What is Kirk Schulz's plan if the Pac-12 starts to unravel?

[PeteTheChop]

Dr. Schulz seems pretty confident the 10 members will stick together and everything will be settled and in good shape once the new TV deal is complete

But, Heaven forbid, what if the Four Corners quartet look at the dollar figures and decide in unison the Big 12 is a better long-term option?

What happens to the PNW schools plus Cal and Stanford at that point if the conference is down to 6 schools?

Do Schulz and his presidential peers have a quick fix to keep the Pac above water?

 

[mikalalas]

Dr. Schulz seems pretty confident the 10 members will stick together and everything will be settled and in good shape once the new TV deal is complete

But, Heaven forbid, what if the Four Corners quartet look at the dollar figures and decide in unison the Big 12 is a better long-term option?

What happens to the PNW schools plus Cal and Stanford at that point if the conference is down to 6 schools?

Do Schulz and his presidential peers have a quick fix to keep the Pac above water?

We either don't know, or about a 23% to 33% to 43% chance that Four Corner PAC 12 Colleges goto Big 12.

If that happens, guarantee that Oregon, UW would also go to 1 of the other P5 colleges, even if Big 12, Big 10, SEC said no, then they would seek to goto ACC, and ACC, would say yes to them.

As such the only teams left would be WSU, ORE ST, Stanford, Cal.

And without the Four Corner Colleges, there would be nothing that Schultz, remaining PAC 12 Presidents, George the Commish, could do to keep UW, Oregon, or if there was a option like raiding conferences, there would be no way the conference would succeed at raiding P5 conferences after losing 4 corner colleges

And if all that was left was WSU, Ore St, Stanford, Cal, then the PAC would be DEMOTED as a conference, or it would disintegrate, or it would grab mountain west teams, and be demoted as a conference, or merge with Mountain West.

In other words, there is nothing that could, would be done at that point, to stop PAC from either disintegrating or getting demoted, etc, and PAC, WSU, Ore St, CAL WOULD BE SCREWED.

Stanford would go independent or goto either Big 12 or Big 10.

The PAC, WSU, Ore St, Cal being SCREWED, happens the moment the four corner colleges leave the PAC 12, IF they leave the PAC 12.

 

[Loyal Coug1]

Dr. Schulz seems pretty confident the 10 members will stick together and everything will be settled and in good shape once the new TV deal is complete

But, Heaven forbid, what if the Four Corners quartet look at the dollar figures and decide in unison the Big 12 is a better long-term option?

What happens to the PNW schools plus Cal and Stanford at that point if the conference is down to 6 schools?

Do Schulz and his presidential peers have a quick fix to keep the Pac above water?

As I've said ad nauseum, we need to pick up San Diego State and UNLV. NOW. I can't remember the reasons Colorado came aboard, but we got them from the Big-12 for some reason. We elevated Utah from the Mountain West. Of course we elevated ASU and UA from the then WAC. So F those ungrateful bastards if they bail. But we need to get off our asses, get SDSU and UNLV, and get the media deal done, for better or worse.

 

[chugspig]

In time 4 corners will go to Big12, UW UO Stanford and Cal will go to Big10, WSU and Oregon St will either form a new pacific west conference with MWC, or have an outside shot joining the Big12. Pac10 may last one more media right deal.

 

[BiggsCoug]

Offer membership to every tier 1 research university in the Western US, FCS or G5 doesn’t matter, and get on with it.

Enough doing business with those that want to do business somewhere else. Add schools that fit the academics required and play ball.

 

[Loyal Coug1]

Offer membership to every tier 1 research university in the Western US, FCS or G5 doesn’t matter, and get on with it.

Enough doing business with those that want to do business somewhere else. Add schools that fit the academics required and play ball.

Well the big question is whether the Pac-12 will still be considered a Power 5 conference if we get all these defections and have to backfill with Colorado State, Utah State, Fresno State etc. No F-ing Boise trucking school please. That aside, stay out west, do the best we can. I wouldn't mind trips to SDSU, UNLV and Fort Collins.

 

[95coug]

Well the big question is whether the Pac-12 will still be considered a Power 5 conference if we get all these defections and have to backfill with Colorado State, Utah State, Fresno State etc. No F-ing Boise trucking school please. That aside, stay out west, do the best we can. I wouldn't mind trips to SDSU, UNLV and Fort Collins.

