has potentially a once in a lifetime coach on their payroll in a major men's sport. Kyle Smith is our version of Mark Few. We can't keep up with the power schools in football, but with a commitment to men's (and women's) basketball, we can be fixtures in elite West coast basketball. We have a campus vibe and an alumni base who will readily jump on the bandwagon if we become consistently good.

WSU had better be thinking about the future, and for the first time in my Coug fan lifetime, our future doesn't revolve around football. Sure, we'll always prioritize football, but it makes sense on so many levels to shift some money around and completely go all-in with basketball. Take a fat chunk of the settlement money and tell Kyle Smith to write his own number on the check. Build him the best house on the Palouse, get serious about a new basketball arena, and make a seismic shift in athletic focus. A sport where we can actually compete at a high level by participating regionally.

Instead chasing football fairytales in a reshuffled ACC or Big12 conference, realize what you have in Kyle Smith and what 10 years of this would do for our campus. If he leaves because he wants to, that's his choice, but don't roll over here. Instead of trying to punch above our weight class vs. Oregon and UW in an unwinnable football spending war, settle into the G5 in football and focus hard on developing the top-5 "other programs" on campus. Men's and women's basketball, volleyball, soccer, and baseball. Youth and collegiate football on the West coast is dying. Recognize that and adapt.
Great post and completely agree. I like your perspective on the lost cause FB is. Yeah we will hang in there. But a successful BB team can bring in the bucks and recognition too. Just look 75 miles north. A BB team with a pedestrian university attached.

Link below (2023 I guess) shows Kyle at $1.5 million and few at Gonzaga at $1.9.


A big-time boost for Kyle (and assistants) is a no-brainer. Unfortunately, Schulz and Chun have, well, no brains.
 
Great post and completely agree. I like your perspective on the lost cause FB is. Yeah we will hang in there. But a successful BB team can bring in the bucks and recognition too. Just look 75 miles north. A BB team with a pedestrian university attached.

Link below (2023 I guess) shows Kyle at $1.5 million and few at Gonzaga at $1.9.


A big-time boost for Kyle (and assistants) is a no-brainer. Unfortunately, Schulz and Chun have, well, no brains.

Yep, that's why it will have to be WSU fans that PUSH, ALMOST force Schultz, Chun to pay Smith more, etc.

And that won't happen UNLESS WSU goes at least 3-1 in last 4 games then 2 wins in PAC tourny, then a #3,4,5,6 seed in NCAA tourny, then Elite 8 in NCAA.

That would wake up the fans enough to try to push, force Schultz, Chun into giving Smith more money, etc.
 
I totally agree on everything said about keeping Smith and about basketball vs football potential. The only real issue is conference alignment. If we end up in a non power 5 conference (which looks likely) does it make sense to pay power 5 wages? It has worked for GU , so not saying it doesn’t make sense but certainly a legitimate question.
 
I couldn't agree more. I sure hope Chun surprises us and finds a way to keep Smith. IF he can do that, perhaps that helps us hang onto a couple players, too. ...Does anyone know if any of the current players receive any NIL money?
 
  • Like
Reactions: mikalalas
Smith is ranked 66th in Salary in D-1(per USAToday)@ $1.5 / yr. Both tOSU and UW (neither pay in top 20) will sign their next coaches for more than double that next season.

WSU has averaged 3,325 fans per home game since January for perhaps, the best team in our history. This doesn’t scream of rabid fan support.

Will we see fan support finally wake from hibernation for the final three home games?

Hope so! See you there!
 
  • Like
Reactions: COUGinNCW
What I'm talking about doesn't just relate to a higher salary. WSU needs to fully commit to basketball for the first time in program in history, and make Kyle Smith the center point of the conversation. Salary, new basketball arena, smarter non-conference scheduling. Take a chunk of the P2 settlement money and make this happen.
 
Here we are, seemingly at the end of all things, and WSU has a potentially once in a lifetime coach on their payroll in a major men's sport. Kyle Smith is our version of Mark Few. We can't keep up with the power schools in football, but with a commitment to men's (and women's) basketball, we can be fixtures in elite West coast basketball. We have a campus vibe and an alumni base who will readily jump on the bandwagon if we become consistently good.

