Presidents planning major conference overhaul

[Cougsocal]

If not, the Pac-12 is heading down the road of the SWC and the Big East, as the former poor step children of the power five, disbandment and realignment. The problem is the presidents seem to thinking that the answer is in the next "media deal" but the far bigger issue and problem long term is the product we are offering is a weak shadow of what Pac-12 football use to be, the dominant football conference. The big media deals will come flocking if the product you offer is in demand. It isn't right now and they won't. If the flagship school of this conference continues to hire the likes of Sark and Helton, instead of digging into its deep deep pockets, we are in deep trouble. It isn't all on USC, however, the rest of the conference needs to try too. WSU and UCLA have made the effort. We got the right hire, but the financials were all wrong and we didn't retain or replace like for like, as a result, and UCLA appear to have swung for the fence and miss. But it doesn't mean you stop trying. Oregon, give them credit, is holding up their end, but the rest of the conference, appears to be merely hoping and praying for a turn around, without doing what needs to be done to pull it off. Case in point, Jimmy Lake. Really? Jimmy may become the greatest football coach of all time, but the UW hiring the man, now, says they aren't willing to spend an extra dime to improve the product or the conference image. Had the UW swung big, it would have put a lot more pressure on Chun and the rest of the conference to do the same.

Scott needs to go because, he doesn't have a clue what he is doing, but he didn't create the problem, he just made it worse.

Hotline exclusive: Pac-12 presidents consider massive overhaul of conference structure, seek adviser for media strategy

The presidents and chancellors are considering hiring an independent consultant who would examine the media strategy and work independently of commissioner Larry Scott.

www.mercurynews.com

 

[chugspig]

If they are hiring a consultant to determine the networks viability, basically Larry’s only project, he is forsure a deadman walking. They’d probably like for him to resign by neutering his projects, but he’s such a loser he’ll continue to hang on and collect what he can while he’s dragged through the mud.

 

[SDCoug]

If they are hiring a consultant to determine the networks viability, basically Larry’s only project, he is forsure a deadman walking. They’d probably like for him to resign by neutering his projects, but he’s such a loser he’ll continue to hang on and collect what he can while he’s dragged through the mud.

Agreed. He’s done. I’ll just go ahead and place the over/under at six months (3/1/21). I’m taking the under.

 

[FnuLnu]

Apparently, one of the members of their advisory group is Jeff Smulyan (USC grad) the former owner of the Mariners between George Argyros and the Nintendo group.
While Smulyan deserves some credit for some of the in stadium improvements the Nintendo group were credited for (Mariner Moose, between innings entertainment - hydros, music etc), he was a disaster otherwise.

Thought Tampa was better baseball market than Seattle ($ wise which is what these guys care about, it definitely isn't) and botched the media rights for the team despite being a radio station owner (owned WFAN which was first "Sports Radio" station - not sure how much that was Smulyan's idea).

Smulyan didn't get the $ amount he wanted for local TV rights for the Mariners and basically only put the team on TV a limited amount. If you want people to come out to watch Ken Griffey, Jr - you need to give some free product away.
The Nintendo group definitely aren't brilliant baseball guys and are cheap but the first thing they did when they bought the team from Smuylan was put as many games as possible on the TV.

Smulyan trying to move the team to Tampa, not reading the stadium lease, and botching the media rights locally probably make him a good fit as a Pac 12 President's advisor.

 

[CougSinceBirth]

The P12 Presidents and ADs have failed the conference. This should've been handled a long time ago. Inexcusable.

 

[ttowncoug]

This is the right decision. Larry is done, especially with the team working with the consultants.

 

[BleedCrimsonandGray]

Apparently, one of the members of their advisory group is Jeff Smulyan (USC grad) the former owner of the Mariners between George Argyros and the Nintendo group.
While Smulyan deserves some credit for some of the in stadium improvements the Nintendo group were credited for (Mariner Moose, between innings entertainment - hydros, music etc), he was a disaster otherwise.

Thought Tampa was better baseball market than Seattle ($ wise which is what these guys care about, it definitely isn't) and botched the media rights for the team despite being a radio station owner (owned WFAN which was first "Sports Radio" station - not sure how much that was Smulyan's idea).

Smulyan didn't get the $ amount he wanted for local TV rights for the Mariners and basically only put the team on TV a limited amount. If you want people to come out to watch Ken Griffey, Jr - you need to give some free product away.
The Nintendo group definitely aren't brilliant baseball guys and are cheap but the first thing they did when they bought the team from Smuylan was put as many games as possible on the TV.

