Great… So glad this is in our rear view mirror

[Coug95man2]

When people say they don't have an emphasis on oline, I think the number of visits from olineman in the Wulff years was higher than it was for Oregon, Stanford, UW, and USC.

But the numbers show a history of WSU struggling at that position.

OK. This is getting a little sideways and the number of points is getting out of hand. So I'm just going to take on this one. First, Quack, Nerd, Huck the Fuskys and the Condoms didn't need to bring in more. They got their guys they wanted. When Wulff would strike out, what would he do? Looking at the numbers below and you'll see why I question the above bolded statement.

But my second point:
At some point, Wulff gave up asking/inviting/offering Oline, as well. How do I know that? Easy numbers, Ed. Same numbers used for the above point. Because as much as you can say CML just has "national charisma" or something, he has tripled, sometimes quadrupled, the offers Wulff had in any given year. If CML gets a "no", he KEEPS OFFERING. Wulff would just stop. That is a major, major, major (it was major) mistake.

Lets look at the offers to illustrate, and back up, what I'm saying:

WSU Oline offers:
2008: 18 offers
2009: 9 offers
2010: 13 offers
2011: 17 offers

2012: 37 offers
2013: 49 offers
2014: 31 offers
2015: 51 offers
2016: 29 offers (so far)

But lets look at Oregon (random, you brought them up), shall we? Same time period?
2008: 8 offers
2009: 15 offers
2010: 12 offers
2011: 15 offers

Won't go past that, as it doesn't really change much for Oregon. But do you notice, in 2009 we offered FEWER Olinemen that the vaunted Oregon Ducks? In 2010, we offered 1 more? Uhm… what? WHY would any coach, that is hurting severely at this specific position, do this? By this point, Wulff knew he was hurting in this position. He knew that the future was going to be painful by this point! He was able to see our Oline getting pushed around every weekend. THIS is key to his demise, on top of so many other things. But jump forward in time, notice CML continues to offer until he gets what he wants. He doesn't just stop offering players because he got to some weird line in the sand. "Ohp! We offered 20 players! We're done! Didn't get any to accept the offer but we offered that many so we're good!". This portion of Wulffs tenure makes so little sense to me, it's amazing. So there might have been a boat load of Olinemen visiting (I doubt that since I see the number of Olinemen offered but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, I guess. No official numbers on "visits".) but evidence shows he didn't OFFER too many to help this positional issue for our team. Have all the visits… might want to offer a few more of 'em.

 

[Coug95man2]

You just admitted you are a bandwagon fan. Go cheer for the Huskies. We don't need bandwagon fans like you.

SHUT UP, Sponge!!!!!!! We need all the bandwagon fans we can get our hands on!!! Holy smokes, Sponge… Did you really just say that? When we can hardly fill our stadium?! Think before you type, please!

 

[wulffui]

You don't even get the question. Let me ask you this before I make another comment. How many times have you either said I am dumb or stupid?

Zero, honestly.

How many times have I called something you SAID dumb or stupid? Probably only a fraction of the times you've actually said dumb or stupid things.

 

[wulffui]

So record of a previous coach and the record of a new coach doesn't mean much to you. There are many other factors, like one coach winning 75% of his games, and after three years the new coach is winning 40%. And getting blown out. Pretty interesting.

I can't understand how you want to rant about something and not tell anyone what you're talking about at the same time.

 

[CougEd]

OK. This is getting a little sideways and the number of points is getting out of hand. So I'm just going to take on this one. First, Quack, Nerd, Huck the Fuskys and the Condoms didn't need to bring in more. They got their guys they wanted. When Wulff would strike out, what would he do? Looking at the numbers below and you'll see why I question the above bolded statement.

But my second point:
At some point, Wulff gave up asking/inviting/offering Oline, as well. How do I know that? Easy numbers, Ed. Same numbers used for the above point. Because as much as you can say CML just has "national charisma" or something, he has tripled, sometimes quadrupled, the offers Wulff had in any given year. If CML gets a "no", he KEEPS OFFERING. Wulff would just stop. That is a major, major, major (it was major) mistake.

