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Athletics audit findings.....

Loyal Coug

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Sep 27, 2003
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...links below. Also a related Bill Moos article on Brand Y. All kinds of no-no's went on under Moos.

https://dailyevergreen.com/31759/ne...management-in-athletics-complimentary-ticket/

http://pullmanradio.com/internal-audit-uncovers-extensive-mismanagement-in-wsu-athletics/

https://dailyevergreen.com/31099/news/investigation-finds-wsu-athletics-employee-violated-title-ix/

In hindsight, it appears that Moos' buddy hires from Oregon (Mike Marlow, Farkas and Lucier) were less than honorable guys. Marlow's blatant attendance inflation, while nothing new at WSU, are really pathetic. Glad he left. Lucier was not a good guy - and he was in charge of Compliance!?

All in all, more of the shine of Moos' tenure is coming off. Which is too bad. I met him more than once, I liked him and drank the Koolaid. I think the lack of fundraising ability was perhaps his biggest shortcoming. I am starting to think that this weakness was hidden under the green robes of King Phil at Orygon.

Finally, the self-inflicted financial crisis at WSU was really a perfect storm with Moos and Floyd's "damn the cost, full speed ahead" approach to everything WSU. Sadly, Shultz so far has not really done much to pare down the bloated and complicit administration that contributed to the university side of the deficit. You don't run that far into the hole unless you have incompetence and enabling and trough feeding among the administrators - none of whom have been terminated since Shultz arrived. He's just added more.
 
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Attendance audits for sporting events are a joke.

Still getting two emails a week from the Oklahoma AD because Jim Sterk couldn't properly manage a shake down of the boosters for 2003 Rose Bowl tickets.
 
...links below. Also a related Bill Moos article on Brand Y. All kinds of no-no's went on under Loos.

https://dailyevergreen.com/31759/ne...management-in-athletics-complimentary-ticket/

http://pullmanradio.com/internal-audit-uncovers-extensive-mismanagement-in-wsu-athletics/

https://dailyevergreen.com/31099/news/investigation-finds-wsu-athletics-employee-violated-title-ix/

In hindsight, it appears that Moos' buddy hires from Oregon (Mike Marlow, Farkas and Lucier) were less than honorable guys. Marlow's blatant attendance inflation, while nothing new at WSU, are really pathetic. Glad he left. Lucier was not a good guy - and he was in charge of Compliance!?

All in all, more of the shine of Moos' tenure is coming off. Which is too bad. I met him more than once, I liked him and drank the Koolaid. I think the lack of fundraising ability was perhaps his biggedt shortcoming. I am starting to think that this weakness was hidden under the green robes of King Phil at Orygon.

Finally, the self-inflicted financial crisis at WSU was really a perfect storm with Moos and Floyd's "damn the cost, full speed ahead" approach to everything WSU. Sadly, Shultz so far has not really done much to pare down the bloated and complicit administration that contributed to the university side of the deficit. You don't run that far into the hole unless you have incompetence and enabling and trough feeding among the administrators - none of whom have been terminated since Shultz arrived. He's just added more.

You need another element - lack of controls, processes and procedures.

As I understand it, there was no formal budgeting process or accountability reviews within the athletic department (and possibly the entire university).

That's a recipe for disaster. With my entire heart, I believe it all comes down to people and processes. Put good people in bad processes and it will eventually chew them up. Put bad people in good processes, it will flush them out or shape them up. Put bad people in bad processes, you may call it a 'perfect storm' but I call it a cluster of epic proportions.

But, hey, the color crimson is standardized for every team now so it's all good.
 
You need another element - lack of controls, processes and procedures.

As I understand it, there was no formal budgeting process or accountability reviews within the athletic department (and possibly the entire university).

That's a recipe for disaster. With my entire heart, I believe it all comes down to people and processes. Put good people in bad processes and it will eventually chew them up. Put bad people in good processes, it will flush them out or shape them up. Put bad people in bad processes, you may call it a 'perfect storm' but I call it a cluster of epic proportions.

