How about a mellow topic - like Immigration

[Loyal Coug1]

I was never a big "Build the wall" guy, but I'm starting to wonder. Now we have 10's of thousands of Chinese immigrants crossing or trying to. Why can't we stop them? Once they get across the border, we are F-ed. This has got to stop, and these dumbass Dem's are not helping. It's like No! you cannot cross the border! How goddam hard is that, fence or no fence? climb the fence and you are trespassing and we will shoot you on the wire.

And I'm a moderate! But this is insane. It's not Ellis Island in 1901 anymore.

 

[WillieThePimp]

I was never a big "Build the wall" guy, but I'm starting to wonder. Now we have 10's of thousands of Chinese immigrants crossing or trying to. Why can't we stop them? Once they get across the border, we are F-ed. This has got to stop, and these dumbass Dem's are not helping. It's like No! you cannot cross the border! How goddam hard is that, fence or no fence? climb the fence and you are trespassing and we will shoot you on the wire.

And I'm a moderate! But this is insane. It's not Ellis Island in 1901 anymore.

This isn’t just a Dem problem - idiots in both parties have tied border security to Ukraine funding.

And you sound a lot more like a Nazi or a Soviet Commie than a moderate.

 

[Loyal Coug1]

This isn’t just a Dem problem - idiots in both parties have tied border security to Ukraine funding.

And you sound a lot more like a Nazi or a Soviet Commie than a moderate.

Not at all. But it appears that we just let thousands and thousands cross the border with nothing but the clothes on their backs, then they become our problem. Next thing you know the Mexis will have their guns up preventing us from sending them back.

 

[CougPatrol]

There are literally no bipartisan ideologies anymore. Even the most basically agreed upon principles like legal, regulated immigration get put into the political blender.

The system has become completely corrupted.

 

[95coug]

The issue isn’t the border. There’s little need for building wall, adding guards, or deploying soldiers. The issue is how easy it is for people to wander across the border and then get set up with everything they need to survive. Too many handouts and entitlement programs.
Change the rules. Create harsher penalties for employers who don’t verify employment eligibility. Make banks and utility companies verify residency before turning on the heat or cashing checks (for banks, tie this to eligibility for FDIC). Force states to verify legal status before issuing drivers licenses or welfare (states like CA and WA will protest, but tie it to eligibility for federal funding and they’ll fall in line).
In short, make it so they can’t come here and get things handed to them. If they come and work, pay taxes and keep social security afloat, I’m fine with them coming. If they want to come and re-establish their village on our dime…no thanks.

 

[Cougini5591]

I know people with farms/land on the border.

If the people down there want it, we are morons not to listen.

The only reason the "left" doesn’t want the wall is because of their voting block now... the numbers that would increase.

People on the "right" who don't want the wall are more about trying to save money... which I find hilarious because I don't see the budget cut really happening cleanly and clearly there either.

I will say that having a "wall" and actually fighting a true war to stop illegal immigration is fair to me because if we do it for people's houses... neighborhoods... government buildings...

If we really want to have a safe, clean, leading country...

We gotta be careful on what/who we let in.

And yeah... drop the hammer on those employers pouring gas on the fire.

 

[WillieThePimp]

If we really want to have a safe, clean, leading country...

We gotta be careful on what/who we let in.

“Safe, clean… country”. Lol. That’s code for “white”.

 

[CougInSpain]

“Safe, clean… country”. Lol. That’s code for “white”.

Your hard on for everything social justice is showing.... might want at least pretend you have a shred of common sense contained within the last few brain cells lingering in your head. We know Covid nearly cleaned you out but GD bro.

 

[Cougini5591]

“Safe, clean… country”. Lol. That’s code for “white”.

You really are a f*cking idiot.

Got it...

Let's make it our goal to not have a safe, clean, leadingbcountry.

Totally makes sense.

Sounds so much better to say "I don't want to have a Safe, clean, leading country".

F*cking moron

Did the word "leading" scare you into becoming even more of a they/them?

 

[mikalalas]

“Safe, clean… country”. Lol. That’s code for “white”.

Everything doesn't have to be about race, racism, etc.

Even HISPANIC, BROWN skinned, LEGAL IMMIGRANTS, COMPLAIN about ILLEGAL ALIEN IMMIGRANTS STEALING their jobs, and are offended, say, WE STAND IN LINE, WAIT FOR YEARS, COME HERE LEGALLY, WORK HARD, SACRIFICE, ETC, AND THESE ILLEGAL ALIEN IMMIGRANTS COME HERE ILLEGALLY, GET HERE BEFORE WE DO, MAKE US HAVE TO WAIT LONGER, STEAL OUR JOBS, MAKE THINGS UNSAFE, BRING COVID, GET HAND OUTS, HAVE OUR TAXES SUPPORT THEM, HAVE THEM REFUSE TO LEARN ENGLISH, ETC.