I don’t think Fresno will be a popular destination…but I don’t think they’re R1.

The New Mexico schools are (I think both, maybe just one). UNLV, I think Reno, Wyoming. Boise isn’t even close.

 

[BiggsCoug]

I don’t think Fresno will be a popular destination…but I don’t think they’re R1.

The New Mexico schools are (I think both, maybe just one). UNLV, I think Reno, Wyoming. Boise isn’t even close.

Last I looked it was:
Hawaii
Davis
Reno
UNLV
Montana State
New Mexico State, if memory serves
Colorado State
Utah State

Wanna go further? North Dakota State.

Wanna add an academy? Air Force.

Fck it. Take them all.

Fresno, Boise, San Jose, San Diego not smart enough.

If WSU got an offer from the B12, take it now. Immediately yes. And then start a rodeo team.

Edit…
Montana makes the list too.
It is UofNew Mexico, not NMSU.
UTEP is on the list.

Take them all fck it. Play 11 league games and any non league games are $1,500,000 payday from out of conference school. Wanna leave the Pac behind? Fine. But it’ll cost you.

 

[Loyal Coug1]

Last I looked it was:
Hawaii
Davis
Reno
UNLV
Montana State
New Mexico State, if memory serves
Colorado State
Utah State

Wanna go further? North Dakota State.

Wanna add an academy? Air Force.

Fck it. Take them all.

Fresno, Boise, San Jose, San Diego not smart enough.

If WSU got an offer from the B12, take it now. Immediately yes. And then start a rodeo team.

Well despite WSU's actual fan appeal (TV), we get no credit because of our small "market". No credit for Spokane or the Seattle area where 2/3 of our grads are from. They ain't gonna offer us.

We need to relax a little on the Tier 1 requirement (SDSU is close), and get real. But our F-ing academic idiot presidents apparently can't figure that out. Dipshits. PhD's know everything about nothing.

 

[PeteTheChop]

Last I looked it was:
Hawaii
Davis
Reno
UNLV
Montana State
New Mexico State, if memory serves
Colorado State
Utah State

Wanna go further? North Dakota State.

Wanna add an academy? Air Force.

Fck it. Take them all.

Fresno, Boise, San Jose, San Diego not smart enough.

If WSU got an offer from the B12, take it now. Immediately yes. And then start a rodeo team.

Good list.

Some of the media guys have suggested these conferences could eventually get to 20-24 members.

So there would be room for even more schools.

I wonder if the presidents would overlook the lack of academic prestige and take San Diego St. (basketball success) and Boise (home of the famous Blue Turf) for other reasons.

Are Fresno State and San Jose St not good enough academically to get in a Power conference? I hadn't heard much about them over the years

 

[PeteTheChop]

Well despite WSU's actual fan appeal (TV), we get no credit because of our small "market". No credit for Spokane or the Seattle area where 2/3 of our grads are from. They ain't gonna offer us.

TV ratings drive advertising rates for these networks — and WSU's were sky-high during the Leach-Minshew era.

We could see a repeat with the Ward-Arbuckle combo

America knows and loves the Cougs because of the tradition of the GameDay Flag.

 

[95coug]

Good list.

Some of the media guys have suggested these conferences could eventually get to 20-24 members.

So there would be room for even more schools.

I wonder if the presidents would overlook the lack of academic prestige and take San Diego St. (basketball success) and Boise (home of the famous Blue Turf) for other reasons.

Are Fresno State and San Jose St not good enough academically to get in a Power conference? I hadn't heard much about them over the years

I think they might lower the academic bar enough for SDSU. That wouldn’t take a huge compromise. They’re not going to lower it far enough for BSU. They barely register with research expenditure, and their grad school is a fraction of the rest of the conference. They’d basically have to completely abandon academic standards, and I don’t see them going that far.

 

[BiggsCoug]

Good list.

Some of the media guys have suggested these conferences could eventually get to 20-24 members.

So there would be room for even more schools.

I wonder if the presidents would overlook the lack of academic prestige and take San Diego St. (basketball success) and Boise (home of the famous Blue Turf) for other reasons.

Are Fresno State and San Jose St not good enough academically to get in a Power conference? I hadn't heard much about them over the years

Pac 10 is first and foremost an academic conference.