Lets look at the offers to illustrate, and back up, what I'm saying:

WSU Oline offers:
2008: 18 offers
2009: 9 offers
2010: 13 offers
2011: 17 offers

2012: 37 offers
2013: 49 offers
2014: 31 offers
2015: 51 offers
2016: 29 offers (so far)

But lets look at Oregon (random, you brought them up), shall we? Same time period?
2008: 8 offers
2009: 15 offers
2010: 12 offers
2011: 15 offers

Won't go past that, as it doesn't really change much for Oregon. But do you notice, in 2009 we offered FEWER Olinemen that the vaunted Oregon Ducks? In 2010, we offered 1 more? Uhm… what? WHY would any coach, that is hurting severely at this specific position, do this? By this point, Wulff knew he was hurting in this position. He knew that the future was going to be painful by this point! He was able to see our Oline getting pushed around every weekend. THIS is key to his demise, on top of so many other things. But jump forward in time, notice CML continues to offer until he gets what he wants. He doesn't just stop offering players because he got to some weird line in the sand. "Ohp! We offered 20 players! We're done! Didn't get any to accept the offer but we offered that many so we're good!". This portion of Wulffs tenure makes so little sense to me, it's amazing. So there might have been a boat load of Olinemen visiting (I doubt that since I see the number of Olinemen offered but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, I guess. No official numbers on "visits".) but evidence shows he didn't OFFER too many to help this positional issue for our team. Have all the visits… might want to offer a few more of 'em.

First, why? Cause you have identified a group of players who could play at that level. In 2009 it was reported the west coast had a shortage of lineman. You don't tie up a scholie in a guy you really don't believe can play.

Second, you only get so many visits. It is great the net is wider, but it comes down to people saying they will visit. WSU had more visits than Stanford, USCand UW. If there number was so much lower than everyone else I would side with your position. You probably nailed exactly why a early signing period would help WSU more than any team in the country.

Lineman are finite. They just are. I gave you a 20 year history where a Rose Bowl coach struggled mightily. And like I said Leach's name got WSU in the door on many lineman that we never had the opportunity before.

 

[CougEd]

Zero, honestly.

How many times have I called something you SAID dumb or stupid? Probably only a fraction of the times you've actually said dumb or stupid things.

OK...you just said something DUMB. Taylor Meighan didn't take anyone's spot. He took no one's scholie.

 

[wulffui]

OK...you just said something DUMB. Taylor Meighan didn't take anyone's spot. He took no one's scholie.

No, but if the coach had recruited the right guy, there's no spot for him. There was one scholarship to be had between Meighen and Dahl, and for whatever reason, even though WSU was his admitted dream school- Wulff didn't give it to Dahl.

So, was Wulff a terrible salesman, or a horrible judge of talent?

 

[Coug95man2]

In 2009 it was reported the west coast had a shortage of lineman. You don't tie up a scholie in a guy you really don't believe can play.

See we've gone over this. This is why I asked about whom you were talking about above. Above you said it was just WSU. NOW it's a west coast shortage. But the thing, just because it was reported (I'd love to see that but I realize that was a while ago), doesn't make it true! How do I know? Easy numbers, again Ed.

National numbers of Olinemen (greater than 2stars rating according to Rivals). The number in parenthesis is the number of Oline in the state of CA, to gauge your "west coast" specificity:
2007: 222 (33)
2008: 211 (40)
2009: 246 (29)
2010: 259 (35)
2011: 298 (35)
2012: 285 (42)
2013: 245 (38)
2014: 246 (30)
2015: 279 (47)

SO! While the idea that CA might have had, literally 6 Olinemen less in 2009 (admittedly the smallest number is CA is 2009) than the next year out there that were 3stars or higher, what does it tell you, when you look at these numbers, about the 2008 offers?! or 2010 or 2011? Should I look to see how many 2star Olinemen were out there to give perspective of this "shortage"? I won't, but I can say with absolute confidence, it proves my point that the shortage was a sliver of a difference. I can also look up the rest of the West Coast if you wish? Do you really think it will help you… or will it help me?