This is NOT race, racism, issue. It's not about making the USA WHITE. It's not about being against LEGAL IMMIGRATION.

STOP MAKING IT ABOUT RACE, RACISM.

STOP PAINTING THOSE THAT ARE AGAINST ILLEGAL ALIEN IMMIGRATION AS BEING HOWLING BIGOTS THAT ARE SUPPOSEDLY AGAINST LEGAL IMMIGRATION.

STOP SAYING, CALLING IT IMMIGRATION, INSTEAD OF ILLEGAL ALIEN IMMIGRATION, IN ORDER TO MAKE IT SOUND LIKE THAT THOSE WHO AGAINST ILLEGAL ALIEN IMMIGRATION ATE SUPPOSEDLY AGAINST LEGAL IMMIGRATION.

We need to legally reform the immigration system. Make it easier for LEGAL IMMIGRANTS to come into our country LEGALLY.

We need to have Walls, fences, check points, more border patrol agents, more patrols. We need to SECURE the border. And when illegal alien immigrants are discovered they either need to WORK on a PATH TO, EARN their LEGAL STATUS, GREEN CARD, CITIZENSHIP, and or be TEMPORARILY DEPORTED, sent to the BACK OF THE LINE, wait longer, etc.

Illegal Alien Immigrant Criminals, MS 13, gang members, CARTEL members, and those that commit violent crimes, etc, need to be instantly jailed, deported.(They are NOT CITIZENS, SO THEY DO NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO TRIAL, AND ARE NOT ASSUMED INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY)

That would eliminate situations that DO HAPPEN where a illegal alien immigrant murders 8 people one at a time, where each time they get caught, released, not deported, get sanctuary in a sanctuary city, county, state, and then murder again, and again, and again each time.

Eliminate Sanctuary cities, counties, states, and prosecute, take to court, take away ALL federal funding of cities, counties, states, that are sanctuaries, refuse to cooperate with federal authorities to stop illegal alien immigration, etc.

ANY, ALL MAYORS, GOVERNORS, COUNTY COMMISSIONERS, POLICE, THAT TURN A BLIND EYE, IS A SANCTUARY FOR ILLEGAL ALIEN IMMIGRANTS, THAT DO NOT COOPERATE WITH ICE, FEDERAL AUTHORITIES, ETC, SHOULD BE ARRESTED, JAILED, PROSECUTED TO THE FULLEST EXTENT OF LAW, HAVE BOOK THROWN AT THEM, BE IMMEDIATELY IMPEACHED, REMOVED FROM OFFICE, ETC.

Do what 95 mentioned, PUNISH BANKS, EMPLOYERS, POLITICIANS, LOCAL GOVTS, UTILITIES, by taking away federal funding, FDIC, certification, permits, business licenses, jail time, etc.

No drivers license, no government issued ID cards, etc.

Make it hard, almost impossible for illegal alien immigrants to come here illegally, and get set up, with hand outs, etc

Of course WA, Oregon, CA, and Willie here, and all the other radical liberal social justice warrior DEMOTARDS, will of course oppose all this, and so none of this will happen, and so there will continue to be a POROUS, UNSECURE BORDER, because the liberal, DEMOTARDS, not only oppose all this, they want more ILLEGAL ALIEN IMMIGRANTS, AND WANT THEM TO THEN GET LEGALIZED LATER, AND TO BE ABLE TO VOTE, BECAUSE THEY WOULD ALL VOTE DEMOCRAT PARTY.

 

[Cougsocal]

Any where you go these days the construction/building trades are immigrant Latino dominated. Same in agriculture, food processing or any job you think you are too good for. Even in Oxford, Mississippi, the heart of redness and unemployment, the university grounds crew is Latino. My floor and tile guy hires them. He said that they don't need to be trained, they show up and are hard working. He says he can't find local guys able and willing to do the work, because it is hard and demanding. Even the most right wing, foreigner hating, republicans out there would have to admit the USA is a little like Dubai, dependant on Latinos for hard labor, because as a culture we now seem to view this type of work in beneath us.

Now let me put on my red hat. Personally, I prefer having illegal aliens (still the definition in the USC) here, than our home grown welfare sponges, smash and grabbers, addicts and the lifestyle homeless crowd. But I dislike lazy and self-entitled. I have no problem with anyone willing to pick up a hammer and work hard, regardless. Let market forces deal with the issue. Economies that don't have ready access to blue collar labor, struggle, Japan and post Brexit UK, for example. We have had a constant illegal alien (USC) "crisis" in this country since Carter. Reagan gave amnesty to millions. Have we suffered? Everyone is richer now than in the good old days. Even being "poor" includes having cell phones and an unlimited plan these days. The stock market has nearly quadrupled in the last 30 years. And who in the hell is going to build the affordable homes that will address the housing shortage/crisis? Our sons? Get real!

