ADVERTISEMENT

How is it Mike Leach gets and sells WSU better than those who

To answer the original question, it's because he's not a Coug, and has seen a lot of different campuses and environments. Even more importantly, it's because he's an intelligent guy who is able to articulate its benefits and who is usually pretty honest and plain-spoken. He doesn't flat out lie or BS, so when he says something, there's usually truth there.

In contrast, a lot of Cougs default to the "you don't understand it unless you're a Coug ... it's just a feeling you get in Pullman" kind of platitudes, which aren't that credible to "outsiders." Leach's statements are.
 
Yarno was here during the Price and Doba eras. Also the Doba era recruiting on paper was very similar to Leach if you throw out 2003 i.e. #25 #52 #45 and #62. Doba's "poor recruiting" is a myth that CougEd and the Wulff apologists trot out. Only Steve and Roberson was here during the douche bag era, as I recall, when recruiting utterly sucked. Can you really blame them.for poor recruiting to a dumpster fire? So guess what, CougEd premise is full of horshit! Leach hasn't demonstrated that he and his staff can recruit well to Pullman, and there is is little evidence that the former Cougs were crap recruiters, when not chained to the Wulff millstone.

Edith's problem when he obsesses over recruiting under Doba is that he names three to five recruits in a class who washed out. Virtually any recruiting class will have five or more recruits that wash out, but it's just the basis for his denial of the miserable job done by Wulff, Chris Ball and the other turds that amounted to a flash flood that washed this program to 6 and 40.
As for the ex-Coug players working as assistants under Doba, there was a bit of complacency that was compounded by the rise of Phil Knight U, other conference schools' improvements, and V. Lane Rawlins' myopic assumptions that the winning would continue despite the crap facilities. As Bill Moos said, WSU was choking on the dust left behind by others racing to the top. Leach has been a difference maker. He's coached this program to 15 wins in its last 20 Pac-12 games. For those burping forth proclamations 30 minutes into the 2012 season that he "wasn't going to get it done" and who, to this day, wax moronic about his paychecks, they really should just go to a corner and quietly pee themselves. The program isn't perfect, but it's hard to dispute its direction at this juncture.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bogusto
Leach and Co. selling of Pullman has not resulted in a single recruiting class that has broken the top 50, according to rivals. How do you reconcile that with what you are saying? It tells me that Leach and Co. can evaluate the hell out of 2 and 3 star talent, talent that is available by mere P-12 membership, but they haven't sold many blue chippers on Pullman. Price's pre Rose Bowl class was ranked 28 (#6 in conference), with 5, 4 and 5 star recruits with crap facilities and 1 bowl in 5 years. That is selling Pullman in my book. Great facilities, 3 bowls in 4 years and a #51 ( #11 in conference; Colorado #7, OSU #9) recruiting class says Mike Leach and co. are far better coaches (elite) than salesmen. What am I missing here?

In my ideal world you have coaches who can sell Pullman like Price & co but who can coach like Leach & co. The 2002 talent with Leach at the helm beats tOSU in Columbus and runs the table, I believe.

Agree except your last statement. With Leach and staff coaching in 2002, we lose to Nevada (first game...duh!) and then run the table. Finish #2 in the country behind unbeaten Ohio State.
 
Edith's problem when he obsesses over recruiting under Doba is that he names three to five recruits in a class who washed out. Virtually any recruiting class will have five or more recruits that wash out, but it's just the basis for his denial of the miserable job done by Wulff, Chris Ball and the other turds that amounted to a flash flood that washed this program to 6 and 40.
As for the ex-Coug players working as assistants under Doba, there was a bit of complacency that was compounded by the rise of Phil Knight U, other conference schools' improvements, and V. Lane Rawlins' myopic assumptions that the winning would continue despite the crap facilities. As Bill Moos said, WSU was choking on the dust left behind by others racing to the top. Leach has been a difference maker. He's coached this program to 15 wins in its last 20 Pac-12 games. For those burping forth proclamations 30 minutes into the 2012 season that he "wasn't going to get it done" and who, to this day, wax moronic about his paychecks, they really should just go to a corner and quietly pee themselves. The program isn't perfect, but it's hard to dispute its direction at this juncture.

That's the problem though. Doba didn't have 5 recruits wash out. He consistently had 15-20 wash out, or never amount to anything.

