2nd best team in the PAC-12?
- Thread starter Cougarmatt90
- Start date
Belittling where people went to school is low rent. You should be better than that.
And I feel the same way when Cougs do it to Boise fans.
I know, right? Truck driving is a fine and noble profession. Those guys make some serious quan.
1. I get what Bleed, others are saying about the game. But even that being the case, shouldnt knee jerk react, should just celebrate the good season, etc. Then later in a constructive way discuss things.
2. 11 wins is the most in school history, since the rosebowl year decades ago where only reason that team didnt have more was only played about 10 games, and if had played 11,12,13, would probably have won 12, 13, more then 11.
3. As far as the AR susceptibility to rush 3, 1,2 linebackers, 6,7 DB's, and how to deal with it, etc:
The answer is of course to run the ball more, both up the gut, center, and to the outside.
And as to how the other teams stuff the run and continue with 3, 1,2, 6,7:
If I was a D coordinator, I would have NON DL players either just barely in box, just barely out of box, on border, fringe of box, in a basketball like run/pass amoeba defense zone(remember UNLV)
Then I would have the defense players READ, REACT like a awesome baseball outfielder.
In baseball, a awesome pro outfielder can position himself perfectly in such a way, that combined with QUICK, REACTION, READ, REACT, the bat hits the ball, and the player is able to get to the ball no matter where in the outfield it goes, whether short, long, left, right, center, etc.
So how does that apply to football? If you put the defense players in the right position, and if they can QUICKLY REACT, READ, REACT, then if run the ball they are able the stuff the run with a 1 to 3.3 yard gain. And if pass, they are able to either cover the WR, and or keep the WR to a 3.3 to 4.3 yard underneath gain.
Then the next thing I would do, would be to occasional just barely cheat up, pretend to stuff the box, causing the QB to go with pass, instead of run, then at last second play the pass.
Also similarly, I would pretend to only have 3 to 6 in box, causing QB to audible to run, run a run, then at the last second before snap, flood the box, stuff the run.
Yeah sure, every once in a super big while, would give up either a big run play or a big pass play.
But most of the time, this type of defense would cause the AR to run less, pass more, and when do run, to stuff run, causing run to be abandoned.
And that is the type of Defense, Cal, UW, Utah, ISU, runs so successfully against WSU.
So how does the AR deal with such a defense?
1. Need to be aware of such a defense.
2. Need to practice to deal with such a defense
3. The QB needs to be able to Read, sniff out what such a defense is doing. That takes a SPECIAL QB.
4. The coach(Leach), needs to be aware of, Read, Sniff out what the defense is doing
5. The coach needs to run more.
Now here is what happens with Leach. Leach usually runs about 68% Pass and about 32% run, over the long term.
Now what happens is in the beginning Leach will occassionally run the ball about 1 out of about 3.75 plays, or QB will audible to run when box appears empty.
Then the defense I mentioned stuffs it for either small or no gain.
So say WSU run about 3,4,5,6,7 times within the first Quarter, and half second quarter and WSU gets 2,3 stuffed runs, 1 4.85 yard run, 1 10 yard+ run.
Leach sees that, and thinks well no sense in running the ball more then about 5 to 10% of the time here in this game, because most to almost all the runs, are either being stuffed, or will be stuffed.
If Leach doesnt see stuffed runs, he runs the ball about 32.5% of the time.
So Leach, WSU abandon the run, in, during the game, which plays into this kind of defense.
This is a weakness of Leach, and most of his QB's in dealing with this defense that stops the AR pretty well.
What Leach, WSU, the QB needs to do is as Biggs, and others said is CONTINUE to run the ball about 32.5% of the time. If continue to do that WSU will have some stuffed runs. But those are like incomplete passes. But even on stuffed runs, will, would probably get at least 1.65,2,2.5,3.25 yards, making it easier to avoid 3rd and long, and making it easier to convert on 2nd, 3rd down.
And would have some 5 yard runs, and would have some 7.5 yard + runs.
But most importantly it would if run both up gut and outside, but center, right, left, OPEN UP THE PASSING GAME, KEEP THIS TYPE OF DEFENSE HONEST FORCE THE DEFENSE from a 3, 1,2, 6,7 to a 4, 1,2,3, 4,5,6 defense.
The other problem against this type of defense is that WSU, Leach doesnt rep OL run blocking enough, or wont occassionally add a 2nd back to help run block, or wont occassionally add 1 versatile TE that can both run block, catch passes, and even if he did, he wouldnt rep it enough in practice to make it work in game.