Don't be stupid and let subconscious racism and xenophobia, kill the golden goose. The only thing needed is far better foreign labor management and control. Times have changed. When I was a teen I spent my summers shearing Christmas trees on a wasp infested, clear cut, hillside outside Allyn, WA. Don't pretend that type of world will ever return.

 

[Flatlandcoug]

The issue isn’t the border. There’s little need for building wall, adding guards, or deploying soldiers. The issue is how easy it is for people to wander across the border and then get set up with everything they need to survive. Too many handouts and entitlement programs.
Change the rules. Create harsher penalties for employers who don’t verify employment eligibility. Make banks and utility companies verify residency before turning on the heat or cashing checks (for banks, tie this to eligibility for FDIC). Force states to verify legal status before issuing drivers licenses or welfare (states like CA and WA will protest, but tie it to eligibility for federal funding and they’ll fall in line).
In short, make it so they can’t come here and get things handed to them. If they come and work, pay taxes and keep social security afloat, I’m fine with them coming. If they want to come and re-establish their village on our dime…no thanks.

This is the most sane answer. The wall was a dumb idea and always was. A vanity project promoted by a narcissist making promises that he couldn't keep.

The Dems are idiots for failing to implement regulations that discourage mass arrivals at the border and deserve a lot of criticism for that. The Republicans are idiots for being nationalistic xenophobes that fail to realize how critical immigration has been to our nation's success. There's a middle ground that the moron's in power are not trying to reach because of tribal politics.

 

[CougPatrol]

“Safe, clean… country”. Lol. That’s code for “white”.

Have you traveled abroad? I mean, there's something to that, PC or not.

 

[WillieThePimp]

You really are a f*cking idiot.

Got it...

Let's make it our goal to not have a safe, clean, leadingbcountry.

Totally makes sense.

Sounds so much better to say "I don't want to have a Safe, clean, leading country".

F*cking moron

Did the word "leading" scare you into becoming even more of a they/them?

You really are a f*cking idiot.

Got it...

Let's make it our goal to not have a safe, clean, leadingbcountry.

Totally makes sense.

Sounds so much better to say "I don't want to have a Safe, clean, leading country".

F*cking moron

Did the word "leading" scare you into becoming even more of a they/them?

Oh… OK. By using the word “clean” you really meant that you want less pollution, cutting back on greenhouse gasses and more recycling.

And not “clean” as in keeping this country “clean” of “vermin” from “shithole countries”.

Um yeah. Got it.

 

[WillieThePimp]

Have you traveled abroad? I mean, there's something to that, PC or not.

Yes. I’ve even been to some “shithole” countries.

 

[wazzucougs96]

People are so desperate for the American dream, to engage in capitalism, to be Americans, that they will risk everything to get here knowing fully well it will mean a brutal life, and the prevailing sentiment from the "no one wants to work anymore" crowd is "we don't want you"

It has never made any sense to me.

 

[Flatlandcoug]

People are so desperate for the American dream, to engage in capitalism, to be Americans, that they will risk everything to get here knowing fully well it will mean a brutal life, and the prevailing sentiment from the "no one wants to work anymore" crowd is "we don't want you"

It has never made any sense to me.

The funny thing for me is seeing the difference in work ethic between American and Hispanic employees when it comes to difficult manual labor. In construction, the vast majority of crews are Hispanic.....they work hard, they don't complain (to your face) and they get the job done well. I had a project about 10 years ago and for whatever reason, it was two American dudes on it. Easy project just cleaning up the grading on some ditches and picking up trash and debris left behind by the crew. It took them three weeks to finish a what a couple of Hispanics would have done in two days.

 

[WillieThePimp]

Your hard on for everything social justice is showing.... might want at least pretend you have a shred of common sense contained within the last few brain cells lingering in your head. We know Covid nearly cleaned you out but GD bro.

Oh yeah, I’m a social justice warrior. You got me pegged.

I’m willing to give him the benefit of a doubt that he doesn’t realize how loaded the word “clean” is when it comes to the hot topic issue of immigration since the language is being mainstreamed. But it still is exactly what it is.

 

[CougEd]

Have you traveled abroad? I mean, there's something to that, PC or not.

Well… tell me about gun laws overseas ?

So tell me how you make Chicago safer ? They are too dumb in Chicago to realize they just need more guns and higher magazines . Why the people of Chcago don’t join the NRA and gun up .

 

[CougEd]

Any where you go these days the construction/building trades are immigrant Latino dominated. Same in agriculture, food processing or any job you think you are too good for. Even in Oxford, Mississippi, the heart of redness and unemployment, the university grounds crew is Latino. My floor and tile guy hires them. He said that they don't need to be trained, they show up and are hard working. He says he can't find local guys able and willing to do the work, because it is hard and demanding. Even the most right wing, foreigner hating, republicans out there would have to admit the USA is a little like Dubai, dependant on Latinos for hard labor, because as a culture we now seem to view this type of work in beneath us.

