They are the bottom of the middle class in the league. There will be a bowl, a shot at 9 wins, not a bad season at all. But it’s still very middle class with potentially a 5-4 conference finish.
Offensive scheme: still don’t like it
- Thread starter ttowncoug
- Start date
They are the bottom of the middle class in the league. There will be a bowl, a shot at 9 wins, not a bad season at all. But it’s still very middle class with potentially a 5-4 conference finish.
I disagree slightly. 6 wins is, should be considered average.
7 wins is above average.
8 wins is semi good.
9 wins is good.
10 wins is semi great to great to semi awesome.
11 wins is semi awesome to awesome
12 wins is semi unbelievable to unbelievable
13 wins is semi miraculous to miraculous.
WSU is at the point where 6-6 bowl game is average, below average at extreme ultimate worst.
WSU should almost never be worse then 5-7 now.
For those who think 7,8 wins is or should be average for WSU, they have trouble remembering the last 100 years of WSU history and the last 35 years of more modern WSU history.
By their standards, Mike Price, and Leach would only be AVERAGE WSU coaches for only winning, averaging 7,8 wins, games, bowl seasons.
SHEESH.
They’re not a 4. Too many holes in the coverage, not enough consistent pressure on the QB.
They looks like a 4 lately because we’ve played bad teams 3 weeks in a row. They weren’t a 4 against any of the teams we lost to. Part of that is on the offense for not doing anything to help…but they gave up 600+ yards to oregon, Utah’s backup QB picked them apart, and oregon state did whatever they wanted.
You cannot be a 4 if you’re giving up piles of yardage and the backfield plays confused. You cannot be a 4 and give up 185 yards a game rushing.
Who has WSU beaten that is worth a shit? No one. They’re average. Bowl bound, which is what you want, but they aren’t “good.”
This is, by WSU and conference standards, a good season. First year (full year) coach. New system on offense. A lot to be proud about.
We will see on recruiting how that shakes out. That's where Dickert is going to have to earn his stripes. A lot of this core was recruited by Leach. Some by Rolo. NIL wasn't a "thing" back when they stepped on campus.
We will see on recruiting how that shakes out. That's where Dickert is going to have to earn his stripes. A lot of this core was recruited by Leach. Some by Rolo. NIL wasn't a "thing" back when they stepped on campus.
Eh…best defense in the conference based on PPG. They haven’t been perfect but they’ve been pretty damn good. To say they aren’t good is dumb. They shut down an AZ team that’s lit up a lot of scoreboards.
Mostly right.
It's a combination of all 3 of Leach, Rolo, and Dickert.
About 39 to 43% of starters, 2 deeps, roster, team was recruited, belongs to Dickert.
Next, this coming recruiting class is going to be CRITICAL, because:
2023-2024, this coming next season is going to be special, mostly upperclass, early grad, leave early to NFL.
2024-2025, might probably be ok, as there will be a little something left.
2025-2026 season will probably be a complete rebuild or reload year, UNLESS Dickert has a good recruiting year after the end of the season, because Rolo wasn't a good recruiter, and Dickert first recruiting class after the end of last season wasn't good(not his fault, Rolo and previous staff's fault).
If Dickert has a good, ok recruiting class after the end of this season, and manages transfers, NIL, Portal ok, and continues that, etc, then 2025-2026 won't be a rebuild, and would be a good reload at worst, and will probably be a 6,7,8 win + bowl game, at minimum season.
But if he Dickert doesn't recruit well, then likely 2025-2026 would likely be a 4,5,6 win season instead of a 6,7,8 win + bowl season
I like what you say. Now let me post my little quiz again, since it is related, and see if someone can get it. Hint-it is only for the Cougs in PAC 12 games. And the "xxx?" will be a forecast number after figuring out the sequence.
Here is some interesting analysis on the Cougs season so far. Who will be the first one to figure out the sequence, and what will be the next number?
+4 (adjusted to -3)
-14
-13
-8
-16
-7
-7
-10
xxx?
Well, I'm with you.....would love to see it happen again for the Cougs. You probably have a better shot at seeing it again than this old fella!