So part of the answer is Leach needs to occasionally add these wrinkles in, rep them in practice, and rep OL run blocking enough to successfully run the ball 32.5% of the time.
But leach is not doing that, and probably wont do that, so WSU, Leach, AR will still probably be vulnerable to this type of anti AR defense.
But fortunately this type of anti AR defense is not easy to do or everyone would do it.
Because its not enough to rush 3 drop 8, without adding the other elements like right run/pass zone positioning in, out, around box, and defensive player ability to READ, REACT, and pretend to either flood the box, or pretend to leave box empty.
If rush 3 DL, drop 8, and dont do those other things in addition, then WSU, QB, Leach can just audible to run, run more successfully, run at least about 32.5% of the time.
Thats why most defenses that Rush 3, drop 8 dont always work,etc, because they dont do the other stuff they need to do to be successful at stopping the AR
This is why WSU, Leach will win, 7,8,9 games, and sometimes 10 games, and almost never 11 games, because most team only rush 3 drop 8, and dont do what they need to do.
But because there is, will always be 1,2,3 defenses that do what they need to do, WSU Leach be hard pressed to win 10, 11 games.
So because of that the ceiling for Leach is 9,10 wins in a season.
Until, unless Leach runs more, which may never happen, the ceiling is 9,10 wins.
But I am ok with that, and others should be ok with that too.
2. 11 wins is the most in school history, since the rosebowl year decades ago where only reason that team didnt have more was only played about 10 games, and if had played 11,12,13, would probably have won 12, 13, more then 11.
3. As far as the AR susceptibility to rush 3, 1,2 linebackers, 6,7 DB's, and how to deal with it, etc:
The answer is of course to run the ball more, both up the gut, center, and to the outside.
And as to how the other teams stuff the run and continue with 3, 1,2, 6,7:
If I was a D coordinator, I would have NON DL players either just barely in box, just barely out of box, on border, fringe of box, in a basketball like run/pass amoeba defense zone(remember UNLV)
Then I would have the defense players READ, REACT like a awesome baseball outfielder.
In baseball, a awesome pro outfielder can position himself perfectly in such a way, that combined with QUICK, REACTION, READ, REACT, the bat hits the ball, and the player is able to get to the ball no matter where in the outfield it goes, whether short, long, left, right, center, etc.
So how does that apply to football? If you put the defense players in the right position, and if they can QUICKLY REACT, READ, REACT, then if run the ball they are able the stuff the run with a 1 to 3.3 yard gain. And if pass, they are able to either cover the WR, and or keep the WR to a 3.3 to 4.3 yard underneath gain.
Then the next thing I would do, would be to occasional just barely cheat up, pretend to stuff the box, causing the QB to go with pass, instead of run, then at last second play the pass.
Also similarly, I would pretend to only have 3 to 6 in box, causing QB to audible to run, run a run, then at the last second before snap, flood the box, stuff the run.
Yeah sure, every once in a super big while, would give up either a big run play or a big pass play.
But most of the time, this type of defense would cause the AR to run less, pass more, and when do run, to stuff run, causing run to be abandoned.
And that is the type of Defense, Cal, UW, Utah, ISU, runs so successfully against WSU.
So how does the AR deal with such a defense?
1. Need to be aware of such a defense.
2. Need to practice to deal with such a defense
3. The QB needs to be able to Read, sniff out what such a defense is doing. That takes a SPECIAL QB.
4. The coach(Leach), needs to be aware of, Read, Sniff out what the defense is doing
5. The coach needs to run more.
Now here is what happens with Leach. Leach usually runs about 68% Pass and about 32% run, over the long term.
Now what happens is in the beginning Leach will occassionally run the ball about 1 out of about 3.75 plays, or QB will audible to run when box appears empty.
Then the defense I mentioned stuffs it for either small or no gain.
So say WSU run about 3,4,5,6,7 times within the first Quarter, and half second quarter and WSU gets 2,3 stuffed runs, 1 4.85 yard run, 1 10 yard+ run.
Leach sees that, and thinks well no sense in running the ball more then about 5 to 10% of the time here in this game, because most to almost all the runs, are either being stuffed, or will be stuffed.
If Leach doesnt see stuffed runs, he runs the ball about 32.5% of the time.
So Leach, WSU abandon the run, in, during the game, which plays into this kind of defense.
This is a weakness of Leach, and most of his QB's in dealing with this defense that stops the AR pretty well.
What Leach, WSU, the QB needs to do is as Biggs, and others said is CONTINUE to run the ball about 32.5% of the time. If continue to do that WSU will have some stuffed runs. But those are like incomplete passes. But even on stuffed runs, will, would probably get at least 1.65,2,2.5,3.25 yards, making it easier to avoid 3rd and long, and making it easier to convert on 2nd, 3rd down.