WSU had better be thinking about the future, and for the first time in my Coug fan lifetime, our future doesn't revolve around football. Sure, we'll always prioritize football, but it makes sense on so many levels to shift some money around and completely go all-in with basketball. Take a fat chunk of the settlement money and tell Kyle Smith to write his own number on the check. Build him the best house on the Palouse, get serious about a new basketball arena, and make a seismic shift in athletic focus. A sport where we can actually compete at a high level by participating regionally.

Instead of chasing football fairytales in a reshuffled ACC or Big12 conference, realize what you have in Kyle Smith and what 10 years of this would do for our campus. If he leaves because he wants to, that's his choice, but don't roll over here. Instead of trying to punch above our weight class vs. Oregon and UW in an unwinnable football spending war, settle into the G5 in football and focus hard on developing the top-5 "other programs" on campus. Men's and women's basketball, volleyball, soccer, and baseball. Youth and collegiate football on the West coast is dying. Recognize that and adapt.

I get the point, but let's not pretend that there is anything to suggest that there is any likelihood that we are going to experience long term success in basketball. I agree that Chun needs to sit down with Smith and have a real conversation about what he needs to get to stay at WSU and do what we can to meet those needs.

The harsh reality is that there is nothing that we can do if Smith is looking for a) money or b) the prestige of an elite job. The teams from the "power" leagues are going to have tens of millions of dollars per year more than WSU and there is no logical way for us to compete. Beasley could use some work to make quality of life better for the team, but in terms of the arena itself....it's good. Having watched a lot of games at Allen Fieldhouse....basketball programs aren't defined by the quality of the concessions or toilets in the arena. We are a lot better off working with Smith on things that he finds important than spending money on an arena that we aren't going to be able to afford and that we haven't proven that we need.

This year is the first time in 16 years that we are even ranked. It's great but let's not pretend that we are suddenly something that we aren't and that we should sell out everything else in the hopes that we can suddenly change. And again, everything revolves around Kyle Smith. If he isn't in love with Pullman already and wanting to stay...there is nothing we can do to avoid the inevitable. That said, let me repeat that I agree that we need to do everything that we can reasonably do to retain Smith.
 
I get the point, but let's not pretend that there is anything to suggest that there is any likelihood that we are going to experience long term success in basketball. I agree that Chun needs to sit down with Smith and have a real conversation about what he needs to get to stay at WSU and do what we can to meet those needs.

The harsh reality is that there is nothing that we can do if Smith is looking for a) money or b) the prestige of an elite job. The teams from the "power" leagues are going to have tens of millions of dollars per year more than WSU and there is no logical way for us to compete. Beasley could use some work to make quality of life better for the team, but in terms of the arena itself....it's good. Having watched a lot of games at Allen Fieldhouse....basketball programs aren't defined by the quality of the concessions or toilets in the arena. We are a lot better off working with Smith on things that he finds important than spending money on an arena that we aren't going to be able to afford and that we haven't proven that we need.

This year is the first time in 16 years that we are even ranked. It's great but let's not pretend that we are suddenly something that we aren't and that we should sell out everything else in the hopes that we can suddenly change. And again, everything revolves around Kyle Smith. If he isn't in love with Pullman already and wanting to stay...there is nothing we can do to avoid the inevitable. That said, let me repeat that I agree that we need to do everything that we can reasonably do to retain Smith.
I disagree. If we keep smith we can build on THIS. This team loves playing for him. He’s going to be putting guys in the NBA (Wells is flying up the chart IMO).

You haven’t do whatever you can to keep this momentum going. I’m going to spend a couple hundred bucks myself these last three games when I normally probably wouldn’t. Every dollar adds up and every fan that joins the party makes the atmosphere better for those who aren’t quite there yet.

Think if Bennett would have stayed. I have no question he would have continued to build and Beasley would become a place you had to be. Gotta do everything we can to keep Smith.
 
I totally agree on everything said about keeping Smith and about basketball vs football potential. The only real issue is conference alignment. If we end up in a non power 5 conference (which looks likely) does it make sense to pay power 5 wages? It has worked for GU , so not saying it doesn’t make sense but certainly a legitimate question.
Huh?

