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2020 Recruiting

Spring1 for Kent: Redding, Dunbar, Davis, and Cheatum (JC)

Spring1 for Smith: Williams, Rodman, Rapp, Markovetskyy, Bonton (JC)

Ultimately Redding saw minutes and the other players left the program after a year. Time will tell how things play out for Smith's first class but it doesn't have much work to do to surpass Kent's initial effort. Of course you hope down the line 1 or 2 of the high school kids develop into a Pac 12 player but you at least want to see the players embrace the vision for the program even they ultimately aren't a big part of the future on the court.

To me Smith did a good job of holding onto the most talented players in the program and getting involved with multiple recruits during the cycle. It's the next couple of recruiting cycles that will tell us how competitive we can become.
 
Glad Cougar said:
Excuse me while I insert myself. There is no credible source anywhere that provides the starting lineup for WSU next year. Good lord, let's at least wait until fall practice begins. It doesn't need to be decided right now. All Jourdand is saying is that James has played as a power forward (4) in the past and is likely to play there most of the time this coming year. That also addresses a need the Cougars have at this time. Kunc is too light right now to get serious time up front....that's not his style of play. James is a decent rebounder and inside defender, which is why he will play up front most, if not all of the time. Does he start? Nobody knows, certainly Coach Smith won't commit to a starting lineup right now. WSU will need depth. The rotation will be just as important, if not more, than who gets to start the game.

By the way, Henson has not been part of this conversation. Is it possible he might play some in the front court?

Glad Cougar
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I still dont think Marko is a project, but Henson at 6 ft 7.5", skinny freshman, is, would be more of a project then Marko, and as such Henson is behind Pollard, Kunc, Elleby, James, and is a good candidate for redshirting.

If he doesnt redshirt, if he gets anytime off bench, it would probably be in garbage time, maybe 4 to 7 to 10 to 13 minutes per game at the 4, in garbage time, unless he really comes out and shocks people, coaches, players, etc.
 
avabob1 said:
Pretty hard to disagree glad. I also was thinking about Henson. Gotta think Pollard, Elleby, and Cannon are Day 1 starters. After that, who knows.

It did occur to me that it would be interesting to see Mikalalas analysis of whether Kevin Durant is a 2, 3, 4, 5.
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Durant is .primarily a 4, Power Forward, but can play at the 3, but is a stretch there, and can play the 5 and is less of a stretch there.

Durant is very much like Rashard Lewis, who played for Sonics, and also played 3,4,5 spots.
 
Mikalalas "logic":
Durant is 6'11 and power forwards and centers are in the 6'11 range therefore Durant is a power forward/center.

Just ignore Durant's handles, shooting, and passing skills which are that of a wing. Ignore that he defends other wings. Ignore that when he plays the "4" he's doing it because they are going with a smaller line up. Ignore that he starts as a three with Green and Cousins at 4 and 5. Just say something is true and it is in your own mind I guess.

mikalalas said:
Durant is .primarily a 4, Power Forward, but can play at the 3, but is a stretch there, and can play the 5 and is less of a stretch there.

Durant is very much like Rashard Lewis, who played for Sonics, and also played 3,4,5 spots.
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mikalalas said:
I still dont think Marko is a project, but Henson at 6 ft 7.5", skinny freshman, is, would be more of a project then Marko, and as such Henson is behind Pollard, Kunc, Elleby, James, and is a good candidate for redshirting.

If he doesnt redshirt, if he gets anytime off bench, it would probably be in garbage time, maybe 4 to 7 to 10 to 13 minutes per game at the 4, in garbage time, unless he really comes out and shocks people, coaches, players, etc.
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Henson's a JC from Salt Lake CC. I believe he primarily played stretch 4 at JC and Kent seemed to sign him with the thought he could help replace Franks.
 
To address complaints about the recruiting class. James, Bonton, and Henson have shown they can compete at the D1 level. Noah Williams and DJ Rodman are talented kids and it wouldn't be a shocker if they contributed.

Rapp and Marko are harder to quantify as international players. But international players are less likely to transfer after a year having not grown up in the AAU transfer culture. Case in point was Aljaz Kunc being the only player on the team that wasn't rumored to be exploring options for a way out of town. Ernie was looking at a mass exodus of players (again) and Smith was able to keep the most important returners in Pullman.
 