But, hey, the color crimson is standardized for every team now so it's all good.
I think you highlight a real issue. When Moos took over, there was very, very little structure. There was obviously no processes or standards for decisions. There was no balance or checks. And although it was meant as a joke, our school color wasn't even standardized. And as crazy as it is, I'm glad he did this. It was a small thing but that's the stuff you do first! Small stuff is quick. I'm not trying to prop up Moos but I think he also took over a department that was about 25 years behind what most schools athletic departments had. At least.

Did he do anything to improve the "cluster"? I don't think so. Not that much, anyways. I think he liked the "all on his own" feel. But it will be interesting to see what Chun does... or if we even get a glimpse of this kind of upgrade in internal structure, especially since we are in major budget crunch and hiring more, or giving more responsibility to others, may not be in the budget. But at some point, we're going to have to pony up for this. We need this foundational stuff. And it's stuff that no one really cares about, doesn't want to earmark their donations for it.
 
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I’m afraid most of us drank the Kool Aid. Moos is sure coming off as a cowboy salesman now, rather than a competent leader. These types of salespeople find a way of doing that, but eventually they get found out. My guess is Moos saw this coming from a ways out and made a proper escape while he still had his name.

Oh well. The FOB was still necessary to keep up with the PAC 12 arms race. It seems like Chun has his shit together and will help get the admistrative part on track. With the visibility I’ve seen from him so far, I think we’re going to be WAY better off when it comes to funding.
 
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...links below. Also a related Bill Moos article on Brand Y. All kinds of no-no's went on under Loos.

https://dailyevergreen.com/31759/ne...management-in-athletics-complimentary-ticket/

http://pullmanradio.com/internal-audit-uncovers-extensive-mismanagement-in-wsu-athletics/

https://dailyevergreen.com/31099/news/investigation-finds-wsu-athletics-employee-violated-title-ix/

In hindsight, it appears that Moos' buddy hires from Oregon (Mike Marlow, Farkas and Lucier) were less than honorable guys. Marlow's blatant attendance inflation, while nothing new at WSU, are really pathetic. Glad he left. Lucier was not a good guy - and he was in charge of Compliance!?

All in all, more of the shine of Moos' tenure is coming off. Which is too bad. I met him more than once, I liked him and drank the Koolaid. I think the lack of fundraising ability was perhaps his biggedt shortcoming. I am starting to think that this weakness was hidden under the green robes of King Phil at Orygon.

Finally, the self-inflicted financial crisis at WSU was really a perfect storm with Moos and Floyd's "damn the cost, full speed ahead" approach to everything WSU. Sadly, Shultz so far has not really done much to pare down the bloated and complicit administration that contributed to the university side of the deficit. You don't run that far into the hole unless you have incompetence and enabling and trough feeding among the administrators - none of whom have been terminated since Shultz arrived. He's just added more.

You're bent out of shape about complimentary tickets? Say it with me COMPLIMENTARY. WSU wasn't going to sell them anyway since these ticket figures were so greatly exaggerated.

Everyone counts tickets sold instead of butts in seats. Who, what, whatever does that hurt?

Marlow destroyed evidence. OK. Does that mean that he deleted emails? Did he delete all his emails all the time? Did he only delete these specific emails? Was it something else?

The conjecture that there may be a NCAA violation is baseless. "The report notes that incomplete information on who receives free tickets could result in NCAA violations, since proper use of those tickets can’t be assured." This is like saying that when a student's car breaks down on the way back from spring break, and I pick that kid up and take him to the nearest town I might have committed a NCAA violation because I didn't make the kid swear on the bible that he's not a student-athlete and may have provided an impermissible benefit.

As far as the IMG contract goes, the State, state entities, corporations, all kinds of people screw up contract administration. The solution is easy. Tell them we're giving IMG less comped tickets in the future. Cause those are are totally sold out, man.... Or maybe not. Or maybe it doesn't matter.
 
You need another element - lack of controls, processes and procedures.

As I understand it, there was no formal budgeting process or accountability reviews within the athletic department (and possibly the entire university).

That's a recipe for disaster. With my entire heart, I believe it all comes down to people and processes. Put good people in bad processes and it will eventually chew them up. Put bad people in good processes, it will flush them out or shape them up. Put bad people in bad processes, you may call it a 'perfect storm' but I call it a cluster of epic proportions.

But, hey, the color crimson is standardized for every team now so it's all good.

