CAF to consider...

[Coug95man2]

Been following the new Seattle Times WSU beat reporter for a while, Stefanie Loh. She delved into our financial situation, for the Athletic Dept. I knew we were not covering the scholarships but did everyone know we are the ONLY P12 school to not cover scholarships?! I apparently need to crawl out of my bunker every once in a while… Crazy sad. So everyone says, "Well, winning will solve that." So how do we explain the fact that CO covers their schollies?!!

Anyways, her article is interesting. We had a 3.5 million dollar gap between the CAF and costs… And that was before the Power 5 conferences agreed to more stipend money for each student. Just that stipend costs WSU Athletics roughly $820,000 more… Almost a million dollars was added to the student athlete bill. Great read. NOTE: There are two links there for anyone interested in helping out.

http://www.seattletimes.com/sports/...s-to-wsu-athletics-financial-balancing-act-2/

http://www.wsucougars.com/CAF

 

[Cougatron]

Because the myth that Cougs are so supportive of athletics is a myth. You just have to point to the students who leave at halftime, the lack of scholarship coverage, or the fact that people cry because we don't win and wonder why...

It's as if they don't see the problem isn't the coach... the problem is us, but they don't want to accept responsibility for it. They want to put it all on someone else...and then we hire the next one...and blame him....and the next one...and blame him...

 

[wazzucougs96]

Been following the new Seattle Times WSU beat reporter for a while, Stefanie Loh. She delved into our financial situation, for the Athletic Dept. I knew we were not covering the scholarships but did everyone know we are the ONLY P12 school to not cover scholarships?! I apparently need to crawl out of my bunker every once in a while… Crazy sad. So everyone says, "Well, winning will solve that." So how do we explain the fact that CO covers their schollies?!!

Anyways, her article is interesting. We had a 3.5 million dollar gap between the CAF and costs… And that was before the Power 5 conferences agreed to more stipend money for each student. Just that stipend costs WSU Athletics roughly $820,000 more… Almost a million dollars was added to the student athlete bill. Great read. NOTE: There are two links there for anyone interested in helping out.

http://www.seattletimes.com/sports/...s-to-wsu-athletics-financial-balancing-act-2/

http://www.wsucougars.com/CAF

Moos has been telling anyone who will listen for years. Problem is, no one cares to listen. They'd rather just bitch on the internet for their house in Puyallup or Seattle or where ever else they are.

 

[CPtheCoug]

Moos has been telling anyone who will listen for years. Problem is, no one cares to listen. They'd rather just bitch on the internet for their house in Puyallup or Seattle or where ever else they are.

And then the internet heroes who say they DO want to donate, or donate more, say they can't because its the CAF's fault for not marketing enough, advertising enough, poor website, no calls to their house, too many calls to their house, not enough personal emails to them, too many emails spamming them, etc... etc...

Good grief...

 

[chipdouglas]

Because the myth that Cougs are so supportive of athletics is a myth. You just have to point to the students who leave at halftime, the lack of scholarship coverage, or the fact that people cry because we don't win and wonder why...

It's as if they don't see the problem isn't the coach... the problem is us, but they don't want to accept responsibility for it. They want to put it all on someone else...and then we hire the next one...and blame him....and the next one...and blame him...

Still shopping this nutty theory, I see. I'd like to see this in context of Stanford football, which is about to go to its 7th straight bowl game despite having some of the lamest fans in CFB. They didn't sell out season tix until 2013 when they had gone 18-1 at home, and it's rarely at capacity and rarely rockin' (I've seen a game there). Still, great football team that can't stop winning in spite of a fanbase that has football as their #5 priority.

Back on topic, I gave another gift to the CAF earlier this week. While on the site, I was looking at membership levels and found it odd that, the way it's currently structured, someone who gives $400 (Butch's Club) is treated the same as someone who gives $2,499 (Cougar Champion). No extra tchotchkes, no extra recognition, nothing. I'm not suggesting CAF membership structure is what's holding us back, but it seems poorly conceived if somebody who paid "house rental" money is getting treated the same as the guy paying "car rental" money.

 

[Geoduck12]

I know this gets everyone all riled up but I think the next round of realignment (5-10 years) should be very interesting for the Athletic Program given that there are several programs from the group of 5 who have greater overall financial capacity.

 

[Cougatron]

Still shopping this nutty theory, I see. I'd like to see this in context of Stanford football, which is about to go to its 7th straight bowl game despite having some of the lamest fans in CFB. They didn't sell out season tix until 2013 when they had gone 18-1 at home, and it's rarely at capacity and rarely rockin' (I've seen a game there). Still, great football team that can't stop winning in spite of a fanbase that has football as their #5 priority.

Back on topic, I gave another gift to the CAF earlier this week. While on the site, I was looking at membership levels and found it odd that, the way it's currently structured, someone who gives $400 (Butch's Club) is treated the same as someone who gives $2,499 (Cougar Champion). No extra tchotchkes, no extra recognition, nothing. I'm not suggesting CAF membership structure is what's holding us back, but it seems poorly conceived if somebody who paid "house rental" money is getting treated the same as the guy paying "car rental" money.

I definitely agree with your assessment of the membership levels.

Stanford is always serious about its athletics. The myth with them is that because they were bad at football they didn't care about athletics, but that is very very very wrong.

Here is how Stanford ranks in athletics overall....

Now as to fans in the stands...they are a heavy academic school. Not a lot of academic schools have student bodies that are hardcore about filling a college stadium, but Stanford knows exactly what they are doing to be competitive in athletics. And Phil Knight gave them a tremendous amount of cash just like he did Nike. They just don't flaunt it like Oregon does.

