Listening to KJR in Seattle and I think

[fingerdisco]

Exactly. And further, exactly none of that is Leach's fault. It's really the HS coaches, guidance counselors or whoever that are telling kids to hold out for a uw offer or go out of state. Somehow, going to bowl games, playing for a well known coach that was producing NFL draft picks and All-Americans was not good enough. Graduating players at one of the highest rates in school history was no good.

You can't discount the fact UW is the local school that these kids grow up watching and dreaming to be a part of--what I don't get is E. WA kids going west to be a part of that dump. Stepping over bums and their "byproducts" on a stroll down the Ave. doesn't sound that enticing to me.

 

[Coug90]

You can't discount the fact UW is the local school that these kids grow up watching and dreaming to be a part of--what I don't get is E. WA kids going west to be a part of that dump. Stepping over bums and their "byproducts" on a stroll down the Ave. doesn't sound that enticing to me.

You’ve got your entire life to live in a city and do this...pay $15 for a cocktail, $10 an hour to park and buy said cocktail.

you’ve got 4-5 years where you can live in another world made up of 20K kids your age. Pretty easy sell for me.

 

[Fab5Coug]

You can't discount the fact UW is the local school that these kids grow up watching and dreaming to be a part of--what I don't get is E. WA kids going west to be a part of that dump. Stepping over bums and their "byproducts" on a stroll down the Ave. doesn't sound that enticing to me.

I've got no problem with UW being the fan favorite in Western Washington. I'd expect nothing other.

What I do have a problem with is people in positions of influence constantly taking shots at WSU, or at least willingly playing the role of lovable loser & UW punching bag, then the next minute, complaining that WSU can't successfully recruit players from their audience.

 

[Coug1990]

I've got no problem with UW being the fan favorite in Western Washington. I'd expect nothing other.

What I do have a problem with is people in positions of influence constantly taking shots at WSU, or at least willingly playing the role of lovable loser & UW punching bag, then the next minute, complaining that WSU can't successfully recruit players from their audience.

Amen

 

[M-I-Coug]

You’ve got your entire life to live in a city and do this...pay $15 for a cocktail, $10 an hour to park and buy said cocktail.

you’ve got 4-5 years where you can live in another world made up of 20K kids your age. Pretty easy sell for me.

Very well said. Sounds like me....when I talk to kids in considering colleges, but you said it better.

 

[froropmkr72]

Jim Moore's logic at work.

Maybe throwing money down a rabbit hole?

 

[Suudy]

You can't discount the fact UW is the local school that these kids grow up watching and dreaming to be a part of--what I don't get is E. WA kids going west to be a part of that dump. Stepping over bums and their "byproducts" on a stroll down the Ave. doesn't sound that enticing to me.

And I grew up on the west side. I even went on a recruiting trip with a teammate of mine (several us joined him). It was the most confined, dirty, noisy, crappy feeling being anywhere in the U district. Granted, we were all from a rural town and weren't used to the city. But I was complete put-off by the city. And that was 30 years ago. It certainly hasn't improved since then.

Pullman was far better. Pullman IS far better.

 

[fingerdisco]

And I grew up on the west side. I even went on a recruiting trip with a teammate of mine (several us joined him). It was the most confined, dirty, noisy, crappy feeling being anywhere in the U district. Granted, we were all from a rural town and weren't used to the city. But I was complete put-off by the city. And that was 30 years ago. It certainly hasn't improved since then.

Pullman was far better. Pullman IS far better.

I did too. I had friends that attended the Ewe and spent some time down there--the campus is nice, but once you step off it's a pile of garbage. The bums and drugs were bad back then (late 80's-early 90's) and it's only gotten exponentially worse.

 

[425cougfan]

You can't discount the fact UW is the local school that these kids grow up watching and dreaming to be a part of--what I don't get is E. WA kids going west to be a part of that dump. Stepping over bums and their "byproducts" on a stroll down the Ave. doesn't sound that enticing to me.

Seeing one day of that shit (literally) made me not go to UW back in the day. My stepbrother was at UW and I went over to visit him. I had grown up in Eastern WA and we went to Seattle / Bellevue, mainly the latter, to shop, to go to M's, Sonics, and Seahawks games, and that kind of thing. I had never really been down by UW other than one time to attend a game.