Ernie's endorsement isn't going to inspire a ton of confidence. Though I will say Henson's comments about Smith telling him he was going to need to step up his defensive game were encouraging.

SaveFerris said:
Henson's a JC from Salt Lake CC. I believe he primarily played stretch 4 at JC and Kent seemed to sign him with the thought he could help replace Franks.
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ElComanche said:
Pollard, Elleby, Ali,Cannon,and James start. The newly recruited guys are a bunch of hopes and really incomplete players. The recruiting has been basically a joke for this year.The dufus is lucky that Cannon and Ali decided to return.
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If your saying Ali starts at 1.Pg, Cannon at 2. SG, Elleby at 3.Wing, James at 4. Pollard, at 5:

Robinson is better then Ali at the 1.PG Spot. But either Robinson/Ali splits starting time at the 1, or Ali backs up Robinson at the 1. Or Robinson plays at 2, with Cannon. If Robinson plays at 2 with Cannon, Bonton either beats out Ali at 1, or splits starting with Ali, or backs up Ali. Remember Ali is very small, doesnt play good defense, etc.

Your right about the newcomers except, Bonton, James, Marko.

Marko will either start at the 5, and push Pollard to the 4, or Pollard at 5, and Kunc, Elleby, James at 4, with Marko playing lots of back up, sub, minutes at 5 behind Pollard.

James is 2nd option at the 4 at best, will play a LOT of minutes tho at the 4.

Bonton will split starting at 2 with Robinson, or back up Robinson at the 2, IF IF Cannon does not start at the 2, and plays more at the 3, an or IF Ali starts at 1, otherwise Bonton starts at 2, if Cannon at 3, If Robinson at 1, otherwise Bonton either splits starting time at 1 with Ali at 1, IF Robinson at 2, Cannon at 3, otherwise backs up either Robinson, Ali. Bonton gets some to almost a lot of time at 1,2.

If Cannon starts at the 2, then Bonton, Robinson will, would either be starting at 1, or backing up a 1, behind either Robinson, Bonton, or Ali at the 1.

Robinson, Bonton, Ali are very close, but Robinson, is probably better then Bonton, Ali, and Bonton is either tied, equal with, an or better then Ali.
 
Not big on red shirting guards snd wings unless they are really in need of physical development. Marko would be the best red shirt candidate , but we have never been able to red shirt bigs who needed it, Motum being the best example along with Hawkinson
 
I have James starting as a marginal PAC 12 player Now one else wanted the other guys. Marko will transfer out as an unsused tall player to pursue his dreams at a University like San Francisco. He is a long term project.
 
etowncoug said:
Ernie's endorsement isn't going to inspire a ton of confidence. Though I will say Henson's comments about Smith telling him he was going to need to step up his defensive game were encouraging.
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From what I have seen from Henson he's basically a 3-point shooter who rebounds when the ball happens to find him. The first part is all Kent probably cared about but he probably can and is going to need to do more for Smith.
 
Coaches often say they will start the 5 best defenders when pressed by sports writers. What they mean is they will start the 5 best scorers who will give a good effort on D.

It may be more difficult with this group to find the scorers than the guys who will play D. Kunc is the best returning shooter although Elleby and Cannon both showed upside over th e course of the season. Ali is a good shooter but he is small and doesnt have a quick release. Bon ton and Henson sound like they can shoot a little.

I always like shooters. Hope we discover enough guys in this group who can shoot snd make the effort on D
 
avabob1 said:
Coaches often say they will start the 5 best defenders when pressed by sports writers. What they mean is they will start the 5 best scorers who will give a good effort on D.

It may be more difficult with this group to find the scorers than the guys who will play D. Kunc is the best returning shooter although Elleby and Cannon both showed upside over th e course of the season. Ali is a good shooter but he is small and doesnt have a quick release. Bon ton and Henson sound like they can shoot a little.

I always like shooters. Hope we discover enough guys in this group who can shoot snd make the effort on D
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Guys who are good shooters on Roster:

Kunc, Elleby, Cannon, Robinson, Ali, Bonton, Henson

Of those:

Kunc is the best, has the best midrange, and 3 point %.

Next is probably Bonton, who shot good at Midrange, 3 pt, at JC

Next is Probably Ali, but is SMALL, slow release, etc.