Now let me put on my red hat. Personally, I prefer having illegal aliens (still the definition in the USC) here, than our home grown welfare sponges, smash and grabbers, addicts and the lifestyle homeless crowd. But I dislike lazy and self-entitled. I have no problem with anyone willing to pick up a hammer and work hard, regardless. Let market forces deal with the issue. Economies that don't have ready access to blue collar labor, struggle, Japan and post Brexit UK, for example. We have had a constant illegal alien (USC) "crisis" in this country since Carter. Reagan gave amnesty to millions. Have we suffered? Everyone is richer now than in the good old days. Even being "poor" includes having cell phones and an unlimited plan these days. The stock market has nearly quadrupled in the last 30 years. And who in the hell is going to build the affordable homes that will address the housing shortage/crisis? Our sons? Get real!

Don't be stupid and let subconscious racism and xenophobia, kill the golden goose. The only thing needed is far better foreign labor management and control. Times have changed. When I was a teen I spent my summers shearing Christmas trees on a wasp infested, clear cut, hillside outside Allyn, WA. Don't pretend that type of world will ever return.

Bingo … just had my house remodeled the last six months .

The Russians put in my windows . I thought there was 100 dolkar bills or coke under the siding because they started at 8 in the. morning and finished at 7at night . It took them three days to complete the job. The original contractor who is white and a local guy (does great work) told me it would take 6 weeks to complete the job and 18 k more than the Russians charged my general and I.

Demo… the Mexicans had it done in less than 8 hours . Drywall, cabinets , carpet. Worked like their life depended on it . I know they didn’t have a lunch and don’t know that they ever went to the bathroom.

The tile installer was from Brazil. His work was flawless. Painters were mexican . Worked as hard as anyone could .

Oh the. the two white finish carpenters . Every time I swung by the house they were taking a 45 minute coffee and cig break. Then a lunch break, afternoon chat session .

Now they have. a great skill and needed skill … but their work ethic was different than immigrants that worked on my house .

 

[CougPatrol]

The funny thing for me is seeing the difference in work ethic between American and Hispanic employees when it comes to difficult manual labor. In construction, the vast majority of crews are Hispanic.....they work hard, they don't complain (to your face) and they get the job done well. I had a project about 10 years ago and for whatever reason, it was two American dudes on it. Easy project just cleaning up the grading on some ditches and picking up trash and debris left behind by the crew. It took them three weeks to finish a what a couple of Hispanics would have done in two days.

I work in capital equipment sales for a company that manufactures medical/dental equipment. Our production team is probably 70% SE Asian. I'm friends with the production manager, and he tells me all the time that the percentage would be 100% if he could get away with it. They never complain, rarely call in sick, they have fantastic camaraderie with the other employees, do pot-luck lunches every Friday. On the flip side, the other 30% are the F-this, F-that, they can't make us do that, this is BS, we deserve longer lunch breaks, call in sick all the time, quit without giving notice.

This isn't an exaggeration.

 

[mikalalas]

Any where you go these days the construction/building trades are immigrant Latino dominated. Same in agriculture, food processing or any job you think you are too good for. Even in Oxford, Mississippi, the heart of redness and unemployment, the university grounds crew is Latino. My floor and tile guy hires them. He said that they don't need to be trained, they show up and are hard working. He says he can't find local guys able and willing to do the work, because it is hard and demanding. Even the most right wing, foreigner hating, republicans out there would have to admit the USA is a little like Dubai, dependant on Latinos for hard labor, because as a culture we now seem to view this type of work in beneath us.

Now let me put on my red hat. Personally, I prefer having illegal aliens (still the definition in the USC) here, than our home grown welfare sponges, smash and grabbers, addicts and the lifestyle homeless crowd. But I dislike lazy and self-entitled. I have no problem with anyone willing to pick up a hammer and work hard, regardless. Let market forces deal with the issue. Economies that don't have ready access to blue collar labor, struggle, Japan and post Brexit UK, for example. We have had a constant illegal alien (USC) "crisis" in this country since Carter. Reagan gave amnesty to millions. Have we suffered? Everyone is richer now than in the good old days. Even being "poor" includes having cell phones and an unlimited plan these days. The stock market has nearly quadrupled in the last 30 years. And who in the hell is going to build the affordable homes that will address the housing shortage/crisis? Our sons? Get real!

Don't be stupid and let subconscious racism and xenophobia, kill the golden goose. The only thing needed is far better foreign labor management and control. Times have changed. When I was a teen I spent my summers shearing Christmas trees on a wasp infested, clear cut, hillside outside Allyn, WA. Don't pretend that type of world will ever return.

