You don't expand your stadium by 10-15K seats so you can sell more tickets to 1 game every other year.
Does WSU even need a new indoor practice facility?
- Thread starter PeteTheChop
- Start date
You don't expand your stadium by 10-15K seats so you can sell more tickets to 1 game every other year.
Once that bubble comes down, it's done. There wouldn't be enough life left in it to cost justify the cost of reconstruction. Good money after bad.
I haven't been overly impressed with Mr Schultz, myself. So far. At this point I see him as another "mid-manager, bean counter" type. WSU needs men/women of vision to lead it. And their vision needs to be on the horizon, not on the ground beneath their feet, IMHO.
I hate to harp on this subject because Dr Floyd isn't with us any more. But he was a man of vision. Moos is a man of some vision. I'm talking leaders, not managers.
The real problem is that the guys who held their jobs before them were total bean counters, except for that golf course thing....
And I think the man at the top right now may be in over his head, as far as being able to lead the university AND provide an environment where the athletic department can be a "shining window" into the school.
But that's just my own opinion and is probably hasty and ill conceived??
I agree that we haven't seen much to indicate Schulz has vision (in particular, at a level that Floyd did), and we have his "handling" of the SCB situation providing a bad example of his leadership. I think it's too early to say he doesn't have any vision, though. I understand he's said that he wants to get WSU to the level of a top 25 university nationwide, which is a pretty ambitious goal and reflects some vision on his part if he's serious about it.
Pete, I've said for years that WSU needs 60,000 seats. Maybe more. If you show me a sell out I'll show you a price increase or stadium increase the next season. Unless you're WSU.
A sell out is great. It also means you left $$$ on the table. Something WSU isn't in a place it can do.
Weren't the Oregon and Arizona games sell-outs this season?
The official attendance for the home opener vs. Eastern was more than the listed capacity.
The Martin Stadium record attendance was set in 1997 against ... get ready ... Stanford.
FWIW: The only "Power 5" conference school with a smaller stadium is Wake Forest, which has 4,800 undergrads.
Among the mid-majors with bigger stadiums than WSU are Central Michigan, South Alabama, Southern Mississippi, Louisiana-Lafayette and Marshall. Those programs likely will have no reason ever to expand their stadiums as the gap grows wider between the haves and the have-nots.
But WSU Football — which will always play major conference opponents at home and is one of two major universities in the nation's 13th-most populous state — can get even bigger and better.
With the media landscape changing, I just don't think the financial windfall Bill Moos and many others were probably counting on may ever arrive.
So than what?
It's a tough spot to be in. You don't have so much $$$ that you can do it. You don't have so much $$$ that you can pass on it. I guess you either wave the white flag or commit to being better and sell the seats necessary to make it pay.
FWIW, Schulz was very well respected at KSU and they spent hundreds of millions on athletic facilities while he was president. He is not going to hold back anything as long as there is a good plan in place. We talked here about giving Leach 5-7 years to get our football program built up but the same fans expect Schulz to effect enormous change in six months as President. It might be a good idea to wait a couple years before we judge too much.
And I will totally agree that goal (top level academic standards, research capabilities, quality of teaching/education) is, and should be, his FIRST priority. But, as Dr Floyd often said, the athletic department is the window to the university for the world. As much as I love WSU athletics, the university as a whole is the important thing. I just want BOTH to be vibrant and healthy!
So far I haven't been very impressed with Schultz. And I did say my opinion/judgement of him may be a bit hasty. Perhaps because practically the first words out of his mouth after arriving on the job were something to the effect that "you guys have made a mess of finances in your athletic building projects and that STOPS NOW". I thought THAT was a bit hasty because without the deficit spending (which was based in part of projections of promised revenue fromP12 that failed to manifest) we would have been so far behind the eight ball in the P12, facility-wise, that we couldn't have dreamed of making up the gap.
But I understood why he said what he said, even if I thought it was a bit ill conceived at the time, given the circumstances. The media was making a big fuss over athletic dept deficits of over 13 million. Interestingly, the UW later announced deficits in THEIR athletic department of around 15 million dollars and the media wasn't after them like vampires at the blood bank......and their president didn't come out with bombastic statements about "this stops now"....
Anyway, he's our University President and does deserve a little time to truly make his mark before being accurately judged.
But I'm also saying he has a few marks against him already, with the ham fisted "THIS STOPS NOW" statement regarding further athletic facilities (reasonable in principle, not in execution), with his over the top criticism of Leach's support for Trump (which was admonished by the state's atty general's office - agree with Leach on that or not, he had the right to act as a private citizen) and his lack of leadership in the Student Disciplinary Board fiasco.
The ball's in his court. I hope he's the right man for the job. I'm willing to give him time enough to tell if that's true, or not.
