ADVERTISEMENT

Bat signal up


Excellent news and is it safe to assume this is the kid Utah and Michigan State we’re trying to get?

Had never heard of LaSalle High School before. Is that an elite college prep school for Metro Yakima?

Good to see RoLo and his coaches still going full speed ahead even with the statewide health scare.
 
Boise is on a major interstate, has a real airport, and - like it or not - has a higher level of national recognition than we do.
A lot of schools have a higher level of national recognition than BSU that have successful camps. Many smaller schools at lower levels have camps. So, I don't think that is relevant one way or another. There was a time when WSU had a huge successful camp. Not having an airport or major highway had nothing to do with it one way or another. You make it a destination for high school programs and players, they will come no matter the location.
 
Isn’t FSP Performance the All-Star team in the Seattle or Tacoma area that has the 3 receivers WSU could possibly sign for this class.

Why avoid an operation with that kind of talent?
 
Isn’t FSP Performance the All-Star team in the Seattle or Tacoma area that has the 3 receivers WSU could possibly sign for this class.

Why avoid an operation with that kind of talent?

I can't honestly envision "ACB" (a certain businessman) is going to sway any kid to WSU unless they're more under the radar players.
 
That certain businessman's m.o. pretty clearly has been to push players who Leach wasn't offering (and instead went to the Mountain West or Big Sky) to get offers from WSU. Leach didn't give a damn but some of this pushing likely influenced simpletons like Puckett and Furness who could be led to believe the problem in the Apple Cup was a lack of Washington players.

From a business perspective, it's pretty simple. The more players who get P5 rides, the more he can advertise that, and the more he can charge for his services. He'd love for his trainees to play at WSU instead of Eastern or Weber State.

Maybe -- just maybe -- WSU offering some of the fringy players would also help "encourage" that businessman to, if not pushing the higher-profile players to WSU, to at least have some nice things to say about the WSU staff and WSU if asked, or, at minimum, to not just perpetuate old stereotypes about WSU.

But again, just consider the business incentive. Let's say we're talking about 4-star players with rides from places like Oklahoma, USC, or even Oregon. Who do you think he'd prefer they sign with when it comes to being able to tout that his players have gone on to play at X school, or to be able to point to when those guys later are on TV?

In many cases, I think these highly-rated players would be much better off at WSU, where they can shine, as opposed to just being another body at USC, but almost no recruits think they're going to be beaten out or just be "another guy," even at USC, since they always have been head-and-shoulders above everyone they've been playing with throughout their lives.
 
In many cases, I think these highly-rated players would be much better off at WSU
If the businessman as we're calling him could deliver his "Three Musketeers" to WSU, that could be the ultimate win-win-win.
  • The players catch a ton of passes and ultimately get showcased for the NFL
  • WSU is seen as "The Place to Be" for many in-state kids
  • FSP All-Stars attract even more talent from Spokane, Tri-Cities, Vancouver and other WSU hotbeds
 
Isn’t FSP Performance the All-Star team in the Seattle or Tacoma area that has the 3 receivers WSU could possibly sign for this class.

Why avoid an operation with that kind of talent?

If you have someone acting like an agent, influencing the athletes to go to one school or another, using them as a way to build their business and put money in their pockets... all while never coaching them in a meaningful game, never being affiliated with the school, having no risk if anything goes wrong.. yeah, what could possibly happen that you wouldn't want to be apart of??

He is a parasite marketer. He is using the work of the kids and the high school coaches to build his business.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ATACFD
If the businessman as we're calling him could deliver his "Three Musketeers" to WSU, that could be the ultimate win-win-win.
  • The players catch a ton of passes and ultimately get showcased for the NFL
  • WSU is seen as "The Place to Be" for many in-state kids
  • FSP All-Stars attract even more talent from Spokane, Tri-Cities, Vancouver and other WSU hotbeds

Why should WSU be involved in the building of someone else's brand?

WSU is the one that has something to offer. They have the scholarship, the facilities, the TV deal, the university, the path to the NFL. If this guy wants his customers to have access to those things it is him that should be worried about his relationship with WSU. Not the other way around.
 
Why don't you like those two guys?