AGAIN, MOST are NOT against LEGAL IMMIGRATION.

And there are LOTS of LATINO, HISPANIC, MEXICAN, NON WHITE, ETC, WHO COME HERE LEGALLY, and do the work your talking about.

ALSO these LEGAL IMMIGRANTS, DETEST, DONT LIKE ILLEGAL ALIEN IMMIGRANTS STEALING THEIR JOBS, ETC..

Also ABOUT 1 out of ABOUT 7 to 10 to 13 to 23, GIVE OR TAKE, PLUS OR MINUS ABOUT 4, ILLEGAL ALIEN IMMIGRANTS, are EITHER Lazy, don't work, refuse to learn English, or are criminals, or are gang members, or are MS 13, or are CARTELL members, or are HUMAN, CHILD SLAVE TRAFFICKERS, or are those that MURDER, commit VIOLENT crimes.

The ratio of number of bad guys out of total illegal aliens, is WORSE then the number of bad guys out of total LEGAL IMMIGRANTS, and number of bad guys out of total USA CITIZENS, GREEN CARD, VISA HOLDERS, etc.

This is important because while there are USA citizens, green card, visa holders, etc, that are bad guys, already here, you don't want even 1 illegal alien bad guy, coming here, commiting violent crimes, murders, etc.

Also a insecure southern border makes it easier for Al Qaeda, ISIS, etc, TERRORIST to sneak into country and commit acts of TERROR, etc.

Also part of the reason about what's so bad about illegal alien immigrants, is that they can't be PRE VETTED before they enter country to see if they are a bad guy or not, while LEGAL IMMIGRANTS ARE VETTED before they are allowed into country to see if they are bad or not.

VETTING, BACKGROUND CHECKS ARE, IS A VERY GOOD THING.

While a lot of illegal alien, undocumented, illegal immigrants are GOOD HARD WORKING people, it's still a numbers game that eventually has BAD GUYS getting into country.

Also there are GOOD, HARD WORKING Illegal Alien immigrants that DIE because of ILLEGAL ALIEN IMMIGRANT SMUGGLERS, or that DIE while crossing the DESERT, SWIMMING, ETC, to illegally cross into our country.

Increased border security, would help prevent those illegal alien immigrant deaths.

Also while a lot of USA citizens, etc, aren't willing, able to build homes, etc, I personally know construction contractors, roofers, construction, housing workers, etc, that are USA CITIZENS, that DO build houses, and DO the type of work you claim that no USA citizen is willing to do.

These fine CITIZENS, do NOT LIKE their jobs STOLEN by ILLEGAL ALIENS.

 

[CougPatrol]

Well… tell me about gun laws overseas ?

So tell me how you make Chicago safer ? They are too dumb in Chicago to realize they just need more guns and higher magazines . Why the people of Chcago don’t join the NRA and gun up .

Gun laws? In Chicago? While I am a gun owner, I have zero problem with restrictive and comprehensive background checks. With that said, strict gun laws will have zero impact on the crime rate in Chicago's South Side.

The only way to make it safer, and this will never happen, is to ditch the sensitivity BS. Build more prisons, rehab, and triage centers, go on a 3-year lock up campaign, and aggressively push back on crime. Make homelessness illegal. Take people to triage centers and determine where their mental health/addiction level is at. If the can be rehabilitated, send them there. If they can't, then they go into supervised halfway work/housing programs. If they violate the terms of the halfway program, they get moved to prison.

 

[CougEd]

Oh… OK. By using the word “clean” you really meant that you want less pollution, cutting back on greenhouse gasses and more recycling.

And not “clean” as in keeping this country “clean” of “vermin” from “shithole countries”.

Um yeah. Got it.

Maybe “clean” means all the white people from West Virginia for example took bus loads of people to get to Florida to get their Oxi… living on some of the squaller and lack of diet and education is what is meant by clean .

A friend had a great suggestion … we ship all the people on the streets of seattle plus two second draft picks for the hardworking latinos that want a chance at the dream and a job

 

[Stretch 74]

The funny thing for me is seeing the difference in work ethic between American and Hispanic employees when it comes to difficult manual labor. In construction, the vast majority of crews are Hispanic.....they work hard, they don't complain (to your face) and they get the job done well. I had a project about 10 years ago and for whatever reason, it was two American dudes on it. Easy project just cleaning up the grading on some ditches and picking up trash and debris left behind by the crew. It took them three weeks to finish a what a couple of Hispanics would have done in two days.

Let me guess here. The two American (white) dudes were union workers, right?

 

[Loyal Coug1]

This is the most sane answer. The wall was a dumb idea and always was. A vanity project promoted by a narcissist making promises that he couldn't keep.

The Dems are idiots for failing to implement regulations that discourage mass arrivals at the border and deserve a lot of criticism for that. The Republicans are idiots for being nationalistic xenophobes that fail to realize how critical immigration has been to our nation's success. There's a middle ground that the moron's in power are not trying to reach because of tribal politics.