Also your point of, "you don't tie up a scholie in a guy you really don't believe can play" thing. When I see these numbers, there were PLENTY of Olinemen he could have offered. He chose not to. These numbers I've outlined above are 3 stars or higher. They aren't just crappy slabs of meat with no intelligence or athleticism. Besides I'd submit, as YOU have so aptly pointed out, we don't have the best of luck at WSU with Oline. Why would we be THAT picky?

Ultimately, my point in an exaggeration… In 2009 there were 246 National Olinemen that were 3 stars or higher… why didn't he offer 246 players to come to WSU? A couple didn't make it, one was a wash out, OK. So the next year, why didn't he offer 259 Oline? You seem to completely miss the point. You act like "finite" means there were only 30 or 40 Oline to choose from, or something. In 2009 he offered single digit Oline, Ed. It didn't improve much from there. But every year, there were literally hundreds to choose from. You reach out, start talking, make friendships, create relationships. You don't act like your Oregon when you're not.

I still can't believe it… we offered fewer Olinemen, IN AN ALLEGED SHORTAGE YEAR according to you Ed, than Oregon… You completely make my point for me.

And to your point of, "Well SC offered this many, UW offered this many, Oregon offered this many. So why should we be different?" Because we need Olinemen, ed. Simply put, we need Olinemen. So we offer more than they do. Price dodged a bullet with his Oline recruiting, IMHO. He wasn't doing it right. He got lucky in a time that was very different than it is today. But Doba certainly didn't dodge it, did he Ed... Wulff certainly didn't. CML is just taking the bullet out of the equation. He doesn't have to dodge, does he?

whew… I think I'm done now…

 

[spongebob11]

SHUT UP, Sponge!!!!!!! We need all the bandwagon fans we can get our hands on!!! Holy smokes, Sponge… Did you really just say that? When we can hardly fill our stadium?! Think before you type, please!

I disagree. What he did is EXACTLY what Husky fans do.

They are fair weathered, band wagon fans. And I don't want those types of fans. Doubt Bill Moos does either.

 

[dgibbons]

No, but if the coach had recruited the right guy, there's no spot for him. There was one scholarship to be had between Meighen and Dahl, and for whatever reason, even though WSU was his admitted dream school- Wulff didn't give it to Dahl.

So, was Wulff a terrible salesman, or a horrible judge of talent?

Or both. Let's not limit his incompetence.

 

[dgibbons]

First, why? Cause you have identified a group of players who could play at that level. In 2009 it was reported the west coast had a shortage of lineman. You don't tie up a scholie in a guy you really don't believe can play.

Second, you only get so many visits. It is great the net is wider, but it comes down to people saying they will visit. WSU had more visits than Stanford, USCand UW. If there number was so much lower than everyone else I would side with your position. You probably nailed exactly why a early signing period would help WSU more than any team in the country.

Lineman are finite. They just are. I gave you a 20 year history where a Rose Bowl coach struggled mightily. And like I said Leach's name got WSU in the door on many lineman that we never had the opportunity before.

Why are you making excuses for Wulff failing to beat out a Big Sky school? I'm serious, why do that?

And the only "report" about a lack of linemen was from Wulff himself. And it was actually a multiyear excuse for his recruiting failures.

 

[How_did_this_happen?]

So the fact he wasn't bee picked up by a NBA team determines whether he is a good coach or not? How many years was Carroll unemployed? he took the job at Montana for a reason. At 57 your at a different spot in terms of marketability. Just the facts.

I have talked to enough people who have more knowledge in their big toe than you and I have. To a person they tell me how good a coach he is. What do you think Klay Thompson thinks of him? Sucky coaches don't take a Portland State team to the dance. Sorry, you can post until the cows come home. Because a coach never gets a gig does not tell me that he cannot coach. Mike Walker never worked in the college game after 2007. And he probably was the best coach at his position and recruiter on the staff.

You aren't reading what I said before. I said that Bone has neither been picked up by another program to be their head coach nor has he been picked up by the NBA. Please check my prior post. In other words, there is no one out there that think he is a coach that should be signed up due to his coaching excellence. It's pretty revealing Ed, and doesn't have anything to do with his age.