Smulyan trying to move the team to Tampa, not reading the stadium lease, and botching the media rights locally probably make him a good fit as a Pac 12 President's advisor.

So, the light at the end of the tunnel is an oncoming train?

 

[FnuLnu]

This is the right decision. Larry is done, especially with the team working with the consultants.

Need the right consultants.

Jeff Smulyan is a millionaire who should be a billionaire.

It would be like Chun selecting Bobby Brett as a consultant.

 

[FnuLnu]

So, the light at the end of the tunnel is an oncoming train?

Jeff Smulyan is basically a mix of the slickness of Mariners GM Jerry Dipoto with the ethics of the Okies who bought the Sonics but with less money.

While in Seattle he was screwing Monica Hart while at the same time he was screwing over the fans.

It was his lack of savvy that was a problem more than the lack of money. (Not the worst guy ever, just not someone you want in this advisory group)

Just don't see what he can bring to the table for this advisory group - this is payback for donations or something.

Jeff Smulyan wasn't the only guy thinking of moving his team to the Tampa Bay "Sun Dome" - Chicago White Sox (Jerry Rhinesdorf, Smulyan's mentor) and SF Giants (before they were sold to NoCal group).

Bad facility, poor location and no fan base but all they saw was "season ticket" deposits which aren't much.

 

[fingerdisco]

Need the right consultants.

Jeff Smulyan is a millionaire who should be a billionaire.

It would be like Chun selecting Bobby Brett as a consultant.

I think they should be looking at Brennan and Dale with Prestige Worldwide—they are a world class consulting company.

 

[billyjoecamaro]

Whether we want to admit it or not we need UW to be a consistent top 15 team. All power five conferences need that. We need SC, Oregon and UW to mirror Ohio State, Penn St and Michigan. Wouldn’t hurt to have a Wisconsin equivalent as well. Without that any tv deal will be weak and I fear systemic changes will eventually take place - like WSU and OSU being replaced or our “big 4” (the above plus UCLA) heading elsewhere. This is such a critical time, and we decided not to play. Shameful.

 

[dgibbons]

Whether we want to admit it or not we need UW to be a consistent top 15 team. All power five conferences need that. We need SC, Oregon and UW to mirror Ohio State, Penn St and Michigan. Wouldn’t hurt to have a Wisconsin equivalent as well. Without that any tv deal will be weak and I fear systemic changes will eventually take place - like WSU and OSU being replaced or our “big 4” (the above plus UCLA) heading elsewhere. This is such a critical time, and we decided not to play. Shameful.

USC is the one that has let the conference down.

 

[Observer11]

Apparently, one of the members of their advisory group is Jeff Smulyan (USC grad) the former owner of the Mariners between George Argyros and the Nintendo group.
While Smulyan deserves some credit for some of the in stadium improvements the Nintendo group were credited for (Mariner Moose, between innings entertainment - hydros, music etc), he was a disaster otherwise.

Thought Tampa was better baseball market than Seattle ($ wise which is what these guys care about, it definitely isn't) and botched the media rights for the team despite being a radio station owner (owned WFAN which was first "Sports Radio" station - not sure how much that was Smulyan's idea).

Smulyan didn't get the $ amount he wanted for local TV rights for the Mariners and basically only put the team on TV a limited amount. If you want people to come out to watch Ken Griffey, Jr - you need to give some free product away.
The Nintendo group definitely aren't brilliant baseball guys and are cheap but the first thing they did when they bought the team from Smuylan was put as many games as possible on the TV.

Smulyan trying to move the team to Tampa, not reading the stadium lease, and botching the media rights locally probably make him a good fit as a Pac 12 President's advisor.

In Smulyan's defense, he was hooking up with Monica Hart - and despite her UW cheerleader roots - she was not ugly.

 

[CougEd]

In Smulyan's defense, he was hooking up with Monica Hart - and despite her UW cheerleader roots - she was not ugly.

The following is not a joke...her legal last name ends with a D and not a T. And her fathers name is Richard. Second worse name I have come across. My assistant had a classmate by the name of Kerry Hunt. Don't parents think before naming : )

 

[95coug]

Whether we want to admit it or not we need UW to be a consistent top 15 team. All power five conferences need that. We need SC, Oregon and UW to mirror Ohio State, Penn St and Michigan. Wouldn’t hurt to have a Wisconsin equivalent as well. Without that any tv deal will be weak and I fear systemic changes will eventually take place - like WSU and OSU being replaced or our “big 4” (the above plus UCLA) heading elsewhere. This is such a critical time, and we decided not to play. Shameful.