"The issue is how easy it is for people to wander across the border" - 95

I want to agree with you guys but I see two problems. To 95, so how do you make it less easy for them to wander across the border without a physical barrier (or a machine gun nest)?

To Flat, what regulations will discourage mass arrivals at the border? That would be on Mexico and the Central American countries down the peninsula. We can't regulate anything until they step across the border, and then it is too late. How do all these tens of thousands of Chinese get into Central America, and what is up with Mexico's Southern border?

I have worked with and employed Hispanics, and yeah most of them work harder than white Americans at those crappy jobs. I would also bet that most or all of them were citizens or LEGAL aliens. They have those you know. Although it drives me nuts around YakiVegas when I run across Hispanics (Pretty much all older males, the Fathers) who can't speak a word of English even though their kids are fluent - Mom typically semi-fluent.

We have worker programs where aliens can get visas or work permits or whatever. Those are fine. But just letting 10's of thousands of Gawd knows who walk across and plop down? No.

 

[WillieThePimp]

The funny thing for me is seeing the difference in work ethic between American and Hispanic employees when it comes to difficult manual labor. In construction, the vast majority of crews are Hispanic.....they work hard, they don't complain (to your face) and they get the job done well. I had a project about 10 years ago and for whatever reason, it was two American dudes on it. Easy project just cleaning up the grading on some ditches and picking up trash and debris left behind by the crew. It took them three weeks to finish a what a couple of Hispanics would have done in two days.

Live in the gorge - There are a lot of ski and wind surfing bros that drop their tool belts and are nowhere to be found the moment the wind is up or there’s fresh snow. When I paint the exterior of my house in the next couple of years I will hire one of the excellent local Mexican outfits because I know they will get it done and do great work - unlike the loafing dipshit pothead Trumptard I hired to paint the interior.

 

[CougEd]

Let me guess here. The two American (white) dudes were union workers, right?

Nope

 

[95coug]

"The issue is how easy it is for people to wander across the border" - 95

I want to agree with you guys but I see two problems. To 95, so how do you make it less easy for them to wander across the border without a physical barrier (or a machine gun nest)?

To Flat, what regulations will discourage mass arrivals at the border? That would be on Mexico and the Central American countries down the peninsula. We can't regulate anything until they step across the border, and then it is too late. How do all these tens of thousands of Chinese get into Central America, and what is up with Mexico's Southern border?

I have worked with and employed Hispanics, and yeah most of them work harder than white Americans at those crappy jobs. I would also bet that most or all of them were citizens or LEGAL aliens. They have those you know. Although it drives me nuts around YakiVegas when I run across Hispanics (Pretty much all older males, the Fathers) who can't speak a word of English even though their kids are fluent - Mom typically semi-fluent.

We have worker programs where aliens can get visas or work permits or whatever. Those are fine. But just letting 10's of thousands of Gawd knows who walk across and plop down? No.

If you're going to quote me, include the full quote: The issue is how easy it is for people to wander across the border and then get set up with everything they need to survive. If it wasn't child's play for them to get here, get a job that pays cash, get a license, food stamps, and free health care - we wouldn't even need a border, they'd have no reason to come. We need to set the system up to create incentives to do it legally. Right now, there's no reason to bother with all that.

If we did that, we don't need to regulate the migrants before they step across the border.

The flipside of that coin is that we also need to improve the process of coming legally so that you can do it in days to weeks instead of months to years...and then we need to have better monitoring on it so people don't get a 6 month visa and then just never leave. Have real penalties and real ID. Require fingerprinting to get a visa, and then if you overstay it you're not eligible for a new one for 10 years. When you apply, we run your prints and if you're flagged, you're denied.

The reality is that we have to have immigrants, and a lot of them. There are a lot of jobs we need them to fill, now that our own kids are too soft to do them. More importantly, we need their wages to pay into things like social security to keep them afloat. But...we need them to be here legally and pay into the programs, we do not need them to be getting cash under the table. We also need to modify the tax code so that you can only deduct dependents who have a Social Security number. This BS of people claiming 15 dependents who live in Mexico to make themselves tax exempt needs to stop.

 

[CougEd]

If you're going to quote me, include the full quote: The issue is how easy it is for people to wander across the border and then get set up with everything they need to survive. If it wasn't child's play for them to get here, get a job that pays cash, get a license, food stamps, and free health care - we wouldn't even need a border, they'd have no reason to come. We need to set the system up to create incentives to do it legally. Right now, there's no reason to bother with all that.

If we did that, we don't need to regulate the migrants before they step across the border.

