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Loyal Coug1

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Ha ha, not yet, but a pretty good article on Brand X. I don't actually hate them, they are just too far away (read McCoy's comment in the bullets). For the non-FB sports. My son does live in Austin, so there is that.


Also, I had missed this article about Anne McCoy in Palm Springs at that event. A few kindly-meant comments from the Polite, Benevolent yet Mighty Loyal One. :)
This is dated Feb 25:
  • As our fearless commissioner Teresa Gould pointed out, the Big 12 and the Big Ten didn't change their names (as their numbers changed), so why should we? So, Pac-12 forever." Oh. Well girls, you know the Pac has changed its name twice to reflect current membership numbers. I still have a Pac-10 shirt
  • Paraphrasing here - our media deal for 2026 may be done as soon as 6 weeks, then "the conference will focus" on the required 8th member. OK, 6+ weeks puts us in April. Then we secure our new member? That's pushing it. "...conference expansion decisions would need to come together quickly, perhaps wrapped in a June-ish timeframe..." Although I guess the July 1, 2025 "deadline" to add isn't a show stopper, but invokes additional major penalties for most teams. Note that the Traitorous 8 gave less than a year. But there were no penalties for them because of our Bylaws.
  • Asked about the grumbling out of Washington, Oregon, Cal and Stanford about shipping all their sports teams to the East Coast for so many games, McCoy opined that the burden is untenable for the non-football sports. OK now this is interesting. So if it is untenable, why would the Pac even consider Texas State or Tulane, Memphis, etc? Granted these schools aren't quite as far as ACC schools. Farther than most B1G schools though.
All that said, a pretty informative article.

 
There is a lot of speculation out there about TSU and St Mary’s getting invites in the near future and a media rights deal coming out soon
 
Texas St is not good enough to go so far away.

Only Memphis, Tulane, USF, UTSA, UNLV are worth going so far away, as those choices are THE BEST OF WHATS LEFT, WOULD WEAKEN AAC, WOULD PRACTICALLY GUARANTEE PAC 12 GETS CFP OVER MWC, AAC, A BARELY BETTER MEDIA DEAL, ETC.

Texas St wouldnt be good enough, bring those things.

The PAC 12 either probably already has a deal already worked out for a 8th football member to join PAC 12, or they are extremely close, and only have to dot the I's, and cross the T's, etc.

The PAC 12 is not going to not talk, not negotiate, etc, with a 8th football addition to the PAC 12, not do anything, and then do media deal in April, and then add 8th football addition last second in April, May, June, July, etc.

The PAC 12 wouldn't do that.

As soon as the PAC 12 media deal is announced in late March, early April, a announcement about the 8th football addition to PAC 12, about who joining PAC 12 as 8th football addition to PAC 12, will be announced hours, a 1,2,3 days, 1 week later, after the media deal announcement.

The Locked On College Football Network You Tube Show, Big Mountain You Tube Show, The Couch You Tube Show, Russ Dillinger, from Yahoo Sports, Canzano, Wilner, Dodd, etc, are all saying the same thing.

And they are reporting that Texas St, is locked in, likely the 8th Pac 12 football addition.

So your "oh no Pac 12 is going to be cutting it close, because the media deal won't be announced until April, and that only leaves a few weeks, months before the July deadline, to find a 8th football member" BS FEAR MONGERING, is BS.

You are right that Texas St is not good enough to be worth going that far away.

Either the PAC 12 should either add either Memphis, Tulane, USF, UTSA, if they are going to go as far or further away as a Texas St, OR should add UNLV, or Airforce, or Sacramento St, because they closer.

Texas St, shouldn't be a option, unless they are the only option that will join PAC 12.
 
There is a lot of speculation out there about TSU and St Mary’s getting invites in the near future and a media rights deal coming out soon

St Mary's is LOCKED into Pac 12, and will be announced immediately after PAC 12 media deal announced.

That's according to the Big Mountain You Tube show saying that Russ Dillinger of Yahoo Sports telling them that.

Locked On College Football Network You Tube Show also reported the same, and that Russ Dillinger has not only told them that, but also Canzano, Wilner, etc.