Glad Cougar
Good answer, but not what we are looking for. Last hints.......Adjustment was for Oregon game, and the sequence is for good Cougar results game by game.
WSU wins by -10(28-18(10 point difference)
Then wins 31-20(-11 win difference)
Oops misremembered wrong. Thought I remembered WSU beating Arizona 31-13 instead of 31-20.
So next in sequence is -11?
Yeah, your right, because if it was -11(WSU beating Arizona by 11), then not only would the previous is, be -10(for beating ASU 28-18), but -7 would be -38(for beating Stanford by 38, in beating them 52-14)
So because of that, my -11 is probably wrong.
Oh well, at least I took a stab at trying to figure it out.
I'm stumped.
Guess I am not as smart figuring these things out as others here.
Oh well.
Curious what the answer is.
Ooops, I have to apologize for a little slip up. For some reason I remembered beating AZ 30-20, instead of 31-20, so the last number i had in the sequence should have been -11. But you and ttown were getting really close. The numbers in the sequence were for only PAC 12 games, and they showed how much the Cougar defense held each team below their average points per game. So the adjustment in the first one was to account for the Pick 6 that Oregon had because that was not attributable to the defense. Picky, I know, but I did it anyway.
I think it is pretty impressive that we have held every conference team to less than their average PPG. Especially since our offense has struggled through some droughts moving the ball.
The unknown number at the end will be for the Apple Cup, and we DEFINITELY will need that number to be negative since the mutts are putting up 40 points per game. A negative 10-14 would be great.
I would never blame the QB or any player unless they were not showing maximum effort. I don't think that is the case with Ward.
It is almost always on the coaching. They get the big bucks to make their players perform. They recruited them and they coach them. If they don't execute, then they need to sit on the bench.
By the way, whatever happened to the shovel pass?
Is Morris doing something different on offense with Ward than he did while at IWU? Has he changed the way he has been coaching Ward in the past? I really don't know but suspect many of the plays that worked so well at the FCS level just aren't as effective with the quality of athletes at the FBS/P5 level.
Glad Cougar
Glad Cougar
Just because you move up a level doesn’t mean what worked in the past will work in the future. The speed, the coaching, the DNA, the talent, the pace of the decision making all are better than FCS football.
They both have to get better.
Well Leach didn't think there was a difference.
Talked to a client who at one point held OC position at two Pac 12 schools. Said just the opposite. Lower level coaches evaluate talent better cause they have to. Also, their staffs are smaller and have a wider arrange of responsibilities, so they have to be equally organized if not more so.
Look at the Chargers coach. He coaches in the NFL and I can't tell you how many games he has cost his team by going for 4th and 2 instead of kicking the fg.
There was a movie called Tin Cup, and Cheech is a golf instructor who says to Kevin Costner his "client", sometimes par is good enough to win. Sometimes taking the points is good enough to win.
Leach may not have seen much of a difference. His experience does not represent the entirety of football and coaches.
Lower level coaches do have to evaluate talent better. But not for the reason your friend believes. Lower levels will rarely see the overwhelming DNA a P5 school sees.
Leach's offense is centered around attacking space. I think scheme wise it can translate to any level of football.
The Morris offense is predicated on dink and dunk. The WR screens are only effective if you can get yards after catch. When you are going against good DBs - that can run and cover space - the odds (my opinion) of this scheme being effective decrease. At the FCS level, where they might not have the speed that the Pac-12 has, maybe you have an edge.
We do zero in the true slot, where a WR would be potentially matched up against an LB over the middle. Those mismatches is what Leach's offense made a living off of.
Again, I don't like the scheme. Can it evolve? Yes. Will Dickert and Morris allow it to evolve, or does Dickert like the run/pass screen ball control style of play?
The Morris offense is predicated on dink and dunk. The WR screens are only effective if you can get yards after catch. When you are going against good DBs - that can run and cover space - the odds (my opinion) of this scheme being effective decrease. At the FCS level, where they might not have the speed that the Pac-12 has, maybe you have an edge.
We do zero in the true slot, where a WR would be potentially matched up against an LB over the middle. Those mismatches is what Leach's offense made a living off of.