Even back then, it was just nasty down there. Literally shocking. I left after one day and didn't go there even though they had admitted me into their honors program, which at the time was pretty exclusive. It was that much of a cesspool. Can't even imagine what it's like at this point.

I can't imagine wanting to spend four or five years around there if a recruit has other options.

 

[CougEd]

by all means, let's get more paul mencke's

We can say that about a lot of out of state kids as well. Tyler Bruggman? Connor Neville?

No one is saying get 9 kids a year from the state, but doesn't seem like there was any APPEARANCE of importance to the state.

 

[etowncoug]

We can say that about a lot of out of state kids as well. Tyler Bruggman? Connor Neville?

No one is saying get 9 kids a year from the state, but doesn't seem like there was any APPEARANCE of importance to the state.

Not all recruits pan out, that's not my point. Price, Doba, and Wulff all brought in kids who never had a chance to pan out who were instate kids. Whether they let the local coaches talk them into taking Big Sky talents or they weren't able to get better players elsewhere it was a problem.

I'm still waiting to see a list of kids during the Leach era we missed instate. We haven't landed a lot of the better instate players, Evan Weaver being a prime example, but this seems to be more a product of local coaches not wanting to send their stars to play for Leach.

I'm more concerned with how Bay Area and So Cal recruiting fell off when Mastro, Manning, and Wilson left. We gotta fix that quickly or we will have some serious problems coming quickly. In the meantime, they can take 2-3 local kids each year and I'll be happy as a clam.

 

[roses04]

"Listening to KJR" ...
that was your first mistake.

 

[CecilYounger]

"Listening to KJR" ...
that was your first mistake.

The recruiting guy they had on is worth listening to but you're not wrong.

 

[Fab5Coug]

Not all recruits pan out, that's not my point. Price, Doba, and Wulff all brought in kids who never had a chance to pan out who were instate kids. Whether they let the local coaches talk them into taking Big Sky talents or they weren't able to get better players elsewhere it was a problem.

I'm still waiting to see a list of kids during the Leach era we missed instate. We haven't landed a lot of the better instate players, Evan Weaver being a prime example, but this seems to be more a product of local coaches not wanting to send their stars to play for Leach.

I'm more concerned with how Bay Area and So Cal recruiting fell off when Mastro, Manning, and Wilson left. We gotta fix that quickly or we will have some serious problems coming quickly. In the meantime, they can take 2-3 local kids each year and I'll be happy as a clam.

So, let's take a look at who we DID get.

2018: Rod Fisher, Cade Beresford
2017: Abe Lucas, Caleb Perry
2016: Josh Watson, Justus Rogers, D'Jimon Jones
2015: None
2014: Deion Singleton, Andre Dillard
2013: Peyton Pelleur, Isaac Dotson, Cody O'Connell, Cole Madison, Matt Meyer

So, assuming Beresford & Fisher contribute next year, that's 10 Pac12 level contributors in 6 classes. 10 of 14 (71%) guys panned out.

Compare that to Wulff...

2012: BJ Salmonson, Sam Flor, Jacob Tuiavae
2011: Max Hersey, Rahmel Dockery, Tana Pritchard
2010: Aaron Dunn, John Fullington, Blair Bomber, Jake Rogers, Connor Halliday, Xavier Cooper
2009: Gino Simone, Nolan Washington, Jamal Atofau, Chris Mastin, Travis Long, Casey Locker, Andre Barrington

That's at least 5 Pac12 level players and I guess I could be convinced Flor, Rogers, Simone, Washington & Locker. Let's split the difference and say he got 8 Pac12 level players out of 19 scholarships (42%).

Now Doba...

2007: Logwone Mitz, Kevin Freitag, Steven Ayers, Erick Block, BJ Guerra, JT Levy, Marshall Lobbestal
2006: Andy Mattingly, Skyler Jessen, Keith Rosenberg, Kevin Kooyman
2005: Shelton Danzy,Kenny Alfred, Brandon Gibson
2004: Andy Roof, JT Diedrichs, Gary Rogers, Matt Eichelberger, Eddie Vickers,Bryan Baird, Jacob McKinney, Steffan Blume, Cole Morgan, Michael Willis
2003: Paul Stevens, Ropati Pitoitua, Scott Selby

Boy, how many of these guys do we want to call Pac12 level players? 9, maybe 10? Let's just say 10 out of 27 scholarships (37%).