You pay market rate for winning coaches, what does conference have to do with it? The only factor that needs to be considered is budget; do we have enough to pay Smith and his asst commensurate with a mid-level tourney team?
 
I disagree. If we keep smith we can build on THIS. This team loves playing for him. He’s going to be putting guys in the NBA (Wells is flying up the chart IMO).

You haven’t do whatever you can to keep this momentum going. I’m going to spend a couple hundred bucks myself these last three games when I normally probably wouldn’t. Every dollar adds up and every fan that joins the party makes the atmosphere better for those who aren’t quite there yet.


Think if Bennett would have stayed. I have no question he would have continued to build and Beasley would become a place you had to be. Gotta do everything we can to keep Smith.

You really think this team loves playing for him
 
  • Like
Reactions: Coug90
Not being in a P5 conference could hurt, but in CBB, that doesn't hurt as much as in football.

Smith's wife is from Eastern WA and I haven't heard otherwise they're not comfortable in Pullman. Based on a previous The Athletic article on Smith, they're going to make sure the location is comfortable enough for his son, Bo.

I think it's likely he stays unless the NIL boost isn't coming (Smith I'm sure wants to see fans care and want to support to keep players) or WSU is stupid ala Price, makes a short-sighted decision, and doesn't make the investment (when in the long run, it's going to cost more).

Article for those interested: https://theathletic.com/1660213/202...his-biggest-challenge-i-cant-help-my-own-son/

EDIT: spelling.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: mikalalas
Huh?

You pay market rate for winning coaches, what does conference have to do with it? The only factor that needs to be considered is budget; do we have enough to pay Smith and his asst commensurate with a mid-level tourney team?
The conference you’re in is the market with which you are compared. A consistent conference champion coach in the Big Sky is not going to command the same salary as a consistent conference champ from the ACC. Thats why coaches move up to better conferences.
 
What I'm talking about doesn't just relate to a higher salary. WSU needs to fully commit to basketball for the first time in program in history, and make Kyle Smith the center point of the conversation. Salary, new basketball arena, smarter non-conference scheduling. Take a chunk of the P2 settlement money and make this happen.
We dont need a new arena, a remodel, seriou upgrade to restrooms and concessions erc...
 
  • Like
Reactions: Coug90
We dont need a new arena, a remodel, seriou upgrade to restrooms and concessions erc...
It needs to look like a new arena. Most of the money should be dumped into the locker room and amenities that high rolling Cougs arriving by private jet would be interested in. The bones are fine. Give it a facelift.
 
  • Like
Reactions: COUGinNCW
It needs to look like a new arena. Most of the money should be dumped into the locker room and amenities that high rolling Cougs arriving by private jet would be interested in. The bones are fine. Give it a facelift.
Interesting that Arizona's arena opened at about the same time as Beasley. 1973. It was renovated a few years back.
 
Except 12000 more fans in the seats.
Well when Beasley is full, more like about 3,000. I too call BS on a new arena. There are substantive things that can be done without spending 80 or 100 million. Idaho's funky arena cost $51 million in 2021 and holds 4,000. And that is paying Idaho wages....
 
Except 12000 more fans in the seats.
Those people aren’t not showing up because the toilets are too old or the concessions aren’t fancy enough. Up until now they think they have something better to do. For $15 they really don’t. It’s a culture thing that hopefully is changing quickly and will continue if we manage to keep Kyle smith.
 
Reports are that remodeling Beasley is going to cost more than a new building. If that’s the case, bulldoze the damn thing to the ground.
 
Reports are that remodeling Beasley is going to cost more than a new building. If that’s the case, bulldoze the damn thing to the ground.
There’s more than one way to skin a cat. Technically if I put a new urinal in one of the bathrooms that would be a remodel. You could find a happy medium that makes it a lot nicer without the cost of a new arena or anywhere close to that. If that’s all they have so far they need to come up with some new remodel plans.
 
There’s more than one way to skin a cat. Technically if I put a new urinal in one of the bathrooms that would be a remodel. You could find a happy medium that makes it a lot nicer without the cost of a new arena or anywhere close to that. If that’s all they have so far they need to come up with some new remodel plans.
In the McKale article, they said the remodel cost $80 million. Hard to believe.