 

[Geoduck12]

Still shopping this nutty theory, I see. I'd like to see this in context of Stanford football, which is about to go to its 7th straight bowl game despite having some of the lamest fans in CFB. They didn't sell out season tix until 2013 when they had gone 18-1 at home, and it's rarely at capacity and rarely rockin' (I've seen a game there). Still, great football team that can't stop winning in spite of a fanbase that has football as their #5 priority.

Back on topic, I gave another gift to the CAF earlier this week. While on the site, I was looking at membership levels and found it odd that, the way it's currently structured, someone who gives $400 (Butch's Club) is treated the same as someone who gives $2,499 (Cougar Champion). No extra tchotchkes, no extra recognition, nothing. I'm not suggesting CAF membership structure is what's holding us back, but it seems poorly conceived if somebody who paid "house rental" money is getting treated the same as the guy paying "car rental" money.

Stanford in 2012 drew an average of 43,000+ fans. And that number has grown since 2012, 20,000 more fans over 6 home games is somewhere in the neighborhood of $7-8 million more in ticket sales alone. Don't even think about the size of Stanfords athletic fund and their annual campaign in comparison to WSU.

 

[Cougatron]

Stanford in 2012 drew an average of 43,000+ fans. And that number has grown since 2012, 20,000 more fans over 6 home games is somewhere in the neighborhood of $7-8 million more in ticket sales alone. Don't even think about the size of Stanfords athletic fund and their annual campaign in comparison to WSU.

Yeah Stanford has insane money. They spent 20 Million on football last year and had revenue of 32 million. on just football.

Total Athletic revenue and expenses last year... 110 million. That's their athletic budget.

WSU... 60 million revenue/Expenses.

So just about take WSU's budget and expenditures...and double it...that's Stanford Athletics...as I said earlier...Stanford pretends like they don't care about athletics, but they care a gigantic amount...110 million dollars and 21 years of consecutive 1st place finishes in the overall points in athletics. They just don't see a reason to hype it like Oregon and other schools.

 

[Geoduck12]

Yeah Stanford has insane money. They spent 20 Million on football last year and had revenue of 32 million. on just football.

Total Athletic revenue and expenses last year... 110 million. That's their athletic budget.

WSU... 60 million revenue/Expenses.

So just about take WSU's budget and expenditures...and double it...that's Stanford Athletics...as I said earlier...Stanford pretends like they don't care about athletics, but they care a gigantic amount...110 million dollars and 21 years of consecutive 1st place finishes in the overall points in athletics. They just don't see a reason to hype it like Oregon and other schools.

Yep, they are very serious

 

[Flatlandcoug]

Because the myth that Cougs are so supportive of athletics is a myth. You just have to point to the students who leave at halftime, the lack of scholarship coverage, or the fact that people cry because we don't win and wonder why...

It's as if they don't see the problem isn't the coach... the problem is us, but they don't want to accept responsibility for it. They want to put it all on someone else...and then we hire the next one...and blame him....and the next one...and blame him...

While I agree that people need to support WSU more, the on the field product is getting enough financial support. Find a school with a coach who makes almost $3 million per year, a staff that makes another $2.3 million and spent well over $100 million on stadium improvements in the past five years and you see a school that is spending an appropriate amount of money on football. It's a BS excuse to say that football struggles because of our fans. The athletic department as a whole is struggling and requires support from the university but the reality is that most of the cost is a paper cost only. WSU doesn't spend money when it gives tuition money to the athletics program. It simply doesn't make money on them. When it's a person that wouldn't have been at the school otherwise, it's not any real money lost.

 

[BiggsCoug]

It is the job of the university to create a culture of giving while the students are on campus. They have a captive audience. It's not the fault of the fan or the student to build this culture. It's the university's job.

11 bowl games in 100 years and people think that it's the fault of the fan???

Attitude reflects leadership. WSU has had piss poor leadership in its athletics department for 100 years. Now they get a decent AD and all of a sudden alums that haven't been back to Pullman for 30 years or alums that haven't donated in 40 years are supposed to open their checkbooks? Im not surprised at all the WSU is last. WSU needs to be accountable FIRST for its CHOSEN lack of action, direction and leadership. Blaming the fans only pushes the fans further away and closes their checkbooks.

 

[wazzucougs96]

Still shopping this nutty theory, I see. I'd like to see this in context of Stanford football, which is about to go to its 7th straight bowl game despite having some of the lamest fans in CFB. They didn't sell out season tix until 2013 when they had gone 18-1 at home, and it's rarely at capacity and rarely rockin' (I've seen a game there). Still, great football team that can't stop winning in spite of a fanbase that has football as their #5 priority.

Back on topic, I gave another gift to the CAF earlier this week. While on the site, I was looking at membership levels and found it odd that, the way it's currently structured, someone who gives $400 (Butch's Club) is treated the same as someone who gives $2,499 (Cougar Champion). No extra tchotchkes, no extra recognition, nothing. I'm not suggesting CAF membership structure is what's holding us back, but it seems poorly conceived if somebody who paid "house rental" money is getting treated the same as the guy paying "car rental" money.

You are dumb as rocks if you don't think Stanford has rich AF donors. Their athletic department endowment is $270 million, the largest in the country. For some perspective, the entire endowment of Washington State University is $868 million.

3 people paid for their entire stadium rebuild.

WSU is a clown show when it comes to donors.