And would have some 5 yard runs, and would have some 7.5 yard + runs.
But most importantly it would if run both up gut and outside, but center, right, left, OPEN UP THE PASSING GAME, KEEP THIS TYPE OF DEFENSE HONEST FORCE THE DEFENSE from a 3, 1,2, 6,7 to a 4, 1,2,3, 4,5,6 defense.
The other problem against this type of defense is that WSU, Leach doesnt rep OL run blocking enough, or wont occassionally add a 2nd back to help run block, or wont occassionally add 1 versatile TE that can both run block, catch passes, and even if he did, he wouldnt rep it enough in practice to make it work in game.
So part of the answer is Leach needs to occasionally add these wrinkles in, rep them in practice, and rep OL run blocking enough to successfully run the ball 32.5% of the time.
But leach is not doing that, and probably wont do that, so WSU, Leach, AR will still probably be vulnerable to this type of anti AR defense.
But fortunately this type of anti AR defense is not easy to do or everyone would do it.
Because its not enough to rush 3 drop 8, without adding the other elements like right run/pass zone positioning in, out, around box, and defensive player ability to READ, REACT, and pretend to either flood the box, or pretend to leave box empty.
If rush 3 DL, drop 8, and dont do those other things in addition, then WSU, QB, Leach can just audible to run, run more successfully, run at least about 32.5% of the time.
Thats why most defenses that Rush 3, drop 8 dont always work,etc, because they dont do the other stuff they need to do to be successful at stopping the AR
This is why WSU, Leach will win, 7,8,9 games, and sometimes 10 games, and almost never 11 games, because most team only rush 3 drop 8, and dont do what they need to do.
But because there is, will always be 1,2,3 defenses that do what they need to do, WSU Leach be hard pressed to win 10, 11 games.
So because of that the ceiling for Leach is 9,10 wins in a season.
Until, unless Leach runs more, which may never happen, the ceiling is 9,10 wins.
But I am ok with that, and others should be ok with that too.
Weird. Matt took off after we won.
Not sure if this is serious or not. My father in law drove a truck for a living. Worked his ass off for 30 years. I respect the heck out of him.
Give me a truck driver over some ambulance chasing lawyer or some business major-turned parasitic white collar bankster making a living off others peoples’ hard earned money any day of the week.
Ahh - the beauty of language.
Seriously, though - just saw something on the news, maybe it was 60 minutes on Sikh truck drivers in the US. There's like Bollywood style recruiting videos. Serious trucker shortage in the US. Those guys are making bank.
Gray. You one of those ambulance chasers or trial lawyers that ensure only those with money get fair treatment under the law?
I’m not a personal injury attorney. But are you under the misimpression that regular people could ever afford to pursue a remedy for their injuries but for the willingness of PI lawyers to advance costs and their time, without payment, for months and months?
And in my observation, poor people are at least as likely to be injured as wealthy people are.
No, but I have been exposed to (insert ailment or substance here).
Can you explain to me why somebody with money can get off from a drunk driving charge while those with money can't? Or those with money can get away with more serious charges like murder, while those without money often plead guilty (even when they aren't) because they simply can't afford the lawyers and time it takes to fight their charges?
ambulance chasers and banksters?
Honest question: what percent of law students would you guess go into what I consider “honorable” law fields such as a public defender, versus the mercenaries like the ones that got O.J. acquitted or the ones that are behind the disclaimers on commercials that tell us wrestling with grizzly bears is dangerous?
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I just never met a lawyer who didn’t know that one-third of nothing equals nothing.
The big money corruption tends to reside on the big money client side of the issues. I don’t represent insurance companies, but I know who has the money in a PI setting.
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[QUOTE="fingerdisco, post: 194171, member
Honest question: what percent of law students would you guess go into what I consider “honorable” law fields such as a public defender, versus the mercenaries like the ones that got O.J. acquitted or the ones that are behind the disclaimers on commercials that tell us wrestling with grizzly bears is dangerous?[/QUOTE]
It’s hard to begrudge a criminal defendant a high priced defense given the resources the State has at its disposal. Some guilty go free. I’m far more offended that some not guilty go to prison or the gallows.
I suppose you can be upset at silly warnings. Most jurors already know wrestling with grizzly bears is dangerous.
