New Jo Albi article

[Loyal Coug]

In the Spokesman. A few observations:

The architects (ALSC, long, long time school district architects in the region), say that a new stadium would cost $23 million. Renovating/downsizing Albi? 18 million. OK, go look at the article and Albi picture. How could it possibly cost nearly as much to renovate/reduce Albi as building a new stadium? Albi lays in a bowl. Read - no vertical stands. The site is already prepped. A new stadium? vertical construction. Land moving, utilities, blah blah blah.

I have experience in the ways of school district capital projects. School administrators typically want to tear down the old and build new. That is a fact, proven over the decades in many districts. Don't make me look it up. They let old buildings go to hell to help justify this. The architects make more money designing new structures. They inflate the costs of renovations. No knock on ALCS, they are just capitalists. Note that a renovation/downsize of Albi leaves room for the new school, and eliminates any issues with parking (big issue downtown). Mead and CV want to build soccer and ballfields as well as football stadiums. Huh - sounds a lot like the Merkel facility.

Now I don't really care, I don't live in Spokane and my kids are grown. But the Spokanites here should take pause and look beyond the "facts" and apply some common sense.

http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2018/feb/08/school-officials-ponder-football-fields-and-the-fu/#/0

 

[Observer11]

Albi is a pit. A huge money pit. It's essentially a complete rebuild except you save on some of the excavation costs. And you get a stadium in a bad location without any surrounding amenities except a parking lot. And a cemetery. That's it.

As much as it pains me to say this - as many, many of my life's memories were made there - Albi needs to go. Bye bye. It's the same ripping off of the bandaid as when the old Coliseum was demolished. And, by far, the Arena is a massive upgrade over the old barn and has literally bought world-caliber events to Spokane. Albi is a bad location and is used 10 Thursday/Friday nights per year for football and maybe a similar number for soccer. As best, I'm guessing 30 events per year...maybe, if that.

Mead and CV aren't in the Spokane school district, nor within the city limits of the City of Spokane - so that's a poor comparison - and they aren't dealing with multiple partnership projects between the city and Spokane Public Schools. The Southgate athletic field/Tower retail project is one example. Several land trades and joint ventures going on -and in the case of Albi, the school district wants that for a middle school site. It's not just the dollars and cents of one deal - it's a series of them that make sense for both parties. It's literally unprecedented in terms of collaboration and sharing of resources.

As a standalone, a downtown stadium is probably not a great dollars and cents deal - but when you factor in the school district NOT having to pay for a site for a northwest middle school, it IS an overall savings to the taxpayer. Because you have to do something with Albi. AND you still have to build a new middle school. The city isn't going to pour money into an Albi downsize at all - they have no upside there. They are interested in cleaning up a portion of town that is a bunch of abandoned warehouses and weed-infested lots as part of the north river bank plan.

 

[Coug95man2]

In the Spokesman. A few observations:

The architects (ALSC, long, long time school district architects in the region), say that a new stadium would cost $23 million. Renovating/downsizing Albi? 18 million. OK, go look at the article and Albi picture. How could it possibly cost nearly as much to renovate/reduce Albi as building a new stadium? Albi lays in a bowl. Read - no vertical stands. The site is already prepped. A new stadium? vertical construction. Land moving, utilities, blah blah blah.

I have experience in the ways of school district capital projects. School administrators typically want to tear down the old and build new. That is a fact, proven over the decades in many districts. Don't make me look it up. They let old buildings go to hell to help justify this. The architects make more money designing new structures. They inflate the costs of renovations. No knock on ALCS, they are just capitalists. Note that a renovation/downsize of Albi leaves room for the new school, and eliminates any issues with parking (big issue downtown). Mead and CV want to build soccer and ballfields as well as football stadiums. Huh - sounds a lot like the Merkel facility.

Now I don't really care, I don't live in Spokane and my kids are grown. But the Spokanites here should take pause and look beyond the "facts" and apply some common sense.

http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2018/feb/08/school-officials-ponder-football-fields-and-the-fu/#/0

What does capitalism have to do with this? You need a dictionary, loyal. You aren't making sense on that little... comment.