And WSU is actually relevant in the world of college football. Winning sucks.
 
You're bent out of shape about complimentary tickets? Say it with me COMPLIMENTARY. WSU wasn't going to sell them anyway since these ticket figures were so greatly exaggerated.

Everyone counts tickets sold instead of butts in seats. Who, what, whatever does that hurt?

Marlow destroyed evidence. OK. Does that mean that he deleted emails? Did he delete all his emails all the time? Did he only delete these specific emails? Was it something else?

The conjecture that there may be a NCAA violation is baseless. "The report notes that incomplete information on who receives free tickets could result in NCAA violations, since proper use of those tickets can’t be assured." This is like saying that when a student's car breaks down on the way back from spring break, and I pick that kid up and take him to the nearest town I might have committed a NCAA violation because I didn't make the kid swear on the bible that he's not a student-athlete and may have provided an impermissible benefit.

As far as the IMG contract goes, the State, state entities, corporations, all kinds of people screw up contract administration. The solution is easy. Tell them we're giving IMG less comped tickets in the future. Cause those are are totally sold out, man.... Or maybe not. Or maybe it doesn't matter.

I never said I was bent out of shape about anything. Calm down. This part below is a little concerning though. Athletics employees got special premium seat discounts, and then didn't even pay up for the discounted amount? Taken as a whole, as the report stated, “the environment within Athletics, as it existed during the scope period and through the end of fieldwork, did not support a culture of compliance or fiscal responsibility.”

The audit examined benefits related to football tickets for athletics staff, revealing employees took advantage of upgrading discounts to the premium club seating at Martin Stadium that have been in place since 2012. The discounts weren’t offered to the public or to other university employees. The audit states this could be a violation of special privileges under state law, and the illegal discounts could cost the university about $130,000 in lost revenue for fiscal year 2017. During the 2016 season, over half of the athletics staff who took advantage of the discount didn’t fully pay for their seats.

I don't see any of this as some gigantic deal, but thought it worth sharing and discussing. All the guys involved are gone, which is good IMHO. And to think Marlow was our AD in waiting. Maybe this sheds some light on why that didn't come to pass, and he bolted.
 
I never said I was bent out of shape about anything. Calm down. This part below is a little concerning though. Athletics employees got special premium seat discounts, and then didn't even pay up for the discounted amount? Taken as a whole, as the report stated, “the environment within Athletics, as it existed during the scope period and through the end of fieldwork, did not support a culture of compliance or fiscal responsibility.”

The audit examined benefits related to football tickets for athletics staff, revealing employees took advantage of upgrading discounts to the premium club seating at Martin Stadium that have been in place since 2012. The discounts weren’t offered to the public or to other university employees. The audit states this could be a violation of special privileges under state law, and the illegal discounts could cost the university about $130,000 in lost revenue for fiscal year 2017. During the 2016 season, over half of the athletics staff who took advantage of the discount didn’t fully pay for their seats.

I don't see any of this as some gigantic deal, but thought it worth sharing and discussing. All the guys involved are gone, which is good IMHO. And to think Marlow was our AD in waiting. Maybe this sheds some light on why that didn't come to pass, and he bolted.

Or because fundraising needed a kick in the butt and Marlow wasn't the guy for it.

If the law was violated, then those responsible have to pay the price. But, we're talking about discounted tickets. There was no lost revenue because those tickets were not going to be sold. The $130,000 is maybe what, around .05% of the athletics budget from 2012-2017.
 
Or because fundraising needed a kick in the butt and Marlow wasn't the guy for it.

If the law was violated, then those responsible have to pay the price. But, we're talking about discounted tickets. There was no lost revenue because those tickets were not going to be sold. The $130,000 is maybe what, around .05% of the athletics budget from 2012-2017.

Well actually, you don't know that. Premium seats, if they mean up in the luxury area, very well may have been marketable to other fans. But whatever, you and Pete have a good chitty-chat in his thread. I have to get ready to watch Aron Baynes and the Celtics.
 
I find this “well now that he up and left us look at how bad he was” sour grapes to be hilarious.

Where was the money for the cougar football project and stadium and quality coaches going to come from? Our fans don’t donate appropriately. They have every excuse in the book “win and i’ll Donate” blah blah they said. Well...we won 3 years in a row.