Can you admit you were wrong in your assessment of Bone at WSU? You defended him until the end. I think that hurt your credibility. That is all I'm saying.

 

[dgibbons]

First, why? Cause you have identified a group of players who could play at that level. In 2009 it was reported the west coast had a shortage of lineman. You don't tie up a scholie in a guy you really don't believe can play.

Second, you only get so many visits. It is great the net is wider, but it comes down to people saying they will visit. WSU had more visits than Stanford, USCand UW. If there number was so much lower than everyone else I would side with your position. You probably nailed exactly why a early signing period would help WSU more than any team in the country.

Lineman are finite. They just are. I gave you a 20 year history where a Rose Bowl coach struggled mightily. And like I said Leach's name got WSU in the door on many lineman that we never had the opportunity before.

And to add-
Sure, you don't want to tie up scholarships. So you take Valenzuela and Prescott....

 

[chinookpirate]

Ya know thong, some of us never stopped caring about Cougar football.

 

[Cougatron]

Ya know thong, some of us never stopped caring about Cougar football.

When someone goes 2-11.1-11 and tells me "We're doing it the right way", and has been confirmed as the worst teams in the BCS era I had every right to walk away. See I'm not the kind of person that can be lied to easily. I see through BS, and just like you posting on the husky board about Obama and telling us to get Michelle Obama, or spelling our AD Bill Moose, etc, I don't let fake people deceive me.

Wulff didn't deceive me. And your fake Coug / Sponge "90% of my posts are against Leach" / Coug Ed ""I didn't post when we went to the bowl game season" selves are so blatantly obvious on here. Nobody believes or agrees with with your crap. It just won't work. There's a reason why you've been hoarded into this thread and everybody piles on you.

It's because you aren't one of us, and you aren't right, and every body knows that. How absolutely pathetic it must be to hop around on here acting the way you do. You must be some horribly lonely person desperate for attention, and more than likely mentally ill...but well that's the way the world is.

The saddest part is that you are lying to yourself wasting your life doing this, but hey if you want to do that be my guest. We'll all be right here, and we'll all prove you wrong and not care about your bs.

 

[spongebob11]

When someone goes 2-11.1-11 and tells me "We're doing it the right way", and has been confirmed as the worst teams in the BCS era I had every right to walk away. See I'm not the kind of person that can be lied to easily. I see through BS, and just like you posting on the husky board about Obama and telling us to get Michelle Obama, or spelling our AD Bill Moose, etc, I don't let fake people deceive me.

Wulff didn't deceive me. And your fake Coug / Sponge "90% of my posts are against Leach" / Coug Ed ""I didn't post when we went to the bowl game season" selves are so blatantly obvious on here. Nobody believes or agrees with with your crap. It just won't work. There's a reason why you've been hoarded into this thread and everybody piles in you.

It's because you aren't one of us, and you aren't right, and every body knows that. How absolutely pathetic it must be to hop around on here acting the way you do. You must be some horribly lonely person desperate for attention, and more than likely mentally ill...but well that's the way the world is.

The saddest part is that you are lying to yourself wasting your life doing this, but hey if you want to do that be my guest. We'll all be right here, and we'll all prove you wrong and not care about your bs.

Showing your true colors, Thong.

You are the last person who is qualified to comment on who is a Coug and who isn't as you just admitted you gave up on the Cougs during the Wulff years.

Now Go Fvck Yourself.

 

[Cougatron]

Showing your true colors, Thong.

You are the last person who is qualified to comment on who is a Coug and who isn't as you just admitted you gave up on the Cougs during the Wulff years.

Now Go Fvck Yourself.

"as you admitted you gave up on the Cougs during the Wulff years" That's not something to be ashamed of. I was correct. He was a bad coach. His being fired from USF / relegated to Team USA confirms that putting effort into supporting the program during his tenure was a waste of energy and time. We did the right thing firing him, and now I'm back as many others are because there is something to look forward to.

 

[chinookpirate]

Nobody was happy during the Wulff years

 

[YakiCoug]

Ed,

Why do you keep bringing up proven coaches, like Pete Carroll, to make your point about Wulff/Bone?