SDSU, Boise, San Jose and Fresno are not strong enough academically. Could they get into other P5 conferences? Yeah maybe. But Pac 10 is tier 1 research.

 

[BiggsCoug]

TV ratings drive advertising rates for these networks — and WSU's were sky-high during the Leach-Minshew era.

We could see a repeat with the Ward-Arbuckle combo

America knows and loves the Cougs because of the tradition of the GameDay Flag.

We will not be seeing a repeat of Minshew/ Leach with Ward/Arbuckle. 2023 will not be an eleven win season.

 

[BiggsCoug]

Well despite WSU's actual fan appeal (TV), we get no credit because of our small "market". No credit for Spokane or the Seattle area where 2/3 of our grads are from. They ain't gonna offer us.

We need to relax a little on the Tier 1 requirement (SDSU is close), and get real. But our F-ing academic idiot presidents apparently can't figure that out. Dipshits. PhD's know everything about nothing.

They are morons. They will have pissed away the biggest money making opportunity the schools have ever seen. When the new SEC deal comes thru and it’s $75,000,000 per year, per school…. The windfall of $$$ on some of those schools will be so great that their academics will surge in profile. And the Pac 10 will watch and realize they pissed away upwards of a billion dollars per school over a 10 year period because they didnt wanna invest in football.

The South sees football as a money maker. The West sees football as a cost.

SC and UCLA were right to leave. They don’t give a shit about the travel. That’s a joke to them while they count up their millions.

 

[PeteTheChop]

We either don't know, or about a 23% to 33% to 43% chance that Four Corner PAC 12 Colleges goto Big 12.stats

John Wilner from the San Jose paper would agree with the "lower end" of your projections Mik.

He thinks it's unlikely anybody else leaves the Pac-12 unless one of the Four Corners presidents "panics" and takes his school to the Big 12.

Wilner also said the media deal should probably, hopefully be complete by the end of spring or else this summer. Any delay thus far (per Wilner) likely indicates "the negotiations (have) progressed significantly, but the final steps are proving elusive."

So basically just crossing the "T's" and dotting the "I's" at this point — and then the uncertainty will be gone

 

[CougSinceBirth]

As I've said ad nauseum, we need to pick up San Diego State and UNLV. NOW. I can't remember the reasons Colorado came aboard, but we got them from the Big-12 for some reason. We elevated Utah from the Mountain West. Of course we elevated ASU and UA from the then WAC. So F those ungrateful bastards if they bail. But we need to get off our asses, get SDSU and UNLV, and get the media deal done, for better or worse.

Colorado joined the P12 to tap into California and a lot of their alumni base is out there.

 

[CougSinceBirth]

Dr. Schulz seems pretty confident the 10 members will stick together and everything will be settled and in good shape once the new TV deal is complete

But, Heaven forbid, what if the Four Corners quartet look at the dollar figures and decide in unison the Big 12 is a better long-term option?

What happens to the PNW schools plus Cal and Stanford at that point if the conference is down to 6 schools?

Do Schulz and his presidential peers have a quick fix to keep the Pac above water?

Schulz and Chun do not have a plan, WSU would be left holding the bag with OSU. They'd have to pray the Big 12 would take WSU and OSU. To think otherwise is hopium.

 

[Loyal Coug1]

I think they might lower the academic bar enough for SDSU. That wouldn’t take a huge compromise. They’re not going to lower it far enough for BSU. They barely register with research expenditure, and their grad school is a fraction of the rest of the conference. They’d basically have to completely abandon academic standards, and I don’t see them going that far.

Agree 120%. And Gawd can we all just please stop mentioning Boise State as a possibility. No, no and F-NO. Ever. They were a community college and trucking school until 1965.

 

[Cougsocal]

We and the Beavs are heading to the MWC, absent a miracle. Clearly, an initial proposed media deal was turned down by some presidents. Remember the "deal imminent" talk of a few months back, attributed to several presidents? Well obviously some prezs said no to it. Now ESPN and Fox are not interested, and every media platform is in a belt tightening phase. Couldn't be a worse time to negotiate!

 

[PeteTheChop]

We and the Beavs are heading to the MWC, absent a miracle.

What about the legislation to link WSU and UW together in all sports conferences?