 

[Flatlandcoug]

Still shopping this nutty theory, I see. I'd like to see this in context of Stanford football, which is about to go to its 7th straight bowl game despite having some of the lamest fans in CFB. They didn't sell out season tix until 2013 when they had gone 18-1 at home, and it's rarely at capacity and rarely rockin' (I've seen a game there). Still, great football team that can't stop winning in spite of a fanbase that has football as their #5 priority.

Back on topic, I gave another gift to the CAF earlier this week. While on the site, I was looking at membership levels and found it odd that, the way it's currently structured, someone who gives $400 (Butch's Club) is treated the same as someone who gives $2,499 (Cougar Champion). No extra tchotchkes, no extra recognition, nothing. I'm not suggesting CAF membership structure is what's holding us back, but it seems poorly conceived if somebody who paid "house rental" money is getting treated the same as the guy paying "car rental" money.

The problem with the CAF giving program is that many of the higher level benefits are a joke for many fans. The "priority" parking for football games at the $350 level is all away across campus. Oooh...sign me up for that! You can pay $20 per game and park by Orton and it's the same walk for under half the price. For someone like me that lives halfway across the country, there is no personal benefit for donating anything more than $100 until you get to $2500 and that's if you value having your name in the gameday program. Other than feeling good for being "part of the team", there is no real reward for upping the cash.

I would suggest that WSU would be better served to give donors at the $500 and higher levels options to pick from:

1) a decent quality WSU polo with that says 20XX CAF Member
2) a football signed by the seniors
3) gameday parking benefits
4) a framed photo of Martin Stadium signed by Leach
5) basketball team photo signed by Kent (or team)
6) etc....

There are great ways around $50 that WSU could add value to the CAF member experience that would generate excitement from those that just need that nudge to get going. Instead, we get told, "Hey, I know that the football, baseball, and men's basketball teams have sucked for years, but they wouldn't suck if you didn't suck at donating!". Man.....sign me up with that kind of guilt trip!

 

[Cougatron]

Blaming the fans only pushes the fans further away and closes their checkbooks.

I disagree the checkbooks have been closed, and that comes from the attitude problems at WSU...see students leaving at halftime.

You are correct that the culture is something WSU must fix, but at the same time a huge part of it is the complete disrespect the fans give to the university.

You can't say...well my checkbook is closed....i don't like how you pointed out that it is closed...now I will make sure it's closed. --- Do you see how stupid and childish that is?

Yet people complain about the team. So it's like...you don't contribute...but you want the right to b i t c h?

Bottom line.

WSU is currently a place where the students leave at halftime
The alumni don't want to give back and support.
But everyone wants to complain about the strength of the program.

If people don't see that as a tremendous problem that should be alarming.


And honestly it doesn't matter who the coach is...who the leadership is...any of that...

Those things change.

But WSU is WSU and it should be supported because it's your school. The fact that we have trouble doing this is absolutely stupid.

 

[wazzucougs96]

The problem with the CAF giving program is that many of the higher level benefits are a joke for many fans. The "priority" parking for football games at the $350 level is all away across campus. Oooh...sign me up for that! You can pay $20 per game and park by Orton and it's the same walk for under half the price. For someone like me that lives halfway across the country, there is no personal benefit for donating anything more than $100 until you get to $2500 and that's if you value having your name in the gameday program. Other than feeling good for being "part of the team", there is no real reward for upping the cash.

I would suggest that WSU would be better served to give donors at the $500 and higher levels options to pick from:

1) a decent quality WSU polo with that says 20XX CAF Member
2) a football signed by the seniors
3) gameday parking benefits
4) a framed photo of Martin Stadium signed by Leach
5) basketball team photo signed by Kent (or team)
6) etc....

There are great ways around $50 that WSU could add value to the CAF member experience that would generate excitement from those that just need that nudge to get going. Instead, we get told, "Hey, I know that the football, baseball, and men's basketball teams have sucked for years, but they wouldn't suck if you didn't suck at donating!". Man.....sign me up with that kind of guilt trip!

Do you really believe that people donate big sums of money so they can get some stuff they could just buy?

And do you really think $350 is a lot of money?

 

[Coug95man2]

Do you really believe that people donate big sums of money so they can get some stuff they could just buy?

And do you really think $350 is a lot of money?

Agreed. At least on the buying stuff part. There are many reasons people donate. The concept that I met my wife at WSU is the major reason I donate, support and do just about anything I can, regarding WSU. Hell, took my wife 15 years to realize our accent walls in our home was a dark red (crimson) and grey. A slight nudge here and there when talking about color schemes and she never knew. When she finally realized, she just shook her head. Still crimson and grey walls. My car is crimson. It goes on and on. Not that much of that stuff goes towards WSU but you get my point. I support but I don't do it to get free stuff. I do it because I met the love of my life there. Others have other reasons. But the perks for major donors are to know they were a major cog in building something pretty cool. Help in the tax bracket helps, too. But man… if it's about what YOU get… then donating to just about any program will suck. Some are better than others but you get my point. It's about building our program, not about you. Whatever I get when I donate, it's all extra to me. Wasn't the point so it's nice for them to give me something in return.

Regarding $350 not being a lot… That depends on who you are. I know a couple people that scrape and scrape, to find $50 to donate… every year since they brought it down. They can't even fathom giving more. Budgets are hard lines for many and I get that. I just wish people would give what they can… Whatever that is. For those that talk about the surrounding areas supporting… You know… the farmers and residents of small communities… $350 is going to be considered quite a bit compared to what others might earn in... lets say the Seattle market as an example. Just a thought.