Next is Henson

Next is Robinson

Next is a tie between Elleby, Cannon.

Not so good shooters:

James

Rodman

Noah Williams

So really have 6, 7 guys on roster who can shoot really well.

And only 3 guys on roster who dont shoot good.
 
7 new players. Last group this size was Sampsons 8 man class his 3rd year. Doubt this group is quite that caliber ( no Lewis or Derrick caliber JCs ), but still impressive on short notice.

Also. Good analysis on shooters Mikalalas. No decimal points fractions, or percentages made it a good read.
 
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James is a 3/4 and will probably play whatever position coach wants. For those of you who want to know his height, he is on campus. You will probably agree that he is taller than what was listed.
 
Azsowhat said:
James is a 3/4 and will probably play whatever position coach wants. For those of you who want to know his height, he is on campus. You will probably agree that he is taller than what was listed.
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Thanks, that is exactly what I have tried to tell here. I said James was a 3,4 that could play the 3 or the 4 as a semi stretch 4, and could play the 2 as a STRETCH 2, and could play anywhere Smith wants, move around between 2,3,4 in order to help team, in whatever way coach wants, and in order to get playing, contribution time, instead of sitting at, on bench.

I said the 3,4 spots are, is LOGJAMMED with Elleby, Cannon, James, Kunc, Rodman, Noah at the 3, with Pollard, Kunc, Henson, Elleby, James at the 4.

I said no way does James start over Pollard, Kunc, Henson, Elleby, at the 4, UNLESS, EXCEPT, if there are injuries, an or IF WSU goes SMALL, or unless, except in a situational match up situation.

So that means that maybe James starts at the 4 1,2,3, etc, times out of about 30 games.

So not saying its impossible James starts at the 4.

Just that its NOT likely, or that USUALLY James will probably NOT start at the 4 spot.

I said that despite that, James will, would play a semi lot at the 4 spot, and would play some at 3, and would only play a little at the 2 spot, and that he James would be moved around between, at the 2,3,4 spots in order to get him on the court.

Nice to have someone who agrees with, understands that, and that is probably more familiar with James, and Colorado St, then any of us, and that because of that, that why understand, agree.

To bad some here dont understand get this like you, me, others do.
 
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He didn’t agree with anything you said! All he said was James is on campus and appears taller than has been reported. Your expert has a handle of “As hole hat” and has never posted before. Guess who
 
jourdand said:
He didn’t agree with anything you said! All he said was James is on campus and appears taller than has been reported. Your expert has a handle of “As hole hat” and has never posted before. Guess who
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James was always listed as 6'8" until this last year where he was listed at 6'6". I am sure the answer is in there somewhere.
 
etowncoug said:
This bizarre rants are funny and, at risk of wasting my time, I'll explain to you some of the ways you are off base. This list is by no means exhaustive.

1. Marko is a true 5. There is no way he plays at the 4 like you claim he will. No where has it been suggested he'll play anywhere other than center.

Mike: Never said he will play, start at the 4. I only put him behind Pollard, Kunc, Henson, Elleby, but ahead of James at the 4, which means he will probably only extremely rarely play at 4, and probably usually wont play at the 4.

Etown:

2. Elleby is a guard. He might play the 4 occasionally in lineups where we go small, but he's going to be handling the ball a lot and typically this isn't done by 4's. Sticking him at the 4 would take away his best abilities.

Mike: I said that as well. Never said that Elleby would beca regular starter at the 4. I said that he is a 3, that could play a little at the 4. That why he is behind Pollard, Kunc, etc, on depth chart at the 4 spot.

Etown:

3. Have you ever watched Kunc play? Dude is rail thin. He's at least a year plus away from being able to defend in the paint. Smith likes defense and Kunc is able to defend the wings well.

Mike: Newsflash the only player WSU has that can defend the paint at the 4 is Pollard. And the only way that can defend paint at 4 and 5 at same time would be to put Pollard at 4, Marko at 5. James will not defend paint any better then Pollard, Kunc, Henson, Elleby at the 4.

Etown:

4. Pollard is going to be primarily a 5. He is extremely limited offensively other than an screener/rebounder. I don't see him getting a ton of minutes with the other true 5 on the floor.

