Yes Virginia ...........
- Thread starter kougkurt
- Start date
Wasn't it Hoopscoug aka Hooperbole who predicted TB would be fired after a couple seasons at Virginia? Maybe it was someone else.
One of the current Brand Y millennials was also predicting Tony's demise on Brand X during Year 1 of Bone.
It was like Dennis Erickson - you could see Tony had it while he was in Pullman.
Congrats Tony. Hope you and the Cavs win it all.
Or a devil ....if you are an Auburn or Purdue fan. The refs missed an easy call where the pt guard double dribbled with about six seconds left in the game .
Last edited:
I don't know about easy. When does a player knock the ball off his foot going behind his back and pick it back up. Definitely a missed call but that scenario doesn't take place often.
I would hazard to guess that most fans would not have realized that's a double dribble in real time. It's easy to see it in replay, and yes, it was a missed call but over the course of a game, it won't be the only missed call. The last second foul was called correctly, in my opinion. Guy was knocked off in mid-air by the Auburn player's body. I would think Virginia would be more pissed if that foul isn't called.
Anyway, happy with the final of Texas Tech vs. Virginia. I like both teams....love the hard-nosed defense and ball control. Happy for Tony. I think it would be cool to say that a guy who started his head coaching career at WSU went on to be a national champion.
Glad Cougar
Anyway, happy with the final of Texas Tech vs. Virginia. I like both teams....love the hard-nosed defense and ball control. Happy for Tony. I think it would be cool to say that a guy who started his head coaching career at WSU went on to be a national champion.
Glad Cougar
Yeah I agree totally on that last foul call - he hit the shooters body BEFORE the shot left his hand. Why there is any controversy baffles me. If it was AFTER the release I could see it. And the defender jumped into the shooter - no James Harden-ish play there.
I like TT and UVA. Offense wins games - defense wins championships. I made that up myself. Really.
I will always root for the Bennett's. The better Tony does with his career, the better WSU looks, and the more chatter our university gets. He got his start with WSU basketball and that's something WSU can hang their hat on if Tony continues to have success.
I don't care if Tony wins or loses, but not sure how any success he has helps WSU. I think I will root for Tech tonight simply because they may never make it back this far, and Tony seems to have things rolling in the direction to make another run.
Now if it was Dick Bennett coaching UVA, I would probably be compelled to root for him.
Because WSU often gets brought up when he's in the spotlight. So the more success he has, the more opportunity his coaching story gets told, and WSU is a big part of that story. Positive press is good for us, don't ya think?
Go Virginia! Go WSU!
Whenever it can be shown that a coach at WSU can achieve the pinnacle of a national championship at another school, it could help attract other aspiring coaches to want to be at WSU. Kyle Smith is a great example of that. He's already pointed to Tony's success, and the fact that WSU played a role in it, as something that attracted him to Pullman. If you haven't listened to Smith's introductory press conference, check it out. He specifically talks about the TB-WSU connection.
Some people will stress the fact that Dick set everything up for Tony....and it's true to an extent. (Tony played a major role in recruiting for Dick and should get some credit). But Tony still had to go out and win the games. His players at WSU always spoke highly of him and I always thought he earned the results. If you think that's no small matter, just look at Pat Knight. His dad set him up at Texas Tech as well...but the results were quite different than the Bennetts at WSU. The younger Knight never ended up being a good head coach and was positively disastrous at his next stop, Lamar. He's now a scout in the NBA. Having a dad lay the foundation doesn't necessarily mean the son is going to succeed.
I still find it odd that a minority of WSU fans go to great lengths to diminish the success of Tony Bennett at WSU while also going to great lengths to make excuses for Ken Bone and/or Ernie Kent.
Glad Cougar
Glad there is one small area of disagreement but it is huge in my mind. We can talk about X's and O's, and I am willing for discussion purposes say he was the best x's and O's guy around. But WSU is about finding players. Players came to WSU because of Dick Bennett. It was his name. Yes, Ben Johnson found Baynes in Australia. Is there much doubt in my mind that Tony made the trip to Australia instead of Dick? Not at all.
But it was Dick's plan, he got the tape of these players through his various contacts and said we want Cowgill. We want Low. He knew how to structure that roster. The collection of players, who to recruit was Dick Bennett and his genius.
Here is the bottom line for me with respect to TB. If Harshman talked Sterk into hiring Tony without his dad, do you believe he would be coaching at Virginia or would he be on someone's staff as a good assistant working his way to a mid major gig?
And no I don't believe Dick set things up for Tony to some extent, I think he set Tony up period. He got Tony the players into the program that would play his brand of ball, stay all four years hopefully pass on their knowledge to the new recruits.
