Bat signal up

[etowncoug]

Another instate kid.

We are back to engaging in no holds barred combat with the Big Sky for our class each year. Hope Rolo has an exceptional eye for talent or these kids have insane work ethics.

 

[Suudy]

I wonder if Rolo will bring the summer football camps back. It seems a damn good way to evaluate speed, strength, work ethic, attitude, etc, by having them on campus for a week.

 

[chugspig]

The good news is it will still be an upgrade on our D

 

[SaveFerris]

Apparently a LB if that wasn't already discussed.

 

[etowncoug]

Apparently a LB if that wasn't already discussed.

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I know who it is, won't spoil the kids moment, but it's definitely an under the radar type

 

[fingerdisco]

I know who it is, won't spoil the kids moment, but it's definitely an under the radar type

I think you already did when you compared him to a Big Sky caliber player

 

[chugspig]

Watched his film, thought he looked pretty good and made very quick reads. He runs well, on both sides of the ball and the way he finds gaps and blocks you can tell he has a good football sense. Scrapes under blocks well too. Again, another kid I do not mind taking despite the lack of Pac12 offers. Academy offers usually mean the kid can work hard and has a head on his shoulders. IMO what you want at these positions on defense. Maybe 2-3 years and we have a player similar to Pelleur. Don’t want a class full of prospects with academy offers but I will take a few no questions.

 

[kougkurt]

 

[kougkurt]

Isn’t La Salle 1A

 

[79COUG]

Isn’t La Salle 1A

Yea, private school in Yakima. Pretty good program but you're right...
1A = Weak competition

But then again, somewhere Will Derting is laughing at me...

 

[CougSinceBirth]

Seems that the in-state love from the "business man" only happens when it's one of his own. Shouldn't he be celebrating all in-staters? Washington forever, right? Hypocrite.

 

[Suudy]

Yea, private school in Yakima. Pretty good program but you're right...
1A = Weak competition

But then again, somewhere Will Derting is laughing at me...

I'm sure there are plenty of 1A guys in our history that have done well. Another I can think of is Josh Dunning (I played against him in HS).

 

[chugspig]

I feel confident only watching his Hudl highlights he will be a better LB than many of the guys we put out their the last two seasons. He has the right technique and fast decision making. Being able to read a play doesn’t get easier as classification goes down, if you can read queues you can read queues. He’ll have better DL in front of him and quality backers besides him in college. Pelleur was not fast or overwhelming. He was smart as hell and tough as hell. That’s what this guy will be.

 

[BiggsCoug]

I'm sure there are plenty of 1A guys in our history that have done well. Another I can think of is Josh Dunning (I played against him in HS).

There are plenty of guys from big time programs all over the West Coast that have shown up and not played a down. It cuts both ways.

 

[Ffffws]

I trust Dickert

 

[Coug1990]

I'm sure there are plenty of 1A guys in our history that have done well. Another I can think of is Josh Dunning (I played against him in HS).

Wasn't James Darling another? Pat Bennett was one as well. Linebacker seems to be a position that might be able to make the transition.

 

[etowncoug]

I'm sure there are plenty of 1A guys in our history that have done well. Another I can think of is Josh Dunning (I played against him in HS).

I'd feel more comfortable pulling a 1A kid after a camp where we could see him against a bunch of other local kids.

 

[Suudy]

I'd feel more comfortable pulling a 1A kid after a camp where we could see him against a bunch of other local kids.

Exactly. Like I posted elsewhere, maybe we need to get the summer football camp going again. Great way to evaluate not just physique and football IQ, but the other intangibles like coachability, leadership, attitude, work ethic, etc.

 

[BiggsCoug]

Exactly. Like I posted elsewhere, maybe we need to get the summer football camp going again. Great way to evaluate not just physique and football IQ, but the other intangibles like coachability, leadership, attitude, work ethic, etc.

I think camps for a lot of high school teams may be a thing of the past. The costs aren't gonna be cheap, then you've gotta find a team of kids that can pay it... I think you've seen a lot of schools just hold 7 on 7's locally or find a place they can go by themselves.

It is a great way to get kids you wanna see on campus. I just don't think WSU has the sway right now to pull it off.