But you do make good, financial points. Link below is from 2011 originally, updated in 2013, latest plan I know of from the school admin. that also has poll numbers of support. And oddly, financial numbers haven't changed from now. There's a red flag, btw. Link doesn't even have downtown site as an option and still has the option of redu'ing school sites. That isn't an option now. But it gives everyone visuals on the sites and the numbers. Last page outlining support is interesting.

http://swcontent.spokaneschools.org...eName=Stadium Presentation 11-18-13update.pdf

The problem is fatigue. Everyone is just so tired of Albi. Financially, yeah, might make sense but in today's world, financial sense is only one factor. Shiny is almost a bigger factor, also location. Millions of tax dollars so they don't have to drive an extra 10-20 minutes is a fair trade to many. But using the Albi site as a Middle School is what has pushed this over the edge, I'd wager. Also, because the city (Spokane Public Facilities) owns the site of proposed new location, that makes land acquisition a non-issue.

I don't live in the city, so it's a non-issue to me financially, as well. But I follow it pretty closely. This is a lot like the North-South freeway. Been on the books, debated, dead-horse beaten for literally a couple decade. In private hands, it was hemorrhaging money so badly, owners wanted to sell and the city was "smart" enough to buy it... hence they are in the situation they are in.

 

[Observer11]

School field sites aren't going to happen.

1 -Hart Field (LC) was revamped after that study and doesn't have sufficient parking or room for additional bleachers (really poor planning but I digress). The neighborhood virtually exploded when the school district moved Jefferson Elementary from the east end of Hart to the West end (more into the residential area). Friday Night Lights will not play well in a high property tax/high school bond voting area.

2 - Ferris: Same as Hart - insufficient parking even now for BASKETBALL games. Even worse than Hart because the closest surface parking in the surrounding neighborhood is a gated community.

*District even floated the idea of a combined south hill field at Ferris - that went over like a fart in church. Will NEVER happen.

3 - NC: No parking. Absolutely horrible layout for any type of field. District won't build a nice stadium at say, Ferris, and leave NC with something inferior. They all have to be similar in design, cost and functionality.

4: Rogers: Reasonable amount of space available but parking lot is a healthy hike from the football field. Neighbhorhood can barely accomodate freshmen games from a parking perspective.

5: Shadle Park - same as above.

Costs to maintain 5 fields/FieldTurf didn't pencil out either.

 

[95coug]

My guess is that the renovation is so expensive because it's essentially a complete rebuild. Reducing from 28,000 seats to 7,000 essentially scraps everything that's there and requires re-construction of all of the access points, moves the press box structure, regrades the whole bowl, etc.

If they're open to a 7,000 seat venue, I would expect it could be accommodated downtown. That significantly reduces the demand for parking, so if it could share with the arena and existing city/county facilities in the neighborhood, it wouldn't require much in addition.

 

[Loyal Coug]

Albi is a pit. A huge money pit. It's essentially a complete rebuild except you save on some of the excavation costs. And you get a stadium in a bad location without any surrounding amenities except a parking lot. And a cemetery. That's it.

As much as it pains me to say this - as many, many of my life's memories were made there - Albi needs to go. Bye bye. It's the same ripping off of the bandaid as when the old Coliseum was demolished. And, by far, the Arena is a massive upgrade over the old barn and has literally bought world-caliber events to Spokane. Albi is a bad location and is used 10 Thursday/Friday nights per year for football and maybe a similar number for soccer. As best, I'm guessing 30 events per year...maybe, if that.

Mead and CV aren't in the Spokane school district, nor within the city limits of the City of Spokane - so that's a poor comparison - and they aren't dealing with multiple partnership projects between the city and Spokane Public Schools. The Southgate athletic field/Tower retail project is one example. Several land trades and joint ventures going on -and in the case of Albi, the school district wants that for a middle school site. It's not just the dollars and cents of one deal - it's a series of them that make sense for both parties. It's literally unprecedented in terms of collaboration and sharing of resources.

As a standalone, a downtown stadium is probably not a great dollars and cents deal - but when you factor in the school district NOT having to pay for a site for a northwest middle school, it IS an overall savings to the taxpayer. Because you have to do something with Albi. AND you still have to build a new middle school. The city isn't going to pour money into an Albi downsize at all - they have no upside there. They are interested in cleaning up a portion of town that is a bunch of abandoned warehouses and weed-infested lots as part of the north river bank plan.

Observer - what stadiums have a bunch of amenities right there? Rose Bowl? No. LA Coliseum? No. Martin Stadium? Not really, except I guess the Cub. And the RV lot! And we are talking about HS football anyway. You don't need a bunch of bars and restaurants next door. It's not like Albi is 50 miles from town. And what amenities are right next to the Spokane Arena anyway?