Honest question: what percent of law students would you guess go into what I consider “honorable” law fields such as a public defender, versus the mercenaries like the ones that got O.J. acquitted or the ones that are behind the disclaimers on commercials that tell us wrestling with grizzly bears is dangerous?[/QUOTE]
It’s hard to begrudge a criminal defendant a high priced defense given the resources the State has at its disposal. Some guilty go free. I’m far more offended that some not guilty go to prison or the gallows.
I suppose you can be upset at silly warnings. Most jurors already know wrestling with grizzly bears is dangerous.
Not only that, but everyone I know who went to UW, took the direct transfer route to get there. Get a C average at community college, transfer in to UW. Nothing wrong with that, but their argument is a little exaggerated. Not to mention, UW historically takes 60-70% of washington HS applicants. Their oversees outreach really pumps up their rejection numbers. They mass market the Univeristy in order to reject maximum numbers of applicants using a short form application first. In other words, they make it super easy to fill out the application.
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We won 11 games this year. What are you expecting? Winning with style? I don't understand the problem. I'll take 11 wins every season...no matter how the game looks. You wouldn't? Baffling.
Hey...what's wrong with Bed, Bath, and Beyond?? I particularly like the "Beyond" part.
What you make of your education depends entirely on the student. In that sense, the school doesn't matter. The so called "elite" schools focus on admitting those who they believe will be the most successful in their work life (because more money to give back to the school).
Ever heard Chelsea Clinton talk or read her writing? She attended Furd. Clearly, not due to her intellect.
I'd be embarrassed to claim her as a grad if I also was a Furd alum. There are many more examples.
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Bingo! Give the man a cigar. ISU was killing us by running at our undersized DL. But if McDougle is as good as advertised and some of the other defensive linemen gain the size that we hope and expect that they will,, this will be a reduced problem next year. Kudos to the Clones for seeing the opportunity and taking it.
Exactly. I agree. If one cannot find anything to do with all the other students in Pullman- and the U of I is a hop, skip and a jump down the road- then you have a personality disorder. The problem is on you, not the school.
Exactly. Next year, the defense can be better. Also, Montgomery is a beast. He is going to be a NFL back some day. By the way, he is going to have a better NFL career than Miles Gaskin.
This all stems from losing apple cups, nothing more. Like I said before, we're still beating most of the teams that match up well against on D like this. It's the one we haven't beat that it causing all this hand wringing. As long as our talent level is maintained/increased, I'm not worried about any of it.
What WSU did do that was impressive against ISU was get TD's when they got in the Red Zone. 4 for 4 and no settling for FG's.
For all of the hand wringing from ISU on officiating , that was the real difference in a very tight game. This is also what has separates WSU to be a 11-2 team instead of 6-6 team. Reality is they have about the same talent as most of the .500 teams out there, but they simply know how to win the tight games where others have not made that leap.
What Leach still lacks is a real difference maker at receiver. Where he took Tech to another level was when he had Crabtree. Defenses like UW or ISU would not get away with some of the coverages that they are using now if there was a true gamebreaker on the outside.
That genius was me. I still think the offense needs a way to hit a defense quickly right up the middle. It's the one missing piece. I'm happy that we have what we have, but it could be better, and I hope it gets better. The offense was more diverse in 2016 than it is now (though not necessarily better).
That offensive balance comment is probably fine it was just the reference to Holgerson that is misplaced . Like I posted he did not have the first about how to generate any offense this year against ISU.
I did notice as the year went on Minshew checked to the run less and less. Actually that turned out fine as WSU obviously continued to win. But I do think Minshew has a healthy amount of confidence that it is on his shoulders to make the plays to win. If you think about it the one play where he loses that control early in a play is when he hands the ball off. The Leach system depends on the QB to be the complete game manager and really does not give him a predetermined amount of times that he needs to run the ball.
Husky asked if I was wearing my red hat, suggesting I was getting Trumpy. I indicated my gat is gray.
It all makes sense now. Ever since Husky lost his coolness I uh, no longer see his posts. Am I missing much?
Ok, ok, evening after. My rant was pretty much inexcusable. I said those things out of sheer frustration. When ever we did something positive, it was countered by a negative. And when we had the chance to bury them, we let them crawl back in. I’m passionate about my Cougars, yes, to a fault. I can’t take back my stupid, sophomoric tirade. I just love our Cougs and want them to kick everyone’s ass. I knew going into the Alamo bowl we were the better team. All this talk about ISU being familiar with the AR offense, sure, but not at the level we play. Extremely proud of this team, I have tremendous respect for our program and wish I could have voiced my frustration in a more positive way. Go Cougs!
Agree. He needs a legit deep threat play maker. A kid that can take the top off the defense and stretch them vertically.