I listed out who I felt were the contributors in each class (as I feel that's more important than listing the washouts). I don't think you can look at those lists and tell me there wasn't a major problem occurring. This isn't an "excuse for Wulff" thing, but those '06, '07 & what was shaping up to be the '08 class were truly terrifying.
 
Actually, Socal, as I recall the Wulff apologists included Bill Moos who trotted out stats of how few D-1 offers most of our team had as a way of excusing our 1 and 2 win seasons under Wulff. If you want to argue that fact I will google it and prove it. There is your evidence.

So maybe Doba's Coug-heavy staff wasn't that great.

And if you think CML "hasn't demonstrated" that he can recruit well to Pullman then you must not read the Sunday papers after our games.

I'm done with this stupid thread

I'll go to my deathbed that Doba earned his shot at the head job. And 2003 showed the guy could coach it.

But then his wife fell ill, and understandably, his focus went elsewhere. Unfortunately, the guys who should have had his back and re-doubled their efforts in his absence chose instead to use the film room for other purposes.

Many of them may have been Coug legends on the field - but they flat dropped the ball as assistants. Doba deserved better - and by the time he got his mojo back, it was too late.
 
Edith's problem when he obsesses over recruiting under Doba is that he names three to five recruits in a class who washed out. Virtually any recruiting class will have five or more recruits that wash out, but it's just the basis for his denial of the miserable job done by Wulff, Chris Ball and the other turds that amounted to a flash flood that washed this program to 6 and 40.
As for the ex-Coug players working as assistants under Doba, there was a bit of complacency that was compounded by the rise of Phil Knight U, other conference schools' improvements, and V. Lane Rawlins' myopic assumptions that the winning would continue despite the crap facilities. As Bill Moos said, WSU was choking on the dust left behind by others racing to the top. Leach has been a difference maker. He's coached this program to 15 wins in its last 20 Pac-12 games. For those burping forth proclamations 30 minutes into the 2012 season that he "wasn't going to get it done" and who, to this day, wax moronic about his paychecks, they really should just go to a corner and quietly pee themselves. The program isn't perfect, but it's hard to dispute its direction at this juncture.
I am not naming "three to five kids" that washed out. The list is much more extensive than that. My concerns were in real time. I went to the Doba dinner and it was clear they weren't getting the same kids with the type of explosion they had from Trufant to Colemen to David to Paymah. The most impressive kid on tape was a kid who was signed, I believe either flunked out or never showed then transferred to Fresno State. He was a dlineman from Fresno. I take that back, Estes was the most impressive, but hne had a chance to play.

from the 04 class, coming off the most successful fun in WSU history, they signed 11 players that never suited up. (and that list included the likes of Morgan and Baird who weren't Pac 10 players) . We signed three 4 star JC recruits, and they were gone by December of 05. The other two JC players were Greg Prator and Myers a DE.

That meant the senior class of 08 consisted of Ward Roof, Graise (never gained a pound) Rogers, (Willis got hurt and retired), Rowlands (left team after 2 weeks of August practice) and Matt Eichelbarger.

In 2005 they had 7 3 or 4 star players suit up for a game. Again, they are only one year removed from 3 ten win seasons. Additionally they had a total of ten players regardless of their ranking never suit up. There was 1 player who was a JC player was gone by December of 2006. That means 11 out of I believe 21 of the 2005 class were gone by 06, combined with 18 of the 25 kids from the prior class.

The players that were left to play 2007 and 2008 were Gibson, Alfred, Hicks, Stripling, Evans, Trent, Tardyl, Eppelle, and Eichelbarger. In 2004 and 2005 they recruited three DT's. Townsend never made it in, Tarkenton was a JC player, and Eichelbarger.

Doba made two strategic mistakes, and I think he has even said as much. With Pflugrad's influence he changed how and who they recruited. They forget the A minus players that helped WSU to the 98 Rose Bowl and the 01-03 run. The second mistake was going more ball control while other programs were recruiting kids to play in a wide open system. I think both mistakes led to part of the recruiting problems.

I remember when Doba announced his decision to change what worked and thought probelms were ahead. And it was similar to Ken Bone changing what worked under Tony Bennett. When Bone made that decision I told a mutual friend that was gong to be a mistake. And in hindsight it was.

When Leon Burtnet becomes probably your best recruiter it says something about others that were on the staff. How much did Rosie and Levy actually recruit?
 