That aside, I don't buy the "remodel costs more than new" line. What do we "need" to do? New seats would be expensive, don't know what shape they are in. But "new" would require that as well.

My ideas would be as such. And again, I haven't been in Beasley in quite a while:
  • Update restrooms as needed
  • Improve concessions. No idea what they even have anymore. Bring in name brand vendors, if they haven't by now?
  • Do whatever is needed down in the bowels. Don't need plasma TV's
  • Luxury boxes/seating. This would be pricy, but here's my idea, which I have shared before. Punch through the upper deck wall to the existing office space, which would be reconfigured to support food, booze, whatever. Cannibalize a section of the inner concourse and corresponding upper/lower deck seats for premium seating, Not quite as cheesy as the half dozen "luxury" boxes that they put under the old Martin pressbox
Simple dimple
 
  • Like
Reactions: Coug90
If a structural / foundation overhaul is needed, bettter to level it and start new.

Dragging this back up to the top. It all depends on what they want to accomplish. Outside of making the argument for some luxury boxes and loge boxes, everything else about Beasley's seating is "fine". I've read that the locker room facilities are the big issue but that isn't a huge deal. WSU talked about putting out an RFQ in 2022 for a report to remodel Beasley. Does anyone know what came of that? I couldn't find anything other than a blog site reporting that the RFQ was going to be put out.
 
Dragging this back up to the top. It all depends on what they want to accomplish. Outside of making the argument for some luxury boxes and loge boxes, everything else about Beasley's seating is "fine". I've read that the locker room facilities are the big issue but that isn't a huge deal. WSU talked about putting out an RFQ in 2022 for a report to remodel Beasley. Does anyone know what came of that? I couldn't find anything other than a blog site reporting that the RFQ was going to be put out.
From a recent thread. 2 years almost and not a peep.


www.cougcenter.com

WSU is looking at a remodel or complete replacement of Beasley Coliseum

Later this week, the school’s selected consulting firm will move forward with figuring out the best path forward for the aging building.
www.cougcenter.com
www.cougcenter.com

https://s3.wp.wsu.edu/uploads/sites/1975/2022/06/RFQ_AthleticsArenaAssessment.pdf
 
I think a major renovation or new basketball arena are way down on CKS priority list.

Well funded NIL $s
Conference Stability/path forward
Competitive Wage

Better Fan Support
Charter Flights


Locker Room Upgrade








New Arena/Renovation

Chick Filet or In and Out Burger to Pullman
 
I think a major renovation or new basketball arena are way down on CKS priority list.

Well funded NIL $s
Conference Stability/path forward
Competitive Wage

Better Fan Support
Charter Flights

Locker Room Upgrade

New Arena/Renovation

Chick Filet or In and Out Burger to Pullman
Yeah - a new Beasley is a non-starter. A major renovation (caveat: depending on your definition of major) is a non-starter.

I haven't been in the bowels of Beasley for probably 15 years, but back then they had fully functioning locker rooms, and at least a couple of sizable conference/meeting rooms. That makes me assume that space exists for whatever enhancements they think they need.

As far as luxury boxes/suites/whatever, I guess a polling of bigger boosters would help inform what is "needed". As I've said before, the ticket and office areas are right behind the middle of the concourse and could be moved to make room for something to be pushed through?
 
From a recent thread. 2 years almost and not a peep.


www.cougcenter.com

WSU is looking at a remodel or complete replacement of Beasley Coliseum

Later this week, the school’s selected consulting firm will move forward with figuring out the best path forward for the aging building.
www.cougcenter.com
www.cougcenter.com

https://s3.wp.wsu.edu/uploads/sites/1975/2022/06/RFQ_AthleticsArenaAssessment.pdf
We didn’t know 10 schools in our conference were going to F us two years ago. Beasley isn’t even a consideration right now.
 
We didn’t know 10 schools in our conference were going to F us two years ago. Beasley isn’t even a consideration right now.

I agree that there isn't money at the moment to do anything. I was just curious if anyone had heard any followup on the study that was proposed. The big question for WSU is whether or not Smith is willing to be patient and try to keep crowds coming with good play.