The flipside of that coin is that we also need to improve the process of coming legally so that you can do it in days to weeks instead of months to years...and then we need to have better monitoring on it so people don't get a 6 month visa and then just never leave. Have real penalties and real ID. Require fingerprinting to get a visa, and then if you overstay it you're not eligible for a new one for 10 years. When you apply, we run your prints and if you're flagged, you're denied.

The reality is that we have to have immigrants, and a lot of them. There are a lot of jobs we need them to fill, now that our own kids are too soft to do them. More importantly, we need their wages to pay into things like social security to keep them afloat. But...we need them to be here legally and pay into the programs, we do not need them to be getting cash under the table. We also need to modify the tax code so that you can only deduct dependents who have a Social Security number. This BS of people claiming 15 dependents who live in Mexico to make themselves tax exempt needs to stop.

If you want latinos to stop coming across the border lead the world by making Honduras financially viable . Instead of getting chips from China set up manufacturing in Honduras . Start to make their economy the engine that drives the country .

 

[95coug]

Yes. I’ve even been to some “shithole” countries.

I'm pretty confident that every person on this board lives within 50 miles of a place that makes the US look like a shithole country. We like to think that we're a shining beacon for the world, but you usually don't have to stray too far from the "nice areas" to find the town is a dump. Anyone been more than 2 blocks off the Vegas strip?

 

[BleedCrimsonandGray]

The issue isn’t the border. There’s little need for building wall, adding guards, or deploying soldiers. The issue is how easy it is for people to wander across the border and then get set up with everything they need to survive. Too many handouts and entitlement programs.
Change the rules. Create harsher penalties for employers who don’t verify employment eligibility. Make banks and utility companies verify residency before turning on the heat or cashing checks (for banks, tie this to eligibility for FDIC). Force states to verify legal status before issuing drivers licenses or welfare (states like CA and WA will protest, but tie it to eligibility for federal funding and they’ll fall in line).
In short, make it so they can’t come here and get things handed to them. If they come and work, pay taxes and keep social security afloat, I’m fine with them coming. If they want to come and re-establish their village on our dime…no thanks.

Nope.

We need illegals to process our food. Figure out a way to make that work instead of punishing the people who put food on our tables.

I agree with all of the other entitlements - illegals were working here fine without having all the hand outs. It encourages immigration without the benefit of a labor force.

Robots are coming to do all that work anyway, so it won't be an issue in 50 years.

 

[95coug]

This is the most sane answer. The wall was a dumb idea and always was. A vanity project promoted by a narcissist making promises that he couldn't keep.

The Dems are idiots for failing to implement regulations that discourage mass arrivals at the border and deserve a lot of criticism for that. The Republicans are idiots for being nationalistic xenophobes that fail to realize how critical immigration has been to our nation's success. There's a middle ground that the moron's in power are not trying to reach because of tribal politics.

I am always sane. And usually right down the middle.

The wall is/was idiotic. I thought it was hilarious when they did a feature on a section of the wall being completed, and by the following morning people had cut through it and were entering anyway. Yeah, that wasn't predictable or anything. No wall or barrier will ever be enough. If the incentive to cross it is strong enough, even machine gun nests won't stop them. Reducing the incentives will be more effective than any barrier.

 

[Loyal Coug1]

If you're going to quote me, include the full quote: The issue is how easy it is for people to wander across the border and then get set up with everything they need to survive. If it wasn't child's play for them to get here, get a job that pays cash, get a license, food stamps, and free health care - we wouldn't even need a border, they'd have no reason to come. We need to set the system up to create incentives to do it legally. Right now, there's no reason to bother with all that.

If we did that, we don't need to regulate the migrants before they step across the border.

The flipside of that coin is that we also need to improve the process of coming legally so that you can do it in days to weeks instead of months to years...and then we need to have better monitoring on it so people don't get a 6 month visa and then just never leave. Have real penalties and real ID. Require fingerprinting to get a visa, and then if you overstay it you're not eligible for a new one for 10 years. When you apply, we run your prints and if you're flagged, you're denied.

The reality is that we have to have immigrants, and a lot of them. There are a lot of jobs we need them to fill, now that our own kids are too soft to do them. More importantly, we need their wages to pay into things like social security to keep them afloat. But...we need them to be here legally and pay into the programs, we do not need them to be getting cash under the table. We also need to modify the tax code so that you can only deduct dependents who have a Social Security number. This BS of people claiming 15 dependents who live in Mexico to make themselves tax exempt needs to stop.

What? Show me one example of claiming 15 people without SS numbers. You have to have a SS number to be claimed as a dependent. That is a wives' tale.

and yes I agree with your afore-mentioned deterrents. But I still prefer keeping them out to begin with.

 

[Flatlandcoug]

Gun laws? In Chicago? While I am a gun owner, I have zero problem with restrictive and comprehensive background checks. With that said, strict gun laws will have zero impact on the crime rate in Chicago's South Side.