They're Coug Die Hards as opposed to that fat blimp from Bellevue on KJR.
They are token opposition on the (once again) UW station.

Supported the Paul Wulff era until the bitter end because it helped their brand (hosted the weekly Jim Walden Show) not because they thought Paul Wulff could actually coach.
 
Why don't you like those two guys?

They're Coug Die Hards as opposed to that fat blimp from Bellevue on KJR.

I would like to like them. With Patchin and Lukens off the air, Puckett and Furness are about the only guys out there to wave the flag. But their criticism of Leach was irrational. Recruiting more Blair Bombers is not a solution to any problem WSU faced. The truth of the matter is that when you have a small budget, most of the time you’re going to have small budget results. On the field, in recruiting, in hiring, in facilities, etc.

I really hope the IPF gets built soon. With the economy going down the toilet I’d put it at five years out, assuming that it remains a fundraising goal.
 
I would like to like them. With Patchin and Lukens off the air, Puckett and Furness are about the only guys out there to wave the flag. But their criticism of Leach was irrational. Recruiting more Blair Bombers is not a solution to any problem WSU faced. The truth of the matter is that when you have a small budget, most of the time you’re going to have small budget results. On the field, in recruiting, in hiring, in facilities, etc.

I really hope the IPF gets built soon. With the economy going down the toilet I’d put it at five years out, assuming that it remains a fundraising goal.
I don't mind Puckett and Furness. That does not mean they are correct in their diagnosis of what any problem was.

As time went on, Leach invested less resources to recruiting Washington. We all know it was because they were not successful beating out the uw, Stanford, Oregon, etc., in recruiting players. They did pick and choose players from the state, mostly regarding the offensive line. They did not have any luck with skill players.

Again, don't hate Puckett and Furness, they just are stuck in their thinking.
 
Is that self-reported? I assume it is.
OK. Words to the contrary may be... that it isn't. I realize the heartache that's been caused by many in-staters going elsewhere or giving their verbal to us and then moving to the dark side (Sankey). And w
e're also aware of the gravity of those who want to take those who might end up at EWU or Montana accepting an offer from WSU because that's their best offer. In other words...I understand the butt-hurt. However, we shouldn't adopt CML's butt hurt regarding this matter.
 
OK. Words to the contrary may be... that it isn't. I realize the heartache that's been caused by many in-staters going elsewhere or giving their verbal to us and then moving to the dark side (Sankey). And w
e're also aware of the gravity of those who want to take those who might end up at EWU or Montana accepting an offer from WSU because that's their best offer. In other words...I understand the butt-hurt. However, we shouldn't adopt CML's butt hurt regarding this matter.

So, is the data in his profile self-reported?
 
OK. Words to the contrary may be... that it isn't. I realize the heartache that's been caused by many in-staters going elsewhere or giving their verbal to us and then moving to the dark side (Sankey). And w
e're also aware of the gravity of those who want to take those who might end up at EWU or Montana accepting an offer from WSU because that's their best offer. In other words...I understand the butt-hurt. However, we shouldn't adopt CML's butt hurt regarding this matter.

I'm OK with getting a decent number of recruits whose best other offer is a good Mountain West offer or something similar, if the staff (accurately) assesses that they can play in the Pac-12 after developing.

So far, it looks like that's what's going on. It gets much less OK if these players otherwise would be headed to Montana or Eastern, or if we start approaching half (or more) of the class without other P5 offers.

It's a pretty fine line, but I think a meaningful one, between these two scenarios. Leach only was recruiting somewhere between 9th through 12th in the Pac-12, with about 60% of the class having other P5 offers in the past few years, but especially in the years when his staff was intact, his recruiting was enough to be an upper-level Pac-12 program with the other things he brought to the table.

Leach probably is in the 95th percentile or higher among college coaches in his ability to win in P5 with that kind of recruiting. Not saying he's the only one who can do it, but there isn't a long list of guys who have shown they can. We'll see if Rolovich can. He won at a disadvantaged place, and the apparent issue here had there, defense, seems to be addressed effectively with Dickert, the rest of the Wyoming crew, and Banker, all of whom have a record of coaching players up.
 
Puckett and Furness are token opposition on the (once again) UW station.

Supported the Paul Wulff era until the bitter end

Well so did CougEd and Loyal Coug.