All I have said about Bone is that Tony did not leave him the program in the same shape as he inherited it, both in terms of PG play and talent at several other positions. Like I said many times, I wish Tony did have an offer after his first year and whether it was Bone or someone else he would have inherited NCAA experienced players and would have given them a chance to get in their players. Saddling someone with Nic Witherill, Brown, Hartune, Watson and their best player Thames was gone before semester in his mind is a problem.
If Tony didn't swing and miss so badly on those players and got a Cowgill type player instead of Hartune, or a Harmeling player instead of Witherill I would agree with what you have said about Tony.
With that said in respect to UVA he has done a nice job.
Spot on. Dick and Tony proved that it could be done in Pullman. While Kyle Smith may not be Dick Bennett (who is?), he is obviously well-regarded, and knowing that it can be done here is not a bad thing. While I wish Tony had stayed longer, the flip side is that he left because we had great success. So, bottom line is we had great success. Better than the 10 years since. So pick your poison. A). Great success then have to start over, or B). no success and have to start over. And have to payoff 2 coaches along the way. I'll take A) thank you very much.
This doesn't make a lot of sense. You don't give Tony any credit as an assistant but give Ben Johnson all the credit as an assistant for Baynes. No question Johnson paved the way for the Aussie recruits but Tony wasn't just sitting around holding on to his Dad's leg for 3 years. It especially doesn't make sense given Low recently was quoted as saying Tony was one of the main reasons he committed to WSU sight unseen.
So did Harshman, Raveling, and Sampson. We have been a stepping stone for some really good coaches over the years. I would rather the good coaches stuck around but if I had to chose I would rather they move on for "bigger and better" than need to fire like we have with Bone and Kent.
I like how you keep bringing up Witherill, but don't mention the guys Tony did leave......like Klay Thompson (heard of him?), Casto, Capers, Nick and Lodwick. I don't know this but I assume Brock Motum was on his way here before Bone took over as well. Or, Tony left Motum's recruiter Ben Johnson behind for Bone, so same thing. And wasn't Harthun a 3 or 4 star recruit? So on paper he was OK. Watson had potential.
I think Bone recruited Moore, don't know about Thames. So no, Bone did not have the same squad Tony inherited. So what? He had a solid squad, but he did a poor job with retention and player control, and the longer he stayed the worse we got....as Tony's guys left.
So you downgrade Tony because he only left the cupboard half full. And cut Bone slack because he was not good enough to fill it the rest of the way, and/or keep the existing contents from spilling out. Which is exactly Glad Cougar's point.
Johnson was the connection to Baynes. Low's coach recommended Derrick to come to Pullman sight unseen because of Dick Bennett and his defense. Low came to Pullman because he knew what Dick Bennett taught. Where else did Derrick get an offer from?
I am not cutting bone any slack, he was fired. It took the Bennett's four years to create a winning culture. I went to a Dick Bennett dinner in West Seattle before his third year. He called it perfectly. He told EVERYONE that year was going to be a down year, that expectations need to be tempered and year four would be the tourney year. It goes to the players who he recruited, players who took time in a system to gel. They weren't players who could take over a game, but depended on the other parts working together. And when Tony handed it off they were the same type of players. Players that needed that time and experience. That is key!
For that to have continued under a new coach Tony had to leave Bone or whoever to take over with Taylor Rochestie, or someone like him.
Bone made similar made the same type of mistakes Doba made. On the surface they were rational well thought out decisions. For Doba, he wanted more ball control and he wanted to recruit against USC and UCLA. On the surface it made sense, but he lost out on the A- player, not having that player locked up while waiting for the SC recruits to make up their mind. And his offensive strategy backfired as everyone else in the conference decided to go fast, no huddle.
Part of Bone's problem was he didn't play pack line, and he did not think ( probably correctly) that players wanted to play that slow paced game. When it came to his decision on Moore, short term for that immediate moment made sense. WSU did not have a returning PG, anyone that could lead that offense. He counted the points and even with playing Bennetts D where were the points coming from?
Casto was 6 points a game, Klay 12, Kop was 8, Hartune 0, Witheril 0, Brown, Watson 0, Capers 4, Watson, Enquist, Lodwick 6, Boeke 0, Sauls 0, Hopson, Ambercrombie 0.
Moore played because he was capable of scoring 12 a night and having a double double. With Klay, Kop, and the base of the team they were capable of scoring 36 a night. Even if he played Bennett's packline how were we going to win games scoring 36?
And the truth is Bone's first year they were I bet 10 points from being 8-8 in conference. That comes down to PG play to me. If they hit their FT's down the stretch they would have won several more games. .