That would be true if Marko wasnt at the 5. Pollard can play 4 just fine, and did so at times last year. Yea he is primarily a 5. But he can play at 4 too

Etown

5. James played both the 4 and 5 spots at Colorado St. Smith has said he's coming to play as a post. He might has the size of a 3 but his game is that of a 4 or 5.

Mike: Like I said before James played that at Colorado St ONLY BECAUSE 1. There was probably no one better, more suited to 4, probably not a 4 on team, so someone had to play the 4. 2. He could probably get away with playing 4 there because lower competition level. 3. Like another poster, fan that visited WSU page, said about him, that he could play, played at all, any spot, wherever the coach wanted, including the 4 spot, showing off his positional versatility.

Etown

6. Henson has a better game to play the 3 but our lack of posts will probably mean he plays as a stretch 4.

Mike: Henson is 6 ft 7 and 2/3 to 3/4 to almost 6 ft 8 in about, around 200 pounds. Like Kunc, he is a HYBRID 3/4.

Again somebody has to play the 4. It would be better, best if WSU had a true 4. But WSU does not have a true 4. Which means someone who is not a true 4, has to play the 4. Of those, Pollard, Kunc, Henson, is what WSU has to start at the 4 spot. While not good, ideal, etc. Its all WSU has. And still better then Elleby, James at the 4 spot. And Elleby, James are just as bad, even worse at the 4 spot, then Pollard, Kunc, Henson at the 4 spot

Etown

Watch the players play and let what they show you determine where you think they should play.
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Inserted my comments into your comments.
 
Wow, Followed a link to ESPN's Top 100, from SaveFerris's link to verbal commits, that linked to ESPN.

ESPN shows that Marjon Beauchamp a low end 5 star by some recruiting services, and a high end 4 star at ESPN and other recruiting services(about 29th to 39th out of ESPN's top 100 list of 5 stars and 4 stars.), has not only been offered by WSU, and scheduled a unofficial visit, but is also in Mar Jon's top 6.

Mar Jons top 6 is: Alabama, Arizona, UW, WSU, cant remember the other 2.

Now I still dont think Mar Jon will commit to WSU, but then again, I didnt think WSU would come even close to making Mar Jon's top 6, so who knows maybe Mar Jon will commit, sign with WSU. Doubt it, but maybe it will happen.

This is truly RARIFIED AIR for any WSU coach, going back to the Raveling, Sampson Era's to even be this close to maybe committing, signing such a HIGHLY RATED, SEMI TOP recruit.

This speaks awesome volumes about how good Smith is at recruiting to have inherited Kents mess, get a late start, having proved nothing at WSU, except to do a good job recruiting, and despite, with that to be even in on Mar Jon, let alone be in Mar Jon's top 6, have about a 25 to 33% chance to commit, sign Mar Jon.

Rarified Air indeed.

And Awesome Job by Smith.

But hey Smith Sucks, cant recruit, according to he who shall not be named. Lol.

And even if WSU doesnt commit, sign Mar Jon, if he Smith keeps this up, it will be just a matter of time until Smith does sign a Top recruit like Mar Jon Eventually.

He Smith needs to continue to go after Mar Jon type recruits, while having good plan B, Plan C's to also go after, fall back on, get, etc.
 
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SaveFerris said:
Spring1 for Kent: Redding, Dunbar, Davis, and Cheatum (JC)

Spring1 for Smith: Williams, Rodman, Rapp, Markovetskyy, Bonton (JC),

Mike:

Williams(3 star), Rodman(2,3 star) Bonton(JC)(3 star) Marko(Olympic Olympian, international freshman transfer, 3 star), Rapp(2 star) James(Grad Transfer)(3 star), Rerecruited Henson(2,3 star), Rerecruited, got Ali, Cannon to comeback.

Fixed, made the good point that Saveferris was, is making, even better.

Saveferris:

Ultimately Redding saw minutes and the other players left the program after a year. Time will tell how things play out for Smith's first class but it doesn't have much work to do to surpass Kent's initial effort. Of course you hope down the line 1 or 2 of the high school kids develop into a Pac 12 player but you at least want to see the players embrace the vision for the program even they ultimately aren't a big part of the future on the court.

To me Smith did a good job of holding onto the most talented players in the program and getting involved with multiple recruits during the cycle. It's the next couple of recruiting cycles that will tell us how competitive we can become.
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Inserted comment into comment to semi fix, make Saveferris's already great point, even better.