 

[wazzucougs96]

Agreed. At least on the buying stuff part. There are many reasons people donate. The concept that I met my wife at WSU is the major reason I donate, support and do just about anything I can, regarding WSU. Hell, took my wife 15 years to realize our accent walls in our home was a dark red (crimson) and grey. A slight nudge here and there when talking about color schemes and she never knew. When she finally realized, she just shook her head. Still crimson and grey walls. My car is crimson. It goes on and on. Not that much of that stuff goes towards WSU but you get my point. I support but I don't do it to get free stuff. I do it because I met the love of my life there. Others have other reasons. But the perks for major donors are to know they were a major cog in building something pretty cool. Help in the tax bracket helps, too. But man… if it's about what YOU get… then donating to just about any program will suck. Some are better than others but you get my point. It's about building our program, not about you. Whatever I get when I donate, it's all extra to me. Wasn't the point so it's nice for them to give me something in return.

Regarding $350 not being a lot… That depends on who you are. I know a couple people that scrape and scrape, to find $50 to donate… every year since they brought it down. They can't even fathom giving more. Budgets are hard lines for many and I get that. I just wish people would give what they can… Whatever that is. For those that talk about the surrounding areas supporting… You know… the farmers and residents of small communities… $350 is going to be considered quite a bit compared to what others might earn in... lets say the Seattle market as an example. Just a thought.

That $350 comment was meant in the context of "high level donors" not in a way that was meant to be demeaning.

 

[Coug95man2]

It is the job of the university to create a culture of giving while the students are on campus. They have a captive audience. It's not the fault of the fan or the student to build this culture. It's the university's job.

11 bowl games in 100 years and people think that it's the fault of the fan???

Attitude reflects leadership. WSU has had piss poor leadership in its athletics department for 100 years. Now they get a decent AD and all of a sudden alums that haven't been back to Pullman for 30 years or alums that haven't donated in 40 years are supposed to open their checkbooks? Im not surprised at all the WSU is last. WSU needs to be accountable FIRST for its CHOSEN lack of action, direction and leadership. Blaming the fans only pushes the fans further away and closes their checkbooks.

Biggs, there are 2 points:

1. I don't know that anyone is blaming fans. Being critical, yes but we are trying to build something. To do that, we need "buy-in". That means changing how you think and operate in order to push something beyond the status quo. THAT is what I'm talking about. NEVER have I blamed. I've been critical but that's because I want our program to change from what you describe. The 100 years of not caring. It's obvious WSU, the board, the president, the AD have changed their stripes. Now they are asking you to do the same.

2. You talk about how we are building something with our football team… in other posts. How it takes time. Specifically you talk about the construction, the non-con schedule and even more specifically the Oline. And I agree on most of that. It takes time. But hasn't our Athletic Program shown you, they are trying to build, as per your points? Spending over $100 Million bucks, hiring CML, working on the soccer field, looking towards Basketball and baseball... NCAA sports has only recently started to really delve into the TV marketing/money. But the foundation of a successful program is it's fans, alumni and the donors. This isn't professional sports, here. NCAA relies on donors. Period. Even with the TV money, that is still true. TV money only raises the water line for all the schools. Won't change just one program. So the only way for a school to change, is for the fans, alumni and the donors the change. That's all Mr. Floyd, Mr. Moos and others have wanted. For us as fans to see they are trying to change but without the foundational support and money to change, our program will stay the same.

But I challenge you to find anyone, other than maybe Tron, that is blaming anyone. Everyone IS asking us to change how we look at WSU Athletics so it can start to thrive.

 

[CougPatrol]

Out of sight, out of mind. That's always been the problem. Our alumni graduate, relocate several hundred miles away, and because our big-2 athletic programs are typically bad, they're not prompted to give back to the University or make the trek back to Pullman to catch a game or two.

I've been going to football games for 30+ years, and friends and co-workers always ask me with astonishment...."do you really, dude?" "why do you drive 300 miles to see your team lose?" "you're a diehard, I could never do that."

If you're an average joe with a family, a career, and you live 160 - 400 miles away, like most all of our alumni do, what about WSU athletics gets you amped up to get to Pullman for a game or give money to the school?

Don't get too elaborate with your problem solving theories. An isolated school like ours needs either football or men's basketball to be traditionally good; or at least decent. Our alumni need to look back on their college days and remember how much fun it was watching the football team play on Saturdays, or how exciting the men's basketball games were.

I get frustrated with our fans too, but winning is what grows a fan base. The Seahawks have stolen fans from both WSU and UW. Going to Pullman takes away from Seahawk game day, and is just one more reason to look the other way.

 

[Coug95man2]

Out of sight, out of mind. That's always been the problem. Our alumni graduate, relocate several hundred miles away, and because our big-2 athletic programs are typically bad, they're not prompted to give back to the University or make the trek back to Pullman to catch a game or two.

I've been going to football games for 30+ years, and friends and co-workers always ask me with astonishment...."do you really, dude?" "why do you drive 300 miles to see your team lose?" "you're a diehard, I could never do that."

If you're an average joe with a family, a career, and you live 160 - 400 miles away, like most all of our alumni do, what about WSU athletics gets you amped up to get to Pullman for a game or give money to the school?

Don't get too elaborate with your problem solving theories. An isolated school like ours needs either football or men's basketball to be traditionally good; or at least decent. Our alumni need to look back on their college days and remember how much fun it was watching the football team play on Saturdays, or how exciting the men's basketball games were.

I get frustrated with our fans too, but winning is what grows a fan base. The Seahawks have stolen fans from both WSU and UW. Going to Pullman takes away from Seahawk game day, and is just one more reason to look the other way.

