I don’t follow every detail of who’s offered by who and other musical chair games of recruiting but I am surprised WSU doesn’t have a verbal from a QB yet. A winning program, the potential to huck the ball 50+ times per game along with top notch facilities would seem to be pretty appealing. Are the Cougs suffering from Bridesmaiditus? Negative recruiting? Holding out for someone really good....?
No QB Commit
- Thread starter COUGinNCW
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I don't think it's any of those things. I think WSU suffers from not enough shiny stuff. 4 and 5 star kids don't wanna be coached. They wanna go somewhere and live a life of luxury.
There is no such lifestyle at WSU. You're going to work. Your press clippings don't mean sh!t. You're not going to be treated like a celebrity. You're not famous. Probably won't have as many Instagram followers.
The list of kids that choose schools because of the coaching, scheme, education, etc usually all have 3 stars by their name. I'm good with all of them and none of the 4 or 5 stars.
Um, I completely disagree with that opinion. You are saying we don't have shiny stuff (facilities?). News to me.
Not going to be treated like a celebrity? Not famous? Yeah, Gardner toiled in obscurity all right. Certainly no fans on or off campus.
And if memory serves me right, Neville, Cooper and Cruz are (were) all 4 star recruits.
Our last 2 QB's are in the NFL (albeit hanging by a thread in Luke's case). Our program AND QB were in the national press all year. Yeah, we work hard - but other programs aren't country clubs. You don't think they work up a sweat at your favorite Alabama?
If there are any reasons why a high profile QB might not choose WSU this year it could be that: He wants to play right away and looks at Cooper and Cruz and says, eh, too much competition. And/or, he looks at our bringing in QB ringers two years in a row and says well hard work and loyalty don't mean much. Fair or not, I think we have to face tht as a potential turnoff.
All that said, and while yes we should bring in a high quality QB every year, maybe this is a good year to get a lower profile guy. We see what happens here - we go from having too many to not enough due to transfers, guys not living up to expectations, etc.
In a perfect world we would get a great QB every other year, spacing out the studs, and a decent backup type in the other years. Depth in case of injury. But that is fantasyland.
Edit: Just read the Rivals article on QB battles. WTH? ASU has ONE returning scholarship QB battling a true freshman. Aubarn has a RS Frosh and a true frosh battling it out. Minnesota has two Sophmores battling it out. Geez - talk about no depth.
And here we have 3 RS Seniors. Weird.
Then again, I guess next year it will be RS soph Cooper vs. RS Frosh Cruz and RS Soph walkon Blesdoe for the Cougs. Am I missing someone?
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Just my view from my porthole, but it looks as though we've been a bit more selective in our QB offers this year. The conclusion I draw if that is correct is that we are confident that we can get a solid, coachable 3* toward the end of the summer if we don't get one of the guys we've already offered before then. That is a continual evolution of recruiting confidence. Good stuff.
I'm expecting that somebody will bite this month. If not, then certainly August. CML is playing this particular recruiting game with a good deal of patience.
I'm expecting that somebody will bite this month. If not, then certainly August. CML is playing this particular recruiting game with a good deal of patience.
I was thinking we've offered more QB's than usual. Will Rogers from Minshewville, Beau Allen from Kentucky, Shane Illingsworth, Chubba Purdy were all guys we seemed to have a serious shot at (plus some of the longshots who gave us unofficial visits like Butterfield). Now we are hoping to snag Stroud or are getting a guy with no other power 5 offers (Richardson). We've offered 13 QB's so far this year, more than any other year in Leach's tenure.
Herm signed THREE QBs in ASU's 2019 class. He's a relative newcomer who's trying to shore up depth and talent. Sounds a lot like what Leach faced when he arrived. As for the rest of your post, I agree with it, Loyal. Numerous recruits are citing WSU's facilities - both location and quality of offerings. And before someone brings up Whoregon, no one is going to match Phil Knight's mid-life crisis mania and money.
Stroud would be a real catch.
Wah? They suck?
Am I a year off? Cruz hasn't even hit campus, right? And he is already a washout?
Explain please.
Not Fab, but I'm guessing no 4 star recruit is going to be scared off by someone who hasn't seen a D1 snap yet. Leach taking grad transfers for two straight years probably would do more to give recruits pause than Cooper and Cruz.
I didn't say that.
No decent recruit is going to be scared off by a couple dudes who haven't even played yet.
Every program in the conference, save for maybe OSU has a 4 star guy on their depth chart somewhere.
If a recruit is scared off by our depth chart, then they probably outta commit to Hawaii or UNLV or something.
Uhmm Cruz participated in Spring practices as an early enrollee. He looked pretty good considering.
This is why Pac 12 team, player, recruiting class, player recruit rankings in the Pac 12 are meaningless, nothing.
You can have a 4 star QB, in your recruiting class, with 4 stars in your recruiting class, and still be ranked last, near last place in Pac 12, with every Pac 12 college having better, higher ranked 4 star recruits then your 4 star recruits, where every Pac 12 college has a 4 star QB recruit, higher ranked then your 4 star QB recruit, where other 3,4 star QB recruits are not afraid of your 4 star QB recruit, and the other 4 star QB recruits at each of the other Pac 12 colleges.
You can have a 4 star QB, in your recruiting class, with 4 stars in your recruiting class, and still be ranked last, near last place in Pac 12, with every Pac 12 college having better, higher ranked 4 star recruits then your 4 star recruits, where every Pac 12 college has a 4 star QB recruit, higher ranked then your 4 star QB recruit, where other 3,4 star QB recruits are not afraid of your 4 star QB recruit, and the other 4 star QB recruits at each of the other Pac 12 colleges.
Also altho this is not the poor ole little ole WSU days, where now WSU gets 4 star QB's, WR's, etc, EASILY, the Pac 12 has still remained ahead of WSU's 4 star QB, 4 star WR, 4 star recruiting, and so because of that any 3,4 star recruit knows that they will have to compete against 4 star QB recruits at each and every Pac 12 college, including WSU, Ore St., and that because of that, they, those 3,4 star QB's are not afraid of WSU's 4 star QB recruits, just like they are not afraid of any Pac 12's 4 star QB recruits.
While thats true, 3,4 star QB recruits dont always know that, and dont always follow things as closely as us fans do.
In fact, most 4 star recruits, only check:
How many 4 star recruits a college has.
Or if there are 1,2 5 star recruits at a college.
If WSU had 3,4, Four star QB recruits instead of the 1,2 Four star QB recruits WSU has now, then a 4 star recruit might be concerned.
Or if WSU had 1,2,3,4, Five Star QB recruits, then they might scared.
Also Alabama Colleges having 2,3,4 Five star QB recruits there, usually doesnt stop 4 stars from playing at Alabama type colleges.
Why?
Because 4 star QB recruits think they can beat EVERYBODY.
I don't think it's anything more meaningful than we've gotten spoiled by early commits in recent years. It's not that unusual for the top level QB's to wait until a little later in the year to make their final choice and I'd like to think that Leach has WSU to the point where we are only looking at Elite 11 type QB's. Our depth chart for 2020 right now is:
R. Fr: Cruz, Angeles (walk-on)
R. So.: Cooper
R. Jr.. Bledsoe (walk-on)
If not for the fear that the loser of the Cooper-Cruz battle in 2020 might transfer, I'd say that we don't even "NEED" a QB this year. With that battle in mind, we need to get a QB but I think we are in the position to hold out for the one that Leach wants. If it's November and we don't have a QB, it might be time to worry. As it is, I'm not concerned at all.
The reality is there are only 12 starting jobs in the PAC 12. I know, Im a math wizard. Anyways, if you want one of them you're gonna have to compete. There is no way around it. Maybe some schools have more talent than others, maybe some have more guys, maybe some have guys with more or less eligibility. Any way you slice it, you have to compete. Choose the scenario you wanna compete in.
Frankly, for any of the 12 schools you shouldn't have a problem finding a good QB. In 4 recruiting classes there will have been enough talent to go around. If you can't find one then the issues are either poor recruiting, poor evaluation, injury or academics. 3/4 the coaches have a large role in....
Frankly, for any of the 12 schools you shouldn't have a problem finding a good QB. In 4 recruiting classes there will have been enough talent to go around. If you can't find one then the issues are either poor recruiting, poor evaluation, injury or academics. 3/4 the coaches have a large role in....
Also, the correlation between star ratings and QB success has not been high. Pretty sure Leach will have a quality starting QB in 2020 whether a 3 star, 4 star, or walk on.
There are hundreds of kids out there with big time arms and good legs. It is the intangibles that make for college success, and Leach seems pretty good at finding those.
There are hundreds of kids out there with big time arms and good legs. It is the intangibles that make for college success, and Leach seems pretty good at finding those.
etown, we may well have offered more QB's total, but my intention was to suggest that we've been offering the QB's that the big boys are recruiting. If you choose to swim in that pool it may well take a bit longer to find your commit.
Cruz is a walk-on? I think you mean early enrollee.
And I forgot - Bledsoe was in Neville's class, not Cooper's. Let's (or let's not
) compare that list to some of our QB lineups in days of yore. Chad, Chad and Chapman. MenckeBaum (sorry Paul, I am still a big fan). And so on.
Loyal,
I read that post as Aaron Angelos (the freshman from Philly) is the walk-on and not Gunner Cruz.
Maybe Flatland can weigh in?
Oh oops. Heh. Uh, now I feel really stoopid. Guess I need to pay more attention.
Thanks for clearing that up...….
Cruz is a walk-on? I think you mean early enrollee.
And I forgot - Bledsoe was in Neville's class, not Cooper's. Let's (or let's not
Cruz is definitely a scholarship player and Angeles is the one that I was calling a walk-on (as noted by Pete). I thought about separating them out by row because I did see that it could be confusing with the way that I listed it.
At the end of the day, we are in a position with young talent that any good QB is going to need to be sure that they want to come to WSU. As mentioned by others, most high school seniors that are good enough to play for Leach are also going to be kids that aren't afraid from embracing competition.