 

[etowncoug]

I think camps for a lot of high school teams may be a thing of the past. The costs aren't gonna be cheap, then you've gotta find a team of kids that can pay it... I think you've seen a lot of schools just hold 7 on 7's locally or find a place they can go by themselves.

It is a great way to get kids you wanna see on campus. I just don't think WSU has the sway right now to pull it off.

I know some of the recent camps were basically a tryout where kids from all over the state paid their own way to come and get looked at by college coaches for a day.

 

[Suudy]

I think camps for a lot of high school teams may be a thing of the past. The costs aren't gonna be cheap, then you've gotta find a team of kids that can pay it... I think you've seen a lot of schools just hold 7 on 7's locally or find a place they can go by themselves.

It is a great way to get kids you wanna see on campus. I just don't think WSU has the sway right now to pull it off.

Eastern still has theirs going. If we can't attract kids to that one ...

As far back as 2016, we had summer camps. From https://www.seattletimes.com/sports...su-cougars-to-cancel-california-camp-circuit/

WSU had about 110 participants at its camp in Pullman last summer, but as Emerick pointed out, “I don’t think 400 kids from Los Angeles will be able to afford plane tickets to come to WSU.”​

This was about the NCAA banning satellite camps.

Hell, even Central Washington and Eastern Washington have summer camps. So does Oregon State. So why not WSU?

And it isn't just whole teams. Our guy that was being recruited by UW went to the UW camp alone. I went to the Central WA camp with a couple of guys. when I was in HS. We never sent a whole team. Now certainly whole teams did go. But individuals can go as well.

If CWU and EWU have "sway," certainly we do.

 

[BiggsCoug]

Eastern still has theirs going. If we can't attract kids to that one ...

As far back as 2016, we had summer camps. From https://www.seattletimes.com/sports...su-cougars-to-cancel-california-camp-circuit/

WSU had about 110 participants at its camp in Pullman last summer, but as Emerick pointed out, “I don’t think 400 kids from Los Angeles will be able to afford plane tickets to come to WSU.”​

This was about the NCAA banning satellite camps.

Hell, even Central Washington and Eastern Washington have summer camps. So does Oregon State. So why not WSU?

And it isn't just whole teams. Our guy that was being recruited by UW went to the UW camp alone. I went to the Central WA camp with a couple of guys. when I was in HS. We never sent a whole team. Now certainly whole teams did go. But individuals can go as well.

If CWU and EWU have "sway," certainly we do.

You have to consider the travel too. It's cheaper for west side teams/kids to go to CWU than WSU. You have to pay a driver and bus. Same for Spokane. EWU is right down the road. If WSU were in Ellensburg I think you'd see a completely different story. They're not. They're in the far right corner of the state 7 hours by bus to the nearest/largest population base. When was the last time you road a school bus or travel bus for 7 hours one way???

Teams/schools/kids aren't going to spend the extra money to get to your school. People in education don't think like business people. They don't see how the added expense helps them. They see getting ahead by saving money. Not by spending more to get more.

You can go as a renegade and play with other schools/solo kids. But how many kids instate are really going to be offered or have a shot at it??? It isn't gonna be 200 kids.

 

[Suudy]

You can go as a renegade and play with other schools/solo kids. But how many kids instate are really going to be offered or have a shot at it??? It isn't gonna be 200 kids.

In 2016 there were 110 kids. So maybe not 200.

But if this rhetoric about WSU not recruiting enough in-state kids, I think this is one of the reasons. Camps generate interest. Kids develop connections with coaches. And it gives up close, first hand experience with potential in state kids.

 

[BiggsCoug]

In 2016 there were 110 kids. So maybe not 200.

But if this rhetoric about WSU not recruiting enough in-state kids, I think this is one of the reasons. Camps generate interest. Kids develop connections with coaches. And it gives up close, first hand experience with potential in state kids.

Consider this, how many kids does the school need to justify having the camp? 110 kids isn't shit. They need 600 or 800 or 1200 kids. Which would only be maybe 15 teams. You gotta have some teams there so they can play each other. 110 kids is 1 team.