I don't completely agree.

I think USC needs to be up there consistently. They have the most traditional bloodlines and arguably the biggest nationwide profile. UCLA should likely be there too, for similar reasons. Oregon doesn't have the tradition, but it's impossible to ignore their current visibility (which could fade just as quickly, if they continue to underperform). I don't really think the 4th consistent performer needs to be UW. They have not been nationally relevant in decades, and aren't particularly noteworthy outside of the northwest. Stanford likely has more brand recognition than UW does, even relating to football.

But, my bigger disagreement is this: It still wouldn't matter. There is (and has been) such a low perception of west coast football that even if we had 4 top 15 teams every season, nobody would care. We'd still have little market draw anywhere east of Denver. We'd consistently hear the argument that USC only wins 10 games every year because they have so many weak teams in conference (while overlooking the fact that Bama gets Arkansas, MSU, and the Citadel every year, and Clemson is the only consistently good team in the ACC).

The Pac-12 Network will never be a national draw. Wouldn't matter if we had 2 conference teams in the playoff for a decade running. Those individual teams might build a bit of a following, but I don't think it would translate to a significant bump in network viewership.

On top of that, I think in the next couple years we'll start to see fragmentation of the networks anyway. They've become overvalued, and subscribers aren't signing up to pay the fees that support the contracts. The next round of negotiations is going to see smaller contracts across the board, and then we'll start seeing increased availability of streaming services for certain teams. It's not going to be a 12-month subscription to watch Pac-12 football, basketball, softball, and water polo. It's going to be a season subscription to watch USC football, Cal gymnastics, Oregon X-box tournaments, and UW personal loans.

 

[CougPatrol]

Question. When was the Pac10/12 ever the consistently dominant football conference, and what metrics are you using to ascertain that?

 

[chipdouglas]

Whether we want to admit it or not we need UW to be a consistent top 15 team. All power five conferences need that. We need SC, Oregon and UW to mirror Ohio State, Penn St and Michigan. Wouldn’t hurt to have a Wisconsin equivalent as well. Without that any tv deal will be weak and I fear systemic changes will eventually take place - like WSU and OSU being replaced or our “big 4” (the above plus UCLA) heading elsewhere. This is such a critical time, and we decided not to play. Shameful.

Crazy to think we're now touting those B10 teams as a model for ourselves. Just 10 years ago I was using them as an argument for why the B10 was over. Now that conference is US.

 

[chipdouglas]

Question. When was the Pac10/12 ever the consistently dominant football conference, and what metrics are you using to ascertain that?

Yeah I don't remember such a time, but there were spans of years not long ago where I think it would have been fair to put us at #2 behind the SEC or B12

 

[CougPatrol]

Yeah I don't remember such a time, but there were spans of years not long ago where I think it would have been fair to put us at #2 behind the SEC or B12

There have definitely been many seasons where the Pac10/12 was, IMO, the best performing football conference in the Nation, but I guess I should have been more clear that I was speaking about different metrics. I'm originally from the East coast, and in the 40+ years I've been avidly following college football, the P12 has always been the least regarded, least prominent, and least respected major conference in the Nation. This applies to professional sports as well, but it's particularly true with college football.

It's not so much a direct slight to our league, but rather the geographical and time zone reality of our Nation. The ACC, SEC, Big10, and Big12 are all somewhat linked together via TV and the fact that there is a lot of alumni crossover in those regions. The Pac12, on the other hand, is out there. Oregon, WA, AZ, UT? Those states are irrelevant to most people East of the Rockies, and the relevance that CA has is mostly negative in their eyes. On top of that, our prime time televised games start 2-3 hours later than normal for those fans, and when we do have earlier starts, we compete with televised games from the SEC, Big10, Big12, and ACC; all of which are more attractive to central and east coast fans.