So St Mary's is probably going to join PAC 12, and that they just have to dot the I's, and cross the T's.
 
On Texas State, we kind of boxed ourselves into this if true. Lower buy-out, gives us access to the Texas TV market. I suppose they become Colorado State's travel partner.

UNLV was the school to grab - the Pac-12 didn't move on that.

I like Tulane and Memphis way better. Better cities to travel to, better TV markets.
 
On Texas State, we kind of boxed ourselves into this if true. Lower buy-out, gives us access to the Texas TV market. I suppose they become Colorado State's travel partner.

UNLV was the school to grab - the Pac-12 didn't move on that.

I like Tulane and Memphis way better. Better cities to travel to, better TV markets.
I'd be curious on how much the TX market moves the needle on the media deal. I don't think Memphis and/ or New Orleans move it much at all.

Not sure if putting ourselves in the same crappy travel schedule as the traitors will pencil out to a net positive when all is said and done.
 
But they were reportedly in different parts of the house, and both appeared to have fallen suddenly, with no signs of trauma. Seems like a CO leak would fit, and would be pretty easily confirmed by the ME. Strangest part is that apparently the front door was partially open.

Authorities have called it unusual and are still investigating.

On Texas State, we kind of boxed ourselves into this if true. Lower buy-out, gives us access to the Texas TV market. I suppose they become Colorado State's travel partner.

UNLV was the school to grab - the Pac-12 didn't move on that.

I like Tulane and Memphis way better. Better cities to travel to, better TV markets.
Agree, ttown. I can live with Texas State. Would have preferred LV. If we get a decent deal, I also like to pursue Memphis and Tulane.
 
I would suppose part of this is to get to the min to play football, eight.

I think you could then go into phase 2, with more time, and poach the best of the American Conference. Rumor is the TV deal will clauses to add schools, so if true, you can continue to build and grow along the way.
 
Need to get a favorable settlement with the Mtn West and grab UNLV then add St Mary’s for BB. I’d be open to two more basketball only schools on the west coast but no one overly strong left out there. Maybe USF and or Santa Clara? Nevada Reno wouldn’t be horrible along with USF or Santa Clara. Good hoops in a semi decent sized market.
 
Need to get a favorable settlement with the Mtn West and grab UNLV then add St Mary’s for BB. I’d be open to two more basketball only schools on the west coast but no one overly strong left out there. Maybe USF and or Santa Clara? Nevada Reno wouldn’t be horrible along with USF or Santa Clara. Good hoops in a semi decent sized market.

St Mary's is a pretty much a done deal, locked into PAC 12, only need to dot I's, cross T's, announce after media deal announcement, according to Big Mountain You Tube show, Russ Dillinger of Yahoo Sports, Canzano, Wilner, etc, etc.

As far as USF, Santa Clara, other bball programs, nothing has been said about adding any of them to PAC 12.

They are probably not going to be added to PAC 12, as the Big Mountain, Dillinger, Canzano, etc, have said that the PAC 12 was only willing to add 1 more Bball only program from the west, and that that was, is St Mary's and nobody else but St Mary's, and that the plan is to announce the media deal, then announce St Mary's, and then announce the 8th PAC 12 football program(Probably, extremely likely Texas St), and then they temporarily done until add a 9th football member to PAC 12, and then they semi permanently, semi temporarily done.

The PAC 12 is not planning to add USF, Santa Clara, anybody other then St Mary's basketball wise.

The Major reason for that, is that St Mary's barely brings enough value to be worth having them join PAC 12, and USF, Santa Clara other western bball programs DO NOT bring enough value to be worth adding them to PAC 12.
 
Just out moments ago: UNLV's president just stepped down. Supposedly to take care of his family, and if true then the president's priorities are in the right place. (3 years ago I moved down from the Seattle area to the Portland area for the same reason.)

I don't know if this is conference realignment related or not. Personally, I think UNLV flat out blew it by not joining the PAC-12 when the chance was there. Look at Utah State. Learn from Utah State.