In their defense, maybe they thought a Grand Slam hire like CML wasn't a realistic possibility?
 
I really hope the IPF gets built soon. With the economy going down the toilet I’d put it at five years out, assuming that it remains a fundraising goal.
I haven't heard Schultzie say a word about tabling the IPF.

Can't imagine RoLo or the Big $$$$ Football Boosters would be OK with that sort of delay.

C'mon, dgib, let's stay positive.

The IPF can be another game-changer
 
If, maybe the best "doing more with less" coach in the business, can only get us to second and third tier bowls with a steady diet of "under the radar kids," Rolo is going to have to hit it out of the park and start recruiting at a Price (at his best) level at some point, or we are going to have no chance of going to the Rose or similar bowls. We went the entire Leach era with many of us in complete denial in this regard. The fact is you don't play the game, or follow the sport, with a Holiday or Alamo Bowl as the objective. Now that Leach is gone, am I free to say, without retribution, that continuing to recruit a steady diet of "under the radar kids" isn't good enough. Is it okay to say, again, that we want a Pac-12 championship every now and then? You can't get their unless you start actually "out recruiting" other Pac-12 schools.

Leach recruited more high end 3 stars, borderline 3/4 stars, low ended 4 stars, RR 5.6, 5.7, 5.8 recruits then almost every other coach in almost all of WSU history, amd STILL his recruiting classes were STILL ranked at the bottom of the Pac 12, despite that(Which goes to show that my point that WSU can recruit more 4 star recruits, be ranked the 25th best class in nation, etc, amd STILL be ranked 12th in Pac 12 recruiting wise, because the other Pac 12 colleges are recruiting even more 4 star then WSU, and are all ranked in the top 23 recruiting classes as that's how tough, good, the Pac 12 can be at times, in recruiting.)

Yes Leach had UNDER THE RADAR, 2 star, NR, MW conference recruits. But often times those recruits got offered, reranked, bumped from NR, 2 stars to 3.5 stars, 4 stars, AFTER Leach, WSU, offered.

And WSU did have a Rosebowl, NY6 ESQUE, LIKE season in 2018, IF PAC 12 Refs had not CHEATED WSU out of a win over USC, and IF there had not been a BLIZZARD in the AC.

2018 was, should have been a 10-1, 11-1 season pre bowl game, etc, and a 12-1 postbowl record with either a Rosebowl, or Fiesta, NY6, etc, with or without NY6 win or loss.

So Leach's recruiting was Rosebowl worthy, or capable of producing a rosebowl. That's not invalidated because of a crazy Pac 12 refs, or a FREAK BLIZZARD.

That said, one has to be as good as Leach or even better, in order to do it Leach's way of recruiting.

1. Is Rolo recruiting only under the radar.

2. If he is, is he Rolo as good as Leach at recruiting the way Leach does with primarily under the radar, making more with less, etc.

The answer is that we dont know yet. We'll see.

The answer to the other question is that Rolo has about 2 4 stars(1 4 star from WA that signed during the early signing period, and 1 other 4 star after that. Then after that, about 2,3,4, 3 stars, and 1,2, 2 stars, 1,2 NR, 1, 2 Big Sky/MW conference guys. So that's a Mixed Bag. Also if Shumpert who a ALL STAR coach says loves, wants to play at WSU, goes to WSU, then his 4 star teammates, that said they will play wherever Shumpert plays, would play at WSU.

So already 2, 4 stars in class, and could easily be 3,4,5,6, total 4 stars in the class mixed with 3 stars, 2 stars, 1 stars, NR, etc.

That's pretty ok to semi good, and just ok, fine enough for his Rolo's first year.

But we'll see if he lands more 3/4 stars, and if he Rolo can get diamond in rough's under the radar talent, and develop, etc.

We'll see.
 
Also if Shumpert who a ALL STAR coach says loves, wants to play at WSU, goes to WSU, then his 4 star teammates, that said they will play wherever Shumpert plays, would play at WSU.
Same thing I’ve heard so there’s a lot of momentum for this to happen.
 
Well so did CougEd and Loyal Coug.

In their defense, maybe they thought a Grand Slam hire like CML wasn't a realistic possibility?