Again, I don't like the scheme. Can it evolve? Yes. Will Dickert and Morris allow it to evolve, or does Dickert like the run/pass screen ball control style of play?
The WR screen can work 1-2 times per game if you’re a threat to throw deep. If the DBs can live their life within 5 yards of the LOS - or if your QB can’t make the lateral throw consistently - it won’t work. We fail on both counts.
Even if Dickert likes the ball control offense, I hope he realizes that if you spend an entire half going 3 & out, you’re not playing ball control.
I have already explained what the DICKERT COUG RAID is and what DICKERT wants to do or thinks the COUG RAID is, etc.
There is a DIFFERENCE between WHAT MORRIS thinks the COUG RAID is, should be, and what DICKERT thinks it is or should be.
And altho Dickert, Morris sees eye to eye on some things Coug RAID wise, DICKERT AND MORRIS DO NOT SEE EYE TO EYE ON THE COUG RAID on other, some things.
Example Dickert has told Morris to "RUN THE DAMN BALL", etc, and has said "THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU RUN THE DAMN BALL, HAVE BALANCE, MIX THINGS UP, ETC"
WSU's PAST offensive woes are, have been on MORRIS, NOT DICKERT.
DICKERT WANTS A MORE SONNY DYKE LIKE OFFENSE. THATS WHAT DICKERT THINKS THE COUG RAID IS.
MORRIS IS NOT RUNNING A, THE SONNY DYKE OFFENSE.
THE ONLY THING THATS ON DICKERT, IS THAT DICKERT HIRED MORRIS.
DICKERT THOUGHT THAT MORRIS WOULD GIVE HIM, RUN THE SONNY DYKES COUG RAID TYPE OFFENSE.
DICKERT WAS WRONG ABOUT THAT.
IF MORRIS EITHER DOESNT RUN THE COUG RAID SONNY DYKES OFFENSE LIKE HOW DICKERT WANTS, AN OR IF MORRIS IS NOT EFFECTIVE NEXT SEASON, DICKERT WILL FIRE MORRIS AND HIRE SOMEBODY WHO WILL RUN THE COUG RAID, SONNY DYKES OFFENSE EFFECTIVELY.
There is a DIFFERENCE between WHAT MORRIS thinks the COUG RAID is, should be, and what DICKERT thinks it is or should be.
And altho Dickert, Morris sees eye to eye on some things Coug RAID wise, DICKERT AND MORRIS DO NOT SEE EYE TO EYE ON THE COUG RAID on other, some things.
Example Dickert has told Morris to "RUN THE DAMN BALL", etc, and has said "THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU RUN THE DAMN BALL, HAVE BALANCE, MIX THINGS UP, ETC"
WSU's PAST offensive woes are, have been on MORRIS, NOT DICKERT.
DICKERT WANTS A MORE SONNY DYKE LIKE OFFENSE. THATS WHAT DICKERT THINKS THE COUG RAID IS.
MORRIS IS NOT RUNNING A, THE SONNY DYKE OFFENSE.
THE ONLY THING THATS ON DICKERT, IS THAT DICKERT HIRED MORRIS.
DICKERT THOUGHT THAT MORRIS WOULD GIVE HIM, RUN THE SONNY DYKES COUG RAID TYPE OFFENSE.
DICKERT WAS WRONG ABOUT THAT.
IF MORRIS EITHER DOESNT RUN THE COUG RAID SONNY DYKES OFFENSE LIKE HOW DICKERT WANTS, AN OR IF MORRIS IS NOT EFFECTIVE NEXT SEASON, DICKERT WILL FIRE MORRIS AND HIRE SOMEBODY WHO WILL RUN THE COUG RAID, SONNY DYKES OFFENSE EFFECTIVELY.
BECAUSE MORRIS IS RUNNING IT, AND NOT EITHER DICKERT OR A OC WHO WILL RUN A SONNY DYKES LIKE COUG RAID.
Sorry, meant gotta get better Oline to be able to do what they want to run and have been successful with. NIL $ wouldn’t hurt either. Ha