This is one of, maybe even the biggest issue I have with P12 marketing. We seem intent upon chasing ghosts with regard to marketing our product back East, where nobody's going to give a $hit about us anyway, instead of focusing on growing our brand and marketing our conference to fans West of Colorado. In comparison to the other 4 major conferences, the passion of our fan bases is lagging behind significantly. The SEC's motto is spot on "it just means more." If the P12 has any business sense, they'll realize this and start building their brand with a West coast emphasis. We're always going to be a "major conference," so even if the much ballyhooed financial shortfall continues to grow, who cares? What matters first is making P12 athletics HUGE out West. Get the P12 championship games in Vegas where they belong, and schedule them on a primetime, Saturday night so fans can make the trip. The same hold true for rivalry games. Stop selling them out for every last TV penny, and/or spread them out if you have to. Apple Cups in Pullman could be played a week or two earlier if need be to avoid black Friday when students aren't in school. God forbid we have a road game after Apple Cup. Honestly, all of the rivalry games should be played on primetime weekend slots and staggered so that the Apple Cup and Civil War aren't played at the same time. Same with the Big Game and SC/UCLA. Use your freaking heads and make these spotlight games. Schedule most of the OOC games vs the Mountain West and Big Sky. The P12 champion will always be an elite team, and with the impending college football playoff expansion happening sooner rather than later, it's not going to matter if we're not on par with the SEC financially. What will matter is whether or not we grow our brand like the SEC has grown theirs. By cultivating regional rivalries and making every high school player out West want to play in the P12.

 

[chipdouglas]

There have definitely been many seasons where the Pac10/12 was, IMO, the best performing football conference in the Nation, but I guess I should have been more clear that I was speaking about different metrics. I'm originally from the East coast, and in the 40+ years I've been avidly following college football, the P12 has always been the least regarded, least prominent, and least respected major conference in the Nation. This applies to professional sports as well, but it's particularly true with college football.

It's not so much a direct slight to our league, but rather the geographical and time zone reality of our Nation. The ACC, SEC, Big10, and Big12 are all somewhat linked together via TV and the fact that there is a lot of alumni crossover in those regions. The Pac12, on the other hand, is out there. Oregon, WA, AZ, UT? Those states are irrelevant to most people East of the Rockies, and the relevance that CA has is mostly negative in their eyes. On top of that, our prime time televised games start 2-3 hours later than normal for those fans, and when we do have earlier starts, we compete with televised games from the SEC, Big10, Big12, and ACC; all of which are more attractive to central and east coast fans.

This is one of, maybe even the biggest issue I have with P12 marketing. We seem intent upon chasing ghosts with regard to marketing our product back East, where nobody's going to give a $hit about us anyway, instead of focusing on growing our brand and marketing our conference to fans West of Colorado. In comparison to the other 4 major conferences, the passion of our fan bases is lagging behind significantly. The SEC's motto is spot on "it just means more." If the P12 has any business sense, they'll realize this and start building their brand with a West coast emphasis. We're always going to be a "major conference," so even if the much ballyhooed financial shortfall continues to grow, who cares? What matters first is making P12 athletics HUGE out West. Get the P12 championship games in Vegas where they belong, and schedule them on a primetime, Saturday night so fans can make the trip. The same hold true for rivalry games. Stop selling them out for every last TV penny, and/or spread them out if you have to. Apple Cups in Pullman could be played a week or two earlier if need be to avoid black Friday when students aren't in school. God forbid we have a road game after Apple Cup. Honestly, all of the rivalry games should be played on primetime weekend slots and staggered so that the Apple Cup and Civil War aren't played at the same time. Same with the Big Game and SC/UCLA. Use your freaking heads and make these spotlight games. Schedule most of the OOC games vs the Mountain West and Big Sky. The P12 champion will always be an elite team, and with the impending college football playoff expansion happening sooner rather than later, it's not going to matter if we're not on par with the SEC financially. What will matter is whether or not we grow our brand like the SEC has grown theirs. By cultivating regional rivalries and making every high school player out West want to play in the P12.

This says as much about the demo of enlisted Marines as it does about regional differences, but when I was in the service, LOTS of people - many of whom were big time football fans - were unaware that there was a state called Washington, separate from DC. THOSE are the people you're trying to sell on Cal football etc.

I still don't know about the PAC being #1, but I agree that the best thing you can do is rack up as many wins as possible. Let other conferences' fans complain and rationalize away our record like we do with the SEC. Also, like you say, recruit true believers at home who will proselytize outside of CO and CA, rather than trying to reach the people back east who either already have a team until they die, or never cared about football.

 

[Ffffws]

Pac12 needs to hire nationally prominent coaches, get teams into the playoff consistently, and win more.