I have said it probably 20 times . I’ll say it for the 21st time. Price took four years to rebuild from 98 to 2001. Why would I expect Wulff to do it quicker ?

Second I have said they shouldn’t have hired Wulff for such a major rebuild. Sterk, Moos and Floyd had a proven guy wanting to come back , even if it was to stabilize the program .

Third I said after 2010 hire Leach . Biggs and I talked about it frequently .

And I fully expect with how Rolo will recruit initially and the problems we have it will take four years to get it back up to 8-9 wins . If you took the starting 22 from 2012 and the ones for 2020, not sure you will see a great deal of difference . The difference for 2020 the kids know how to win...
 
I have said it probably 20 times . I’ll say it for the 21st time. Price took four years to rebuild from 98 to 2001. Why would I expect Wulff to do it quicker ?

Second I have said they shouldn’t have hired Wulff for such a major rebuild. Sterk, Moos and Floyd had a proven guy wanting to come back , even if it was to stabilize the program .

Third I said after 2010 hire Leach . Biggs and I talked about it frequently .

And I fully expect with how Rolo will recruit initially and the problems we have it will take four years to get it back up to 8-9 wins . If you took the starting 22 from 2012 and the ones for 2020, not sure you will see a great deal of difference . The difference for 2020 the kids know how to win...

I take it that Rolovich does not possess the magic eye for talent.

And that you have no idea what you’re talking about.
 
I have said it probably 20 times . I’ll say it for the 21st time. Price took four years to rebuild from 98 to 2001. Why would I expect Wulff to do it quicker ?

Second I have said they shouldn’t have hired Wulff for such a major rebuild. Sterk, Moos and Floyd had a proven guy wanting to come back , even if it was to stabilize the program .

Third I said after 2010 hire Leach . Biggs and I talked about it frequently .

And I fully expect with how Rolo will recruit initially and the problems we have it will take four years to get it back up to 8-9 wins . If you took the starting 22 from 2012 and the ones for 2020, not sure you will see a great deal of difference . The difference for 2020 the kids know how to win...

The difference is cavernous. Oline alone was High School good in '12
 
  • Like
Reactions: earldacoug
Leach recruited more high end 3 stars, borderline 3/4 stars, low ended 4 stars, RR 5.6, 5.7, 5.8 recruits then almost every other coach in almost all of WSU history, amd STILL his recruiting classes were STILL ranked at the bottom of the Pac 12, despite that(Which goes to show that my point that WSU can recruit more 4 star recruits, be ranked the 25th best class in nation, etc, amd STILL be ranked 12th in Pac 12 recruiting wise, because the other Pac 12 colleges are recruiting even more 4 star then WSU, and are all ranked in the top 23 recruiting classes as that's how tough, good, the Pac 12 can be at times, in recruiting.)

Yes Leach had UNDER THE RADAR, 2 star, NR, MW conference recruits. But often times those recruits got offered, reranked, bumped from NR, 2 stars to 3.5 stars, 4 stars, AFTER Leach, WSU, offered.

And WSU did have a Rosebowl, NY6 ESQUE, LIKE season in 2018, IF PAC 12 Refs had not CHEATED WSU out of a win over USC, and IF there had not been a BLIZZARD in the AC.

2018 was, should have been a 10-1, 11-1 season pre bowl game, etc, and a 12-1 postbowl record with either a Rosebowl, or Fiesta, NY6, etc, with or without NY6 win or loss.

So Leach's recruiting was Rosebowl worthy, or capable of producing a rosebowl. That's not invalidated because of a crazy Pac 12 refs, or a FREAK BLIZZARD.

That said, one has to be as good as Leach or even better, in order to do it Leach's way of recruiting.

1. Is Rolo recruiting only under the radar.

2. If he is, is he Rolo as good as Leach at recruiting the way Leach does with primarily under the radar, making more with less, etc.

The answer is that we dont know yet. We'll see.

The answer to the other question is that Rolo has about 2 4 stars(1 4 star from WA that signed during the early signing period, and 1 other 4 star after that. Then after that, about 2,3,4, 3 stars, and 1,2, 2 stars, 1,2 NR, 1, 2 Big Sky/MW conference guys. So that's a Mixed Bag. Also if Shumpert who a ALL STAR coach says loves, wants to play at WSU, goes to WSU, then his 4 star teammates, that said they will play wherever Shumpert plays, would play at WSU.