You are correct that good coaches get fired. What you're missing is good coaches also get rehired, not castoff into 'coaching Siberia'.

Can anyone think of another coach that drove his career into the ground faster than Wulff?

I thought all great coaches aspired to Team USA...

 

[YakiCoug]

Nobody was happy during the Wulff years

Not true. You and your huskies were quite happy, Ruthie.

 

[YakiCoug]

"as you admitted you gave up on the Cougs during the Wulff years" That's not something to be ashamed of. I was correct. He was a bad coach. His being fired from USF / relegated to Team USA confirms that putting effort into supporting the program during his tenure was a waste of energy and time. We did the right thing firing him, and now I'm back as many others are because there is something to look forward to.

The mark of a true fan is spending 99 percent of his time criticizing a coach who has taken WSU to a bowl game and is methodically rebuilding the program. Oh, yes, this makes complete sense at a time WSU has vastly improved its facilities and is garnering attention and LOI signatures from some of the top recruits in the nation.

 

[Coug1990]

The mark of a true fan is spending 99 percent of his time criticizing a coach who has taken WSU to a bowl game and is methodically rebuilding the program. Oh, yes, this makes complete sense at a time WSU has vastly improved its facilities and is garnering attention and LOI signatures from some of the top recruits in the nation.

Yes, that is all true. But, who is going to QB the Cougars in a few years now that Book is going to Notre Dame? The class is falling apart.

 

[YakiCoug]

Yes, that is all true. But, who is going to QB the Cougars in a few years now that Book is going to Notre Dame? The class is falling apart.

"That was sarcasm, right?" - Sheldon Cooper

 

[Coug1990]

"That was sarcasm, right?" - Sheldon Cooper

Yes, of course . I was just getting a head start for the negative Nancy's we have as fans.

 

[chinookpirate]

https://rivals.yahoo.com/washingtonstate/football/recruiting/teamrank/2016/PAC12/all

 

[dgibbons]

https://rivals.yahoo.com/washingtonstate/football/recruiting/teamrank/2016/PAC12/all

And people accuse you of being a husky....

 

[Cougatron]

And people accuse you of being a husky....

As I stated the guy is mentally ill and has some obsession with being negative about us/Leach. Based on average recruit rankings we are 10th and our final ranking will naturally go up as we get more commits.

 

[CougEd]

No, but if the coach had recruited the right guy, there's no spot for him. There was one scholarship to be had between Meighen and Dahl, and for whatever reason, even though WSU was his admitted dream school- Wulff didn't give it to Dahl.

So, was Wulff a terrible salesman, or a horrible judge of talent?

This is why your statement is incorrect. Taylor Meighan didn't compete for Dahl with a scholie because he came in at semester, thus counts against the previous class. And he offered Dahl when no other Pac 10 team or even a team like CSU or Wyoming. Dahl admitted he made a mistake. Thus came in and walked on when he didn't have to.

 

[wulffui]

This is why your statement is incorrect. Taylor Meighan didn't compete for Dahl with a scholie because he came in at semester, thus counts against the previous class. And he offered Dahl when no other Pac 10 team or even a team like CSU or Wyoming. Dahl admitted he made a mistake. Thus came in and walked on when he didn't have to.

Why couldn't Wulff outrecruit Montana?

 

[CougEd]

As I stated the guy is mentally ill and has some obsession with being negative about us/Leach. Based on average recruit rankings we are 10th and our final ranking will naturally go up as we get more commits.

Why not be truthf

Why couldn't Wulff outrecruit Montana?

Cause the kid committed and apparently didn't want to break his commitment. What more do you want to hear. The kid said he didn't handle it right.

 

[CougEd]

As I stated the guy is mentally ill and has some obsession with being negative about us/Leach. Based on average recruit rankings we are 10th and our final ranking will naturally go up as we get more commits.

Dr. Tron, why is he mentally ill?

 

[CougEd]

When someone goes 2-11.1-11 and tells me "We're doing it the right way", and has been confirmed as the worst teams in the BCS era I had every right to walk away. See I'm not the kind of person that can be lied to easily. I see through BS, and just like you posting on the husky board about Obama and telling us to get Michelle Obama, or spelling our AD Bill Moose, etc, I don't let fake people deceive me.

