Number of 4/5 star players on each Pac-12 roster next seasom...
- Thread starter How_did_this_happen?
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USC and Oregon not much of a surprise. I can see the appeal for Furd and UCLA. Even ASU for party reasons. But UW once again way up there, similar to the recruiting "analysis" I did in Tableau a few months back. As always, the fact that those two teams (USC & UW) haven't won the north and south every year for the last two decades is totally inexcusable. In fact they have combined (I think) for 4 appearances out of a possible 32. Gross.
Lots of people on this board though were swearing up and down Petersen's teams would inevitably decline once Sark and his ace recruiters were all phased out and CCP brought his MWC incompetence. If I were a UW booster I'd be pretty happy to be sitting atop the PAC once again...
Lots of people on this board though were swearing up and down Petersen's teams would inevitably decline once Sark and his ace recruiters were all phased out and CCP brought his MWC incompetence. If I were a UW booster I'd be pretty happy to be sitting atop the PAC once again...
He’s also not recruiting against Carroll or Kelly in his Oregon heyday. uw is not the same withou Ross, Shelton, Peters, etc.
So impressive what Leach has done looking at these rankings. He will just keep doing his thing and keep beating most all these teams.
Four in a row vs Oregon. Four in a row vs Utah. Three in a row vs Furd...
Reminds me of the days when Don James could pick essentially who he wanted out of the entire Northwest, Hawaii, and Northern California...and then pick up a few good players each year in Southern California. Not to dismiss what he accomplished as a coach, but that was a huge advantage back in the day. Oregon was horrible, as was OSU, Furd, and Cal.
At first, it seemed that Petersen was all too happy to land a bunch of 3-star OKGs and that the real talent was limited to holdovers from the Sark era, but UW has stepped up recruiting in a big way. I think this has quite a bit to do with tumult at UCLA and incompetence at USC, but unfortunately, a lot of this is self-reinforcing ... no matter what the reason, once UW is established as a place 4- and 5-stars go, even over USC and UCLA, that becomes ingrained quite easily due to perception, some of those guys going to the NFL and UW getting credit for it, etc.
And he built his rep at a time there were no scholarship limitations. The UW copied USC's stockpiling strategy. Of course, this strategy also included taking in future felons (assuming Norm Maleng didn't prevent prosecution).
That "four in a row vs. Oregon" was nearly five in a row. Leach very nearly pulled off the upset over a Mariota-led Duck team in Pullman five years ago.
People forget the effect that improved facilities have had on mutt recruiting. Peterson's arrival coincided with all that. And they have a real brick-and-mortar IPF.
If you buy into the rankings, Oregon has the better class this year.
Good point. I had forgotten about. We had two turnovers and they had zero. Ouch. Gained the same number of yards as Oregon in that game.
I'm not real impressed yet with Cristobal's coaching. I think he replaced his OC(?), so that may help.
We have their number...and have even been much more successful in the past several years vs Oregon than that team on the west side of our state. Kind of amusing given how much their fans hate the Duckies.
http://www.espn.com/college-football/game?gameId=400548267
He built his program in an uncompetitive era. Very few teams were pushing $ into their facilities, coaches and paying off players.
He is not the coach people want to remember him as. First he cheat, then he quit. Wildly unimpressed.
Fools gold.
UW, with the talent they have, should be demolishing the P12 and running away to a college playoff berth every year. The P12 is and has been down for a while, and while it has been great for the Cougs' success, that as well is fools gold.
UW played a middling Auburn team and got trounced, and every team that could compete with them in the trenches gave them fits or beat them.
You are correct about their lack or performance being inexcusable, though.
You hear uw fans talk about his era and they would have you believe the uw averaged 10 wins every year. He had a lot of 6, 7 and 8 win years, 10 in fact.
And a mysterious no call on an obvious PI when WSU was driving in the 4th quarter.
Cristobal can obviously recruit. But that offense was quite pedestrian considering all that talent. Early 90s Miami/FSU offense- run the ball and throw deep. Which leads to the question of whether there really is "all that talent."
The duck fans I talked to prior to last year's game were not happy with Mario's offensive scheme. They weren't looking forward to the game. By halftime, I'd imagine that most of them hit the road.
To be fair to the mutts, they didn't get "trounced" by Auburn. They lost 21-16 and never trailed by more than 9 points. I wouldn't consider our 21-16 loss to Michigan in the Rose Bowl a beatdown. Of course, the fact that Auburn ended up being kind of mediocre and finished 7-5 takes a little luster off the whole "keepin' it close" angle.
People focus on the best years and treat them like it was every year.
Same for the SEC. Just cause Alabama is always in the playoff doesnt mean Vandy, Arkansas, A&M, Tennessee etc are all that good too. Theyre not. There is defintely a middle and lower class in the SEC. How theyre all treated as being soooo good is a product of Fake News Espn pushing the brand.
The bummer for anybody who doesn't win in those "down years" is that only the losers remember or talk about it. Only Coug fans talk about the PI no-call vs Oregon in 2014 that would have made it 5 straight instead of 4; the rest of the world only knows the streak is 4.
I'm a Hawks fan and while everyone remembers SBXLIX as a "good game" with a crazy ending, nobody in 2019 is talking about the impact of losing Jeremy Lane to a broken arm and what that meant for Edelman repeatedly moving the chains in the slot.
And Hawks fans remember historically bad officiating in XL, but there are no asterisks next to the Steelers' or Patriots' Super Bowl rings.
This is a fallback from the original position I've read 1000x though.