You are ignoring the travel. It's an issue. If the cost of your travel bus is $4000 to CWU or $8000 to WSU, WSU is out.

These coaches and parents don't think in terms of spending more to get more. They're looking for the cheapest, easiest path to camp. 7 hours on a bus isn't it.

I read somewhere that the Tri City schools said to hell with camps and just play each other at their schools and kids sleep on the floor of the gym. Costs next to nothing.

 

[Suudy]

Consider this, how many kids does the school need to justify having the camp? 110 kids isn't shit. They need 600 or 800 or 1200 kids. Which would only be maybe 15 teams. You gotta have some teams there so they can play each other. 110 kids is 1 team.

Which school to justify? I'm only talking about WSU offering the camp. I'm not saying anything at all about schools sending kids.

For the record, back in the Price years, when I started my officiating career, we used to officiate the scrimmages at the end of the camp. There weren't 600, 800 or even 1200 kids at the camp. Maybe 200, at the most. And there were plenty of scrimmages. You only need 11 at a time to be a "team." Maybe 22 if you want separate offense and defense. But we all know many--if not most--kids play both sides of the ball in high school. So that's 10 teams. Plenty for a full day of scrimmaging.

And given the few officials that volunteered and add in the assistant coaches, and there weren't more than 4 or so scrimmages at a time.

You are ignoring the travel. It's an issue. If the cost of your travel bus is $4000 to CWU or $8000 to WSU, WSU is out.

I'm talking about WSU offering the camp, not whether individuals choose to attend. And no doubt the travel cost has skyrocketed. We see this at our little K-12 school where we aren't allowed to have volunteer bus drivers (even if they have a CDL) because the insurance company requires the driver to be an employee. So instead we have 5-6 parents volunteer to drive all the kids to volleyball, basketball, etc games.

These coaches and parents don't think in terms of spending more to get more. They're looking for the cheapest, easiest path to camp. 7 hours on a bus isn't it.

Again, I'm talking about WSU offering the camp, not whether some choose to attend.

I read somewhere that the Tri City schools said to hell with camps and just play each other at their schools and kids sleep on the floor of the gym. Costs next to nothing.

I know this for a fact. I attended an officiating camp in the Tri-Cities some 5 years ago, or so. We worked two days of "jamborees" of various schools showing up.

But from the WSU perspective, this isn't helpful. Summer camps are not only to pass on skills, but identify those kids who have strong potential. Ignore the player side of the issue. Just have WSU offer the camp.

 

[cr8zyncalif]

James Darling was actually who I thought of, 1990. As I recall, he was from SoCal; transferred in to Kettle Falls. Attended a camp in Pullman the summer before his senior year. Offered before the end of camp. The rest is history. He played RB and MLB for Kettle, in a single A league. Derting's story is probably better known, but their level of HS competition was similar.

 

[BiggsCoug]

Which school to justify? I'm only talking about WSU offering the camp. I'm not saying anything at all about schools sending kids.

For the record, back in the Price years, when I started my officiating career, we used to officiate the scrimmages at the end of the camp. There weren't 600, 800 or even 1200 kids at the camp. Maybe 200, at the most. And there were plenty of scrimmages. You only need 11 at a time to be a "team." Maybe 22 if you want separate offense and defense. But we all know many--if not most--kids play both sides of the ball in high school. So that's 10 teams. Plenty for a full day of scrimmaging.

And given the few officials that volunteered and add in the assistant coaches, and there weren't more than 4 or so scrimmages at a time.


I'm talking about WSU offering the camp, not whether individuals choose to attend. And no doubt the travel cost has skyrocketed. We see this at our little K-12 school where we aren't allowed to have volunteer bus drivers (even if they have a CDL) because the insurance company requires the driver to be an employee. So instead we have 5-6 parents volunteer to drive all the kids to volleyball, basketball, etc games.


Again, I'm talking about WSU offering the camp, not whether some choose to attend.


I know this for a fact. I attended an officiating camp in the Tri-Cities some 5 years ago, or so. We worked two days of "jamborees" of various schools showing up.

But from the WSU perspective, this isn't helpful. Summer camps are not only to pass on skills, but identify those kids who have strong potential. Ignore the player side of the issue. Just have WSU offer the camp.