Ok I misread the article - I thought it said you could keep Albi AND still have room for a middle school. My bad. That said, why do you need 20 acres for a middle school? How big is this thing going to be? And you couldn't share parking and the fields with Albi/Merkel? Hint - there are no soccer or football or softball games conflicting with these uses during the school day.

I did notice Coug 95's point from his link about the overwhelming public % opinion saying keep Jo Albi. Kind of a small sample size though.

95 - my "capitalist" remark meant that architects are motivated to lean towards a new facility (or school in other cases) because they make more money on a new set of plans than a remodel. Not sure why that scenario doesn't fall under capitalism.

"an economic and political system in which a country's trade and industry are controlled by private owners for profit, rather than by the state.
synonyms: free enterprise, private enterprise, the free market;"

Anyway, this is kind of interesting on a Friday.

 

[Loyal Coug]

My guess is that the renovation is so expensive because it's essentially a complete rebuild. Reducing from 28,000 seats to 7,000 essentially scraps everything that's there and requires re-construction of all of the access points, moves the press box structure, regrades the whole bowl, etc.

If they're open to a 7,000 seat venue, I would expect it could be accommodated downtown. That significantly reduces the demand for parking, so if it could share with the arena and existing city/county facilities in the neighborhood, it wouldn't require much in addition.

Well they also don;t have land acquisition costs included in the downtown estimate.

Shifting gears, I'm kind of surprised that we are still going to do the Spring game up there. Can I assume that the turf is in terrible shape as well? Uhhh, injuries? Concussions? Fans falling through broken seats and tripping down rundown steps? Drunk of course?

 

[Coug95man2]

Well they also don;t have land acquisition costs included in the downtown estimate.

Shifting gears, I'm kind of surprised that we are still going to do the Spring game up there. Can I assume that the turf is in terrible shape as well? Uhhh, injuries? Concussions? Fans falling through broken seats and tripping down rundown steps? Drunk of course?

And I'll guess the cost for land acquisition will be minimal. The city will look at it as development and they'll make the deal sweet. I know of deals the city has made where the land cost a dollar... literally. With many caveats about not selling, development, etc. but still... a dollar.

You've touched on so many of the problems with Albi. You'll notice in the link I provided, there are pictures of the "stadium" to outline all the issues with it. You'll notice the building that is literally caving in (it's A LOT worse now). That's supposed to be concessions. The steps are concrete and they are separating and crumbling. The seats are OK. There is no elevator for the disabled. The only lighting is for the stadium itself (and a couple years ago a whole bank went out for the year... got fixed after the year was over) but nothing really for the parking. A major, major safety issue.

 

[dgibbons]

In the Spokesman. A few observations:

The architects (ALSC, long, long time school district architects in the region), say that a new stadium would cost $23 million. Renovating/downsizing Albi? 18 million. OK, go look at the article and Albi picture. How could it possibly cost nearly as much to renovate/reduce Albi as building a new stadium? Albi lays in a bowl. Read - no vertical stands. The site is already prepped. A new stadium? vertical construction. Land moving, utilities, blah blah blah.

I have experience in the ways of school district capital projects. School administrators typically want to tear down the old and build new. That is a fact, proven over the decades in many districts. Don't make me look it up. They let old buildings go to hell to help justify this. The architects make more money designing new structures. They inflate the costs of renovations. No knock on ALCS, they are just capitalists. Note that a renovation/downsize of Albi leaves room for the new school, and eliminates any issues with parking (big issue downtown). Mead and CV want to build soccer and ballfields as well as football stadiums. Huh - sounds a lot like the Merkel facility.

Now I don't really care, I don't live in Spokane and my kids are grown. But the Spokanites here should take pause and look beyond the "facts" and apply some common sense.

http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2018/feb/08/school-officials-ponder-football-fields-and-the-fu/#/0

Thanks for your advice. Us Spokanites are so dumb, it’s amazing we’ve gotten this far without you.

Albi is a pos. It’s not capable of being fixed. There is no one that wants to fix it.

 

[Loyal Coug]

Thanks for your advice. Us Spokanites are so dumb, it’s amazing we’ve gotten this far without you.

Albi is a pos. It’s not capable of being fixed. There is no one that wants to fix it.

Geez dude don't get offended. Sorry if I know stuff about school district capital projects. And that includes knowledge of ALSC architects in my own district over the years. Nothing wrong with them or any other company, I just know the drill. When you exhibit some knowledge of anything other than being a lemming, I will defer to your expertise.