Why wouldn't the Mountain WAC schools leave and join WSU, UW, OSU, UO, Cal and Stanford in the Pac? There would still be a lot of visibility in a conference with those particular brands

Way too much doom and gloom

 

[PeteTheChop]

Gawd can we all just please stop mentioning Boise State as a possibility. No, no and F-NO. Ever. They were a community college and trucking school until 1965.

To be fair Loyal, that was almost 60 years ago.

Imagine BSU offers more than the Tailgating 101 or Truck Stop Hookers 301 at this point.

The Broncos could be a good regional rival with the four current PNW schools.

Gotta figure Coug-Bronco games would be sellouts or near-sellouts every season

 

[BiggsCoug]

We and the Beavs are heading to the MWC, absent a miracle. Clearly, an initial proposed media deal was turned down by some presidents. Remember the "deal imminent" talk of a few months back, attributed to several presidents? Well obviously some prezs said no to it. Now ESPN and Fox are not interested, and every media platform is in a belt tightening phase. Couldn't be a worse time to negotiate!

I would hold onto the Pac brand name. They join the Pac, not the Pac dissolving.

 

[Loyal Coug1]

To be fair Loyal, that was almost 60 years ago.

Imagine BSU offers more than the Tailgating 101 or Truck Stop Hookers 301 at this point.

The Broncos could be a good regional rival with the four current PNW schools.

Gotta figure Coug-Bronco games would be sellouts or near-sellouts every season

Research expenditures, 2021.

WSU: 357K
OSU: 277K
SDSU: 107K
UNLV: 101K
BSU: 46K
SMU: 41K

https://ncsesdata.nsf.gov/profiles/site?method=rankingBySource&ds=HERD&o=n&s=a

So can we stop the BSU BS please? And WTF was Kliatkoski (whatever his name is) doing even talking to SMU?

 

[Cougsocal]

What about the legislation to link WSU and UW together in all sports conferences?

Why wouldn't the Mountain WAC schools leave and join WSU, UW, OSU, UO, Cal and Stanford in the Pac? There would still be a lot of visibility in a conference with those particular brands

Way too much doom and gloom

Proposed legislation that was tabled ain't law.

Sure MWC schools would want to join a viable Pac-12, but why would Cal and Stanford be on board with a bad, mostly streaming, media deal, when 6 schools have bolted? They are elite academic universities, all they need do is ask the Big-10, and they are in? They are loyal to the conference, but are they willing to associate with low rung academic universities to stay? Oregon could be struck with us. While they have Phil's money, and a strong football program, they don't have a school of engineering, medicine, vet or other tech school like ag, they are a basically a liberal arts college, which is unlike any other Big-10 school, who are known for tech and engineering. The ADs might want them, but academia won't. Cal or Stanford in green they aren't.

 

[mikalalas]

What about the legislation to link WSU and UW together in all sports conferences?

Why wouldn't the Mountain WAC schools leave and join WSU, UW, OSU, UO, Cal and Stanford in the Pac? There would still be a lot of visibility in a conference with those particular brands

Way too much doom and gloom

It's TIMING. IF the 4 corner colleges leave the PAC BEFORE the vote on the UW/WSU stuck together legislation, then the moment they leave UW/Oregon also leave without WSU/Ore St.

Also even tho the WA state legislature and legislators are saying they are gonna vote on the UW/WSU stuck together legislation, that could be JUST TALK, and even if they do vote, THEY MIGHT VOTE IT DOWN, because maybe UW would make the point to them that if they leave, they could give some of the money to WSU and would still do the Apple Cup with WSU, in order to get the legislation voted down.

The legislation might still be passed, but it will take time, and UW/Oregon can still leave BEFORE the legislation passes.

And even if the legislation passes before UW/Oregon would leave, the State of Oregon is not passing similar legislation, which means that altho UW would stay, Oregon would leave.

And a WSU, Ore St, Cal, Stanford, UW, NO OREGON, would STILL SINK.

Stanford would either leave or go independent as soon as Oregon left, as Stanford not either going down with the ship or not staying in a conference where even if either Merge with MWC, or backfill from MWC, the PAC would be DEMOTED. Stanford wouldn't stay for that, and UW would only stay for that if legislation forced them to stay for that.