Offering the camp is fine. What happens when it doesnt produce enough kids and loses money?

They would be better off having a 1 day prospect camp and inviting coaches from all over the PNW to attend so kids can be seen.

 

[Suudy]

Offering the camp is fine. What happens when it doesnt produce enough kids and loses money?

How many businesses measure returns on advertising? Meet and greets? Sure they try things like "click-through" ratios, etc. But these are all just the cost of doing business. Summer camps are the same thing.

They would be better off having a 1 day prospect camp and inviting coaches from all over the PNW to attend so kids can be seen.

Why not do both?

 

[BiggsCoug]

How many businesses measure returns on advertising? Meet and greets? Sure they try things like "click-through" ratios, etc. But these are all just the cost of doing business. Summer camps are the same thing.


Why not do both?

For a school that isn't shot in the arse with platinum, there very much is a point where they need a certain amount of bodies to make it go. You are wrong if you think there isn't.

If WSU were in a location with high density population OR had a team kids were dying to play for, maybe both would be an option.

 

[etowncoug]

Welp, a certain businessman is building his brand by shipping kids who can't get other P5 offers to WSU.

 

[95coug]

Offering the camp is fine. What happens when it doesnt produce enough kids and loses money?

They would be better off having a 1 day prospect camp and inviting coaches from all over the PNW to attend so kids can be seen.

You’re not going to get turnout in Pullman with a 1-day camp. Has to be at least a weekend. Ask coaches to bring their best players, do position drills & coaching tips on day 1-2. Start pulling units together for unit drills part of day 2, and work into some scrimmages on day 3.

Don’t minimize the liability concerns though. I guarantee that’s a factor in WSU not running a camp anymore.

 

[BiggsCoug]

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Welp, a certain businessman is building his brand by shipping kids who can't get other P5 offers to WSU.

A couple of in state program guys dont bother me. If the trend is to sign 2 star kids for the entire class Rolo’s hire was a colossal flop as he has no idea what P5 talent looks like.

There is a diff between knowing what P5 talent is and knowing what kids turned you down at your last school and assuming those kids were P5.

I have always wondered if the perceived beef between Leach and in state kids/coaches stemmed from Leach knowing what P5 talent looked like and refusing to take in state kids that werent that level. For a long time I think WSU has been a place where coaches felt they could send kids that didnt get offers from uw or UO...

Years ago a buddy of mine was coaching at Michigan Tech... He goes to a HS in Detroit... Coach has two kids come down to speak to him. Neither are impressive. The coach clearly had in mind that he could pawn these guys off on him cause he knew no one else would take them... My buddy says to him... “have you seen Grand Valley State play???” Coach says “yeah, theyre really good.” My buddy says.. “they are. We’re trying to beat them. Do you have anyone that can help us?”

Coach calls down his 6’4” 280lbs guard.

I dont have a beef with Rolo taking a few in state guys that are good players and jack of all trades guys. Too many of them and youre right back to 2 wins. It is a DNA game.

 

[Coug1990]

You’re not going to get turnout in Pullman with a 1-day camp. Has to be at least a weekend. Ask coaches to bring their best players, do position drills & coaching tips on day 1-2. Start pulling units together for unit drills part of day 2, and work into some scrimmages on day 3.

Don’t minimize the liability concerns though. I guarantee that’s a factor in WSU not running a camp anymore.

If Boise State can have a camp, then I think WSU can.

http://boisestatefootballcamp.com/

 

[NMBRCRNCHR]

If Boise State can have a camp, then I think WSU can.

http://boisestatefootballcamp.com/

Back in the mid 90s, I went to their camp twice...it was awesome. Week long and full contact, some of the most fun I had playing football.

 

[WASH ST A&M FAN]

I have always wondered if the perceived beef between Leach and in state kids/coaches stemmed from Leach knowing what P5 talent looked like and refusing to take in state kids that werent that level. For a long time I think WSU has been a place where coaches felt they could send kids that didnt get offers from uw or UO....

This Is 100% Right On The Mark Biggs!!!