 

[fingerdisco]

Pac12 needs to hire nationally prominent coaches, get teams into the playoff consistently, and win more.

Were that to happen, it would also have to have the effect of reversing the trend of the SEC picking the west coast clean of all the top talent. Just getting bigger name coaches won't fix the P12's situation, and I don't think its automatic that the top talent stays just because of a coach's name. The SEC and B1G is where its at right now.

 

[dgibbons]

Pac12 needs to hire nationally prominent coaches, get teams into the playoff consistently, and win more.

For national perception, the conference “needs” USC to be national power. Or Oregon or Washington needs to win a natty.

A lot more TV revenue would also help.

 

[COCoug]

I think there was a time where you could argue that "top-to-bottom" the P12 was the most competitive conference. This related mostly to bottom teams like WSU upsetting the leaders occasionally. The problem is that in today's sports world, nobody really cares about the bottom of the conference. One obvious issue is that when you are focused at the top of the conference, having 16 teams is a huge advantage over having 12, when you are looking at having 5 or 6 ranked teams. I agree that USC has let us down, but really so has UW, and underperforming is part of the Oregon DNA since as long as I can remember.

The clear recipe for success is to be very strong on top, very weak on the bottom, and play a soft non-conference schedule. The PAC12 has never done any of those things. We are also getting squeezed out of recruiting as high school football is in decline.

The other thing that has really killed us is the style of refereeing. The obsessive number of ticky-tac fouls discourages physical play, and we look like pansies when we play other P5 teams. We need about 30-40% fewer calls a game.

 

[OrangeGravy]

There have definitely been many seasons where the Pac10/12 was, IMO, the best performing football conference in the Nation, but I guess I should have been more clear that I was speaking about different metrics. I'm originally from the East coast, and in the 40+ years I've been avidly following college football, the P12 has always been the least regarded, least prominent, and least respected major conference in the Nation. This applies to professional sports as well, but it's particularly true with college football.

It's not so much a direct slight to our league, but rather the geographical and time zone reality of our Nation. The ACC, SEC, Big10, and Big12 are all somewhat linked together via TV and the fact that there is a lot of alumni crossover in those regions. The Pac12, on the other hand, is out there. Oregon, WA, AZ, UT? Those states are irrelevant to most people East of the Rockies, and the relevance that CA has is mostly negative in their eyes. On top of that, our prime time televised games start 2-3 hours later than normal for those fans, and when we do have earlier starts, we compete with televised games from the SEC, Big10, Big12, and ACC; all of which are more attractive to central and east coast fans.

This is one of, maybe even the biggest issue I have with P12 marketing. We seem intent upon chasing ghosts with regard to marketing our product back East, where nobody's going to give a $hit about us anyway, instead of focusing on growing our brand and marketing our conference to fans West of Colorado. In comparison to the other 4 major conferences, the passion of our fan bases is lagging behind significantly. The SEC's motto is spot on "it just means more." If the P12 has any business sense, they'll realize this and start building their brand with a West coast emphasis. We're always going to be a "major conference," so even if the much ballyhooed financial shortfall continues to grow, who cares? What matters first is making P12 athletics HUGE out West. Get the P12 championship games in Vegas where they belong, and schedule them on a primetime, Saturday night so fans can make the trip. The same hold true for rivalry games. Stop selling them out for every last TV penny, and/or spread them out if you have to. Apple Cups in Pullman could be played a week or two earlier if need be to avoid black Friday when students aren't in school. God forbid we have a road game after Apple Cup. Honestly, all of the rivalry games should be played on primetime weekend slots and staggered so that the Apple Cup and Civil War aren't played at the same time. Same with the Big Game and SC/UCLA. Use your freaking heads and make these spotlight games. Schedule most of the OOC games vs the Mountain West and Big Sky. The P12 champion will always be an elite team, and with the impending college football playoff expansion happening sooner rather than later, it's not going to matter if we're not on par with the SEC financially. What will matter is whether or not we grow our brand like the SEC has grown theirs. By cultivating regional rivalries and making every high school player out West want to play in the P12.
[/QUOT

The gains available by increasing regional "out west" fandom are negligible to zero. There aren't anymore potential rabid football fans to grab. If it was even possible, it would take decades to build that kind of passion to even come close to the level of the other regions. It's not even worth the money or the effort. No amount of marketing or strategy is going to change the cultural lifestyle priorities of people in the West.