By all means, keep repeating it.....you must really believe the old adage "if you repeat a lie often enough people will believe it." Like I said, I'll pay for your airfare if you pitch this idiotic idea to Moos & Co. And I'll even throw any copies of Field of Dreams for the whole BOT, so you can end on a big note. You know, Build it and they will come sort of thing. Dumbest idea ever...in a forum known for 'em. Despite channeling your inner Kevin Costner, do you have other brilliant ideas? Why not start with paying the Cougar athletic fund the $100 you owe them? Welcher.
Pete, since biggs slept through both ethics and geography, let me tell you what he slept through. Yeah, Washington might be the "13th-most populous state" but where do those people live? 75% of the PNW's people live in 7 Metro areas and few colleges are as far away (using time or mileage) from the people as WSU is....You know what can happen in Nov and Dec in the Palouse....and in Central Wash and the Cascades....and those are the barriers between the people and Martin. It just makes it hard to get butts in the seats in an area of the country that doesn't worship football (unlike those schools you mention). So take guys like M-I Coug or others with RVs.....when you tally up the costs to pack up shop and make a game, it wipes the weekend off the map and hundreds of dollars....or you can buy the primo CF TV package, trick out a man cave and enjoy football in the comfort of your home. Now why do you think Martin Stadium is the way it is?
Flatland posted a picture of WSU's seating chart earlier in the thread. Take a look at it. WSU is "selling out" games with a quarter of the stadium as student seating. How much is a sports pass these days? Couple hundred bucks a year? WSU is practically GIVING AWAY a quarter of their seats, including some pretty prime spots right on the 50 yard line.
I've been saying for years, if the demand is there, reducing the student section and selling those seats, especially the 50 yard line seats makes WAY more sense than spending millions on expanding the stadium. Those seats on the other side of the stadium go for $150-$400 a piece.
And before you complain that's not fair to the students, look at the seating charts for other stadiums. Husky Stadium looks to give their students about 1/10th of their capacity and the seats are in the endzone. Students at Autzen look to get roughly 1/10th of their capacity and are in the corner of the endzone, stretching out to the 20. UCLA students look to get about 1/8th of their tickets, corner of the endzone out to the 20. USC students look to have about an 1/8th of their stadium. Some prime seats for them, out to about the 35, but a lot are up in the corner and those awful field level seats behind the endzone.
Again, if ticket revenue is a concern, WSU needs to start maximizing what we have, not adding inventory.
i wonder where martin ranks in terms of percentage of seats devoted to the student section. it has to be near the top. you just don't see that many schools that give that kind of real estate to students anymore (not with all the fancy stadium renos we see all the time).
Fab5Coug,
I am going to respectfully disagree.
Most would agree that WSU's pool of future ticket buyers will consist primarily of WSU alumni.
That being said, those who regularly attend games while in school at WSU seem much more likely to one day buy tickets and financially support the program then those who found other things to do other than show up and cheer at Martin Stadium on Saturdays in the fall.
Offering students an unmatched experience at those games — including plentiful seats in prime locations — seems to me a great way to differentiate WSU from the rival programs you mentioned who make well-heeled alumni and boosters their top priority.
Like many have said here and elsewhere, more is asked of WSU fans to attend games than their counterparts at other major institutions.
So why not give them something better while they are in school at Pullman?
BiggsCoug,
I missed this when you originally posted, but can you revisit how 60,000-plus seats would be a success for WSU Football? Interested to see some thoughts on a massive expansion that would nearly double the size of Martin Stadium.
In addition to adding hotels and restaurants, I'm guessing the roads might have to widened from both the north and the west into Pullman? Maybe some other infrastructure enhancements would be needed, too?
I missed this when you originally posted, but can you revisit how 60,000-plus seats would be a success for WSU Football? Interested to see some thoughts on a massive expansion that would nearly double the size of Martin Stadium.
In addition to adding hotels and restaurants, I'm guessing the roads might have to widened from both the north and the west into Pullman? Maybe some other infrastructure enhancements would be needed, too?
The students don't fill their sections anyway. I can't remember the last time I saw the upper corner of section 31 full the entire game. Why are we giving them more seats than they need, and premium seats at that?
And in terms of generating future season ticket holders by giving them seats no other team in the conference gives their students, how's that working out so far? Season ticket sales must be through the roof having practically given away 1/4 of the stadium and some of the best seats in the house.
And future students wouldn't know the difference anyway. They'll have a great time at games sitting in sections 30, 31 & 32. Don't give your premium product to people who don't appreciate it, or don't know the difference. You open a new restaurant, how do you market? "Come on in and have a free appetizer." You don't give away a steak dinner the first time they come in.
Bowl the stadium in. Build as many seats as possible. Add luxury boxes where applicable.
I do think that the university would be well advised to review the attendance at games and size the student seating to match the enthusiasm that students are showing. If we've allocated 8,000 seats to students but only 7,000 are showing up, I don't see how they could complain if next year, they only get 7,000 seats allocated.