 

[CougSinceBirth]

I have always wondered if the perceived beef between Leach and in state kids/coaches stemmed from Leach knowing what P5 talent looked like and refusing to take in state kids that werent that level. For a long time I think WSU has been a place where coaches felt they could send kids that didnt get offers from uw or UO...

THIS. It's like WSU is expected to always be the one to take flyers on kids. I think having WA kids are great, and if they truly deserve an offer, great.

But WSU shouldn't be bowing to the altar of a certain businessman. That's a headache I'd just pass on altogether.

 

[Coug1990]

A couple of in state program guys dont bother me. If the trend is to sign 2 star kids for the entire class Rolo’s hire was a colossal flop as he has no idea what P5 talent looks like.

There is a diff between knowing what P5 talent is and knowing what kids turned you down at your last school and assuming those kids were P5.

I have always wondered if the perceived beef between Leach and in state kids/coaches stemmed from Leach knowing what P5 talent looked like and refusing to take in state kids that werent that level. For a long time I think WSU has been a place where coaches felt they could send kids that didnt get offers from uw or UO...

Years ago a buddy of mine was coaching at Michigan Tech... He goes to a HS in Detroit... Coach has two kids come down to speak to him. Neither are impressive. The coach clearly had in mind that he could pawn these guys off on him cause he knew no one else would take them... My buddy says to him... “have you seen Grand Valley State play???” Coach says “yeah, theyre really good.” My buddy says.. “they are. We’re trying to beat them. Do you have anyone that can help us?”

Coach calls down his 6’4” 280lbs guard.

I dont have a beef with Rolo taking a few in state guys that are good players and jack of all trades guys. Too many of them and youre right back to 2 wins. It is a DNA game.

Complainers are going to complain. They will always find something to complain about. I remember when Tony Bennett was here. He said that they tried to recruit the state of Washington, but they found they were wasting their time. Yes, there was an instate player here and there who they contacted, but they were few at the end.

The top in-state football players seldom want to go to WSU, unfortunately. Sure, borderline in-state players would love a P12 scholarship. Those who make a living off of these high school players want them to get a P12 scholarship because it sells their brand.

 

[Cougsocal]

If, maybe the best "doing more with less" coach in the business, can only get us to second and third tier bowls with a steady diet of "under the radar kids," Rolo is going to have to hit it out of the park and start recruiting at a Price (at his best) level at some point, or we are going to have no chance of going to the Rose or similar bowls. We went the entire Leach era with many of us in complete denial in this regard. The fact is you don't play the game, or follow the sport, with a Holiday or Alamo Bowl as the objective. Now that Leach is gone, am I free to say, without retribution, that continuing to recruit a steady diet of "under the radar kids" isn't good enough. Is it okay to say, again, that we want a Pac-12 championship every now and then? You can't get their unless you start actually "out recruiting" other Pac-12 schools.

 

[BiggsCoug]

THIS. It's like WSU is expected to always be the one to take flyers on kids. I think having WA kids are great, and if they truly deserve an offer, great.

But WSU shouldn't be bowing to the altar of a certain businessman. That's a headache I'd just pass on altogether.

WSU not being treated like the end of the road option for PNW kids starts with WSU not offering those kids. If they're mad, oh well. EWU is looking for guys. So is CWU.

If it were me, there is no day I would speak to or acknowledge a guy that runs a private gym trying to act like a broker for kids. This trend is happening all over the country. This is an effort to turn P5 football into AAU basketball. These guys will be asking and expecting handouts to get kids. They will use their relationships with players to sway them to schools or away from schools. In fact, if Rolo had a policy of refusing to speak to kids that worked with guys like this I am 100% fine with it. Tell the kids to pick one. You can pick the guy acting like an agent or the school with the scholarship. Not both.

Lemme tell you something... WSU isn't paying for the 3 star kids that dominate their LOI day. These kids aren't choosing between which school offered how much money. WSU isn't paying for 4 star kids either lol. There is no money in the budget for that. There is no booster with an extra $50,000 in their pocket lol. These types of guys should just keep on looking elsewhere.

 

[95coug]

If Boise State can have a camp, then I think WSU can.

http://boisestatefootballcamp.com/

Boise is on a major interstate, has a real airport, and - like it or not - has a higher level of national recognition than we do.