Conclusion, you could look at that and say Leach didn't invest enough scholarships in Washington, or you could look at it and say he just figured out how to offer the guys he needed to offer and cut out the crap. He got his 10 contributors without having to burn the extra 5, 10, 15 extra scholarships.

 

[OrangeGravy]

"Listening to KJR" ...
that was your first mistake.

HAHA, that was my first thought reading the thread title

 

[Observer11]

In all fairness, at least as far as the GSL goes, the talent level hasn’t been all that spectacular. It’s a basketball league now.

Brett Rypien and Austin Rehkow were the last two show stoppers and that was five years ago. Weaver was a stud and the Cougs were in on him.

Can’t speak for the rest of the state but there’s no Bishop Sankey or Connor Halliday or Travis Long or Chris Mastin roaming the eastern 509 lately.

 

[COUGinNCW]

In all fairness, at least as far as the GSL goes, the talent level hasn’t been all that spectacular. It’s a basketball league now.

Brett Rypien and Austin Rehkow were the last two show stoppers and that was five years ago. Weaver was a stud and the Cougs were in on him.

Can’t speak for the rest of the state but there’s no Bishop Sankey or Connor Halliday or Travis Long or Chris Mastin roaming the eastern 509 lately.

Unless I missed someone, I think there was only 1 kid from the GSL that signed with a D1 school this year and that was Idaho. Agree, the GSL has become a basketball league. Not a lot of superstars but lots of depth on just about every team.

 

[PeteTheChop]

Brett Rypien and Austin Rehkow were the last two show stoppers and that was five years ago. Weaver was a stud and the Cougs were in on him.
Can’t speak for the rest of the state but there’s no Bishop Sankey or Connor Halliday or Travis Long or Chris Mastin roaming the eastern 509 lately.

Some great ball players there Observer and Cougs got their share for sure.

1. Why did Evan Weaver ending up picking Cal over WSU? Just hearing he almost was a Cougar is tough to swallow. Got to think his presence alone would’ve added a few more wins for the good guys.

2. What the heck ever happened to Chris Mastin?! If anyone ever got to see Lewis and Clark’s championship team a few years back, they would know Mastin was a heck of a ballplayer! He signed with WSU but for some reason he never did suit up for the Cougs. Anybody else remember him?

 

[PeteTheChop]

Unless I missed someone, I think there was only 1 kid from the GSL that signed with a D1 school this year and that was Idaho.

There’s a D-I quarterback prospect at Central Valley from what some of the talent scouts say, but apparently he’s waiting until February to make his decision.

 

[wazzucougs96]

Literally no one is saying don't recruit the state. But

Some great ball players there Observer and Cougs got their share for sure.

1. Why did Evan Weaver ending up picking Cal over WSU? Just hearing he almost was a Cougar is tough to swallow. Got to think his presence alone would’ve added a few more wins for the good guys.

2. What the heck ever happened to Chris Mastin?! If anyone ever got to see Lewis and Clark’s championship team a few years back, they would know Mastin was a heck of a ballplayer! He signed with WSU but for some reason he never did suit up for the Cougs. Anybody else remember him?

WSU was on Weaver early, but we never had a chance with him, he basically laughed us out of the room. He came from UW family.

 

[wazzucougs96]

In all fairness, at least as far as the GSL goes, the talent level hasn’t been all that spectacular. It’s a basketball league now.

Brett Rypien and Austin Rehkow were the last two show stoppers and that was five years ago. Weaver was a stud and the Cougs were in on him.

Can’t speak for the rest of the state but there’s no Bishop Sankey or Connor Halliday or Travis Long or Chris Mastin roaming the eastern 509 lately.

Any D-1 hoopers we should be in on? Seems like Gonzaga has gotten far too good to recruit anyone less than a 5 star local guy now, so that screams opportunity to me.