I think that is a major hurdle… distance. And I think you ARE right that winning will help that aspect. But I guess I don't see how donating has anything to do with going to games. So you can't go to all the games. All the more reason to donate. The point is… we need to start looking at our school and it's athletic dept. as something that needs our help. We all need to find a way to do that. For some, that's going to games. For others it's donating. For some, it's both. The two options aren't exclusive nor married at the hip.

 

[wazzucougs96]

Out of sight, out of mind. That's always been the problem. Our alumni graduate, relocate several hundred miles away, and because our big-2 athletic programs are typically bad, they're not prompted to give back to the University or make the trek back to Pullman to catch a game or two.

I've been going to football games for 30+ years, and friends and co-workers always ask me with astonishment...."do you really, dude?" "why do you drive 300 miles to see your team lose?" "you're a diehard, I could never do that."

If you're an average joe with a family, a career, and you live 160 - 400 miles away, like most all of our alumni do, what about WSU athletics gets you amped up to get to Pullman for a game or give money to the school?

Don't get too elaborate with your problem solving theories. An isolated school like ours needs either football or men's basketball to be traditionally good; or at least decent. Our alumni need to look back on their college days and remember how much fun it was watching the football team play on Saturdays, or how exciting the men's basketball games were.

I get frustrated with our fans too, but winning is what grows a fan base. The Seahawks have stolen fans from both WSU and UW. Going to Pullman takes away from Seahawk game day, and is just one more reason to look the other way.

Bingo. Same stuff happens to me. WSU football is TV entertainment for most alumni, nothing more. Typically when I hear these types of fans complaining about winning and losing and why we don't fire this coach and hire that coach, I ask them what they really know about how the AD works and where the expect that money comes from. Most of them don't have a clue.

 

[CougPatrol]

It is the job of the university to create a culture of giving while the students are on campus. They have a captive audience. It's not the fault of the fan or the student to build this culture. It's the university's job.

11 bowl games in 100 years and people think that it's the fault of the fan???

Attitude reflects leadership. WSU has had piss poor leadership in its athletics department for 100 years. Now they get a decent AD and all of a sudden alums that haven't been back to Pullman for 30 years or alums that haven't donated in 40 years are supposed to open their checkbooks? Im not surprised at all the WSU is last. WSU needs to be accountable FIRST for its CHOSEN lack of action, direction and leadership. Blaming the fans only pushes the fans further away and closes their checkbooks.

Biggs, you're 100% correct. The biggest problem is that our alumni have forgotten about WSU. The team is good maybe 1 in 10 years. The students greatest memories of Pullman don't involve triumphant football or men's basketball victories. The alumni don't see WSU football or men's basketball teams covered by ESPN or even local news unless we're on the receiving end of a beat down.

Bill Moos is doing what we need to be doing.....asking for donations. If WSU wants donations to increase, they'll do everything they can to win games and make college football and men's basketball game days "circle the calendar" events. Why do our students leave at halftime of the football games? Well, trailing 30-0 after the first quarter and winning 15 games in 10 years has *something* to do with that.

 

[Flatlandcoug]

That $350 comment was meant in the context of "high level donors" not in a way that was meant to be demeaning.

Do you really believe that people donate big sums of money so they can get some stuff they could just buy?

And do you really think $350 is a lot of money?

First, I know you said in a later post that it wasn't meant as an insult.....but it certainly comes across that way.

FWIW, I put a little over $30,000 per year into savings of different kinds (college for my kids, rainy day fund, 401k, stock market, etc....). I donate less than $500 per year to Washington State. Do you know why I don't donate more? Because as a fan at a distance, I haven't heard a sales pitch that inspires me to do more. If I were to give WSU $10,000, they would still be millions of dollars short of meeting their goals. If I donate more than I do now, the value that I receive is a parking pass that I won't use. Would I increase my donation to over $500 if they offered one of those trinkets that I listed? I don't know for sure, but I can tell you that access to crappy parking doesn't work. Telling me that I need to do more because over 100,000 WSU alums sit on their collective asses doesn't inspire me either.

None of us "owe" WSU anything. I'm a CAF member because I feel like doing a little something, but I guarantee that I haven't seen anything since 2003 that makes me feel all that good about what I do donate. I almost set up an automatic monthly donation about 8 years ago, but didn't get around to it. By the time that Wulff had drained the life out of our football program, I didn't feel like doing that anymore. If they want people like me, who value their savings and like to be ready for the future, to separate themselves from more of their discretionary income, they need to find a better hook than guilt. The comments about distance make my situation more relevant than you might realize. There are undoubtedly a lot of alumni in the Puget Sound that feel the same way. They might want to donate but they want more than a hearty "Thanks!" and a Lot C parking pass. If you feel that makes them bad fans, so be it. Just don't bitch when they don't donate.

BTW, there are two reasons to give out quality SWAG to those mid-level donors ($500-2500). It gives them a WSU trinket that is cool......and when their friends see it, they can say, "WSU gives me cool stuff when I donate" and their friends (who we hope are WSU grads) think, "Man, I better get off my tail and do something!"

 

[CougPatrol]

I guess I don't see how donating has anything to do with going to games. So you can't go to all the games. All the more reason to donate.

People donate to causes based on momentum. ALS donations skyrocketed while the Ice Bucket Challenge was all over social media. Red Cross donations are highest after a major catastrophe. Season ticket requests blow up after teams post great seasons.

Watching WSU lose game after game doesn't inspire anyone to pick up the phone and donate. Winning big games, going to bowl games, and winning the Apple Cup regularly are the single most important factors that relate to donations.

Also, and many people on here disagree with me about this, playing football and men's basketball games in Western WA, where 70+% of our alumni resides, is absolutely critical to the winning of their hearts and minds.