So already 2, 4 stars in class, and could easily be 3,4,5,6, total 4 stars in the class mixed with 3 stars, 2 stars, 1 stars, NR, etc.

That's pretty ok to semi good, and just ok, fine enough for his Rolo's first year.

But we'll see if he lands more 3/4 stars, and if he Rolo can get diamond in rough's under the radar talent, and develop, etc.

We'll see.

Mike Leach can get more out of less than virtually anybody. 2018 was close and proof of that. 2018 happened because he signed the ultimate under the radar kid, a modern Rueben Mayes. But that kid didn't have the talent around him to overcome a bad call or the Huskies.

Verse the competition, according to Rivals, this is how Leach fared recruiting wise: 12th, 10th, 12th, 10th, 11th, 11th, 8th and 11th. This means that he won too few recruiting battles and was forced to sign a steady diet of under the radar kids, meaning kids that either other Pac-12 schools did not think could play or weren't on their boards. If we want to get back to WSU at its pinnacle, 2002, favored to win the conference from the beginning, and beating an Orange Bowl bound Carroll led USC team, we need to do better than a steady diet of bottom rung recruiting classes, because I don't see anything to suggest that Rolo is better than Leach on the "more with less" front. The good news is Rolo seems to be genuine and a nice guy that kids warm to, tools that should serve him well in recruiting battles to come.
 
If you took the starting 22 from 2012 and the ones for 2020, not sure you will see a great deal of difference . The difference for 2020 the kids know how to win...

And there it is.......

E.D. new Narrative

‘Leach Left The Program Just As Wulff Left It‘

So pathetic & predictable by the simple minded CougE.D.
 
I have said it probably 20 times . I’ll say it for the 21st time. Price took four years to rebuild from 98 to 2001. Why would I expect Wulff to do it quicker ?

Second I have said they shouldn’t have hired Wulff for such a major rebuild. Sterk, Moos and Floyd had a proven guy wanting to come back , even if it was to stabilize the program .

Third I said after 2010 hire Leach . Biggs and I talked about it frequently .

And I fully expect with how Rolo will recruit initially and the problems we have it will take four years to get it back up to 8-9 wins . If you took the starting 22 from 2012 and the ones for 2020, not sure you will see a great deal of difference . The difference for 2020 the kids know how to win...

4 years to 8,9 wins, thats a crazy Joke Ed. Either Rolo gets WSU to 8,9,10 wins or he doesnt, but IF he does, it wont take, or shouldnt take 4 years.

The Oline and WR corps alone is, are like NFL players compared to Junior High players(not saying they were Junior High players, just a example of the difference between NFL players and Junior High Players being like the difference between 2020 and 2011/2012, what Leach inherited from Wulf.)

And the QB corp is pretty good with a 4 FOUR STAR DE LAURA, 4 FOUR STAR CAMMON COOPER, HIGHEST ENDED 3 STAR QB, Bledsoe.

Bledsoe, 4th on the depth chart is about as good as Tuel, Lopina was under Wulf, as thats how much better 2020 QB corp is then what Wulf gave Leach.

The only place, way where you might be semi close to right is the Defense.

But the defense had, has some playmakers, guys who in 2018 were all world, that didnt repeat their 2018 all world performance, in 2019/2020, because of BAD COACHING.

So because of that, even the defense is better then what Wulf gave Leach.

The only place where you might be right, is that Leach's Defense recruits altho technically better then what Wulf gave Leach, werent much better then what Wulf gave Leach.

Year 1. 4 to 8 wins, Likely: 6 wins. Line: 5.5

Year 2: 5 to 9 wins. Likely: 7 wins. Line: 6.5

Year 3: 6 to 10. Likely: 8 wins. Line: 7.5

Year 4: 7 to 11 wins. Likely: 9 wins. Line: 8.5

Year 5: Ceiling: 8 to 12 wins. Likely: 10 wins, line: 9.5

Thats more likely then your 4 years to 8 wins.
 
And there it is.......