 

[Fab5Coug]

Some great ball players there Observer and Cougs got their share for sure.

1. Why did Evan Weaver ending up picking Cal over WSU? Just hearing he almost was a Cougar is tough to swallow. Got to think his presence alone would’ve added a few more wins for the good guys.

2. What the heck ever happened to Chris Mastin?! If anyone ever got to see Lewis and Clark’s championship team a few years back, they would know Mastin was a heck of a ballplayer! He signed with WSU but for some reason he never did suit up for the Cougs. Anybody else remember him?

Believe Mastin was an academic casualty.

 

[dgibbons]

There’s a D-I quarterback prospect at Central Valley from what some of the talent scouts say, but apparently he’s waiting until February to make his decision.

Gabbert might have a shot in the Big Sky.

 

[PeteTheChop]

WSU was on Weaver early, but we never had a chance with him, he basically laughed us out of the room. He came from UW family.

Goodbye and good riddance, then.

What are the odds that an All-America linebacker, born and bred in Spokane, comes from a UW family?

Maybe 1 in 100 at best?

Unbelievable.

 

[Observer11]

There’s a D-I quarterback prospect at Central Valley from what some of the talent scouts say, but apparently he’s waiting until February to make his decision.

He’s not a D1 player. Just not. The kid at Mead is better and he’s not a D1 player either.

 

[PeteTheChop]

Any D-1 hoopers we should be in on? Seems like Gonzaga has gotten far too good to recruit anyone less than a 5 star local guy now, so that screams opportunity to me.

Good point 96.

I think one of our posters here at CougZone is big in Spokane's AAU basketball circuit and could provide some evaluations.

Might be a great topic for the basketball board (Beasley Baseline)?

 

[Observer11]

Believe Mastin was an academic casualty.

Sort of - fathered a child. In Tacoma last I heard. He was a freak of nature. Every bit the player as Travis Long.

 

[dgibbons]

Any D-1 hoopers we should be in on? Seems like Gonzaga has gotten far too good to recruit anyone less than a 5 star local guy now, so that screams opportunity to me.

Tyson Degenhart is a junior at Mt. Spokane, but I think he's heading to Boise State. U-Hi has a sophomore named Bippes who might get some attention.

 

[wazzucougs96]

Tyson Degenhart is a junior at Mt. Spokane, but I think he's heading to Boise State. U-Hi has a sophomore named Bippes who might get some attention.

Losing out on a local basketball player to Boise is terrible, unless Smith just doesn't think he is the right fit for what he wants to do.

 

[Observer11]

Tyson Degenhart is a junior at Mt. Spokane, but I think he's heading to Boise State. U-Hi has a sophomore named Bippes who might get some attention.

There was a time I could tell you every player on every roster in the GSL on their varsity, JV and freshman teams -but I got out of coaching a few years back.

Degenhart is BSU unless Leon gets fired which is possible.

I will say the new basketball staff is much more responsive. I gave them a name a few weeks ago of a kid who is parked at a JC - definite D1 caliber and they emailed back within a couple hours.

Kicking myself for not pushing this kid during the coaching change. Very small but averages almost 35 ppg in games vs. D1 teams. He'd have had one year of eligibility this season. Better shooter than anyone on the current roster right now and not even close. Different level of competition but he'd still drop 3 or 4 threes per game in the Pac 12 at least.

 

[FnuLnu]

In all fairness, at least as far as the GSL goes, the talent level hasn’t been all that spectacular. It’s a basketball league now.

Brett Rypien and Austin Rehkow were the last two show stoppers and that was five years ago. Weaver was a stud and the Cougs were in on him.

Can’t speak for the rest of the state but there’s no Bishop Sankey or Connor Halliday or Travis Long or Chris Mastin roaming the eastern 509 lately.

"Demographics is destiny"

Short version: Local recruiting base that Walden had to work with is better than what Leach/Rolo facing.

tl, dr version....

Eastern Washington (& the entire state) was the benefit of migration due to WW2 and post war federal spending of workers from south and midwest who upon arriving bred large football (and sports loving) families. Compare the population growth this state had (compared to Oregon and to most states besides California) between 1940 and 1980 and you'll see why both Oregon schools sucked until Uncle Phil came on the scene.