An edit - no one wants to do anything with Albi except 96% of the public input from 95's article link.

 

[Observer11]

Thanks for your advice. Us Spokanites are so dumb, it’s amazing we’ve gotten this far without you.

Albi is a pos. It’s not capable of being fixed. There is no one that wants to fix it.

When dgibbons and I actually agree, there shouldn’t be much doubt. Albi is a junk pile. The city won’t fix it. The school district wants it for a school site. It’s going away.

The replacement is not for an FBS or NFL team. It’s a place where the city high schools can play their games together as they have for generations. It’s a Spokane thing. It’s just not going to be in the same place.

And as to amenities, the stadium location isn’t vital to the local schools - the old Playfair site was or the University District is a better spot - it’s to stage and attract regional, super-regional and national events. It’s part of the PFD sportsplex and having that many hotel rooms, restaurants and other attractions within walking distance of Tournament Central will blow other cities out of the water.

As to the spring game, Albi probably has 3 more years before the FieldTurf needs replacement. So it’s fine for now. But Mead is bailing on their joint agreement so it will be up to Spokane Schools and the City to fund replacement. But for all the reasons above, neither wants to put lipstick on that pig.

 

[dgibbons]

Geez dude don't get offended. Sorry if I know stuff about school district capital projects. And that includes knowledge of ALSC architects in my own district over the years. Nothing wrong with them or any other company, I just know the drill. When you exhibit some knowledge of anything other than being a lemming, I will defer to your expertise.

An edit - no one wants to do anything with Albi except 96% of the public input from 95's article link.

What Spokane needs is more sports fields and more gyms. Bulldozing Albi, expanding Merkel and building a new stadium and sports plex will do that.

IMO, whatever city you live in should slap a new coat of paint on the biggest eye sore in town and call it good. Don’t spend any money on anything. Ever.

 

[wazzubruce]

I live in Spokane and Albi needs to be replaced in some form, on site or elsewhere. It's pretty simple. Yes, I know things cost money. In addition we don't need a stadium of any size downtown.

 

[Loyal Coug]

What Spokane needs is more sports fields and more gyms. Bulldozing Albi, expanding Merkel and building a new stadium and sports plex will do that. Which will also fix the major homeless and panhandler (and meth) problem - they can hang out on the soccer fields and downtown stadium and make some coin.

IMO, whatever city you live in should slap a new coat of paint on the biggest eye sore in town and call it good. Don’t spend any money on anything. Ever. Although In my beloved Spokane that would take a helluva lot of paint.

Fixed your post........

 

[dgibbons]

Fixed your post........

Please tell us about the utopia you live in.

 

[Loyal Coug]

Please tell us about the utopia you live in.

Sorry, that was bit below the belt. Just irks me that "more sports fields" are the solution to whatever.

And I was born, raised and still live in Davenport. Heaven on earth.

 

[Observer11]

Sorry, that was bit below the belt. Just irks me that "more sports fields" are the solution to whatever.

And I was born, raised and still live in Davenport. Heaven on earth.

This explains much.

 

[COUGinNCW]

I live in Spokane and Albi needs to be replaced in some form, on site or elsewhere. It's pretty simple. Yes, I know things cost money. In addition we don't need a stadium of any size downtown.

There aren’t a lot of good places for it. The Faitgrounds might make some sense if the CV schools were still sharing it but it’s about as central as Albi us for the City schools.

Personally I like downtown if it can be done in a way that doesn’t affect parking for Arena events. I think it will bring extra energy to HS football in Spokane and that’s a good thing for the sport.

 

[FnuLnu]

This explains much.

He meant Davenport, Iowa - home of St Ambrose University -where WSU's previous OC coached (along with Jody Sears and Timm Rosenbach)

 

[wazzucougs96]

The access to amenities of the north river location will be huge - and not just for high school football. That whole area is huge for the event economy of this town. Having club tournaments for various sports at that stadium would be a no brainer, and those people want to eat while they are here. Walking over the river to do so is much more practical than driving from the current Albi site.

It might be blasphemy, but imagine having hoopfest center court there. That would be amazing.

 

[dgibbons]

The access to amenities of the north river location will be huge - and not just for high school football. That whole area is huge for the event economy of this town. Having club tournaments for various sports at that stadium would be a no brainer, and those people want to eat while they are here. Walking over the river to do so is much more practical than driving from the current Albi site.

It might be blasphemy, but imagine having hoopfest center court there. That would be amazing.

