Doom & Gloom on the D?

[chinookpirate]

... and to the other sub-thread: it seems guys are starting to argue why and how it happened. Attrition is built in. it's a given.

25 X 5 = 85

Does it really matter how a coach gets to his "40"?

 

[CougEd]

Brilliant. Thanks. PLEASE come back when you have another epiphany.

But to move this forward, that is 2 JUCO DB's that could very well fill a hole. I truly hope so. The one question I have is, how many years do these JC's have at WSU? Is it just the normal 2?

Historically speaking at least one will be a bust. Historically speaking the other one will start to make an impact in game five. Is that hard and fast rule, nope. But if you took 10 cases, 8 with follow that same path.

The second concern is how much will they help right away. They are just learning how

Yes Ed, Chima was good enough his freshman year. So was everyone else that played in 2007 and sucked in 2008. Ed, the easiest and most logical answer is Wulff who got fired after one year at his last job.

Of course he was, he had a better dline. Ropati and Johnson were the anchors. What Wulff did at S Florida had nothing to do with WSU. Chima had a position coach that had numerous players in the NFL. They still coach the position the same way, put in the same amount of hours. So the fact Tuel regressed means it is Leach's fault. Got it because Leach is OC and QB coach.

Why act like a players career is a straight line. It isn't. In Chima's case he was coached by a position coach that is well respected in college football.

 

[Cougsocal]

Here is a small consideration that maybe some aren't taking into account. The below players are the JUCO's that are coming in, that were not in the Spring Game. I would wager, while not at 100% ready and fully submerged, these guys could easily make an impact immediately.

Treshon Broughton 3Star DB
Shalom Luani 3Star DB with a legit 4.5x40
Jeremiah Mitchell 2Star DE (This MAN might be a 2star but he shouldn't be… He's vicious AND big. He was also at the C&G game, fyi)
Aaron Porter 3star LB

Now 1.) combine these players with the current players coming back (for what that's worth) and also 2.) the freshman coming in that will also push everyone (doubt they will start but maybe), AND 3.) Grinch whom by all accounts is breathing new life into the Dark Side, I truly do look forward to seeing how far this D squad will come this year.

The incoming true freshman (on D) I'm excited to see? Not a full list and others might be just as exciting but these guys stand out on paper/video.
Sean Harper Jr 3star DB out of GA
Logan Tago 2Star LB out of Pago Pago
Thomas Toki 4star DT out of CA
Hunter Dale 3star DB out of LA
Kameron Powell 3star DB out of CA

Just thoughts… Instead of looking at the "glass half empty", thought looking at it as "glass half full" might be refreshing. We are building. I'd disagree that it's "HALF empty" btw. I'd say we have more positives than negatives. No 50/50, IMHO.

As member of the much hated non - kool aid drinkers, my opinion of the 2015 class is that it represents a fundamental shift in our recruiting practices over the last 7 years or so. We looked to sign athletes first, over the scale and tape measure kids of the past. Mitchell is a classic example, a 250# DL on paper he's to small to play in a 3-4, but we haven't had an athlete like this on the DL, for many years. Shalom at 200 is not the "size" you "want" at safety, but he is tough, has great feet and most important is a serious speed upgrade.

 

[cr8zyncalif]

Personally, I think Dotson's odds of starting went up a bunch when Grinch brought in his nickel scheme. Dotson looks like that hybrid safety/mobile LB that the nickel needs.

The guys that 95 mentioned in his initial post all have a chance to contribute. Odds are that half of them get some real PT this fall. There is clearly some talent there, but I suspect that we have more returning talent at DB and LB than we realize...if they are all healthy. Best case (glass half full) is that there are real battles for starting positions in fall camp, that extend well into the fall. This time of the year, I'm a glass half full kind of guy. Ask me again the last week of fall camp!

 

[Coug95man2]

I'd also suggest, the shift isn't just in the kind of body type that is being recruited. But this past year, it seems to be a real shift in JC's and the specific side of the ball those players are on. We recruited 5 JC's, 4 of them for the D. Prior, 4 JC's were the highest number of recruits CML has brought in, in any given year. And they were on both sides of the ball.

It seems that our coaches saw our D was lacking. We were recruiting some of the JC's in the middle of the season. That really indicates that they weren't oblivious to the problems, they just had to wait for the recruiting cycle. I like the fact they see a problem and are recruiting JC's to try and fill the "hole" as fast as possible. Should they have done something a few years ago? Yeah, probably.

 

[chinookpirate]

The Bennett's didn't even do as well three years in. There is a difference between taking a wait and see attitude and sarcastically trashing Leach's program.

1. There is a difference between basketball and football.

2. If Leach wants to be considered a winner at Washington State, great! it's what I want... but he needs to start winning in order to do so.

3. In my mind, Leach currently ranks 5th place In achievement WHILE HEAD COACH at WSU ... over the past 7 coaches. (Price, Walden, Erickson, Sweeny, Leach, Doba, Wulff) I think Leach has a possibility to jump 2 spots up the achievement-as-HC-WSU ladder, this season.

I 'hope' so

 

[wulffui]

1. There is a difference between basketball and football.

And you say it like that implies you think building a football team is the EASIER of the two?

 

[chinookpirate]

Let me be clear.

In my opinion, if Leach wants to move ahead of Sweeney and/or Erickson, up the WSU achievement ladder while coach at WSU, he needs to win a Bowl game and put a trophy in the trophy case Moos built.