Here's a link:

UNLV's president says "Bye".

I'm off to check some other message boards.
 
Ha ha, not yet, but a pretty good article on Brand X. I don't actually hate them, they are just too far away (read McCoy's comment in the bullets). For the non-FB sports. My son does live in Austin, so there is that.


Also, I had missed this article about Anne McCoy in Palm Springs at that event. A few kindly-meant comments from the Polite, Benevolent yet Mighty Loyal One. :)
This is dated Feb 25:
  • As our fearless commissioner Teresa Gould pointed out, the Big 12 and the Big Ten didn't change their names (as their numbers changed), so why should we? So, Pac-12 forever." Oh. Well girls, you know the Pac has changed its name twice to reflect current membership numbers. I still have a Pac-10 shirt
  • Paraphrasing here - our media deal for 2026 may be done as soon as 6 weeks, then "the conference will focus" on the required 8th member. OK, 6+ weeks puts us in April. Then we secure our new member? That's pushing it. "...conference expansion decisions would need to come together quickly, perhaps wrapped in a June-ish timeframe..." Although I guess the July 1, 2025 "deadline" to add isn't a show stopper, but invokes additional major penalties for most teams. Note that the Traitorous 8 gave less than a year. But there were no penalties for them because of our Bylaws.
  • Asked about the grumbling out of Washington, Oregon, Cal and Stanford about shipping all their sports teams to the East Coast for so many games, McCoy opined that the burden is untenable for the non-football sports. OK now this is interesting. So if it is untenable, why would the Pac even consider Texas State or Tulane, Memphis, etc? Granted these schools aren't quite as far as ACC schools. Farther than most B1G schools though.
All that said, a pretty informative article.

What a sad situation.
 
As someone who periodically checks message boards of the incoming PAC-12 schools (Boise St et al), there are some posters out there who do not want to see UNLV join the conference.

I'd bet on Texas State, too.
 
What are the reasons given for not wanting UNLV?
While it seems like UNLV could be a decent conference member, I do like the idea of continuing to host several conference championships there without having the school located there having a big home field/court advantage.

That said, if UNLV is the school that is determined to bring the new conference the best value, then just throw the whole home field/court advantage issue right out the window.
 
While it seems like UNLV could be a decent conference member, I do like the idea of continuing to host several conference championships there without having the school located there having a big home field/court advantage.

That said, if UNLV is the school that is determined to bring the new conference the best value, then just throw the whole home field/court advantage issue right out the window.

For me, it's hard to picture UNLV having much TV value because they have so little influence in the Las Vegas market. I do believe that they are a sleeping giant because of their location, but then again, Temple is in Philadelphia and that hasn't meant much for them. Outside of last season, my fantasy football team has the same number of 10 win seasons as UNLV has had in the last 50 years....i.e. zero. Odom was a good hire but he's already gone.

I'm sure that there are other reasons, but the Pac-12 took in Utah State...who has a pathetic athletic budget and is the #3 team in their own TV market. That suggests the UNLV still deserves consideration. I will say that given that I own a house in Vegas and I have family there, it would be nice to have another excuse to go there.
 
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For me, it's hard to picture UNLV having much TV value because they have so little influence in the Las Vegas market. I do believe that they are a sleeping giant because of their location, but then again, Temple is in Philadelphia and that hasn't meant much for them. Outside of last season, my fantasy football team has the same number of 10 win seasons as UNLV has had in the last 50 years....i.e. zero. Odom was a good hire but he's already gone.

I'm sure that there are other reasons, but the Pac-12 took in Utah State...who has a pathetic athletic budget and is the #3 team in their own TV market. That suggests the UNLV still deserves consideration. I will say that given that I own a house in Vegas and I have family there, it would be nice to have another excuse to go there.
UNLV averaged around 23,000 in attendance for football in 2023. They bumped up to 32,000 in 2024...including breaking 40K twice. They were 9-5 in 2023, 11-3 in 2024.