Play a football game in Seahawk Stadium, and give fans a CAF membership option of paying $50 when they purchase their tickets. If WSU had a competitive team, this would be a GREAT way to tap into their wallets.

The problem is, our Seahawk Stadium case study was conducted during the worst era of WSU football in 50 years. Try playing a game in Seattle vs. USC, BYU, Boise State, etc. when our team is a legitimate contender and see what attendance looks like.

 

[Cougatron]

Why do our students leave at halftime of the football games? Well, trailing 30-0 after the first quarter and winning 15 games in 10 years has *something* to do with that.

They are leaving when we are winning though. I've seen it myself.

 

[CougPatrol]

They are leaving when we are winning though. I've seen it myself.

No question about it. That happens at Alabama as well.

 

[Coug95man2]

People donate to causes based on momentum. ALS donations skyrocketed while the Ice Bucket Challenge was all over social media. Red Cross donations are highest after a major catastrophe. Season ticket requests blow up after teams post great seasons.

Watching WSU lose game after game doesn't inspire anyone to pick up the phone and donate. Winning big games, going to bowl games, and winning the Apple Cup regularly are the single most important factors that relate to donations.

Also, and many people on here disagree with me about this, playing football and men's basketball games in Western WA, where 70+% of our alumni resides, is absolutely critical to the winning of their hearts and minds.

Play a football game in Seahawk Stadium, and give fans a CAF membership option of paying $50 when they purchase their tickets. If WSU had a competitive team, this would be a GREAT way to tap into their wallets.

The problem is, our Seahawk Stadium case study was conducted during the worst era of WSU football in 50 years. Try playing a game in Seattle vs. USC, BYU, Boise State, etc. when our team is a legitimate contender and see what attendance looks like.

And that is where I think I'm zigging, when you are zagging. I'm not in a frame of mind that says we are having success thus I will reward WSU athletics with my money. I'm in a frame of mind that says, "WSU hasn't cared about sports for decades. They do now. They need help so that we can boost our program to another level." I'm not looking at joining the bandwagon. I'm looking at building the bandwagon. I'm urging others to join the building.

 

[Flatlandcoug]

They are leaving when we are winning though. I've seen it myself.

There's nothing in the short term that is going to keep students from bailing at halftime of a game that is out of hand. Years of bad football have created a fanbase who just don't care about football that much and the idea of getting your drunk on and hoping to score with some chick is a pretty good draw when you don't really care about the team. In time, if we start to win (and more than once or twice per year at home), you'll see fans that are more invested in games. They'll make more trips than they currently do and students will, in time, start to stay later in the game. If WSU can start winning, you won't have students leaving at halftime thinking, "screw it, we're probably going to lose anyway".

People will still leave but if the general apathy of the fanbase can be cured, you won't see as much of it. WSU tried giving away stuff at games and I don't know if they still do that. If we start winning, it might be a more effective carrot to try again.

 

[CougSinceBirth]

Bingo. Same stuff happens to me. WSU football is TV entertainment for most alumni, nothing more. Typically when I hear these types of fans complaining about winning and losing and why we don't fire this coach and hire that coach, I ask them what they really know about how the AD works and where the expect that money comes from. Most of them don't have a clue.

I agree with a lot of Biggs and a lot of others.

However, I've noticed there are a lot of young alumni my age that told me they're not concerned about the final score of Cougar football, etc. but more concerned about getting to the Coug, Valhalla and so on. It sucks but it's reality.

I think the CAF could make some changes and they would go a long way. One of those being fixing their website to be slick, easy to use and actually processes payments. If anyone wants to donate, it should be extremely easy.

 

[kayak15]

Some of Flat's suggestions got me thinking. A trinket such as the signed photo of Martin and others would add to the donating experience. An actual material demonstration of appreciation. The trinket itself may not count for much but the thought would. Couldn't cost the AD much and would aid in encouraging further support. Not a bad idea, not an earth shattering one but not bad. But the suggestion that really got me thinking was his first. The one about the polo shirt saying CAF donor 2xxx. This has some problems but is on the right track to my thinking. What does a polo shirt cost wholesale, $20 or so? Then add in shipping and handling costs and you have just spent half of the small donation. Giving it only to the big spenders would differentiate CAF donors by financial standing and would be undesirable. So, how about this: A t-shirt to CAF supporters reading same as above with the subscript "I donate to WSU" or something similar. I'm sure that most recipients would be delighted to wear that to games. I know that I would. Effectually we would have thousands of walking billboards wandering through campus on game day and attending the events therein. Others attending the events could not help thinking (1) WSU and (2) donation. A bit of not so subliminal advertising. Other adults would wonder whether they should not join in and also support the CAF. And the students....... At their age and financial situation they are not thinking beyond next week's chemistry test and certainly not about contributing to the school's coffers. But now is the time to put the idea into their heads. Seeing the older alumni walking about with shirts proclaiming their financial support would present them with the demonstration that this is normal and expected behavior after graduation as a way of repaying their debt to WSU's contribution to their lives. Not aware what the cost of these t-shirts to CAF members would be and maybe it would be prohibitive but the idea of a flood of walking advertisements on campus appeals to me. They are already giving out some free Coug themed t-shirts so this idea cannot be too far off the mark. As far as the fancier and more expensive polo shirts, these could be sold in the Bookie- CAF card required for purchase. Feel free to tear this alteration of Flat's suggestion #1 to shreds. Wouldn't be the first time one of my ideas has been shot down in flames by reality.