All BS aside...locker rooms are the only thing that should matter to the team. I've gone to Allen Fieldhouse many times and that place is a complete sh!tbox of an arena with poor seating, limited bathroom facilities, terrible concessions and bad parking...but they get over 16,000 fans in there every game. 350 consecutive sellouts in that crappy old building.

It's not about the building...it's about the product on the floor.
 
The product on the floor is currently, the best product in WSU history.

They played in front of 40% capacity most of the season without a single sold out game.

I think it’s something else.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BleedCrimsonandGray
The product on the floor is currently, the best product in WSU history.

They played in front of 40% capacity most of the season without a single sold out game.

I think it’s something else.
I don’t think if you do a $100M spruce up of the arena you’re getting students to get off their iPads and come to the games. The student turnout has been much better of late as the winning has continued.

Fancy up the locker rooms, fresh paint and concessions, some new lights, bathrooms, luxury/high end seating with private food/beverage options, new scoreboard maybe…done. The bones are fine.

You could do all that for under $30M
 
The product on the floor is currently, the best product in WSU history.

They played in front of 40% capacity most of the season without a single sold out game.

I think it’s something else.
Well I agree wholeheartedly, but IMHO it is several somethings, which have been discussed before. A list of potential reasons:
  • Increasing disinterest in Athletics, particularly basketball, among students
  • Years and years of bad and uninteresting basketball. That changed significantly this year, but no one seemed to notice until the end of the season when we also were winning
  • To add, many past teams maybe just didn't perk interest. Bennetts team(s) were interesting. Robbie the skeleton, Kyle, Low, Baynes, Casto, Rochestie, etc. Way back, Puidokas, House, Collins, etc. This year we have Rice's story, Wells, Slick's grandson, Aussie Cluff, etc. Interesting players. Maybe that's just me
  • Poor promotion and marketing
  • This year, a slow start by a no name team
  • Every game on TV
  • Relatively minor item, but as I discovered, hundreds or more endline nosebleed seats obstructed from the scoreboard? WTF is that? Someone who has gone recently help here? Looks like the banners might be getting in the way. If so, fix that
  • The things that have always hamstrung WSU. Location, weather
 
  • Years and years of bad and uninteresting basketball. That changed significantly this year, but no one seemed to notice until the end of the season when we also were winning
I think this is the biggest thing. As an Illinois alum, we've lot a GENERATION or more of football fans who won't make the 2-3 hour drive from Chicago for an 11a.m. start time--meaning leaving that area around 6am so you have time to tailgate,etc..

One poster I read several years ago said "I've found other things to do"---most all fans, if the product is that weak/poor for THAT long will be lost and it will take **time and continued success**to make them want to come back to the games.

As an aside, one fun thing at Illini home basketball games--if an opposing player misses two consecutive free throws, the students get FREE CHICKEN NUGGESTS. It's fun to watch how into it they get for free fast food!!
 
  • Like
Reactions: COUGinNCW
The product on the floor is currently, the best product in WSU history.

They played in front of 40% capacity most of the season without a single sold out game.

I think it’s something else.

You say that...but once everyone bought in late in the season, we averaged over 8,500 in the last three games. We need KU type success to have sellouts all the time...but if we can put a good product on the floor...we can get 7,000 per game and that's enough atmosphere for the place to be great to play at.

To your point....unintentional or not.....there's a reason that most programs are downsizing their arenas. Of the last 30 college basketball arenas built, only 4 of them are over 10,000 in capacity and only 2 of those were over 11,000. Only one of them (Texas) was an on-campus facility. The other three are off-campus facilities that serve the community as a whole. Even Texas downsized their arena from 16,500 down to 10,700 for basketball.

We could easily take out the upper seating on one side and put in some loge boxes and luxury suites when the time is right and leave everything else the same. We aren't going to sell out a 12,000 seat arena no matter what product we provide.
 
Why spend money on large boxes and luxury suites. Who in Pullman is gong to buy those? Just leave things alone and put the money toward Coaching and NIL. Debt to build stuff that isn't needed is just a waste.

With the end of the Pac12 comes an end of TV so some fans will make the drive and some students will opt to go to the games. Front loading of good teams for the next 2 years will make fans have more interest in early season games as they have a chance to be a good game instead of dogtrot paid U
 
  • Like
Reactions: bostoncoug
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT