Disagree. Use it as many times as you want. 1 free transfer is fair. A second time costs you. That is fair too. And that price is high. Losing 25% of your 4 year career is steep price.
Offensive Line
- Thread starter Coug-Vandal
- Start date
Disagree. Use it as many times as you want. 1 free transfer is fair. A second time costs you. That is fair too. And that price is high. Losing 25% of your 4 year career is steep price.
Of course they did. This is exactly the slippery slope that many were talking about that proponents claimed would never happen. Players getting paid was always going to lead to malfeasance, except now its not malfeasance its perfectly acceptable "cheating". You should know better since the NCAA is run by a Husky, but no one would listen.
All position groups matter, but some matter more than others. Receivers for instance. 2017 featured outside receivers who couldn't get separation to save their lives.
Can you imagine if the kid who went to Oregon that apparently got a 1 mil in NIL....cant tie it to performance or longevity, gets 1 mil up front then transfers to USC the following year and gets another mil? Do you think there will be some upset booster around Oregon. This is a real problem....
Along with their “plan” when the Tax Man comes a calling come April 2023 & beyond……
Agree that JDL must have had offers on the table. But what a head scratcher picking one of the worst P5 teams in the country.
Don't see him staying there if their highly touted QB freshman overtakes him sometime this season.
Watch him end up at the University of Hawaii.
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No. These are funded by groups of boosters in most all cases. Rich boosters (like you). If the player takes off after one year, they consider it the cost of doing business. It's chump change for these boosters. They move to the next player.
And it's the or a chunk of the marketing budget for a business. The money is going to spent anyway.
Yep. It's an advertising expense for a business. And the player who's receiving it - and who has probably never filled out anything more complicated than a 1040EZ, if that - is suddenly on the hook for tax on all of it.
You know those hard luck stories about lottery winners going broke? This is going to be the same thing. Sooner than later, the schools are going to end up hiring financial advisors to help their recruits manage their NIL money.
absolutely, if they can get paid to play they can foot the bill for financial advice
They could, but they won’t. A couple of stories about kids who got big NIL money and then end up in a gutter, and someone will decide that the schools need to help them.
Interesting comment … the night you were at home on Saturday at 930 wondering why I didn’t post I was with the type of money you are referencing , and we talked about NIL.
It is pocket change for these men and women. However, they expect a return . If a coach brings in these kids and they don’t perform right away , the coach may get two years . If they bring in guys who are on a year to year nil deal, and they lose kids to the portal again a problem for the coach. They will pour money into these kids if they produce . Well that is what this money bags told me he would do ….
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I like being at home on Saturday night at 930. It's the best place to be for me. Why wouldn't it be?
Ed, I've traveled the world to visit nearly 40 countries visiting multiple times staying at the best hotels and eating at the best restaurants...and that experience was mostly enjoyable. But at this stage of life, there is nothing better than being at home. I have no shame admitting that. None at all.
Good so you would understand why someone else wouldn’t be posting at 945 on a Saturday night ..
The fact was that the question I had asked you about defining what constitutes a man or a woman was asked by me several days before that, so your obsession with last Saturday night is merely a diversion.
He is calendar phobic or a Wulff Day Adventist.
CPW never lost on Monday Tuesday Wednesday etc.
Just on Game Day
Couldn't agree more. When I enter the gate of my ranch the weight of the world melts off my shoulders. I used to really enjoy traveling abroad, not so much anymore. Annual trip to St. John in July does it for me these days.
Wulff Day Adventist....that is some strong material right there!!
"Coach Wulff came to my house and ate my dad's Gumbo then used my bathroom (#2) so we were family at that point"
-Spencer "wash out" Waseem
No diversion at all. It is just a bit odd to me you would EXPECT someone to be at home posting on this board on a sat night. As Seinfeld was fond of saying .. although there is nothing wrong with that . Also Please note the word expect.
I don't know why it is a surprise to you as to why I haven't answered your question. You gave me the perfect post..."I will tell you how men and women think differently, but I need a favor tho." and you asked a different question where I answered it, you had a follow up and I gave you more info. Then you wanted to know what constitutes a man and a woman. I told you because you defaulted on answering the question I said no more answers for you. You know, living up to an agreement. So no answers for you...
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There's Turd, and There's Turd 2.0, also known as Turd, its a bit confusing, but if you hang around long enough it will all make sense.
So you think the dad withheld the gumbo antidote (pesto bismol?) or even the TP until CPW put his signature on his 2 star's LOI?
Sort of an e coli Luca Brasi - made CPW an offer he couldn't refuse. "Either your signature or gumbo juice will be on that LOI"
Good thing the Wulff took the browns to the super bowl before he boarded the flight home. If he dropped that gumbo bomb on the plane we might still be talking about the last words of the pilot on the black box.
Nobody is saying that we shouldn't be recruiting the offensive line. What's funny is that it's obvious that you didn't read my post above where I looked at one of our games and out of 55 participants....only 9 were offensive linemen.
You want to throw some math at that, it means that only 16% of the guys that are actually stepping on the field to play are offensive linemen. 16% of 25 is 4.1 not 5 or 6. In the real world....not the fantasy world that y'all live in, everyone else is recruiting around 4 offensive linemen per year because when it comes down to it.....that's what needs to happen.
I can buy into the notion that WSU is better served to go with 4-5 guys per year because I do agree that we have shown a demonstrated need for that focus....but it is moronic to be sh!tting your pants because we "ONLY" got 7 guys in a two year period at one point and it's myopic to suggest that we should be looking at 6 guys per year because 6 is close to 25% of 25. About 84% of the players that step onto the field are NOT offensive linemen. You want to throw math around....it's freakin' simple.
If you look at the updated list of people signed in this class, a total of 27, I believe there are 5 offensive linemen, some transfers, some high school. So it appears as though this staff seems to be on the correct path, sure it just might take a while to stock up the cupboards again, but I think they realize the importance of the OL. And I would assume they will take 4-5 each year. I do think having a tight end impacts the number of linemen you take. but 4-5 a year, with a red shirt for some, will leave you with an average of 18-20+ at anyone time.
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This is the part that will get the academic side of some institutions on board. They aren't big on athletes now because they don't pay tuition. But in a world where you can sign kids who pay full tuition using money that doesn't come from the university...hell yes, sign them up.
Here's my proposal for fixing the issue:
- One free, no-penalty transfer per athlete. Cannot be used until after completion of 2 years of eligibility (redshirt years do not count).
- Exception: If the head coach leaves the university for another college position or is fired, all athletes who have not already used a no-penalty transfer are eligible to transfer without penalty. This exception does not apply if the coach retires, dies, or leaves for an NFL position.
- Exception 2: Any athlete who has completed their degree may transfer to any other institution without penalty
- Timing of announcements
- No-penalty transfers that are a result of the head coach's departure must be announced within 30 days of naming the new head coach.
- All other no-penalty transfers must be announced during the 30-day period starting on the early signing date.
- Transfers to accommodate the death or serious illness of an athlete's immediate family member may occur at any time of year without penalty. Confirmation of the precipitating event is required, and the transfer must be to an institution that is at least 50% closer to the athlete's hometown.
- Any athlete who exercises their no-penalty transfer option is restricted as follows:
- They cannot transfer to the same school the head coach goes to. Further, they cannot under any circumstance play under that head coach until at least two seasons have passed.
- They are ineligible for NIL compensation for one calendar year after the transfer. Transfers that occur under exceptions 1 or 2 above are exempt from this restriction.
- Any coach found to have sanctioned, participated in, or been aware of any of the following shall be considered to have provided cause for termination, and shall automatically be subject to a 5-year "show cause" restriction:
- Efforts to entice athletes to transfer prior to the athlete's announcement of intent to transfer;
- Efforts to entice athletes to transfer using NIL compensation
- Efforts to fabricate basis for transfer to qualify for exemption from the above restrictions
This seems to address a lot of the "dipping the toe in the water" issues that have proven to serve no one unless the athlete is extremely lucky or has some high up contacts.
Apparently playing time is the end-all for these kids because someone has convinced them that they are all NFL bound. To which I will concede that you'll never get spotted/scouted if you're on the bench, but there are a lot more rotational players taken from P5 schools than starters from D2 schools.
I dont agree with making kids stay 2 years. If it isnt a fit for the player, why would you make him stay? It does go both ways. If it isnt a fit for the program, why make the school hold on to dead weight? It limits opportunity for both parties.
I dont have an issue with kids following coaches. They have 4 yrs to play. Let them invest their time in what is known. A new coach can walk in, change the scheme, now what? Maybe you fit, maybe you dont. Losing a season of eligibility is a high price. Let the kids roll on. Dont limit the new coach to only a certain amount of scholarships though. Make it an “open 85” so the new coach can fill his roster.
There should be some formal timing of portal entries. Maybe after the season until start of spring ball and again after spring ball to start of season??? Add some structure.
I like your idea of the NIL restriction. Dunno how it finds a role in the scenario though. But it’s an interesting idea.
I’d add an academic clause too. Kids that maintain high gpas get as perks. Burn up your 1 free transfer and picked a bad fit? Do you have a gpa of 3.5 or higher? You get another free transfer. Is that reasonable for high academic achievement?
I dont like the tampering. Enticing kids into the portal with back door deals is an issue. You can find yourself starting a qb in a bowl game that has offers on the table from other schools… then throws a tantrum at halftime cause things arent going well and decides to quit. You’d want to avoid that scenario.
My free 2 cents.
I could come off of the 2 year requirement, as long as the NIL restriction was enforced. I could also be convinced to lift the 2 year requirement if the transfer was to a lower division team (FBS to FCS, not P5 to G5). Mostly I want to eliminate the 'I didn't play as a freshman so I'm leaving,' and even more than that...eliminate the transfers purely for NIL money.
Prohibiting the player from following the coach goes toward the tampering - a coach leaves and then cherry-picks his old school's roster. Just eliminate the option.
The timing of portal announcements was something I thought about a bit. Giving 30 days after the early signing date basically means announcements are during bowl season, and leaves a little bit of time to sign a replacement in February. It also creates a recruiting window when other programs can try to bring in the announced transfers ahead of signing day and spring ball. I was also trying to set it up so kids could participate in spring at their new school, but that might not be realistic. I also like the idea of limiting it to a certain period. It's effectively free agency in college, so just have a free agency period like the NFL.
I like the academic clause idea, but I'm not sure I like it enough to give another free transfer. And, I kind of think that the graduate transfer option does the same thing - finish your academic requirements in 4 years, sure...you can have a free transfer for your last year of eligibility.
Tampering is where I don't think there should be any leniency. Proof of tampering results in - essentially - the death penalty for a coach. They're not allowed to be hired in CFB for 5 years. And, I'll extend it to the athlete - if you're soliciting/entertaining offers for a transfer during the season, or without announcing that you're in the portal, you forfeit your no-penalty transfer permanently. I'm also inclined to say that you cannot play for any institution or coach who contacted you during that period.
Thanks, 95. Excellent post; both ideas and details to discuss.
I like some sort of academic progress measure more than a GPA alone. If 120 credit hours is typical to graduate, then that is 15/semester. If you are well ahead of that (maybe 17/semester or more), then that also figures into the higher GPA for added transfer eligibility.
I don't care about 2 years of eligibility. Do with that what you wish. I also think it is OK to follow your previous HC.
"Open 85" for the first year or two for a new HC makes total sense.
I like your tampering and NIL thoughts.
I like some sort of academic progress measure more than a GPA alone. If 120 credit hours is typical to graduate, then that is 15/semester. If you are well ahead of that (maybe 17/semester or more), then that also figures into the higher GPA for added transfer eligibility.
I don't care about 2 years of eligibility. Do with that what you wish. I also think it is OK to follow your previous HC.
"Open 85" for the first year or two for a new HC makes total sense.
I like your tampering and NIL thoughts.
Here’s the thing about transferring to me… any student can transfer at any time to anywhere that will enroll them. I have a hard time with removing an athlete’s freedom to choose their education. There are reasons for kids leaving after not playing as a frosh. Could have been told one thing by a coach and another happened, could have seen the writing on the wall that they were never gonna play or have to wait longer than they feel is reasonable or they very well could be delusional in regards to how good they are. Any way you slice it, as a coach I dont want anyone on my team that doesnt wanna be there. You arent likely to get someone’s best effort, attitude, performance if they hate being there. Wish them well, find someone that wants to be there.
I dont have a problem with a kid following a coach. Consider how long they may have known each other or the staff. 2-3 years in high school plus however long they were at the school… There is a level of trust there that may not be there with the next coach. I agree on the tampering. But if the kid enters the portal on his own, why remove his freedom in choice of education? Why remove options for the kid? The school can find more players. There is no shortage of kids wanting to play ball.
What if kids couldnt enter the portal until their teams season was finished? Regular season, bowl season, playoff season. That way teams dont have to worry about kids playing skipping their bowl game or playoff game to get into the portal asap. In theory a player could play the first 4 games, leave the team for the portal, call that his redshirt season, take his campus visits while going to class during the week and then transferring after finals to his new school. Close that option altogether. He can leave the team but cant enter the portal, cant take campus visits, cant be recruited at all under his team’s season is complete. Also, what if school’s cant host portal kids until their season is done too? I wouldnt even allow a kid to apply to another university while his team was still playing. No one gets a jump on the process. If the school does get an application, they either self report or they face sanctions.
Sanctions for tampering… Ive been thinking about this. Wanna see kids, schools, boosters play fair?
1st offense - You cannot take any portal transfers for 2 years and max limit of 20 new players per year for 2 years. Schools could lose their senior class and kids to the portal. They could be left the following year with 70 kids.
2nd offense - No NIL deals for 2 seasons.
3rd offense - Forfeiture of all NIL deals for the entire program for 4 seasons. If found to be giving NIL deals during that time, add 8 more years.
Wanna make sure it goes above board? Take the kids $$$ away.
Point taken regarding the education opportunities. But there’s got to be rules that are pretty severe regarding coaches contacting players from their former school. I think even if they’re in the portal, the HC can’t initiate contact.
Not sure about the portal timing, other than I think the window should end before spring ball starts.
Totally agree on the mid-season quitters. They can’t announce, contact, or be contacted until their team is done. They can leave the team, even drop out of school. But they can’t go somewhere else until the original team’s season is over. I’d probably be OK letting them start the move at the end of the regular season. Waiting until the end of bowl season probably doesn’t align with some academic calendars.
I like severe sanctions for tampering, but in the modern world even your 2nd offense is probably effectively a death penalty. The 3rd certainly is. That being said…to your ideas I’d add mine for sanctions against the player(s) involved….and if their program is sanctioned due to their participation in tampering, those players cannot play for a different program for the duration of the sanctions.
The thing about the sanctions is creativity. In my mind the death penalty = no team at all. But when they come back they can ramp up again with NIL $ and voila, right back where they were. I say let them play. But $0 NIL. Even cut their scholarships. But make them play games with less talent and less depth. Which is worse… the death penalty and 0 games or going 2-10 for 5 years in a row? Hell, make them play all 12 games on the road! Hammer their game day $. Or let them play home games and the league gets 50% of their game day revenue.