Unfortunately when the last bunch came through for WSU, the school was as poor as church mice - in terms of facilities and had a buffoon (but admittedly entertaining) coach in Jim Walden - who tried to turn two local NFL QBs into running QBs.

The pay gap and football IQ gap between high school coaches and the Big Sky and Pac 8/10 coaches in the 1970s wasn't that great. 3 Big Sky coaches ended up in the Big 9 - only one successful (Troxel at Kennewick)

The current population growth is soy boys and immigrants from soccer playing countries. And relatively rich. Rich folk like results - hence the growth of recruiting profile services & 7on7 teams (football's version of "Travel Ball" that infests baseball, soccer and basketball)

And the WIAA can't afford to rent the Tacoma Dome, turns a blind eye to recruiting, no JC ball (because of budget cuts and Title IX, 25 years earlier), open enrollment boundaries (which concentrates the remaining talent but eventually leads to discouraging participation "can't win, why bother?"), decline of prep coverage (Seattle & Tacoma, Seattle Times prep coverage is limited to hagiography of the local dirty programs)

 

[wazzucougs96]

The current population growth is soy boys and immigrants from soccer playing countries.

This has some creepy qanon vibes to it.

 

[dgibbons]

The GSL doesn't require a secret decoder pin to decipher. Gonzaga Prep is probably going to generate a Pac-12 caliber guy every 3-4 years. Send a coach there every May. Otherwise, spot recruit. Anyone that's Pac-12 caliber is going to be all league both ways (if not league MVP) junior year. Easy to spot. You're better off spending time at Lake City and CDA High.

 

[Observer11]

The GSL doesn't require a secret decoder pin to decipher. Gonzaga Prep is probably going to generate a Pac-12 caliber guy every 3-4 years. Send a coach there every May. Otherwise, spot recruit. Anyone that's Pac-12 caliber is going to be all league both ways (if not league MVP) junior year. Easy to spot. You're better off spending time at Lake City and CDA High.

Post Falls is the new Lake City. Lake City became kind of a dumpster fire when Bryce Erickson made his tour of duty there.

A tour of the GSL takes about 5 hours. Do a drive-by handshake once per year and call it good. It's not like the coaches can't watch KXLY Friday Night Lights and see the entire league or catch games on SWx.

 

[FnuLnu]

This has some creepy qanon vibes to it.

Soy boy = smaller families & rich.

The rich think they are good at sports. They are not.

Select sports was built on fooling rich parents into thinking they can buy their way into excellence. And to eliminate competition from lower incomes.

Quite a bit of out of state migration to WA in 40s/50s was from SEC country due to federal spending on big ass construction projects (civil and military) and blacks also fleeing segregation. It wasn't because WA was low tax or the "quality of life in Seattle" - they needed work. Also bred lots of football players - usually the 3rd son onward in big families are pretty damn good in sports (because of facing older siblings).

 

[wazzucougs96]

Select sports was built on fooling rich parents into thinking they can buy their way into excellence. And to eliminate competition from lower incomes.

This is one thing about sports today that I absolutely hate.

 

[Coug90]

This is one thing about sports today that I absolutely hate.

As a non-helicopter parent I love it. Those parents can fork out all that dough for the select leagues while my kids have fun without all those asshole parents yelling at them during their games.

 

[CecilYounger]

As a non-helicopter parent I love it. Those parents can fork out all that dough for the select leagues while my kids have fun without all those asshole parents yelling at them during their games.

And hopefully your kids get a little free time to be, you know, kids.

 

[COUGinNCW]

This is one thing about sports today that I absolutely hate.

And oh so true.

 

[COUGinNCW]

Losing out on a local basketball player to Boise is terrible, unless Smith just doesn't think he is the right fit for what he wants to do.

Dagenhart plays AAU ball with Few’s kid on a team sponsored by Sabonis. They were probably in his ear to stay away from WSU.

Basketball doesn’t seem to go after committed players like they do in Football but I have a feeling WSU basketball is headed in the right direction. Maybe he’ll reconsider (assuming he’s Pac-12 caliber).