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and considering Walden's post-Wulffian meltdown, I wonder how Cougar fans perceive both men, particularly if Erickson is now held in higher esteem. Certainly, Walden once easily outranked him, but is that still the case?
Walden achieved much more at Washington State, most certainly.
Erickson could have taken WSU to the next level, but... He quit.
So did Walden... what, exactly?So did Walden, before he was run out of town.
Someone is working on getting ANOTHER entire thread deleted.Your purple is showing.
Hey, when you can defend a coach who retired after hanging an 0-10-1, you've GOTTA do that.Someone is working on getting ANOTHER entire thread deleted.
Why are you doing that?... Are you really unable to have a conversation?... or just bitter I'm in Pullman again... And you're not... AGAIN!Someone is working on getting ANOTHER entire thread deleted.
Not having any luck finding that reading tutor, I see.Hey, when you can defend a coach who retired after hanging an 0-10-1, you've GOTTA do that.
Six losing seasons out of 9, and his pinnacle of success: a 3rd place (7-4) conference finish, or a 4th place conference finish plus loss in Holiday Bowl (8-3-1).Walden achieved much more at Washington State, most certainly.
Erickson could have taken WSU to the next level, but... He quit.
Not many coaches get to go winless. Probably puts you near the bottom of the profession.Not having any luck finding that reading tutor, I see.
That all sounds like moral victory stuff--which you were denigrating a while backJim Walden faced the biggest challenge to Cougar football in modern history. 4 head coaches in four years. The worst facilities in the Conference. Remote location, no press. No tv. No internet.
WSU... quite literally could not find a coach with head coaching experience to take the job.
Jim Walden was an internal staff hire.
Jim Walden entered his final game in 1982 in the drivers seat to Win the PAC conference. He took WSU to our first bowl game in 50 years.
Jim Walden made Cougar football relevant in the modern era.
Dennis Erickson, did none of that while at WSU.
There is no doubt whatsoever that Erickson is the better coach. It's not even close. It's laughable to even compare.
DE won two national titles coached 2 NFL teams 7 conference titles with 4 different teams at the college level
Won the Sugar, Orange, and Fiesta Bowls...
And Walden...went to 1 bowl game which he lost in 17 years of coaching.
Erickson coached only 2 years at WSU and took us to a bowl game in year 2 which he won (Aloha)
So Erickson has secured more bowl victories for WSU than Walden. And handed a 9-3 team to Mike Price.
Walden handed a 3-7-1 team over to Erickson.
Factor in we were stupid enough to keep Walden's deadbeat loser self around for so long (which no other program would have done...for so long and continually put up with his temper-tantrum hissy fits / "straight talk" even when he tried to sandbag the program because he was bitter his incompetent protege failed.
How can it not be Erickson by miles and miles and miles.
Just because we kept that mangey has been around doesn't mean it was a good thing. It just shows how stupidly nice we are and how foolish we were to even listen to him about ANYTHING....EVER...the guy was total deadweight and we celebrated and carried him around like a hero? Please.
Show many ANY....ANY program in the country that would let a losing record / 1 bowl game coach run the radio programming/have input in the athletic department hiring/firing decisions for future coaches. Any program? There isn't 1 on the power 5 level...because Athletic departments don't let has been coaches with no significant accomplishments make any decisions or have any input.
We paid Walden for his time here...and kept paying him...and kept paying him....and kept paying him...while he whined and cried and was obnoxious...like a deadbeat uncle that never would leave...but you keep supporting him because "he's family"...when all he does is holding you back.
Only at WSU would we be so naive and nice.
I think Walden also donated a fairly sizable amount of money, which maybe had something to do with him sticking around longer than he should have.
I really liked him in the booth. I found his homerism amusing & unique. His subsequent Wulff related meltdown was very sad to me.
They're both gone, who cares?and considering Walden's post-Wulffian meltdown, I wonder how Cougar fans perceive both men, particularly if Erickson is now held in higher esteem. Certainly, Walden once easily outranked him, but is that still the case?
