"This game destroys peoples brains"

[How_did_this_happen?]

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...-this-game-destroys-peoples-brains/842904001/

No fan of Bob Costas (but that is neither here nor there)...but I think we have a big problem with the future of football as we know it.

Can technology save it? Maybe. More rules changes coming? Not sure what that would look like. Flag football anyone?

Anyway...love the game. It's the best game on the planet as far as I'm concerned.

(forgot the possessive on "peoples'" in title...oops)

 

[Cougatron]

I don't see people saying something about UFC where people actually punch and elbow each other in the head.

I say we get rid of the helmet and go full rugby style.

 

[ATACFD]

I don't see people saying something about UFC where people actually punch and elbow each other in the head.

I say we get rid of the helmet and go full rugby style.

Ironically, if we got rid of the helmet, there would actually be FEWER brain injuries.

 

[How_did_this_happen?]

Ironically, if we got rid of the helmet, there would actually be FEWER brain injuries.

Yes...likely.

 

[longtimecoug]

I don't see people saying something about UFC where people actually punch and elbow each other in the head.

I say we get rid of the helmet and go full rugby style.

John Madden had it right years ago, he said if we want players to stop using their heads take off the facemasks

 

[brettcraycraft51]

the technology strikes me as mosty bullshit "advances" that companies can market to sell helmets.

peter berg has talked a lot about a group called "heads-up tackling" or something that has a certification program for coaches that many youth leagues are starting to use. honestly, that's probably the only real way to limit the amount of head injuries is to coach a better way of tackling.

 

[79COUG]

Players are bigger, stronger, faster than ever before. Brains are not.

 

[Coug90]

I don't see people saying something about UFC where people actually punch and elbow each other in the head.

I say we get rid of the helmet and go full rugby style.

I played football AND soccer for years. Never got a concussion playing football and had several playing soccer, along with thousands of headers that accumulated in who knows how much damage to my brain long term.

There are risks with damn near every sport (hockey anyone??). The fact that football is getting singled out and taking all of the concussion bad rap is stupid.

People can live their lives in a bubble, or we can enjoy things that are fun and make us happy and may carry some risk. Football is not going anywhere.

 

[Coug90]

Yes...likely.

No way. There would be less full speed intentionally violent collisions, but you'd also have people getting knocked out left and right accidentally hitting their heads. It would still be a game played at high speed with exceptional athletes. Losing the helmets would not be a good idea.

 

[kayak15]

I played football AND soccer for years. Never got a concussion playing football and had several playing soccer, along with thousands of headers that accumulated in who knows how much damage to my brain long term.

There are risks with damn near every sport (hockey anyone??). The fact that football is getting singled out and taking all of the concussion bad rap is stupid.

People can live their lives in a bubble, or we can enjoy things that are fun and make us happy and may carry some risk. Football is not going anywhere.

Not surprised by your soccer comment. Statistically one is more likely to suffer a concussion in soccer with no helmets than in American football. Yet football is excoriated because of the concussion problem while soccer is steadily growing in the U.S.

 

[BiggsCoug]

Pretty simple. If you don't want to play, don't.

Personally, I don't see the value in contact sports before high school. I don't think there is anything taken from contact sports at a young age that can't be taught in high school. Especially when you mix in the crapshoot that is youth coaching.

To make it to the BCS level or beyond has more to do with DNA then practice or reps. There is nothing that happens at age 10 on the football field that cannot be coached up to snuff at age 16.

 

[95coug]

I played football AND soccer for years. Never got a concussion playing football and had several playing soccer, along with thousands of headers that accumulated in who knows how much damage to my brain long term.

There are risks with damn near every sport (hockey anyone??). The fact that football is getting singled out and taking all of the concussion bad rap is stupid.

People can live their lives in a bubble, or we can enjoy things that are fun and make us happy and may carry some risk. Football is not going anywhere.

I was a lineman (both ways), but my concussions and worst injuries were in basketball. Worst ones I saw were in baseball. If you gave me the choice of taking a fastball to the face, a batted ball to the jewels, or a hard hit by a linebacker...I'll take the linebacker.