The school had to go into debt and we are now making more money than anytime in our history.

This article is complaining about attendance numbers...some tickets they don’t know who get them...some IMG contract that didn’t receive competing bids?

It’s all ticky tack bullsh*t to try and villanize Moos.

If you are delusional to think that he is a bad AD then watch what happens with Nebraska and Scott Frost. They are going to be a success just like we were when Moos hired Leach and I’ll bet busker fans won’t give two sh*ts about “who got tickets” and ooh there was a 100k mistake here and ooooh we didn’t have a competing bid against a company that pretty much has a monopoly on collegiate athletics (seriously go look up IMG)

Now Moos did make a mistake with Kent. That I believe was a mistake and I have not seen much positive from Kent’s tenure. So basketball is a bust, but Football. The most important of all athletic sports Moos was a homerun. THAT is why Nebraska hired him. You don’t get hired to head the athletics department of a team with multiple national titles coming from the smallest and most remote Power 5 school.....unless you turn it completely around to be a competitor with much larger programs. And that is what Moos did.

Now as I have said before the athletic department will be making a lot of money in the future. There is debt to pay, but every year the amount is decreasing.

Seriously crying about this is like buying a house and then crying about the mortgage payment. Yes you have to make payments...because you didn’t have the money to do what you wanted to do. Now you have to pay it off and every year you get closer to getting rid of the debt.

The PAC 12 posted its best revenue year yet and that is going to be about a 30 million dollar payout per school.
https://www.mercurynews.com/2018/05...evenue-campus-payouts-in-line-with-estimates/

When you actually look at this it is clearly new guys coming in and not understanding why the debt exists in the first place.

The athletic department will be in the black by 2020
http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2018/apr/27/washington-state-athletic-department-in-67-million/

But they are crying about the accumulated debt (as I said of course there will be debt you didn’t have the money to build a new stadium and football ops building!)

61 million for football ops building and
Then like 65 million for the stadium / press boxes for a total of 125 million.

That was the cost and it has been known for a long time that was the cost
http://sportspressnw.com/2133995/2012/cougars-football-stadium-remodel-nears-debut

Now six years later you have a new AD and President going “uhhh hey uhhh why is there this debt”

They even add up the deficient (because of the payments for the 125 million dollar upgrade) every year and are like HEY you all are in debt! It’s 65 million!

No sh*t it’s a 125 million dollar project.

They might as well add up all the payments and say “hey they spent 125 million!” No sh*t we knew that from the beginning.

The athletic department was always under the assumption that the school would help subsidize the payments...but Schultz and Chun weren’t part of that understanding so they are like why you need so much money?

I can’t hammer this point hard enough...the athletic department is making a ton of money they just have to pay the debt of 125 million dollars. That’s always what the problem has been.


And by 2020 they will be in the black. Now the school subsidized the payments so let’s say it is another 20 million from now until 2020.

The total “deficit” that the school had to carry would be 85 million over an 8 year payments (2012-2020) for a 125 million dollar project.

Which means the athletic department paid 40 million bucks over those 8 years or 5 million per year while winning games.

The reality is that WSU embarked on a massive project...which it will have to make payments on...
And new guys came in and are throwing a fit about such payments...
And the athletic department is making more and more and more money every year paying that debt off but now has the new guys crying about the subsided help with those payments.

Just to show you how much absolute bullsh*t this whole "deficit" thing is...

Back in 2012 Washington State's athletic revenue was just WSU athletic department "generated $42 million in revenue" Which the Pac - 12 dispersing 21 million that was 2012.
Source link: http://sportspressnw.com/2152799/2013/moos-believes-cougs-can-compete-in-arms-race

If you want to go back to 2011

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It was 40.6 million.

So 40.6 million in 2010-2011
42 million in 2012-2013

That's are starting point six years ago. about 42 million in budget.

What is it doay in 2018?

about 58 million in revenue.
https://247sports.com/college/washi...enses-answer-to-deficit-is-greater-r-74922855

Meaning that we gained almost 50% in revenue from where we were in 2012.

From about 40 to about 60 million.

And the athletic department will more than likely be in the black by 2020.