E.D. new Narrative

‘Leach Left The Program Just As Wulff Left It‘

So pathetic & predictable by the simple minded CougE.D.

Ed clearly loves the Cougs and wants the program to reach new heights.

But for some reason, he seems intent on diminishing CML's coaching legacy at WSU as it compares to those of Mike Price and Paul Wulff.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: NMBRCRNCHR
Interesting thread. Let me toss out a couple of things that relate but haven't gotten much mention here.

First, the limited travel covid situation is something no program has any experience at coping with. But for a new coach in his first full class? I think his strategy has been good. Try to get the interest of a bunch of kids and see which ones have interest in continuing the (remote) conversation. Do some high profile videos that showcase the campus and personality of the head coach. Yes, you could say that the air travel restrictions put us at a disadvantage. But when it comes to making lemonade out of lemons, the staff has done A class work. Every recruit knows you can't just hop a plane and take a visit, so the idea that somebody in Pullman is paying attention to them from a distance is in a way even more flattering. That leads to getting the conversation started, which is the goal at that stage.

Second, when it comes to limited air travel, this year of all years it makes more sense to really sift carefully through what WA has to offer, because those are the kids you can more easily see...and who can more easily visit the campus. Will we have the same strategy after we arrive at the new normal? Who knows? But it is easy to support it this year.

Third, how do you think Leach would be doing under the current conditions? Would he be strictly an occasional Zoomer or Skyper from Key West? I suspect that Rolo & staff have adapted better to the current reality than Leach and last year's staff could have.

And finally, as you've heard me say many times, the most important thing when selling anything is being able to differentiate your product. The run & shoot is definitely a differentiable product. I've heard that some of the "getting to know you" conversations with recruits by staff have essentially been condensed classes on the run and shoot. I thought that was brilliant as a way to not only build a relationship with a kid (teaching anyone anything of interest is always a good relationship builder), but also to reinforce your value as a coach. I suspect that we will win some recruiting battles this year.
 
Ed clearly loves the Cougs and wants what's the program to reach new heights.

But for some reason, he seems intent on diminishing CML's coaching legacy at WSU as it compares to those of Mike Price and Paul Wulff.

Well let me clarify. Mike Leach is a top 10 coach. He can win with less talent. He can plug and play QB's, in part how many reps his backups get during practice. On top of that, they throw so much the quarterbacks, all of them probably double the number of throws per season in practice than other teams.

Mike Leach did a great job at WSU. You do get I acknowledge that. I think his system fits him, and I don't disagree with people that said he has a upper middle ceiling. Nor have I hid the the fact not being competitive in the Apple Cup is frustrating. So if there is a 1-10 scale, and Wulff is a 1, where does that put Leach? Between 9.25 to 9.75. The Apple Cup gets a skewed score from the Russian judge. (and maybe the most important thing Leach did was keep his players lower leg injuries to a minimum via the beach)

But Leach isn't here anymore. We have a coach who is bringing in a new system on both sides of the ball. I do not expect the QB coach to be like Leach and plug in any qb on the roster and not miss a beat. I was very clear I don't think the talent is all that wide from 2012, but the difference is 2020 kids know what it takes to win. (but if they don't perpetuate winning this season, that soon gets lost as well)

How do we know Cooper and Cruz aren't Bruggman? We don't. What makes us think the defense that was so bad is better? And if you make the argument other teams are going to struggling breaking in QB's, that certainly will help and be a factor.

With all of that said, saying 2020 to 2023 may be a struggle because of talent and staff turnover doesn't change the fact what Leach did for the program from 2012 to current.

But that does not prevent me from looking at a .333 team in conference and saying a record setting qb is gone, the coach who could plug and play a new QB is gone, their best corner is gone, their center and LG are gone, Ryan struggled a bit at LT, and I look at a Dline that cant penetrate and can't get to the QB, and am I one to think yeah that is a 7 or 8 win team?

Add that Covid has prevented workouts, the coaches to get to know the players, the players to have spring ball, and that is problematic. Then looking to 2021, supposedly at least two of our best Dlineman are leaving, potentially 3/5's of the offensive line, our best linebacker, a few wr's, and I am cautious when I look to see where we are.