 

[Coug90]

Pretty simple. If you don't want to play, don't.

Personally, I don't see the value in contact sports before high school. I don't think there is anything taken from contact sports at a young age that can't be taught in high school. Especially when you mix in the crapshoot that is youth coaching.

To make it to the BCS level or beyond has more to do with DNA then practice or reps. There is nothing that happens at age 10 on the football field that cannot be coached up to snuff at age 16.

Great point. I started FB in 8th grade when you first could in school. Just about every kid I played with through High School who played pee wee ball couldn't tackle worth a damn because they had developed shitty habits as youngsters - because little kids don't want to hit other kids and are going to lunge, put their heads down, close their eyes, etc, and that carries over when they get older. Of course there are a few exceptions, but this was widely the case with the kids I played with.

 

[cr8zyncalif]

The difference between football and soccer head concerns is that you don't have 30+ former Premier League guys who have died miserable brain-related deaths, then had their brains cut open for analysis. One of my sons played soccer at a large SoCal HS, and I saw him take some pretty devastating headers...so I can believe that enough of that could produce brain trauma. But it is proven with football, and the only open questions are not "what", but "how much" and "how fast"...similar in a way to global warming's effects. The helmet thing is probably nibbling around the edges...worth doing, but probably not a long term solution. As for what that means for the future of football, I think it is obvious that there will be changes. What they will be, exactly, I can only speculate.

 

[95coug]

The difference between football and soccer head concerns is that you don't have 30+ former Premier League guys who have died miserable brain-related deaths, then had their brains cut open for analysis. One of my sons played soccer at a large SoCal HS, and I saw him take some pretty devastating headers...so I can believe that enough of that could produce brain trauma. But it is proven with football, and the only open questions are not "what", but "how much" and "how fast"...similar in a way to global warming's effects. The helmet thing is probably nibbling around the edges...worth doing, but probably not a long term solution. As for what that means for the future of football, I think it is obvious that there will be changes. What they will be, exactly, I can only speculate.

I suspect the helmet is all but irrelevant, or that it may even contribute to an increase in brain injuries. A helmet prevents the blunt force injuries to the skull itself. But the concussions and brain injuries are caused when the brain impacts the inside of the skull. That comes from the sudden stop or change in direction - the instant in which the head and body turn 90-180 degrees, but the brain keeps moving forward. The helmet does little or nothing to prevent that, and the padding in the helmet - by softening the immediate external impact - allows players to hit harder and faster, which makes the changes in direction more severe.

Football is getting the attention, partially just because it's wildly popular and makes a good story, but also because of the sheer number of huge hits that make the highlights every week, and the number of hits that happen on every play. It's pretty easy to look at the SportsCenter top 10 and say "this is why". If they started looking at other sports - and once there's a way to do it without dissecting the brain, I'm sure they will - I'm guessing they'll find brain damage is relatively common in hockey, soccer, and rugby players, boxers and MMA fighters, and even in race car drivers.

 

[HHusky]

Ironically, if we got rid of the helmet, there would actually be FEWER brain injuries.

I suspect you're right. Every one of us playing football in the 1960s and 70s was taught to use the helmet as a weapon. I've got the neck to prove I could take instruction. Even with the changes to the rules since then, the helmet allows a player to take a more reckless approach than he would without it.

 

[random soul]

the technology strikes me as mosty bullshit "advances" that companies can market to sell helmets.

peter berg has talked a lot about a group called "heads-up tackling" or something that has a certification program for coaches that many youth leagues are starting to use. honestly, that's probably the only real way to limit the amount of head injuries is to coach a better way of tackling.

I think you're also going to see, fairly soon, the abolition of the 3 point stance. So much of the damage is the smaller, repetitive blows on the line of scrimmage.

 

[random soul]

I suspect the helmet is all but irrelevant, or that it may even contribute to an increase in brain injuries. A helmet prevents the blunt force injuries to the skull itself. But the concussions and brain injuries are caused when the brain impacts the inside of the skull. That comes from the sudden stop or change in direction - the instant in which the head and body turn 90-180 degrees, but the brain keeps moving forward. The helmet does little or nothing to prevent that, and the padding in the helmet - by softening the immediate external impact - allows players to hit harder and faster, which makes the changes in direction more severe.