First it was "it will decline when Sark recruits are gone," then it was "it will decline when Carroll or Kelly 2.0 arrive," then it was "it doesn't matter anyway." Seems like heads I win, tails you lose.
I do have facts on my side, like the W-L record. uw has declined with the departure of Sarkisian's recruits following the 2016 season. The sweet spot of Sarkisan's upper classmen and Petersen's development has passed. I know that's inconvenient for your narrative.
Washington Huskies (Pac-12 Conference) (2014–present)
2014 Washington 8–6 4–5 3rd (North) L Cactus
2015 Washington 7–6 4–5 4th (North) W Heart of Dallas
2016 Washington 12–2 8–1 1st (North) L Peach† 4 4
2017 Washington 10–3 7–2 T–1st (North) L Fiesta† 15 16
2018 Washington 10–4 7–2 T–1st (North) L Rose† 13 13
Washington: 47–21 30–15
It's definitely going to be interesting to see what happens now that the core of their offense has been gutted. History says that Boise State coaches don't have extended success once they leave the friendly smurf turf behind. Nutt, Koetter, Hawkins all had their chance to shine and couldn't get it done elsewhere. It looked like Petey was going to end that storyline but it would be fine in my book if he turned into the 7-8 win guy that Koetter ended up being at ASU.
If not for WSU finding new and different ways to suck against the mutts, they would have missed the Heart of Dallas in 2015 (their only bowl win under Peterson), and not made it to any of their NY6 games. You're welcome mutt fans........hoping that we quit giving you that gift starting this year.
We can look at statistical decline as well.
uw's offense, points per game and yards per game:
2014- 30.2; 388.6.
2015- 30.6; 403.1.
2016- 41.8; 456.9.
2017- 36.2; 405.5.
2018- 26.4; 414.6.
cristobal wants to run an alabama power offense, but his o line recruiting looks more like wulff than saban. .last time I looked they had 2 ol this year
"My" narrative? Why are you coming after me? I'm curious what kind of crazy "narrative" I'm assumed to have.. .
The claim - not necessarily from you but from a dozen others at least - was that recruiting was going to massively fall off once Sark's recruits had gone. That hasn't happened. At all.
HDTH just posted how they're #1, and my Tableau post a month or so back showed they and SC have been doing this for quite awhile.
Citing W/L record is a completely separate point. Nobody disagrees they chronically underperform under the circumstances - although maddeningly, they seem to use talent to perfect advantage every November.
Yes, your narrative. Go back and read this thread if you’re unclear.
Sorry to bring up facts, like W-L record. So silly of me.
That's a good point longtime I just looked at it myself.
Biggs is right they took just 3 this year.
Last year they took 4
before that 3
And before that 4
But in 2015 they took 6
Not surprisingly their two deep is loaded with RS Seniors from that 2015 class.
They are showing 17 lineman on their roster and a whopping 7 seniors on the OL this year. Which means that after this year they are losing quite a bit. More than they are replenishing.
So let's take a look at what they got.
They have 17 OL listed. And 3 incoming (we assume) so that puts them at 20.
They will lose AT LEAST 7 this year due to graduation.
So at that point they will have at most 13 lineman for the 2020 season. (which I am sure they will recruit more for but they will mostly be people without experience)
Looking at Oregon's two deep they'll pretty much be replacing the entire depth at RT and RG, the Center and Left Guard leaving only 1 guy Penei Sewell that has significant experience (who apparently missed some playing time with an injury as a True freshman)
This is a make or break year for Oregon. They do have a lot coming back, but it is out the door after this year, and the offensive line will have to totally rebuild in 2020.
This is exactly what the rating services fail to take into account when rating classes. There are positions that are more important than others. You need to make sure that your roster has enough depth at those positions.
"Sorry to bring up facts" - wow, did you just step out of a Swayze movie? So let's talk facts:
- Many here claimed recruiting would drop off once the sun set on the Sark era
- Per 247, this has not happened:
- Sark's average class ranking is 5.8. Petersen's is 4.8
- Petersen is getting better, not worse: average of his first 4 was #6; last 2 have been #2.5
- Sark's best class: #3. Petersen's: #2.
- Sark's average class ranking is 5.8. Petersen's is 4.8
- Now you want to talk wins?
- Sark's W/L: 0.539
- Petersen: 0.691
- They've played in the P12CG in 2 of his 5 completed seasons
- And they've won every AC in his tenure
I'm really scratching my head trying to figure out what kind of ammo you think you're working with here. The well is bone dry my friend.
You can’t keep your story straight. People, like me, repeatedly now in this thread, have pointed out that uw has been declining since Sarkisian’s recruits left.
The issue I have with the straight comparison between Sarkisian and Petersen is that the starting points for each was way different. Sarkisian took over a winless program with little talent and Petersen took over a nine win team that had gone to four straight bowls.
Willingham had destroyed recruiting inroads for the uw in both Washington and California. Sarkisian had to build the trust back up for the program. That was not a problem for Petersen.
Petersen has done well getting the highest rated players from the Greater Seattle-Tacoma area. Still, Sarkisian was doing the same thing the last few years of his time on montlake.
In the next few years, we will see just how good his coaching and recruiting classes are.
Petersen has out recruited Sark (look it up) and put a better product on the field. Sark couldn't get any more than 8 total wins and 5 in conference. Contrast that with 2 pac 12 championships and 3 NY6 bowls. Sark was good for UW at the time but not very good overall. I have no doubt that coug fans would love to have him back at UW though.
No we want Tyrone. He was truly legendary.
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