Chidom transferring
- Thread starter etowncoug
- Start date
Wondered why he didn’t play against Montana State. Wish he was sticking around but hope it works out for him wherever he ends up.
G Ny Redding (Wyoming); C Valentine Izundu (San Diego State); G Que Johnson (Western Kentucky); G Derrien King (Angelo State); G Renard Suggs (Nebraska-Omaha); F Aaron Cheatum (Cal State San Bernardino); G Jackie Davis (Odessa College); G Trevor Dunbar (City College of San Francisco); G Milan Acquaah (Cal State Baptist); G Malachi Flynn (San Diego State); G Jamar Ergas (South Plains Junior College); G TJ Mickelson (Lake Region State College) and guard Kwinton Hinson (Life University).
Is this a preview of our non-con schedule for next year? If so I predict a 1-10 start.
Chidum seems like a good kid, and I thought he had some upside. However it didint look like he had made much improvement this year.
As for Kent, I think he under achieved 2 of his first 4 years. However this season I am willing to watch it play out. Nobody likes losing to a Mont St, but 95-90 or 50-45 makes no difference. I still think there is more talent on this team than people think. Maybe Ernie will develop it, maybe he won't.
As for Kent, I think he under achieved 2 of his first 4 years. However this season I am willing to watch it play out. Nobody likes losing to a Mont St, but 95-90 or 50-45 makes no difference. I still think there is more talent on this team than people think. Maybe Ernie will develop it, maybe he won't.
It doesn't much matter what Ernie does this year or next, he's gone. Chun isn't going to pay $1.4 Million again to the guy. That's purely the definition of insanity. Whether or not Ernie develops what he has right now is irrelevent. That grave has already been dug - we just have to wait until the seasons change so the dirt can be shoveled back over the top of it.
And, to anyone thinking Ernie will 'do the right thing' and resign is crazy. Nobody walks away from $1.4 Million per year without a major NCAA scandal or compromising pictures. Just isn't going to happen. He's on the bench for the foreseeable future.
Been a lot of years when we didnt even have two guys who were better than marginal Pac 12. As for the rest of the roster it may or may not be the worst but Wade, Robinson, and Ali are significant upgrades over previous JC kids. Very few JV players dont have an adjustment period.
Kunc isnt likely to help much this year, but looks like a kid we want to keep.
Kunc isnt likely to help much this year, but looks like a kid we want to keep.
Quote from the presser:
"This is not an Ernie Kent problem. This is not a Washington State problem. This is a societal problem." I'm sure he'll get mocked for this, but he's not wrong on this point.
The Ernie Kent problem is the team isn't ready to play consistently. The Washington State problem is the program doesn't have the resources to attract top talent. The societal program is kids consistently transfer looking for a better deal.
"This is not an Ernie Kent problem. This is not a Washington State problem. This is a societal problem." I'm sure he'll get mocked for this, but he's not wrong on this point.
The Ernie Kent problem is the team isn't ready to play consistently. The Washington State problem is the program doesn't have the resources to attract top talent. The societal program is kids consistently transfer looking for a better deal.
Chidum was a project from Day 1, but looked like a good gamble. He didn't seem to develop much from last season.
As for Ernie, I agree that too many times the team hasnt been ready to play. That is why I thought we under achieved 2 of the l last 4 seasons.
The problem with the MSU game wasnt giving up 95 points, but rather not taking advantage of multiple opportunities to to over come the unconsciously hot hand of a 25% 3 point shooter.
Also, sometimes teams just get hot in the 3 point era. Ask Tony about that against a 16 seed.
As for Ernie, I agree that too many times the team hasnt been ready to play. That is why I thought we under achieved 2 of the l last 4 seasons.
The problem with the MSU game wasnt giving up 95 points, but rather not taking advantage of multiple opportunities to to over come the unconsciously hot hand of a 25% 3 point shooter.
Also, sometimes teams just get hot in the 3 point era. Ask Tony about that against a 16 seed.
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If it's a societal problem, then the same variable is in play across all universities. Everyone has to deal with it.
Somehow Ernie has determined that he is the sole victim of society's woes.
Which, to me, is a loser mentality to steal a phrase from the great googler Tron.
Not buying what he's selling there.