Last edited:
I'll go to my deathbed that Doba earned his shot at the head job. And 2003 showed the guy could coach it.

But then his wife fell ill, and understandably, his focus went elsewhere. Unfortunately, the guys who should have had his back and re-doubled their efforts in his absence chose instead to use the film room for other purposes.

Many of them may have been Coug legends on the field - but they flat dropped the ball as assistants. Doba deserved better - and by the time he got his mojo back, it was too late.
While he earned his shot as a head coach, he was much better suited to be a highly paid assistant coach. While he wasnt highly paid at WSU, he should have been. But there was a reason he was passed over for other head coaching opportunities.

Let me ask you....would Doba have ever fired a coach for not being effective? And the truth of the matter is the answer is no. That is one of the differences between being a head coach an a very good assistant.

It is pretty widely known at this point Levy was more of a babysitter than a OC simply because the staff was so out of control and dysfunctional. Two of the people on the staff struggled being in the same room. And it was highly unfair to Doba.
 
While he earned his shot as a head coach, he was much better suited to be a highly paid assistant coach. While he wasnt highly paid at WSU, he should have been. But there was a reason he was passed over for other head coaching opportunities.

Let me ask you....would Doba have ever fired a coach for not being effective? And the truth of the matter is the answer is no. That is one of the differences between being a head coach an a very good assistant.

It is pretty widely known at this point Levy was more of a babysitter than a OC simply because the staff was so out of control and dysfunctional. Two of the people on the staff struggled being in the same room. And it was highly unfair to Doba.

I don't know if I could ever answer that given the uncertainty of Judy Doba's illness on Coach Doba's mindset. I'd like to think that given a clear head and focus, he'd have been able to make the necessary adjustments to his staff to weed out the non-performers. Under the circumstances, I think that was about the last thing on his mind.
 
I am not naming "three to five kids" that washed out. The list is much more extensive than that. My concerns were in real time. I went to the Doba dinner and it was clear they weren't getting the same kids with the type of explosion they had from Trufant to Colemen to David to Paymah. The most impressive kid on tape was a kid who was signed, I believe either flunked out or never showed then transferred to Fresno State. He was a dlineman from Fresno. I take that back, Estes was the most impressive, but hne had a chance to play.

from the 04 class, coming off the most successful fun in WSU history, they signed 11 players that never suited up. (and that list included the likes of Morgan and Baird who weren't Pac 10 players) . We signed three 4 star JC recruits, and they were gone by December of 05. The other two JC players were Greg Prator and Myers a DE.

That meant the senior class of 08 consisted of Ward Roof, Graise (never gained a pound) Rogers, (Willis got hurt and retired), Rowlands (left team after 2 weeks of August practice) and Matt Eichelbarger.

In 2005 they had 7 3 or 4 star players suit up for a game. Again, they are only one year removed from 3 ten win seasons. Additionally they had a total of ten players regardless of their ranking never suit up. There was 1 player who was a JC player was gone by December of 2006. That means 11 out of I believe 21 of the 2005 class were gone by 06, combined with 18 of the 25 kids from the prior class.

The players that were left to play 2007 and 2008 were Gibson, Alfred, Hicks, Stripling, Evans, Trent, Tardyl, Eppelle, and Eichelbarger. In 2004 and 2005 they recruited three DT's. Townsend never made it in, Tarkenton was a JC player, and Eichelbarger.

Doba made two strategic mistakes, and I think he has even said as much. With Pflugrad's influence he changed how and who they recruited. They forget the A minus players that helped WSU to the 98 Rose Bowl and the 01-03 run. The second mistake was going more ball control while other programs were recruiting kids to play in a wide open system. I think both mistakes led to part of the recruiting problems.

I remember when Doba announced his decision to change what worked and thought probelms were ahead. And it was similar to Ken Bone changing what worked under Tony Bennett. When Bone made that decision I told a mutual friend that was gong to be a mistake. And in hindsight it was.

When Leon Burtnet becomes probably your best recruiter it says something about others that were on the staff. How much did Rosie and Levy actually recruit?

Ed Nauseam: WSU under Mike Leach has won 15 of its last 20 Pac-12 games. Yet you're still awash in aPaulogetic trashings of Bill Doba. Get. The. Fudge. Over. It. Get. A. Life.
 
ADVERTISEMENT

Latest posts

ADVERTISEMENT