Added James, Henson, Ali, Cannon to the Smith List that compared to Kent.
 
Pretty clear that Smiths staff has auch wider network of connections than Kents staff, particularly over seas. Doesn't mean we will start signing a bunch of top recruits, but the morr kids we are in on, the mire likely we start getting a few.

As for coaching, it isnt rocket science. If you can get a group to play to their potential at the mid major level, you can do the same at the high major level. I dont think either of the last 2 Cougar teams played to their potential.
 
Without playing a game it's pretty obviously Smith's a better coach than his predecessor. It might not be rocket science but we haven't played with much purpose for a long time. This year pre-Arizona and post-Arizona was telling. I don't think anyone really thought we had turned the corner in Arizona but to face plant like we did the final 6 games was brutal.
 
mikalalas said:
Wow, Followed a link to ESPN's Top 100, from SaveFerris's link to verbal commits, that linked to ESPN.

ESPN shows that Marjon Beauchamp a low end 5 star by some recruiting services, and a high end 4 star at ESPN and other recruiting services(about 29th to 39th out of ESPN's top 100 list of 5 stars and 4 stars.), has not only been offered by WSU, and scheduled a unofficial visit, but is also in Mar Jon's top 6.

Mar Jons top 6 is: Alabama, Arizona, UW, WSU, cant remember the other 2.

Now I still dont think Mar Jon will commit to WSU, but then again, I didnt think WSU would come even close to making Mar Jon's top 6, so who knows maybe Mar Jon will commit, sign with WSU. Doubt it, but maybe it will happen.

This is truly RARIFIED AIR for any WSU coach, going back to the Raveling, Sampson Era's to even be this close to maybe committing, signing such a HIGHLY RATED, SEMI TOP recruit.

This speaks awesome volumes about how good Smith is at recruiting to have inherited Kents mess, get a late start, having proved nothing at WSU, except to do a good job recruiting, and despite, with that to be even in on Mar Jon, let alone be in Mar Jon's top 6, have about a 25 to 33% chance to commit, sign Mar Jon.

Rarified Air indeed.

And Awesome Job by Smith.

But hey Smith Sucks, cant recruit, according to he who shall not be named. Lol.

And even if WSU doesnt commit, sign Mar Jon, if he Smith keeps this up, it will be just a matter of time until Smith does sign a Top recruit like Mar Jon Eventually.

He Smith needs to continue to go after Mar Jon type recruits, while having good plan B, Plan C's to also go after, fall back on, get, etc.
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I would go with I don't think so.
 
SaveFerris said:
I would go with I don't think so.
View embedded media
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Well, the ESPN site had a similar Top 6, 7 as NCAA recruiting site, except I think it was the Beavers, that werent listed.

Also ESPN could be wrong, or outdated.

I was just going by what the ESPN top 100 site had for Mar Jon as his top 6.

If you others dont believe me, you can just go to ESPN top 100. Then goto Mar Jon, then look up his list of top 6 there, and you will see what I saw there, that WSU was listed in his top 6.

It looks like the NCAA recruiting site might be more accurate, current, what with the team hashtags that in top 7 there.

The ESPN site didnt have team hashtags like that as part of Mar Jon's list.

Also like I said, doubted all along that WSU would make Mar Jon's top 6,7, commit, sign with WSU.

But still think that Smith even being in on Mar Jon is still pretty good.
 
Believe you and Taff are probably correct. ESPN is outdated and we probably were on his list when Haskins was an assistant.

I think we will be fine without Beauchamp though.
 
More offers:
Will McClendon (6'4" PG/SG) with a bunch of recent offers from us, ASU, SC, and Arizona
Andre Harris (6'7" F). Verbal commits shows him as a SF but seems more like a PF. Tulsa, UTEP, St. John's are recent offers.

EDIT: Harris is listed at 250 so definitely a PF.

Isaiah Johnson (6'6" SF) also offered today. Pepperdine offered recently.
 
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Another 2021 offer to Houston Mallette who is a 6-4" PG/SG. Offers from UNLV, Santa Clara, and USD and others. Reminded me in some ways of a shorter version of Reggie Miller although I would assume he's not at Miller's shooting level.
 
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