Erickson was an innovative coach who did better coaching other coaches' recruits than his own. Walden could recruit and find talent, but wasn't innovative enough to win with less. Erickson lucked out by inheriting the best OL in school history, by a country mile and an NFL QB and RB. He recruited like crap in Pullman, however. Walden squandered his chance for greatness in 1983 with the Rypien affair, the dumbest move since Evashevski was shown the door. Bottom line: both guys had their flaws, but Erickson was/is an insincere carpetbagger. Walden gets the nod over Erickson.
That all sounds like moral victory stuff--which you were denigrating a while back
Dude, DE got as bigger paycheck because of his results. Just stop it. Everyone in football knows DE and hardly anyone around the country can recall Walden......unless you're talking about the pond....because then..it's a legend.For the record, you could make the argument that many of the foundation things that Walden did were the reason that Erickson had a situation where he could win. If that's unimportant, why did we waste hundreds of millions of dollars on facility improvements recently? If it's just the coach, why go in debt for nothing? Walden fought hard for WSU and would have had three bowl teams in today's environment. Still, I agree with the arguments that say that he overstayed his time and his act got old. I think everyone was ready for him to be gone.
Erickson was a better gameday coach but because of all of his inherent flaws, he's just a guy who used us to get a bigger paycheck. I don't blame him for it, but it's the truth.
For the record, you could make the argument that many of the foundation things that Walden did were the reason that Erickson had a situation where he could win. If that's unimportant, why did we waste hundreds of millions of dollars on facility improvements recently? If it's just the coach, why go in debt for nothing? Walden fought hard for WSU and would have had three bowl teams in today's environment. Still, I agree with the arguments that say that he overstayed his time and his act got old. I think everyone was ready for him to be gone.
Erickson was a better gameday coach but because of all of his inherent flaws, he's just a guy who used us to get a bigger paycheck. I don't blame him for it, but it's the truth.
They're both gone, who cares?
This is no different than a Wulff/Leach debate. It's totally pointless and irrelevant, and can only lead to the same kind of antagonistic back-and-forth that it always does.
The only reason to entertain these questions is if they are relevant to today's team, and neither Erickson or Walden is. Stop. Let the past stay where it is.
Dude, DE got as bigger paycheck because of his results. Just stop it. Everyone in football knows DE and hardly anyone around the country can recall Walden......unless you're talking about the pond....because then..it's a legend.
You are correct when you suggest Walden would have had bowl teams in '83 and '84 had there been more bowls available. It also is true Walden recruited the players Erickson shaped into a winner in '88, but I doubt Walden would have achieved the same success had he remained. His and his staff's verbal and physical mistreatment of players in '86 sealed his fate. There was no recovering from that.
FWIW, I don't blame Erickson for leaving. He would have been an idiot not to go. At the same time, when you look at his overall career arc, he was a mercenary and nothing more. That doesn't mean he wasn't good at it.
My comments about Walden were based on the idea that he set the table for Erickson to be successful. He recruited some damned good players, he got football games back in Pullman and he was the guy who steadied the ship and stopped the revolving door at WSU. Without Walden, who knows if WSU would have started to "expect" to be a factor in the Pac-10 again. The 1981 team was the first time in about 25 years that WSU was a serious contender for the conference title. He fostered the attitude that WSU could play with anybody and he energized the fanbase. It was time for him to leave when he bailed for Iowa State, but it reflects a lack of understanding of WSU history to ignore his contributions.
This is some veiled revisionism.
Erickson was widely reviled and mocked in WSU cIrcles for bolting Pullman to take the Miami job after spending just two years in Pullman. This shortly after ditching Wyoming after just one year. He's also held in disdain around Moscow for ditching them to take the ASU job. All quite logical professional opportunities but Dennis left a sour taste wherever he carpetbagged to his next stop.
Definitely a quality football coach but the fact is Dennis is all about Dennis and always has been.
This is some veiled revisionism.
Erickson was widely reviled and mocked in WSU cIrcles for bolting Pullman to take the Miami job after spending just two years in Pullman. This shortly after ditching Wyoming after just one year. He's also held in disdain around Moscow for ditching them to take the ASU job. All quite logical professional opportunities but Dennis left a sour taste wherever he carpetbagged to his next stop.
Definitely a quality football coach but the fact is Dennis is all about Dennis and always has been.