Will he do that this year? from my angle? not likely. Could he? Sure he could.

I hope he does. If he does, '16 and '17 should be special.

 

[chinookpirate]

The good thing is that since you're a uw fan that your actions did not constitute a recruiting violation. Well done.

I have no affiliation with UW. I don't take kids there. As you well know, I am a WSU alum and booster... and my actions still didn't constitute a violation... Imagine that.

 

[CougEd]

I'd speculate that what drove people away from 2010 on was 2008-10, not message board sniping. Unless... were people really advocating hard for Wulff's fourth year, after three wins in three years? But that is what the coaches blamed for their failure, darn mean message boards.

That's a pretty healthy list of players you just ran down, worse for their time at WSU under the Wulff staff.

Had nothing to do with the staff, though.

So you are saying Levy who coached a ton of WR simply got worse cause he coached for Wulff? That has to be what you are saying.

 

[wulffui]

So you are saying Levy who coached a ton of WR simply got worse cause he coached for Wulff? That has to be what you are saying.

Nope, I would say coach Wulff was pretty foolish to demote his ten win offense for the pride of St. Ambrose at the OC position. Is it D-3? NAIA? High School? A Caribbean for-profit college? Only Coach Wulff knows for sure.

 

[YakiCoug]

I'm trying to hold a rational fact based discussion.

All I seem to be attracting are Internet trolls bent on hurling personal insults while ignoring the facts?

Btw, how many WSU recruits did YOU drive to Pullman so they could watch practice, meet coaches and players, tour facilities and campus? (I know, loaded question, right?)

Heehee, "chinookpirate/HWGC" and "rational" in the same room? All this from a guy who has twice been banned for "hurling personal insults."

 

[How_did_this_happen?]

And you say it like that implies you think building a football team is the EASIER of the two?

On this subject, Ed convincingly and correctly argued that a football program is more difficult to build than a basketball program (back in 2009-2010). Of course, he apparently disregarded this position when Ken Bone was shown to be a horrible coach at this level. Ed couldn't stop making excuses for his performance. I believe he even suggested Bone was a better coach than Dick Bennett! At that point, I knew he had gone off the rails and thus had almost no credibility to me in evaluation of coaches.

Anyway, I couldn't resist jumping in on your comment...

 

[How_did_this_happen?]

I'm from Missouri when it comes to this team and the upcoming season.

 

[YakiCoug]

Historically speaking at least one will be a bust. Historically speaking the other one will start to make an impact in game five. Is that hard and fast rule, nope. But if you took 10 cases, 8 with follow that same path.

The second concern is how much will they help right away. They are just learning how


Of course he was, he had a better dline. Ropati and Johnson were the anchors. What Wulff did at S Florida had nothing to do with WSU. Chima had a position coach that had numerous players in the NFL. They still coach the position the same way, put in the same amount of hours. So the fact Tuel regressed means it is Leach's fault. Got it because Leach is OC and QB coach.

Why act like a players career is a straight line. It isn't. In Chima's case he was coached by a position coach that is well respected in college football.

For a guy who doesn't care about Wulff, your front end is

On this subject, Ed convincingly and correctly argued that a football program is more difficult to build than a basketball program (back in 2009-2010). Of course, he apparently disregarded this position when Ken Bone was shown to be a horrible coach at this level. Ed couldn't stop making excuses for his performance. I believe he even suggested Bone was a better coach than Dick Bennett! At that point, I knew he had gone off the rails and thus had almost no credibility to me in evaluation of coaches.

Anyway, I couldn't resist jumping in on your comment...

Some so-called Cougar fans have a lip-lock on loser coaches.

 

[YakiCoug]

We are losers because we lose.

We will be winners when we win.

Simple fact.

Great, so why your leg humping of Wulff throughout 2008-2011 and since? You're a troll and embrace it. You'll be banned again soon enough. Count on it.

 

[spongebob11]

Heehee, "chinookpirate/HWGC" and "rational" in the same room? All this from a guy who has twice been banned for "hurling personal insults."

You've been banned for hurling personal insults you moron!

You would still be banned if the site wasn't sold.

 

[wulffui]

You've been banned for hurling personal insults you moron!

So good.

 

[froropmkr72]

The good thing is that since you're a uw fan that your actions did not constitute a recruiting violation. Well done.

Nice! This is just too true.

 

[froropmkr72]

I have no affiliation with UW. I don't take kids there. As you well know, I am a WSU alum and booster... and my actions still didn't constitute a violation... Imagine that.[/QUO

With friends of the university such as yourself...they don't need anymore enemies.

I have no affiliation with UW. I don't take kids there. As you well know, I am a WSU alum and booster... and my actions still didn't constitute a violation... Imagine that.

LIAR!

 

[YakiCoug]

You've been banned for hurling personal insults you moron!

You would still be banned if the site wasn't sold.

Wow. Big sis help you write this one? Devaluing a WSU degree as always!

 

[froropmkr72]

Wow. Big sis help you write this one? Devaluing a WSU degree as always!

Let's just skip to the chase as we recall this thread as well as where everyone was coming from.

 

[Fab5Coug]

Let's just skip to the chase as we recall this thread as well as where everyone was coming from.

Why bump this up? Just one of probably 100 troll jobs by chinook.