Bottom line IF IF IF the 4 corner colleges leave the PAC, the PAC would be DOOMED at that point, IF IF IF that happened.

 

[Cougsocal]

Research expenditures, 2021.

WSU: 357K
OSU: 277K
SDSU: 107K
UNLV: 101K
BSU: 46K
SMU: 41K

https://ncsesdata.nsf.gov/profiles/site?method=rankingBySource&ds=HERD&o=n&s=a

So can we stop the BSU BS please? And WTF was Kliatkoski (whatever his name is) doing even talking to SMU?

You are right. People tend to think it is only about athletics. But for anyone to be allowed in, they must get approval from academia too! Academia at WSU/OSU might be willing to bite the bullet on the likes of SDSU, but Cal and Stanford? They have parking lots for Nobel Laureates for christ sake.

 

[mikalalas]

To be fair Loyal, that was almost 60 years ago.

Imagine BSU offers more than the Tailgating 101 or Truck Stop Hookers 301 at this point.

The Broncos could be a good regional rival with the four current PNW schools.

Gotta figure Coug-Bronco games would be sellouts or near-sellouts every season

The problem is not or should not be academic standards, as academic standards should be lowered, and BSU is not as bad academically or nowhere near how things were 60 years ago.

But the real problem with adding BSU, is if BSU were added it would DESTROY WSU recruiting.

The only reason why WSU CAN out recruit, beat out BSU for recruits, is that WSU is P5 and BSU is MWC.

WSU and BSU Share the same recruiting footprint.

WSU does not need a GONZAGA of Football in BSU, in WSU's Front porch recruiting area, scooping up any local recruits worth anything and leaving WSU with local scraps not worth getting, just like Gonzaga.

The only way BSU should be added, is if it's WSU, Ore St, Cal, Stanford, and the rest of PAC left the PAC, then the PAC would have to take BSU.

But the PAC 10 should not take BSU, since there are BETTER choices in SDSU, SMU, UNLV, etc

 

[mikalalas]

Proposed legislation that was tabled ain't law.

Sure MWC schools would want to join a viable Pac-12, but why would Cal and Stanford be on board with a bad, mostly streaming, media deal, when 6 schools have bolted? They are elite academic universities, all they need do is ask the Big-10, and they are in? They are loyal to the conference, but are they willing to associate with low rung academic universities to stay? Oregon could be struck with us. While they have Phil's money, and a strong football program, they don't have a school of engineering, medicine, vet or other tech school like ag, they are a basically a liberal arts college, which is unlike any other Big-10 school, who are known for tech and engineering. The ADs might want them, but academia won't. Cal or Stanford in green they aren't.

The legislation isn't law yet, but according to the state legislature, legislators, credible media sources, the legislation is supposedly going to get voted on.

That does mean it is law yet. They first have to vote on it, and even if vote on it, they may or may not get the votes to pass it.

But the legislation, law, is a POSSIBILITY, SEMI PROBABILITY.

We'll have to see what happens, and see if the legislation, law passes.

 

[mikalalas]

Proposed legislation that was tabled ain't law.

Sure MWC schools would want to join a viable Pac-12, but why would Cal and Stanford be on board with a bad, mostly streaming, media deal, when 6 schools have bolted? They are elite academic universities, all they need do is ask the Big-10, and they are in? They are loyal to the conference, but are they willing to associate with low rung academic universities to stay? Oregon could be struck with us. While they have Phil's money, and a strong football program, they don't have a school of engineering, medicine, vet or other tech school like ag, they are a basically a liberal arts college, which is unlike any other Big-10 school, who are known for tech and engineering. The ADs might want them, but academia won't. Cal or Stanford in green they aren't.

Stanford might or might not get into the Big 10 or Big 12. Cal is just as screwed as WSU, Ore St, and would not get into Big 10, maybe get into Big 12, and would either just stay, or get out of Football, etc, or go independent like Stanford might do, or hope to get into Big 12, etc.

 

[mikalalas]

Proposed legislation that was tabled ain't law.

Sure MWC schools would want to join a viable Pac-12, but why would Cal and Stanford be on board with a bad, mostly streaming, media deal, when 6 schools have bolted? They are elite academic universities, all they need do is ask the Big-10, and they are in? They are loyal to the conference, but are they willing to associate with low rung academic universities to stay? Oregon could be struck with us. While they have Phil's money, and a strong football program, they don't have a school of engineering, medicine, vet or other tech school like ag, they are a basically a liberal arts college, which is unlike any other Big-10 school, who are known for tech and engineering. The ADs might want them, but academia won't. Cal or Stanford in green they aren't.