Leaving the University with its subsidized portion of the debt. Which can be replenished by just throwing excess back to them from the surplus which the athletic department should have after 2020.

What I am driving at is that the University spent 120 million dollars to have a nice modern stadium, a football operations building, and quality coaches to compete athletically.

During that time we had 3 winning seasons in a row, and a 50% increase in our athletic revenue that WILL pay off that debt and then some, and a new President and AD walking in throwing a tempertantrum because they weren't part of this whole situation and blaming it on the other guys.

Schultz and Chun haven't done a damn thing for WSU. Not 1 damn thing. They haven't proven to make anything better since they got here. Nothing. Moss did improve things. He improved the stadium, he improved the football team, he improved our athletic revenue by 50%. There is a cost associated with those improvements and those costs WERE KNOWN when we started.

Now instead of trying to seriously work to make money they are adding up every year of the deficit (which was known) and crying that it costs money. Of course it costs money. It cost 120 million bucks + upgrading the coaching staff.

We didn't have the coaching staff, we didn't have the facilities or a decent venue. we had cheaped out for so long that we had teams kneeling it on the 50 yard line instead of a pitty punt. That's how bad it was.

Every single year of our success we are making more and more and more money in the athletic department, and the debt payments are going to be gone and then our athletic department is in the black.

Will the University be paid back for subsidizing? Yes... it will be. that was all part of the plan, but at least now it's not interest payments and it can easily be transfered as surplus... but that won't happen till 2020.

This is all blowhard bllush*t stuff.

We all knew we spent 120 million dollars on upgrading football.
We all knew there would be debt on it.
I don't care if they give away unsold tickets to people
I don't care if they count tickets sold as opposed to tickets scanned (all programs do that)

The more I see Schultz around the athletic department the more I don't like it.

Make us more money Schultz, don't screw with our successful football program.
 
Well actually, you don't know that. Premium seats, if they mean up in the luxury area, very well may have been marketable to other fans. But whatever, you and Pete have a good chitty-chat in his thread. I have to get ready to watch Aron Baynes and the Celtics.

Right. That must be why the seats were available for the employee discount....
 
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  • I find this “well now that he up and left us look at how bad he was” sour grapes to be hilarious
  • It’s all ticky tack bullsh*t to try and villanize Moos
  • If you are delusional to think that he is a bad AD, then watch what happens with Nebraska and Scott Frost
  • The more I see Schultz around the athletic department the more I don't like it
tenor.gif
 
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It's Lucifer...not Lucier.

Moos's hiring of Ernie and renewing his contract each year has been a travesty. Oh, and paying the guy $1.5M per year. Unreal. I could have led the team to more wins during his tenure and I'd have been very willing to sign a heavily incentive-based contract.
 
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You need another element - lack of controls, processes and procedures.

As I understand it, there was no formal budgeting process or accountability reviews within the athletic department (and possibly the entire university).

That's a recipe for disaster. With my entire heart, I believe it all comes down to people and processes. Put good people in bad processes and it will eventually chew them up. Put bad people in good processes, it will flush them out or shape them up. Put bad people in bad processes, you may call it a 'perfect storm' but I call it a cluster of epic proportions.

But, hey, the color crimson is standardized for every team now so it's all good.


Observer, your comment: "With my entire heart, I believe it all comes down to people and processes. Put good people in bad processes and it will eventually chew them up. Put bad people in good processes, it will flush them out or shape them up. Put bad people in bad processes, you may call it a 'perfect storm' but I call it a cluster of epic proportions.", is probably as succinct a summary of how organizations (pretty much all organizations) really work as I've seen. Well done. POTD for me.

I'll just add that good people + good processes = potential for world class
 
Observer, your comment: "With my entire heart, I believe it all comes down to people and processes. Put good people in bad processes and it will eventually chew them up. Put bad people in good processes, it will flush them out or shape them up. Put bad people in bad processes, you may call it a 'perfect storm' but I call it a cluster of epic proportions.", is probably as succinct a summary of how organizations (pretty much all organizations) really work as I've seen. Well done. POTD for me.

I'll just add that good people + good processes = potential for world class
I'm so stealing this guys. You guys are spot on. Great quotes
 
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