As alluded to very early in this thread by someone else, if I had a concern about recruiting, it's that Leach has gone to the transfer portal two straight years. If he makes it three years in a row next year, that's a bad sign for Cooper in particular and has the potential to tell recruits that Leach may not be willing to give them the starting job if he can find a guy he likes in the portal. I think it's too early to really stress about that, but I can understand the concern.
There is really nothing to be concerned about with next years QB's.
There will be no need for Leach to get a grad transfer.
1. Cooper will be a 4 star QB, that will probably get some back up snaps, time to improve, would be a Reshirt Sophmore(The equivalent to a 3rd year True Junior). Also Falk was the same, a Redshirt Sophmore, when he started, did well.
2. Cruz a 3 star by some recruiting services, a 4 star by other recruiting services. Has looked good so far in Spring Football. Would be a Redshirt Freshman(equivalent of a 2nd year True Sophmore)
3. Bledsoe, has looked good in Spring football, has had some back up snaps. Would be a Redshirt Senior(5th year SR Walk On)
Angelos. Dont know much about him, except that he likely is a walk on.
Either, 1. Cooper, 2 Cruz, 3. Bledsoe, will likely be the starter, and whichever of the 3 will likely not only be the starter, but likely will do a good job as the starter, or at least well enough that the OL, Borghi, WR's, Defense, all combined will, would probably win about 7,8,9,10 games for WSU.
So because of that, Leach would probably not need to go get another Grad Transfer.
And even if he Leach did need to go get a grad transfer, because, if the current next years QB's were to if, probably get about only 5,6,7 wins, instead of 8,9,10, wins, if that were to be the case, it might be better to only have the 5,6 wins, then to risk not getting good future QB recruits not wanting to commit, sign with WSU, because of 3 straight years of Leach getting a grad transfer.
But really everything should be just fine next year.
There will be no need for Leach to get a grad transfer.
1. Cooper will be a 4 star QB, that will probably get some back up snaps, time to improve, would be a Reshirt Sophmore(The equivalent to a 3rd year True Junior). Also Falk was the same, a Redshirt Sophmore, when he started, did well.
2. Cruz a 3 star by some recruiting services, a 4 star by other recruiting services. Has looked good so far in Spring Football. Would be a Redshirt Freshman(equivalent of a 2nd year True Sophmore)
3. Bledsoe, has looked good in Spring football, has had some back up snaps. Would be a Redshirt Senior(5th year SR Walk On)
Angelos. Dont know much about him, except that he likely is a walk on.
Either, 1. Cooper, 2 Cruz, 3. Bledsoe, will likely be the starter, and whichever of the 3 will likely not only be the starter, but likely will do a good job as the starter, or at least well enough that the OL, Borghi, WR's, Defense, all combined will, would probably win about 7,8,9,10 games for WSU.
So because of that, Leach would probably not need to go get another Grad Transfer.
And even if he Leach did need to go get a grad transfer, because, if the current next years QB's were to if, probably get about only 5,6,7 wins, instead of 8,9,10, wins, if that were to be the case, it might be better to only have the 5,6 wins, then to risk not getting good future QB recruits not wanting to commit, sign with WSU, because of 3 straight years of Leach getting a grad transfer.
But really everything should be just fine next year.
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If I'm a high school recruit, especially a 4-5 star one, I kind of like the look of the WSU QB depth chart. The walk-ons are irrelevant, I got offered a scholarship so I think I'm ahead of them. So I have to compete with two other young guys who've never played a live down, which I think gives me a chance of PT as a true freshman. Completely possible one of those guys transfers if they don't win the job in 2020, so I could be the backup before my redshirt year is over.
But, I don't have to even make up my mind right now. I can watch the 2019 QB battle, and see who wins. As long as Cooper and Cruz stay on the bench, I don't have to compete against experience next year. If something happens that puts one of them on the field, my battle may be a little more uphill.
I think Bledsoe will be a RS junior next year, not senior. I also wouldn't count on a lot of snaps for backup QBs unless there are injuries. Gordon and Tinsley got precious little game time last year, even in some lopsided games. I would hope Cooper gets some action, but wouldn't be surprised if Tinsley/Gordon get those backup snaps behind Gubrud.
Glad Cougar
If WSU is blowing out a team, I would certainly hope either Cooper or Cruz would get the back up snaps, over Gordon/Tinsley, no matter how good Gordon/Tinsley are as back ups, as long as either Cooper, Cruz, good enough back ups, because Gordon/Tinsley will be gone next year, and thus probably wouldnt need back up snaps, since would have Cooper, Cruz as back ups, and because Cooper, Cruz would likely need the back up snaps, since Cooper/Cruz would likely start next year, and so would need to get them back up snaps, experience, if WSU is blowing a team out.
You've apparently failed to watch WSU teams coached by Leach. I'm not going to say that Cooper or Cruz won't get snaps.....but Leach is going to put the guy that he believes is the best #2 QB at the time. That could be any of the guys on the roster. And it will be very, very late in games.
Exactly Flat. Whoever the #2 QB is will be taking those late game snaps in order to be ready to play in meaningful situations should there be an injury. As much as I would like to see the young guys get a little experience, I don't expect Leach to change his ways.
Glad Cougar