Exactly. Additional revenue streams for a new venue (not a refurbed pile of crap) would be important to ensure proper upkeep and maintenance of the facility (the facility would be the new stadium and sportsplex). As it sits right now, Albi hosts high school football, soccer, and a few random events like band competitions. No one wants to use it.

It would be kinda cool to go to a crimson and gray game in a 7,000 seat stadium too.

 

[Coug95man2]

I think the term, "refurbed" is not really accurate. The plan is to literally bulldoze the existing stands. The only thing that would remain, I believe, is the concessions stand on the south side. And I could be wrong on that. Everything else would be brand-spanking new. So whatever location dictates would change things but the Albi stadium would be as new as the stadium downtown.

Where the rubber meets the road? Location worthy of millions of tax payer money? Dgibbons and 96 have outlined great points, as far as other streams and bolstering the downtown revenues, stores, etc. But still... it's a lot of money. On the light side, I'll say it'll be around 8-10 million dollars more to have a pretty stadium downtown, rather than having a pretty stadium at the old location.
-stadium build, 5 million dollars more for downtown location (recognize this is estimates from 2013. I'm sure that has changed, no one has let those numbers be public, though. Educated guess, 30% more, all around)
-annual maintenance, 2 million more for downtown location... annually (again, 2013 numbers)
-land acquisition, I put 2 million but that's hoping/praying the city will let it go for such a sweetheart deal. ACREAGE downtown Spokane does not cost so little as 2 million dollars.

 

[dgibbons]

I think the term, "refurbed" is not really accurate. The plan is to literally bulldoze the existing stands. The only thing that would remain, I believe, is the concessions stand on the south side. And I could be wrong on that. Everything else would be brand-spanking new. So whatever location dictates would change things but the Albi stadium would be as new as the stadium downtown.

Where the rubber meets the road? Location worthy of millions of tax payer money? Dgibbons and 96 have outlined great points, as far as other streams and bolstering the downtown revenues, stores, etc. But still... it's a lot of money. On the light side, I'll say it'll be around 8-10 million dollars more to have a pretty stadium downtown, rather than having a pretty stadium at the old location.
-stadium build, 5 million dollars more for downtown location (recognize this is estimates from 2013. I'm sure that has changed, no one has let those numbers be public, though. Educated guess, 30% more, all around)
-annual maintenance, 2 million more for downtown location... annually (again, 2013 numbers)
-land acquisition, I put 2 million but that's hoping/praying the city will let it go for such a sweetheart deal. ACREAGE downtown Spokane does not cost so little as 2 million dollars.

Land acquisition is supposed to be done through a swap between the city and Spokane Public Schools.

I’m sure the downtown restaurants, hotels and retailers would love to have it. Let’s do a tourist tax like King County did to cover upkeep and maintenance.

Even a shiny new remodeled Albi has a major problem- it’s in a terrible location. Proximity to restaurants, hotels, parking, etc. will be important for attracting events that are worth hosting.

 

[Coug95man2]

Land acquisition is supposed to be done through a swap between the city and Spokane Public Schools.

I’m sure the downtown restaurants, hotels and retailers would love to have it. Let’s do a tourist tax like King County did to cover upkeep and maintenance.

Even a shiny new remodeled Albi has a major problem- it’s in a terrible location. Proximity to restaurants, hotels, parking, etc. will be important for attracting events that are worth hosting.

It's all about location. Is it worth the up-cost. The up-cost that hasn't been published yet.

While I like most of what you say... you lost me. As soon as anyone says, "Lets do ____ like Seattle or King County" I'll almost automatically hate the idea. Spokane should run away from anything that resembles Seattle or King County. Now, I am partly kidding here... kinda

 

[Observer11]

There will be no new stadium in NW Spokane. Mark it down in ink and tattoo it on your butt. Is not gonna happen.

The city already owns the dirt downtown.

 

[froropmkr72]

Land acquisition is supposed to be done through a swap between the city and Spokane Public Schools.

I’m sure the downtown restaurants, hotels and retailers would love to have it. Let’s do a tourist tax like King County did to cover upkeep and maintenance.

Even a shiny new remodeled Albi has a major problem- it’s in a terrible location. Proximity to restaurants, hotels, parking, etc. will be important for attracting events that are worth hosting.

Part of the Albi land would be a great opportunity for retail in that area....easily 6 acres....that's really lacking as it is in large suburban areas. There's 5 acres right next to Albi. They finished 2 hotels...Embassy Suites and Hampton Inn on 5 acres...271 rooms total in Hillsboro, Or.