What presser - you mean this is an EK quote? The top part that is. What is a societal problem? What was the question anyway? Why kids are transferring? I'm confused.
And here we are again with facilities. Or whatever resources are - maybe you mean charters. But/so are you giving EK a pass on recruiting? if we had better "resources" he would be bringing in top talent? BS. He sucks and needs to be fired. Or quit. And he bears no responsibility for his recruits leaving in droves nearly every year? BS again. He is nothing but a TV evangelist whose flock has gotten tired of him.
Yes. Ernie said this in his weekly presser today. The question referred to why so many kids transfer. Ernie said it's a societal problem. He's not wrong on this.
You might think we should be winning and going to the NCAA's every few years with the worst facilities and travel schedule in the conference because that's what a good coach should do at WSU. But this isn't reality. Short of envelopes full of cash going to recruits, no high 3 star or low 4 star talent is coming here until we start to have some success. So Ernie has been left taking chances on fringe prospects. When they work out it looks like Robert Franks or Vionte Daniels, but most of the time it looks like Arinze Chidom, Jamar Ergas, Trevor Dunbar, or Jackie Davis. When these guys don't work out, its not like they were being chosen over more talented prospects. All but 3 of the transfers under Kent have been low percentage guys to begin with. Any coach you bring in is going to have similar problems until you demonstrate a desire to put the resources into the program to compete at the Pac-12 level.
Compounding this problem is the LeBron James effect. The biggest star in basketball has infected the games culture with a "I'm taking my talents to..." mindset. He made it acceptable to transfer 3 times in 5 years to find the right situation. Kids are transferring multiple times in high school to find a "better situation". Gone are the days of a Caleb Forrest working his way from the 11th or 12th man to the 8th or 9th over his career. Instead, if there isn't a clear path to start, they transfer. Winning would probably cure a lot of this, but as I mentioned earlier, it's hard to win with a bunch of randos.
My complaint with Ernie is the team doesn't show up too often. This could be fixed with a new coach. But the barrier to competitiveness is far larger than CEK.
This is an interesting take away from his comments. Saying it's a societal problem implies everyone has to deal with it. He's not saying he's some sort of unique victim here. He is telling everyone to stop bitching about transfers like it is somehow unique to him and Washington State. Big difference between the two.
Thanks for the long explanation in the other post. Although I'd like to see what the typical transfer rate is out there. Hard to believe many if any schools are as bad us WSU.
One thing I will say that I think is hard to argue - While the Bennett era was welcomed and cherished, it really did create a perception or attitude among many people, myself included, that a good coach with a good system and a bunch of hardworking, blue collar guys could be not just good, but great. None of Dicks original recruits were all that "good", but they became a great team. I remember what Notre Dame said when we beat them in the round of 32 - "they (WSU) just imposed their will on us). Too bad we had to play NC in the next round. Beating the mutts 7 in a row over 3 years. Beating Gonzaga back to back. Those were the days.
That scenario was a one in a million luckout, that is for sure.
I watched some of the ND game last night on Pac 12 Washington and it still surprises me when even our fans suggest that group wasn't all that talented. I'm not exactly sure what they are seeing.
None of Dicks original recruits were all that "good", but they became a great team. I
Geezus. If I said they were all fantastic, you guys would be telling me that they weren't that good. As Dick said, when he first came to WSU Weaver couldn't "guard a chair". Maybe good coaching had a little bit to do with how "good" they became? You all totally missed the point of my post.
And Baynes and Rochestie were not Dick's first recruits.
Geezus. If I said they were all fantastic, you guys would be telling me that they weren't that good. As Dick said, when he first came to WSU Weaver couldn't "guard a chair". Maybe good coaching had a little bit to do with how "good" they became? You all totally missed the point of my post.
And Baynes and Rochestie were not Dick's first recruits.
For the "basketball fans' who spout off without knowing anything. A quick study on the other board show a couple of interesting things., Since the year 2014 the cougs rank 3rd in the number of transfers in the PAC 12. Utah has had 18 transfers while ASU leads the pack with 20. Other numbers Oregon 15.OSU 11 and Washington 13. Stanford and UCLA had small numbers So it is seemingly people with an axe to grind who complain. They need to look at what is happening with many programs. Not enough wins sure but seizing on transfers who leave for many and varied reasons is only talking just to be heard.The number of transfers the last 4-5 years in the collegiate ranks is astounding and many kids are seeking greener pastures.