And as for the excuses for Bone, if Tony hit on Watson and Sauls and Boeke it would have given Bone or the next coach to time get rid of the players who weren't Pac 12 players. Th eteam could have played off the winning culture the Bennett's put in place.
Like I said, Tony inherited a better all around situation, including experience than what he handed off. Bone was fired and he was given his time to right the ship in Pullman and failed. Tony was put in a no fail position. Therein lies the difference for me.
Last edited:
Bone should get absolutely no slack, he just wasn't a very good coach and not someone that could be successful at WSU. It was a TERRIBLE hire and no idea why we went that direction. He asked players to completely switch styles and force the ball up the court immediately. It was a Bonehead mistake...
So I guess Derick remembers it differently? He's quoted as saying Tony specifically was a big reason he came to WSU and how they connected during his recruiting in a brandx article. Do you have a quote from the coach? Low also had offers from Utah and Gonzaga.
As you have said Dick was going to step aside. They all knew Tony was going to become the head coach. Commence deflecting.
I think you understate the contribution Tony made to the program's recruiting efforts while his Dad was in charge. I think father and son worked together as a team to identify players and sell them on WSU. Ben Johnson played a role as well. But I suspect Dick Bennett, knowing that his son was going to take over the program, consulted with Tony and gave him a bigger role than he would any other assistant in selecting players that would end up playing for Tony. Can't recall all the details, but I seemed to remember Dick and Tony disagreed on Kyle Weaver....Tony thought he was worthy of a scholarship and talked his Dad into it.
Secondly, had Tony given Bone a Cowgill instead of a Harthun and a Harmeling instead of a Witherill to go along with Klay, Casto, Kopravica, Thames, Motum, Capers, and Lodwick....that would have been the single greatest roster ever handed over to a new coach at WSU. Given that EVERY coach misses on some recruits, that's not very realistic to expect from Tony or anyone else. The fact that Bone stopped winning once all of Tony's recruits were gone speaks volumes.
Finally, Tony Bennett has won at WSU, he has won at UVA. He's a two-time National Coach of the Year. Obviously, he had the ingredients to become a great college coach. If not for his Dad, he would have gotten another opportunity somewhere else. I don't believe for one second that he would still be an assistant working his way up to a mid-major HC job if it weren't for his Dad paving the way. It might have taken longer to get to a school like Virginia, but he's been destined to be a successful head coach at a major university.
Glad Cougar
Bennett left Thames and Bone recruited Moore. Talent wasn't the issue. He needed to keep one of them around for 4 years and wasn't able to do it with either.
Sampson had time once he recruited Seltzer for year 3 and the 4 Texas JCs and Washington high school players in year 4. At that point he wasn't going anywhere. If it was about recruiting players Harshman and Motta weren't delivering with mostly JC's like Juan Thomas, Bubba Smith, and LaVar Ball.
Well, after the above explanations, I now understand perfectly CougEd's position on Tony Bennett: he was born with a silver spoon in his mouth and the fact he has a team on the cusp of a national championship is through no effort of his own. His old man is solely responsible for his son's success. Very enlightening.
When you show me the similarities between the two programs then his dad not setting him up at Virginia becomes a relevant point.
Fire Spurrier Jr! He is only good because of his dad! Cut Bledsoe! Never watch a movie with Michael Douglas! Impeach Trump - his Dad gave him all his money!
Which one of the above 4 do think I really want to see?
Which one of the above 4 do think I really want to see?
Congratulations to Virginia and Tony Bennett. Great game tonight, both teams played as well as they could.....and despite the great defense, a lot of big shots were made. Really enjoyable to watch.
Glad Cougar
Glad Cougar
Love and Singler was probably the beginning but they went to UCLA and Duke and obviously not WSU.
Fire Spurrier Jr! He is only good because of his dad! Cut Bledsoe! Never watch a movie with Michael Douglas! Impeach Trump - his Dad gave him all his money!
Which one of the above 4 do think I really want to see?
Yes, that is exactly what has been said. We are talking about Tony and his time at WSU. So I am clear
1) I don't think Tony as a head coach without his dad is successful at WSU. Not a knock, but his dad laid the foundation.
2) WSU isn't for the weary, It can break a lot of good coaches.
3) Dick Bennett is special.
4) It would be akin for Donald Trump and his self reported 10 billion handing it over to Eric and at the end of three years he has 7 billion and someone saying he was the reason a big reason there is 7 billion left.
5) WSU would have been better off if someone was handed the program after Tony's first season and he went somewhere were he and his wife wanted to live.
6) How did Tony get a Virginia accent?
Last edited:
In the last 50 years I believe we have had 11 coaches. Who was really good that was broken?
Similar threads