Now if you tell me there is a Herc on the line I haven't seen, or Falk or Minshew are ready to step up, I will revise my thoughts.
 
  • Like
Reactions: cr8zyncalif
And there it is.......

E.D. new Narrative

‘Leach Left The Program Just As Wulff Left It‘

So pathetic & predictable by the simple minded CougE.D.

Yo Ike....you are at least learning. I have no new narrative. why you discount a very important part of what you snipped is beyond me.... reread this---The difference for 2020 the kids know how to win...

Why you discount a very important part of the equation is beyond me. In a rebuild like 98 to 2001 a team doesn't know what it takes to win and doesn't know how to win, to they make a couple plays and they learn slowly what needs to be done, and then there is the belief they know how to win. It is hard to get over that hump before the coach is fired and a new one is hired.
 
The difference is cavernous. Oline alone was High School good in '12

Hmmm....I think Fullington who was in the NFL, and Rodgers who was drafted might take issue with that statement. Bosch, Goetz( Leach recruited at Tech), Spitz/Forbes could be argued serviceable. Dahl (NFL) transferred in, Eckland, Middleton. They might say bigger, yes. In terms of talent and experience, not sure the gap is that huge especially considering they will be learning new technique and splits, and everything that goes with it.

Do you feel the difference in QB talent and experience, WR talent you seeing a huge difference? Dline talent (would I rather have Long, Pole, Paulo, Cooper, Laurenzi) (and didnt keep Cherry committed who started for ASU for two years)or Hobbs, Rodgers, and the crew? Is there a huge difference there?

Linebackers? Woods is special. Or can be. That group way better than Mizel, Monroe, Sua, Kaufusi? If they are in terms of talent not sure I have seen it.

Finally the secondary. Are you seeing the wide gap between the two years?

Now if you tell me there are two or three game changers I haven't seen that either were injured or redshirted, especially on the Dline, I will say in terms of talent there is a difference.

The ultimate difference is Leach taught them how to win.
 
Well let me clarify. Mike Leach is a top 10 coach. He can win with less talent. He can plug and play QB's, in part how many reps his backups get during practice. On top of that, they throw so much the quarterbacks, all of them probably double the number of throws per season in practice than other teams.

Mike Leach did a great job at WSU. You do get I acknowledge that. I think his system fits him, and I don't disagree with people that said he has a upper middle ceiling. Nor have I hid the the fact not being competitive in the Apple Cup is frustrating. So if there is a 1-10 scale, and Wulff is a 1, where does that put Leach? Between 9.25 to 9.75. The Apple Cup gets a skewed score from the Russian judge. (and maybe the most important thing Leach did was keep his players lower leg injuries to a minimum via the beach)

But Leach isn't here anymore. We have a coach who is bringing in a new system on both sides of the ball. I do not expect the QB coach to be like Leach and plug in any qb on the roster and not miss a beat. I was very clear I don't think the talent is all that wide from 2012, but the difference is 2020 kids know what it takes to win. (but if they don't perpetuate winning this season, that soon gets lost as well)

How do we know Cooper and Cruz aren't Bruggman? We don't. What makes us think the defense that was so bad is better? And if you make the argument other teams are going to struggling breaking in QB's, that certainly will help and be a factor.

With all of that said, saying 2020 to 2023 may be a struggle because of talent and staff turnover doesn't change the fact what Leach did for the program from 2012 to current.

But that does not prevent me from looking at a .333 team in conference and saying a record setting qb is gone, the coach who could plug and play a new QB is gone, their best corner is gone, their center and LG are gone, Ryan struggled a bit at LT, and I look at a Dline that cant penetrate and can't get to the QB, and am I one to think yeah that is a 7 or 8 win team?

Add that Covid has prevented workouts, the coaches to get to know the players, the players to have spring ball, and that is problematic. Then looking to 2021, supposedly at least two of our best Dlineman are leaving, potentially 3/5's of the offensive line, our best linebacker, a few wr's, and I am cautious when I look to see where we are.

Now if you tell me there is a Herc on the line I haven't seen, or Falk or Minshew are ready to step up, I will revise my thoughts.


Ed is Chinese propaganda.
 
  • Like
Reactions: earldacoug
ADVERTISEMENT

Latest posts

ADVERTISEMENT