 

[dgibbons]

It's all about location. Is it worth the up-cost. The up-cost that hasn't been published yet.

While I like most of what you say... you lost me. As soon as anyone says, "Lets do ____ like Seattle or King County" I'll almost automatically hate the idea. Spokane should run away from anything that resembles Seattle or King County. Now, I am partly kidding here... kinda

Are you saying that Spokane is not worthy of the same things that occurred in King County?

 

[Coug95man2]

Are you saying that Spokane is not worthy of the same things that occurred in King County?

I'm saying I hate Seattle... I hate King County. Incredible natural beauty and it's complete misery to live there. And I hate the concept that Spokane can't think for itself and find it's own identity. There are many that think we should do quite a bit like the west side. I don't.

 

[kougkurt]

I'm saying I hate Seattle... I hate King County. Incredible natural beauty and it's complete misery to live there. And I hate the concept that Spokane can't think for itself and find it's own identity. There are many that think we should do quite a bit like the west side. I don't.

How about a Spokane sugar beverage tax

 

[Coug95man2]

How about a Spokane sugar beverage tax

lol.... yeah!!! Let's do that!!! It's helping/forcing people to be so healthy!

 

[kougkurt]

lol.... yeah!!! Let's do that!!! It's helping/forcing people to be so healthy!

As long as they don’t touch my brown sugar bourbon

 

[Coug95man2]

As long as they don’t touch my brown sugar bourbon

 

[dgibbons]

I'm saying I hate Seattle... I hate King County. Incredible natural beauty and it's complete misery to live there. And I hate the concept that Spokane can't think for itself and find it's own identity. There are many that think we should do quite a bit like the west side. I don't.

Seattle is an awesome city on a sunny and clear day, if you're not planning to drive anywhere.

 

[Loyal Coug]

Seattle is an awesome city on a sunny and clear day, if you're not planning to drive anywhere.

Or find a place to park when you get there.

 

[wazzucougs96]

Part of the Albi land would be a great opportunity for retail in that area....easily 6 acres....that's really lacking as it is in large suburban areas. There's 5 acres right next to Albi. They finished 2 hotels...Embassy Suites and Hampton Inn on 5 acres...271 rooms total in Hillsboro, Or.

Nobody is driving to the Albi area to go shopping.

 

[froropmkr72]

Nobody is driving to the Albi area to go shopping.

We're no talking about a Macy's...we're talking eateries, hair place and all the other reasons to have to drive 2-3 miles away to a strip mall. The idea is that you don't have miles of suburbs with one main strip of businesses along a single road that everyone files out onto....starts flipping each other and honking each other. Why, because there's there's no healthy restaurant, place to get your hair cut, drug store, chiropractor, doctor's office in their neighborhood.

 

[Observer11]

Doesn’t work. Development isn’t up that stretch.

Growth is downtown, south and north up the Indian Trail corridor to Mead.

 

[random soul]

Doesn’t work. Development isn’t up that stretch.

Growth is downtown, south and north up the Indian Trail corridor to Mead.

Did they finally get around to paving the gravel roads that lead up to 9 Mile hill and back from Indian Trail Road? I grew up in that neighborhood when it was being built and assume that the people living up there would've fought it because of the extra traffic, but for everyone else it would've been nice to have.

 

[COUGinNCW]

Did they finally get around to paving the gravel roads that lead up to 9 Mile hill and back from Indian Trail Road? I grew up in that neighborhood when it was being built and assume that the people living up there would've fought it because of the extra traffic, but for everyone else it would've been nice to have.

Do you mean this:

https://my.spokanecity.org/news/stories/2017/11/30/city-of-spokane-opens-barnes-road/

 

[wazzucougs96]

Did they finally get around to paving the gravel roads that lead up to 9 Mile hill and back from Indian Trail Road? I grew up in that neighborhood when it was being built and assume that the people living up there would've fought it because of the extra traffic, but for everyone else it would've been nice to have.

Yes - the new paved Barnes Road opened back in the fall and Strong Road was shut down. That area is now being developed by Crappo into a townhouse/SFH plat.

Barnes has seen quite bit of traffic increase as a result, but I don't think anyone should be surprised by that. It grants good access to that Albertsons shopping area. The increase traffic on Strong at the top leads to some annoying traffic issues at the 2 way stop intersection with 5 Mile Road, but that is going to be replaced with a roundabout this year. Hopefully that helps a bit.