Wulff didn't deceive me. And your fake Coug / Sponge "90% of my posts are against Leach" / Coug Ed ""I didn't post when we went to the bowl game season" selves are so blatantly obvious on here. Nobody believes or agrees with with your crap. It just won't work. There's a reason why you've been hoarded into this thread and everybody piles on you.

It's because you aren't one of us, and you aren't right, and every body knows that. How absolutely pathetic it must be to hop around on here acting the way you do. You must be some horribly lonely person desperate for attention, and more than likely mentally ill...but well that's the way the world is.

The saddest part is that you are lying to yourself wasting your life doing this, but hey if you want to do that be my guest. We'll all be right here, and we'll all prove you wrong and not care about your bs.

""I didn't post when we went to the bowl game season" selves are so blatantly obvious on here. Yes Tron, I said that. And tell me what that proves?

 

[YakiCoug]

Why couldn't Wulff outrecruit Montana?

It's always amusing to watch the aPaultergeists work like devils to divert attention from the reality that the object of their Freudian desires recruited and signed only SEVEN high school offensive linemen in FOUR years, and three of those never qualified. So, as you can see, Wulff was highly selective about which high school o-line prospects would get schollies under this watch.

 

[YakiCoug]

And people accuse you of being a husky....

Well, she (Ruth) is a husky. She's worn out the knee pads to prove it.

 

[Cougatron]

Dr. Tron, why is he mentally ill?

Because he isn't an actual fan but some weird Coug/Leach hating troll. He spends a ridiculous amount of time on the husky board. Pretends to come on here and throw out bs fluff posts and then tries to complain all the time. The guy didn't even spell Moos name right... he started blabbing about vacations and 10,000 bets and all kinds of bs and some Leach PR conspiracy. The guy is mentally ill.

 

[Cougatron]

""I didn't post when we went to the bowl game season" selves are so blatantly obvious on here. Yes Tron, I said that. And tell me what that proves?

It proves that you clearly aren't someone that supports the program. You show up only to be negative. You defend our worst coach in history, and then when we get to a bowl game for the first time in 10 years nothing? Please. like I said you are no Coug.

 

[YakiCoug]

Because he isn't an actual fan but some weird Coug/Leach hating troll. He spends a ridiculous amount of time on the husky board. Pretends to come on here and throw out bs fluff posts and then tries to complain all the time. The guy didn't even spell Moos name right... he started blabbing about vacations and 10,000 bets and all kinds of bs and some Leach PR conspiracy. The guy is mentally ill.

So it's no surprise when the mentally ill rise to her defense. Perhaps they'll take another season off to undergo therapy for their personal matters. That, or they can continue chugging Busch, "the good stuff."

 

[Cougatron]

This whole Dahl thing is stupid.

He didn't come to WSU when Wulff was here despite an offer.
He walked on to WSU when Leach showed up.

Wulff didn't coach a single down of him (and thank god for that) and now he's an Outland Trophy watchlist.

Thank you Leach and thank you Moos for firing Wulff.

 

[YakiCoug]

This whole Dahl thing is stupid.

He didn't come to WSU when Wulff was here despite an offer.
He walked on to WSU when Leach showed up.

Wulff didn't coach a single down of him (and thank god for that) and now he's an Outland Trophy watchlist.

Thank you Leach and thank you Moos for firing Wulff.

Dahl, as with Bucannon and Cooper before him - and Dom Williams now -rose to a level he wouldn't have achieved had it not been for Leach's hiring. A question that hasn't been asked is this: would Dahl have left Montana for WSU had Wulff remained as coach? I await the precious answer from the aPaultergeists and their girl, Ruth.

 

[wulffui]

Cause the kid committed and apparently didn't want to break his commitment. What more do you want to hear. The kid said he didn't handle it right.

That not being able to convince a kid to break his Big Sky commitment for a PXII offer is terrible, and is a rare failing, but only one of the many that coach made. It's not like Dahl couldn't be swayed- he left at the first chance to play at WSU without having to be coached by Wulff.