This is in a town with 660K population. So, they've got a pretty low level of local interest even when they're a decent team,. Even with a 40+% bump in bandwagon fans when they're pretty good, they are barely a blip in the local market. In TV viewership, they actually had more viewers in 2023 than they did in 2024 - by about 48K per game, which is nearly 20%. Difference might be that they played Michigan in 2023. Regardless, they are ranked in the 80s in viewership both years, at an average of 260-270K per week over the 2 seasons. Not really that much.

So, yeah....there's potential there in that there's a growing metro area. But it's an area that has demonstrated indifference, and there are plenty of other things to do. Short of sustained and/or increasing success, I don't see a lot of potential for UNLV to turn into a real media value. But, to be fair, I'm not sure I see anyone else out there that brings more value or more potential.
 
For me, it's hard to picture UNLV having much TV value because they have so little influence in the Las Vegas market. I do believe that they are a sleeping giant because of their location, but then again, Temple is in Philadelphia and that hasn't meant much for them. Outside of last season, my fantasy football team has the same number of 10 win seasons as UNLV has had in the last 50 years....i.e. zero. Odom was a good hire but he's already gone.

I'm sure that there are other reasons, but the Pac-12 took in Utah State...who has a pathetic athletic budget and is the #3 team in their own TV market. That suggests the UNLV still deserves consideration. I will say that given that I own a house in Vegas and I have family there, it would be nice to have another excuse to go there.
And you could move there and still post here without having to change your handle! That's all I have to say about that 😃
 
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What are the reasons given for not wanting UNLV?
Good question. Basically, football hasn't been very successful outside the past two seasons. Also, the UNLV athletic department apparently has some serious debt. I visit websites for Boise St., Utah St, and San Diego St. frequently and there are a lot of fans on some (or all) of those sites who have expressed concerns.

UNLV Football Wiki - scroll to "Head Coaches" and note the win/loss record from 1982 to 2022.
 
UNLV averaged around 23,000 in attendance for football in 2023. They bumped up to 32,000 in 2024...including breaking 40K twice. They were 9-5 in 2023, 11-3 in 2024.

This is in a town with 660K population. So, they've got a pretty low level of local interest even when they're a decent team,. Even with a 40+% bump in bandwagon fans when they're pretty good, they are barely a blip in the local market. In TV viewership, they actually had more viewers in 2023 than they did in 2024 - by about 48K per game, which is nearly 20%. Difference might be that they played Michigan in 2023. Regardless, they are ranked in the 80s in viewership both years, at an average of 260-270K per week over the 2 seasons. Not really that much.

So, yeah....there's potential there in that there's a growing metro area. But it's an area that has demonstrated indifference, and there are plenty of other things to do. Short of sustained and/or increasing success, I don't see a lot of potential for UNLV to turn into a real media value. But, to be fair, I'm not sure I see anyone else out there that brings more value or more potential.
The reality is, 90% of people in the United States don't care, or don't watch college football. The vast majority, just don't care. Granted, if you're team is ranked in the top 5, yes there are bandwagon fans, but the majority are doing something else.
 
On the negative side, UNLV lacks a winning tradition in football and many of their students are either night school or part time, which does not generally lead to being highly involved in campus activities. I also seem to recall that they don't have a large dorm/on campus living presence, though that may be old news. Their budget problems, though not unique in the college landscape, are not trivial. And Nevada is as politically bifurcated as any state in the country; even more than WA. That has led to some funding challenges for UNLV from the state.

On the positive side, and unlike the last big wave of moves to LV 20-ish years ago (which featured many, many retirees), the current wave of people moving there lean heavily to younger working families from California (particularly SoCal) who want an affordable house. My strictly anecdotal observation is that that 25-40% move back to California within 2-3 years...that summer climate is tough to take...but LV is still in a net gain mode of families with children. That is likely to lead to more local identification with the school over the next generation. Not much help tomorrow, but a solid long term outlook. And that is in a growing metro area. The only thing that could impede LV population growth over the next 20 years is water availability....but that is a real possibility. They will inevitably face water rationing in some form during that time.
 