Oregon would be a Shoe in to get into 1 of the other P5 conferences, and have a better shot at that then Stanford, Cal.

Oregon would not, is not STUCK.

 

[Observer11]

The legislature is not going to force the UW to stay joined at the hip with WSU. Not with tens if not hundreds of millions of dollars at stake.

I don't have the breakdown of Coug legislators vs. Husky legislators but I have to assume it mirrors the general populace. They aren't going to vote staying together into law.

If that's the hail mary play, there's 11 DBs on the field and 99 yards to go for the Cougs.

Sorry, just being pragmatic here. Not gonna happen.

 

[mikalalas]

The legislature is not going to force the UW to stay joined at the hip with WSU. Not will tens if no hundreds of millions of dollars at stake.

I don't have the breakdown of Coug legislators vs. Husky legislators but I have to assume it mirrors the general populace. They aren't going to vote staying together into law.

If that's the hail mary play, there's 11 DBs on the field and 99 yards to go for the Cougs.

Sorry, just being pragmatic here. Not gonna happen.

They are officially saying they are going to vote on it.

Whether it passes is a different.

While their is logic behind what you say, no one can authoritatively say it's impossible that it would pass. Improbable, longshot, ok.

 

[PeteTheChop]

The legislature is not going to force the UW to stay joined at the hip with WSU. Not with tens if not hundreds of millions of dollars at stake.

I don't have the breakdown of Coug legislators vs. Husky legislators but I have to assume it mirrors the general populace. They aren't going to vote staying together into law.

If that's the hail mary play, there's 11 DBs on the field and 99 yards to go for the Cougs

Observer, how you feeling about WSU/OSU to the Big 12 (if a non-Pac option is needed).

Cougs and Beavs would basically be a West Coast version of Kansas State and Iowa State — win their share of games and establish themselves as good B12 media brands.

 

[Observer11]

Observer, how you feeling about WSU/OSU to the Big 12 (if a non-Pac option is needed).

Cougs and Beavs would basically be a West Coast version of Kansas State and Iowa State — win their share of games and establish themselves as good B12 media brands.

Wouldn't bother me a bit.

Either the Big 12 or the MWC are good fits for WSU - though I think we'll get our clocks cleaned in basketball in the Big12.

It won't happen but a MWC/Pac 8 merger (assuming UW and UO are gone) would be good for the stability of both conferences.

 

[Cougini5591]

I still think Hawaii could be a good hook. I know there are lots of things that don't make sense, but we could become LOUD and PROUD of supporting a school/people/area like Hawaii.

 

[Loyal Coug1]

They are officially saying they are going to vote on it.

Whether it passes is a different.

While their is logic behind what you say, no one can authoritatively say it's impossible that it would pass. Improbable, longshot, ok.

As I said in the other thread, the legislature has adjourned. See you in a year.

 

[Flatlandcoug]

To be fair Loyal, that was almost 60 years ago.

Imagine BSU offers more than the Tailgating 101 or Truck Stop Hookers 301 at this point.

The Broncos could be a good regional rival with the four current PNW schools.

Gotta figure Coug-Bronco games would be sellouts or near-sellouts every season

Not that anyone will notice, but if we end up in a league with Boise State, it's the sign that I'm done donating and being an active fan of WSU. I'll watch when we are on TV and maybe in person if it's the right spot, but if things have devolved to the point where we are in bed with the Broncos, it means that we don't have any have a "Dumb and Dumber" level of chance to be relevant anymore.

 

[PeteTheChop]

And WTF was Kliatkoski (whatever his name is) doing even talking to SMU?

The upscale neighborhoods in Dallas (and Houston) are Grade A Milf country

 

[95coug]

Observer, how you feeling about WSU/OSU to the Big 12 (if a non-Pac option is needed).

Cougs and Beavs would basically be a West Coast version of Kansas State and Iowa State — win their share of games and establish themselves as good B12 media brands.

B12 would have all the cards at that point, and could hold WSU/OSU’s feet to the fire for a reduced share.