A quick check shows that there has been 875 transfers in D 1 college basketball alone for the year 2018.The number in D 11 basketball mirrors that.There is more complete information available but i am too lazy to pursue that.
I’m not sure who you’re referencing but I’ve coached upwards of 400 games and my father was a high school coach too. Been around the game my entire life. Can’t even fathom the number of games played in, watched and coached - several thousand?
Transfers aside, I know good basketball. Ernie’s teams don’t play good basketball.
It’s probably pretty close that at the high school level with regards to kids who don’t live in a particular attendance area or transfer from one school to another - at least 30% is my guess. Pretty common the last 5 or so years. It's the new normal. Thanks, Lebron superteams and AAU.
It's weak that Ernie uses that as a crutch. It happens to everybody. It may not be 'right' but that's the way of the world.
Dont see how this is an arguement "against fan who do not now". P5 team ranked in top 3nfor transfers shows a problem. Its not like we are loosing player to other P5 teams.
Kent needs to go. Not sure how that plays out but guessing one of 3 scenarios.
1. Find someone cheap for the next 2-3+years to be a stop gap for facilitites, charters, etc.
2. Best we can find atm. Pay around 1.5 mil foe next coach and hope he can do what Ernie cant with facilitites, lack of charters, middle ground.
3. Some goldie lock zone coach. Around 1 mil that will allow us to do a littlenof both (unlikley)
Kent will be here next year, Someone on the other board posted that Chidom has a learning disability and may have had problems picking up stuff. It seems that Kent invested a lot of time on the guy. Yes i have been around basketball for ages and thousands of games does sound familiar as a player,referee.observer and coach at the HS level.I have spent time talking with guys like KC Jones and others who did know a lot about basketball and life in general.I would expect that a few fans here have spent a lot of time with the game they love. There will always be differing opinions on the game and players
Here is an idea. Take the money it would cost to buy out Ernie, and put it into facilities and travel. That investment might lure a much better candidate than we could get today, and it is likely nobody would improve the record much over the next 2 years anyway.
I think Kent should be fired, but I can see the argument for keeping him and spending the buy out money for upgrades. At this point our program can’t sink any further. As far as the transfers go, it is the world we live in. I can see pros and cons for both the schools and players. It appears we were not going to get much out of Chidom this year or the next so it is probably best for the team if he moves on. Hopefully for his sake he ends up in a positive situation.
What if Paul Graham was the coach, not Ernie Kent, under the same contract? Would it still be better to bite the bullet, keep him around, and use the buyout money instead to pay for facilities and travel? Legitimate question, I'm not trying to belittle your suggestion...it has merit. I'm also not suggesting that Ernie Kent is remotely close to being as bad as Graham, who was, IMO, the worst basketball hire ever made by a Pac-12 school. But at some point when a coach's winning percentage remains below 40% after 5 years and there is very little interest in the program, is it the right thing to keep him around?
Glad Cougar
If WSU’s athletic department wasn’t in huge debt that would be a solid strategy. Unfortunately it’s like dreaming about what to do if you won the Powerball. I don’t see any other route than to keep Ernie around for at least a couple more years.
Good points bith if you. I can differentiate between Graham and Kent. You might disagree but Kent is still a significantly better coach than Graham was. I think the program would benefit under Ernie with significant upgrades, not so under Graham, even though they were needed. I understand how bad the record has been, but I can see potential for this years team to improve. We have at least 4 players after Elleby and Franks that are better than anyone Graham had after Kelati and Moore.
Still a pipe dream, as you point out
Still a pipe dream, as you point out
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We already have seen what happens when you go from bad to worse with Graham and Kent. I don't think Chun makes that mistake. Unless another Tony is out there ready to take over it's probably the best decision to keep Kent given the amount to buyout.
I don' know how we address charters and facilities. They are probably a long ways off short of someone with deep pockets bankrolling a huge portion of the cost. That was Chun's priority so I'm not sure how it helps to go another $4.2M in the hole.
I don' know how we address charters and facilities. They are probably a long ways off short of someone with deep pockets bankrolling a huge portion of the cost. That was Chun's priority so I'm not sure how it helps to go another $4.2M in the hole.