 

[Cougatron]

Some of Flat's suggestions got me thinking. A trinket such as the signed photo of Martin and others would add to the donating experience. An actual material demonstration of appreciation. The trinket itself may not count for much but the thought would. Couldn't cost the AD much and would aid in encouraging further support. Not a bad idea, not an earth shattering one but not bad. But the suggestion that really got me thinking was his first. The one about the polo shirt saying CAF donor 2xxx. This has some problems but is on the right track to my thinking. What does a polo shirt cost wholesale, $20 or so? Then add in shipping and handling costs and you have just spent half of the small donation. Giving it only to the big spenders would differentiate CAF donors by financial standing and would be undesirable. So, how about this: A t-shirt to CAF supporters reading same as above with the subscript "I donate to WSU" or something similar. I'm sure that most recipients would be delighted to wear that to games. I know that I would. Effectually we would have thousands of walking billboards wandering through campus on game day and attending the events therein. Others attending the events could not help thinking (1) WSU and (2) donation. A bit of not so subliminal advertising. Other adults would wonder whether they should not join in and also join the CAF. And the students....... At their age and financial situation they are not thinking beyond next week's chemistry test and certainly not about contributing to the school's coffers. But now is the time to put the idea into their heads. Seeing the older alumni walking about with shirts proclaiming their financial support would present them with the demonstration that this is normal and expected behavior after graduation as a way of repaying their debt to WSU's contribution to their lives. Not aware what the cost of these t-shirts to CAF members would be and maybe it would be prohibitive but the idea of a flood of walking advertisements on campus appeals to me. They are already giving out some free Coug themed t-shirts so this idea cannot be too far off the mark. As far as the fancier and more expensive polo shirts, these could be sold in the Bookie- CAF card required for purchase. Feel free to tear this alteration of Flat's suggestion #1 to shreds. Wouldn't be the first time one of my ideas has been shot down in flames by reality.

I like it Kayak I would proudly wear it. Whatever it takes for people to realize that the school we all went to is an amazing place...not just because of what we experienced, but the people that paved the way for it to be that great experience, and now it's your turn to be that person.

 

[chipdouglas]

You are dumb as rocks if you don't think Stanford has rich AF donors. Their athletic department endowment is $270 million, the largest in the country. For some perspective, the entire endowment of Washington State University is $868 million.

3 people paid for their entire stadium rebuild.

WSU is a clown show when it comes to donors.

Jesus H you're abrasive. ITG for sure.

To be abrasive back, you're dumb as rocks if you think that helps prove your point. Money was never mentioned in my OP, but let's unpack this:

• 'tron says lack of fan support (financial, moral) is holding back our program
• But for all Furd's athletic money, 8 in the last 10 years pre-Harbaugh were losing seasons
• Stanford replaces an 85.5k capacity stadium with a 50k stadium (and still can't fill it)
• Under Harbaugh, Furd improves every year and gets to 12-1 in Year 4
• Shaw takes the reins and reels off 3 more straight 11+ win seasons
• But Furd can't sell out season tix or fill a stadium until they're invincible at home (18-1) and have gone to 4 straight bowls
• Even today, after becoming an elite program, the atmosphere is lame and stuffy - rowdy fans need not apply
• Not to mention my side-analysis a month ago finding that home attendance explains virtually nothing of wins

3 factors could explain Stanford's ascendance: money, coaching or rowdy fans who show up.

One, we know their fans aren't rowdy, so nix that. Two, they've always had money and they still couldn't stop losing, so table that one. Three, a great coach like Jim Harbaugh rolls in and takes 3 years to build a bowl team. Next thing you know attendance is climbing and [presumably] money is pouring in at least as fast as it was before (probably faster).

You tell me.

 

[Cougatron]

Jesus H you're abrasive. ITG for sure.

To be abrasive back, you're dumb as rocks if you think that helps prove your point. Money was never mentioned in my OP, but let's unpack this:

• 'tron says lack of fan support (financial, moral) is holding back our program
• But for all Furd's athletic money, 8 in the last 10 years pre-Harbaugh were losing seasons
• Stanford replaces an 85.5k capacity stadium with a 50k stadium (and still can't fill it)
• Under Harbaugh, Furd improves every year and gets to 12-1 in Year 4
• Shaw takes the reins and reels off 3 more straight 11+ win seasons
• But Furd can't sell out season tix or fill a stadium until they're invincible at home (18-1) and have gone to 4 straight bowls
• Even today, after becoming an elite program, the atmosphere is lame and stuffy - rowdy fans need not apply
• Not to mention my side-analysis a month ago finding that home attendance explains virtually nothing of wins

3 factors could explain Stanford's ascendance: money, coaching or rowdy fans who show up.

One, we know their fans aren't rowdy, so nix that. Two, they've always had money and they still couldn't stop losing, so table that one. Three, a great coach like Jim Harbaugh rolls in and takes 3 years to build a bowl team. Next thing you know attendance is climbing and [presumably] money is pouring in at least as fast as it was before (probably faster).

You tell me.

There is no denying Harbaugh is a good coach, but you know who else posted the following record..

9-3
10-3

at Stanford.... Tyrone Willingham... the 0-12 Husky Tyrone Willingham.

He went to Notre Dame and did nothing...went to Washington and did nothing... and the reason why he was able to do it at Stanford is they have an incredible internal support structure. It's one of the few places that doesn't require fans in the stands to win, and the reason is they can do that is they have the money, and the academic prestige to get the smartest kids and they know how to win in athletics.

We don't have lots of support, we don't have the fans, and we don't have a great recruiting draw...

We can control 2 of the 3 by being rowdy fans and giving as much as we can to help out. The recruiting part is the hardest but Leach is bringing in better and better players. But as fans we aren't doing our part to help out. We're the obnoxious kids in the backseat screaming ARE WE THERE YET?!? and throwing hissy fits because we aren't.