Football is getting the attention, partially just because it's wildly popular and makes a good story, but also because of the sheer number of huge hits that make the highlights every week, and the number of hits that happen on every play. It's pretty easy to look at the SportsCenter top 10 and say "this is why". If they started looking at other sports - and once there's a way to do it without dissecting the brain, I'm sure they will - I'm guessing they'll find brain damage is relatively common in hockey, soccer, and rugby players, boxers and MMA fighters, and even in race car drivers.

Hockey might actually be the safest one on that list.

 

[dgibbons]

the technology strikes me as mosty bullshit "advances" that companies can market to sell helmets.

peter berg has talked a lot about a group called "heads-up tackling" or something that has a certification program for coaches that many youth leagues are starting to use. honestly, that's probably the only real way to limit the amount of head injuries is to coach a better way of tackling.

Heads up tackling is a NFL initiative for teaching tackling at the youth level. A lot of kids are now taught Hawk Tackling too- the head goes behind instead in front of the ball carrier.

Brain injuries won’t kill football. The money is too big. Declining ratings, loss of sponsors, the political BS, might kill football.

 

[dgibbons]

Pretty simple. If you don't want to play, don't.

Personally, I don't see the value in contact sports before high school. I don't think there is anything taken from contact sports at a young age that can't be taught in high school. Especially when you mix in the crapshoot that is youth coaching.

To make it to the BCS level or beyond has more to do with DNA then practice or reps. There is nothing that happens at age 10 on the football field that cannot be coached up to snuff at age 16.

That would take a revolution in coaching and the organization of high school sports, at least in Spokane. High school coaches don’t teach as much as they used to. That’s for all sports, not just football. Practice starts two weeks or so before the first game of the season. With kids playing since third or fourth grade, fundamentals are expected much more than taught.

 

[brettcraycraft51]

Brain injuries won’t kill football. The money is too big. Declining ratings, loss of sponsors, the political BS, might kill football.

seems like brain injuries could be a contributing factor to some of these though. especially as the research becomes more dialed in and the results are more broadly communicated.

 

[kugrz98]

I played football AND soccer for years. Never got a concussion playing football and had several playing soccer, along with thousands of headers that accumulated in who knows how much damage to my brain long term.

I still play soccer, including last night (O-40's in the Seattle area). I used to take a ton of headers playing sweeper as a kid on punts, goal kicks and corners, and never felt like I had any effects. Now, if I head the ball at all, I get a headache which at least carries over to the next day.

Back to football, the rules and teaching of the game will have to change. I just can't see changing the helmet and/or making it less safe to prevent players from using their head. Imagine the lawsuits....

 

[Cougsocal]

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...-this-game-destroys-peoples-brains/842904001/

No fan of Bob Costas (but that is neither here nor there)...but I think we have a big problem with the future of football as we know it.

Can technology save it? Maybe. More rules changes coming? Not sure what that would look like. Flag football anyone?

Anyway...love the game. It's the best game on the planet as far as I'm concerned.

(forgot the possessive on "peoples'" in title...oops)

The problem is contained the name of the condition, CTE, i.e. "chronic" not "acute." The condition is caused by repetitive minor blows/ shaking of the brain, effectively callusing the synapses over time.

It did not appear to be a significant problem in the past, except among OLs during the head slap era. We should be able to reverse it. This appears to be a largely modern problem, exacerbated by coaching techniques that promote CTE, due to equipment improvements allowing players to be more violent. Continue to limit contact scrimmaging, but also legislate the value of "concussive" style tackling/blows back out of the game. They penalize head hunting/targeting already. Many of you are too young. But you used to punished in practice for attempting to tackle without wrapping up, bouncing off was bear crawl time (1970s), a vestage from football's past. How about reintroducing the "rugby rule" that you are only "down" in bounds when brought down under control, once again (pre 1932). It would naturally discourage concussive tackling in favor of the wrap up tackling, while not making it a arbitary Ref judgment call?