The only way to make it safer, and this will never happen, is to ditch the sensitivity BS. Build more prisons, rehab, and triage centers, go on a 3-year lock up campaign, and aggressively push back on crime. Make homelessness illegal. Take people to triage centers and determine where their mental health/addiction level is at. If the can be rehabilitated, send them there. If they can't, then they go into supervised halfway work/housing programs. If they violate the terms of the halfway program, they get moved to prison.

More prisons isn't going to fix the problem in Chicago's South Side. There are cultural issues ingrained into a lot of folks that will take generations to fix. Of course, like everything else, tribal politics makes that discussion dumb. The GOP wants to build a bunch of prisons hoping that it will terrorize people into compliance. The Democrats want to foster a victim mentality where handouts are given in the hopes that people will want to aspire to be better if they just had a few more dollars.

 

[95coug]

What? Show me one example of claiming 15 people without SS numbers. You have to have a SS number to be claimed as a dependent. That is a wives' tale.

and yes I agree with your afore-mentioned deterrents. But I still prefer keeping them out to begin with.

Nope. You can claim non-resident dependents, specifically if they are from Canada or Mexico. You're supposed to apply for an ITIN instead, but those expire after 3 years...so you can recycle the name and do it again.

I'd also be fine with revising the tax code to say that you can only claim dependents who actually live with you (that might handicap some non-custodial parents, but realistically...if a kid doesn't live with you, you probably don't provide half of their support).

 

[Stretch 74]

Nope

Pay attention Ed. My comment was a reply to Flatland's post, not yours. That was obvious.

BTW, did you happen to check the immigration status of all those foreign workers or were you just happy to take advantage of those poor illegal immigrants to save yourself a few bucks? Typical liberal elitist, not caring about those whose opportunities are being undercut but the illegal immigrants willing to work for less than a "living wage". Right?

 

[Flatlandcoug]

Let me guess here. The two American (white) dudes were union workers, right?

I missed this post. They weren't union workers.

I will say that a friend of mine who is a manager for a company in Washington has a lot of negative things to say about the union employees that work for him.

The union guys tried to sabotage the career of a younger kid who received an award for his hard work and made them look bad.

 

[mikalalas]

If you're going to quote me, include the full quote: The issue is how easy it is for people to wander across the border and then get set up with everything they need to survive. If it wasn't child's play for them to get here, get a job that pays cash, get a license, food stamps, and free health care - we wouldn't even need a border, they'd have no reason to come. We need to set the system up to create incentives to do it legally. Right now, there's no reason to bother with all that.

If we did that, we don't need to regulate the migrants before they step across the border.

The flipside of that coin is that we also need to improve the process of coming legally so that you can do it in days to weeks instead of months to years...and then we need to have better monitoring on it so people don't get a 6 month visa and then just never leave. Have real penalties and real ID. Require fingerprinting to get a visa, and then if you overstay it you're not eligible for a new one for 10 years. When you apply, we run your prints and if you're flagged, you're denied.

The reality is that we have to have immigrants, and a lot of them. There are a lot of jobs we need them to fill, now that our own kids are too soft to do them. More importantly, we need their wages to pay into things like social security to keep them afloat. But...we need them to be here legally and pay into the programs, we do not need them to be getting cash under the table. We also need to modify the tax code so that you can only deduct dependents who have a Social Security number. This BS of people claiming 15 dependents who live in Mexico to make themselves tax exempt needs to stop.

I agree with almost EVERYTHING you say here in this post.

But in addition to doing what you say, we need to do ALL that what you said in your post, plus WALL OR FENCE OR CHECK POINTS, MORE BORDER PATROL, MORE DEPORTATIONS, ELIMINATE SANCTUARY CITIES, COUNTIES, STATES, UNCOOPERATIVE POLITICIANS, POLICE THAT DONT COOPERATE WITH ICE, FEDERAL AUTHORITIES, etc.

If do those and other things in addition to what you said, then the problem would be fixed.

But that won't happen, as there are too many SJW's, Liberals, PC'ers, Wokesters, WA, CA, Oregon, etc, that would successfully fight that every step of the way.

 

[CougEd]

Gun laws? In Chicago? While I am a gun owner, I have zero problem with restrictive and comprehensive background checks. With that said, strict gun laws will have zero impact on the crime rate in Chicago's South Side.

The only way to make it safer, and this will never happen, is to ditch the sensitivity BS. Build more prisons, rehab, and triage centers, go on a 3-year lock up campaign, and aggressively push back on crime. Make homelessness illegal. Take people to triage centers and determine where their mental health/addiction level is at. If the can be rehabilitated, send them there. If they can't, then they go into supervised halfway work/housing programs. If they violate the terms of the halfway program, they get moved to prison.

wait .. i heard more guns make us safer ? Gun up I say . Get some ar 15’s and higher capacity mags . That will make the streets safer .