 

[chinookpirate]

Plausible wins, over time and a plus.500 record at home will ensure min crowds of 30,000 and occasional sellouts.

What you do when they get there (fan experience, etc.) is what will keep them coming back and bringing a friend or two.

 

[Flatlandcoug]

Some of Flat's suggestions got me thinking. A trinket such as the signed photo of Martin and others would add to the donating experience. An actual material demonstration of appreciation. The trinket itself may not count for much but the thought would. Couldn't cost the AD much and would aid in encouraging further support. Not a bad idea, not an earth shattering one but not bad. But the suggestion that really got me thinking was his first. The one about the polo shirt saying CAF donor 2xxx. This has some problems but is on the right track to my thinking. What does a polo shirt cost wholesale, $20 or so? Then add in shipping and handling costs and you have just spent half of the small donation. Giving it only to the big spenders would differentiate CAF donors by financial standing and would be undesirable. So, how about this: A t-shirt to CAF supporters reading same as above with the subscript "I donate to WSU" or something similar. I'm sure that most recipients would be delighted to wear that to games. I know that I would. Effectually we would have thousands of walking billboards wandering through campus on game day and attending the events therein. Others attending the events could not help thinking (1) WSU and (2) donation. A bit of not so subliminal advertising. Other adults would wonder whether they should not join in and also join the CAF. And the students....... At their age and financial situation they are not thinking beyond next week's chemistry test and certainly not about contributing to the school's coffers. But now is the time to put the idea into their heads. Seeing the older alumni walking about with shirts proclaiming their financial support would present them with the demonstration that this is normal and expected behavior after graduation as a way of repaying their debt to WSU's contribution to their lives. Not aware what the cost of these t-shirts to CAF members would be and maybe it would be prohibitive but the idea of a flood of walking advertisements on campus appeals to me. They are already giving out some free Coug themed t-shirts so this idea cannot be too far off the mark. As far as the fancier and more expensive polo shirts, these could be sold in the Bookie- CAF card required for purchase. Feel free to tear this alteration of Flat's suggestion #1 to shreds. Wouldn't be the first time one of my ideas has been shot down in flames by reality.

FWIW, Kansas State did a grass roots fundraising campaign called "ICAT". It stood for "I Contributed A Twenty". Give $20 and you got a t-shirt. They got a local company to donate the printing costs and sold tens of thousands of them. As much as anything, it trained their young supporters to give money to athletics.

 

[BiggsCoug]

Things aren't going to change just because the school got $22M and now wants to win. The university CHOSE not to invest in athletics for 100 years. Now, they win the lottery, and expect alums and fans to push their chips in when they didn't until they won the TV revenue sweepstakes? Sorry, not buying it.

When the university gives until it hurts and the team wins, then I think you'll see the fans start to do the same. Until then, don't ask the fans to do what you spent 100 years not doing. Attitude reflects leadership.

 

[How_did_this_happen?]

Out of sight, out of mind. That's always been the problem. Our alumni graduate, relocate several hundred miles away, and because our big-2 athletic programs are typically bad, they're not prompted to give back to the University or make the trek back to Pullman to catch a game or two.

I've been going to football games for 30+ years, and friends and co-workers always ask me with astonishment...."do you really, dude?" "why do you drive 300 miles to see your team lose?" "you're a diehard, I could never do that."

If you're an average joe with a family, a career, and you live 160 - 400 miles away, like most all of our alumni do, what about WSU athletics gets you amped up to get to Pullman for a game or give money to the school?

Don't get too elaborate with your problem solving theories. An isolated school like ours needs either football or men's basketball to be traditionally good; or at least decent. Our alumni need to look back on their college days and remember how much fun it was watching the football team play on Saturdays, or how exciting the men's basketball games were.

I get frustrated with our fans too, but winning is what grows a fan base. The Seahawks have stolen fans from both WSU and UW. Going to Pullman takes away from Seahawk game day, and is just one more reason to look the other way.

You're a great fan. I highlighted the key question you asked? Seriously, why do you do that? Clearly, you have some extra money to make this happen that others may not have. But your response to that question would be interesting to me. You've probably explained this before, but I don't recall.

I am big fan but don't have that kind of commitment. Not even close. I blame my dad for condemning me to being a WSU fan for life.

 

[kayak15]

FWIW, Kansas State did a grass roots fundraising campaign called "ICAT". It stood for "I Contributed A Twenty". Give $20 and you got a t-shirt. They got a local company to donate the printing costs and sold tens of thousands of them. As much as anything, it trained their young supporters to give money to athletics.

Very interesting and not a bad idea. I was unaware of that. I think that I will send an email to the AD or CAF suggesting that they read this thread and consider utilizing some form of these CAF t-shirt campaigns. Will post the summary of whatever reply I receive.

 

[YakiCoug]

It is the job of the university to create a culture of giving while the students are on campus. They have a captive audience. It's not the fault of the fan or the student to build this culture. It's the university's job.

11 bowl games in 100 years and people think that it's the fault of the fan???

Attitude reflects leadership. WSU has had piss poor leadership in its athletics department for 100 years. Now they get a decent AD and all of a sudden alums that haven't been back to Pullman for 30 years or alums that haven't donated in 40 years are supposed to open their checkbooks? Im not surprised at all the WSU is last. WSU needs to be accountable FIRST for its CHOSEN lack of action, direction and leadership. Blaming the fans only pushes the fans further away and closes their checkbooks.

There are no captive audiences when their faces are staring into the cell phone pool.