On the negative side, UNLV lacks a winning tradition in football and many of their students are either night school or part time, which does not generally lead to being highly involved in campus activities. I also seem to recall that they don't have a large dorm/on campus living presence, though that may be old news. Their budget problems, though not unique in the college landscape, are not trivial. And Nevada is as politically bifurcated as any state in the country; even more than WA. That has led to some funding challenges for UNLV from the state.

On the positive side, and unlike the last big wave of moves to LV 20-ish years ago (which featured many, many retirees), the current wave of people moving there lean heavily to younger working families from California (particularly SoCal) who want an affordable house. My strictly anecdotal observation is that that 25-40% move back to California within 2-3 years...that summer climate is tough to take...but LV is still in a net gain mode of families with children. That is likely to lead to more local identification with the school over the next generation. Not much help tomorrow, but a solid long term outlook. And that is in a growing metro area. The only thing that could impede LV population growth over the next 20 years is water availability....but that is a real possibility. They will inevitably face water rationing in some form during that time.
Counterpoint. Boise State used to be a tuneup game for Wazzu and got their teeth kicked in pretty regularly by Idaho. An upgrade in scenery with the right elements around it can lead to a pretty drastic change in performance given the right circumstances. UNLV can be that sleeping giant IMO. I could see Vegas elites getting behind the program like people did in Miami back in the 80s, and a celebrity coach bringing attention to the program like Deion did with Colorado.
 
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Counterpoint. Boise State used to be a tuneup game for Wazzu and got their teeth kicked in pretty regularly by Idaho. An upgrade in scenery with the right elements around it can lead to a pretty drastic change in performance given the right circumstances. UNLV can be that sleeping giant IMO. I could see Vegas elites getting behind the program like people did in Miami back in the 80s, and a celebrity coach bringing attention to the program like Deion did with Colorado.

All BS aside, it all comes down to finding the right coach for any school and having an AD who is willing to do what it takes to win. Where it gets tougher is keeping them once you've got them. The problem for all but about the most elite programs, if your coach has success, you're almost guaranteed to see them leave. For a school like UNLV, they need consistent success through a couple coaching hires to get somewhere. Boise State didn't get a positive rep nationally until they were on their 3rd straight successful coach.

UNLV couldn't keep Odom. They are hoping that Mullen, who ended up being a bit erratic at the Power 5 level, can be successful at UNLV....just like Odom. Odom got canned by Missouri for mediocrity. If Mullen can maintain the success, maybe fans will start buying in and they can get momentum. Odds aren't in their favor though.
 
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I got this article for free, hopefully you can, too. It's at the Spokesman-Review & dated March 8th. Jon Wilner argues for Texas State over UNLV for the PAC-12 expansion.

Pac-12 expansion options: Texas State, not UNLV, should be the top target because membership is about the future, not the present

I'll make it easier on everyone...


Why Texas State, not UNLV, should be top target for Pac-12 expansion​


Summarize I'll make it easier on everyone...

Jon Wilner
March 10, 2025 at 6:00 am Updated March 10, 2025 at 6:00 am
The rebuilt Pac-12 is fast approaching the sweet spot for a media rights agreement. Perhaps by the end of the month, but likely by the close of April, according to sources, the conference should secure a deal for the next era.

At that point, the focus will shift back to where it began in September — back to the membership issue and finding the eighth all-sports member.

Why not the other way around? Why not expand first, then find a media deal? Because nowhere in the full sweep of possibilities is there a school, or collection of schools, that will materially alter the rebuilt conference’s media value for 2026 and beyond.

At least, that’s the case for this contract, according to multiple industry sources.

But what about the next deal?

This is a multi-dimensional calculation, folks. The Pac-12 is seeking security for the present, but it needs chips for the future.

UNLV makes sense because of geography — because it’s right there — but the Rebels are not the best bet for longer-haul growth.

UNLV is the move for 2025.

Texas State is the play for 2030.

Granted, we have no idea how the landscape will look in five or six years, when the Pac-12 begins to negotiate its next media deal.

There might not be a Pac-12.

There might not be a Power Four.

Or perhaps several of the departed schools will return to a regional conference on the West Coast.