It is was good enough for Red Grange, George Gipp and the "four horsemen," and the golden age of college football, why not once again.

 

[BleedCrimsonandGray]

No way. There would be less full speed intentionally violent collisions, but you'd also have people getting knocked out left and right accidentally hitting their heads. It would still be a game played at high speed with exceptional athletes. Losing the helmets would not be a good idea.

Rugby players do it all the time. Yes they get owies, yes they get concussions, but far fewer than in Football. And if you think they aren't going full speed knocking the sh!t out of each other, you're wrong. They just do it in a way that is far safer than in football, where the pads and helmet have allowed the athletes to turn their bodies into human bullets designed to inflict the most damage on the opposing player as possible, instead of protecting them from potential injury.

 

[cr8zyncalif]

I guess a broken nose (or three) is clearly better than CTE, but I don't like either. Never knew a serious Rugby player who didn't have a broken nose (or 3). For a variety of reasons, I don't see football going back to the pre-face guard days.

 

[Flatlandcoug]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/spor...f60b5a6c4a0_story.html?utm_term=.f2d3435d3301

 

[brettcraycraft51]

watching the iowa state/ok state game and they just showed an isu prof in sports medicine (maybe? didn't quite catch the dept) who's developing a portable machine that looks like a virtual reality headset that doctors or whoever can use on the sidelines to do a concussion test that gives actual quantitative data to the decision makers. obviously, i don't know much about the technology, but i feel like any advance that can help take some of the judgment call feel out of those decisions and bring an extra element of independence is a big step in the right direction.

incidentally, isu and osu are having a wild one today. very entertaining game...

 

[BleedCrimsonandGray]

watching the iowa state/ok state game and they just showed an isu prof in sports medicine (maybe? didn't quite catch the dept) who's developing a portable machine that looks like a virtual reality headset that doctors or whoever can use on the sidelines to do a concussion test that gives actual quantitative data to the decision makers. obviously, i don't know much about the technology, but i feel like any advance that can help take some of the judgment call feel out of those decisions and bring an extra element of independence is a big step in the right direction.

incidentally, isu and osu are having a wild one today. very entertaining game...

Concussions aren't necessarily the issue, though. Its the repetitive nature of the collisions that causes the build up of the Tau enzyme as I understand it. Also, they believe that concussions are exponential in nature, so that the first one may not cause that much damage, but each successive one does increasingly more damage.

If that proves to be the case, where do you draw the line, especially with college and hs kids? Arguably, two concussions are one too many if the research shows that they are indeed increasingly harmful.

The real breakthrough will be when they figure out whether or not CTE and Tau enzyme are selective in who they afflict. It would seem that from initial research and findings that it is due to the large number of players who have had concussions and repetitive head trauma with no or lesser adverse affects than those affected with CTE.

 

[brettcraycraft51]

Concussions aren't necessarily the issue, though. Its the repetitive nature of the collisions that causes the build up of the Tau enzyme as I understand it. Also, they believe that concussions are exponential in nature, so that the first one may not cause that much damage, but each successive one does increasingly more damage.

If that proves to be the case, where do you draw the line, especially with college and hs kids? Arguably, two concussions are one too many if the research shows that they are indeed increasingly harmful.

The real breakthrough will be when they figure out whether or not CTE and Tau enzyme are selective in who they afflict. It would seem that from initial research and findings that it is due to the large number of players who have had concussions and repetitive head trauma with no or lesser adverse affects than those affected with CTE.

oh, i totally agree that this isn't a panacea, but it does kind of stand to reason that a more accurate/independent might help prevent the repetition of the more significant head trauma by getting guys off the field at the right time.

also an interesting notion is that this tech (assuming the $$ isn't prohibitive) can be used to test everyone periodically, regardless of whether they've had a collision involving their head. that might help cut down on guys continuing to play w/ undiagnosed milder concussions.

or i could just be talking out of my ass. i'm less educated on this issue than i'd like to be...