The list of possibilities is both endless and, at some level, unknowable.

But combine the ACC’s settlement with Florida State and Clemson, the economic pressures created by revenue sharing and the expiration of several critical media contracts, including the Big Ten (2030) and the College Football Playoff (2032), and there’s a good chance college sports will look completely different in six or eight years.

The Pac-12 should act accordingly. Strategic decisions in the spring of 2025 must be made with the fall of 2030 in mind, with building the strongest, most valuable football product possible.

From that standpoint, Texas State is the easy call as the eighth full-time member.

Adding the Las Vegas metropolitan area could provide a modest increase in value over time. (By value, we mean on the broadest scale possible, not just media dollars.) It’s already well within the rebuilt Pac-12’s footprint, which stretches from San Diego to Pullman to Fort Collins.

Just because UNLV is the best remaining option in the West doesn’t mean the Rebels are the best option for the Pac-12.

The American Athletic Conference schools are enticing targets, as well, whether the focus is just Memphis or the combination of Memphis, South Florida and Tulane. But unless the Pac-12’s media deal is worth substantially more than most industry experts forecast ù the expected range is $8 million to $10 million per school per year, according to sources — there will be little financial incentive for the AAC schools to make the leap.

Texas State’s economics are vastly more manageable. It would cost far less to lure the Bobcats, who compete in the Sun Belt and aspire to a higher tier. In fact, the Pac-12 could offer membership at a reduced revenue share, thus creating more cash for the seven football schools (and Gonzaga) that are committed for 2026.

Notable competitive fact: Texas State has posted as many winning seasons (three) since moving to the FBS level in 2012 as the Rebels have produced since 2000.

Unlike UNLV, the Bobcats would greatly expand the Pac-12’s media footprint, adding a campus in the Central Time Zone to create more broadcast windows.

And not just anywhere in the Central Time Zone — in Texas.

Booming Texas.

Talent-laden Texas.

Oil-rich Texas.

Football-crazed Texas.

Specifically, the Bobcats are located in San Marcos, halfway between Austin and San Antonio on the I-35 corridor that’s home to 4.5 million people.

If the essence of your strategy is acquiring chips for 2030 — and if that’s not the case with the Pac-12, something is very wrong — then having a campus in Texas beats having a campus in Nevada. And it’s not close.

(UNLV recently touted its student enrollment growth, which increased an impressive 2% year-over-year, based on spring data. Texas State’s enrollment in the same span grew by 5.9%.)

The Hotline made essentially the same point about another Texas school two years ago, when the legacy version of the Pac-12 was seeking new members and a media deal.

In an examination of SMU’s potential, we wrote:

“The conference must consider SMU’s value when the next media rights cycle comes to an end (in the late 2020s or early 2030s), and it starts the negotiating process all over again.”


Admittedly, SMU and Texas State are more different from they are alike. But they are closer to each other in long-haul potential than either is to the options available to the Pac-12 this spring.

Yes, the travel would be suboptimal — not for the football programs, which charter flights, but for the Olympic sports, which typically fly commercial.

Pac-12 teams competing in San Marcos would fly into Austin, 35 miles away. If the conference creates travel partners, the closest campus would be Colorado State. From Fort Collins, the trip entails a one-hour bus ride to Denver International, a two-hour flight to Austin and a 30-minute drive to San Marcos.

(In the Big Ten, that’s amateur hour.)

The conference could pursue a second Texas school to pair with the Bobcats and reduce travel demands. UTSA and North Texas come immediately to mind, particularly given the AAC’s media rights deal allocates smaller shares to its newer members than to the likes of Memphis and Tulane.

All that said, let’s be clear: The Rebels would not be a bad addition to the rebuilt Pac-12, although there are significant complications at this point with the school’s contractual commitment to the Mountain West and a series of lawsuits playing out.

UNLV has potential; Las Vegas has value; and focusing on a regional membership strategy has merit.

But the Rebels should not be the Pac-12’s top target.

Texas State is the easy call.

Follow the (oil) money, acquire the chip and start preparing for 2030.

Jon Wilner
 
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