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Future of Bowl Games?

Coug95man2 said:
Just to make it reaaaally simple, the Alamo bowl got 5.5 million viewers. How much do you think the network get per set of eyeballs? $5? $10? $50? Check out that math and realize this is just one vein of money flow. And this is coming from a bowl they DON'T own but then lets look at the potential of owning a bowl.

First and foremost, the butts in seats. No matter how many, that's normally gravy. The venue's are HEAVY sponsors. Valero paid a few bucks to be the title sponsor. Lets not forget the smaller sponsors. I was going to put the list of other sponsors on here but there are so many, it went past the allotted numbers of characters I could use in a post. Go here. https://www.alamobowl.com/get-involved/current-sponsors/
Some are financial, most of them probably aren't but that just means less overhead, more monies to keep in the coffers.

Lets not forget about the towns and Chamber of Commerce. Remember these are sold as community events because of the massive influx of travelers coming into town... And all of this is just the beginning. This is all the bigger stuff but I'm certain I'm missing one of the biggies. Anyways, I guess it depends on your definition of "exceptional but hundreds of millions of dollars flowing around ONE bowl game is... exceptional to me.
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Ok, slow down. What does the Alamo Bowl have to do with your previous post, which was about the ESPN-owned bowls - all of which are of the Mickey Mouse variety? There will not be hundreds of millions flowing around the Myrtle Beach Bowl, in the 20,000 capacity venue of Coastal Carolina. Nor will there be 5.5 million eyeballs watching it on TV. The ESPN-owned Camelia Bowl had attendance of 17,000, and paid the teams $250,000. It was in Montgomery , Alabama, with Georgia Southern as one participant. I don't think there was a massive influx of travelers for that one.

Obviously ESPN profits from all these mickey mouse bowls, otherwise why would they have all of them (and more)? Not sure if anyone else does.......
 
BiggsCoug said:
When you say “most” how many guys? Maybe 3 or 4 kids? I dunno if that’s enough.

It’s risk versus reward. Miss out on the Heisman which you may or may not win OR get injured and watch your earnings plummet???
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You’re assuming they get hurt. Highly unlikely they will. Many actually skip because the higher quality of opponent may make them look bad in a high profile game. Announcing the awards after the bowl games will make sure a guy like Will Grier thinks twice about being selfish....
 
CrimsonDisciple said:
You’re assuming they get hurt. Highly unlikely they will. Many actually skip because the higher quality of opponent may make them look bad in a high profile game. Announcing the awards after the bowl games will make sure a guy like Will Grier thinks twice about being selfish....
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Will Grier wasnt gonna win the Heisman. Thats fake news.

Im not assuming they get hurt at all. Im stating there is risk. If you dont get hurt, good news. If you do, you lit your lottery ticket on fire. Some may take the risk, others may not. I wouldnt fault anyone for protecting their income.
 
CrimsonDisciple said:
You’re assuming they get hurt. Highly unlikely they will. Many actually skip because the higher quality of opponent may make them look bad in a high profile game. Announcing the awards after the bowl games will make sure a guy like Will Grier thinks twice about being selfish....
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Grier isn't even a first rounder unless someone gets really desperate.
 
BiggsCoug said:
Will Grier wasnt gonna win the Heisman. Thats fake news.

Im not assuming they get hurt at all. Im stating there is risk. If you dont get hurt, good news. If you do, you lit your lottery ticket on fire. Some may take the risk, others may not. I wouldnt fault anyone for protecting their income.
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The risk of getting exposed like Justin Herbert is worse than the chance of injuries. Serious injuries are possible every time you give max effort in football. Heck, several players get severely injured every year in non contact drills.

Lots of these kids trying to game the draft. Avoiding certain events in the combine where they might lower there stock. Ducking competition which might make them look bad, etc. The reality is the NFL is going to present them with a lot of challenges beyond their ability to control. At some point GM's are going to dock kids points in their evaluations for stuff like this.
 
etowncoug said:
The risk of getting exposed like Justin Herbert is worse than the chance of injuries. Serious injuries are possible every time you give max effort in football. Heck, several players get severely injured every year in non contact drills.

Lots of these kids trying to game the draft. Avoiding certain events in the combine where they might lower there stock. Ducking competition which might make them look bad, etc. The reality is the NFL is going to present them with a lot of challenges beyond their ability to control. At some point GM's are going to dock kids points in their evaluations for stuff like this.
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I'm gonna call Bullsh!t on this one. I've never met a college player with more than a shred of talent who didn't think that he was great. They are never worried about what scouts would think of them playing in a game. If anything, they want as many snaps as they can to prove how great they are. The players who aren't playing in bowl games are skipping them because they have been told that there is nothing to gain and everything to lose by playing. There's zero fear of getting shown up by better competition.
 
Flatlandcoug said:
I'm gonna call Bullsh!t on this one. I've never met a college player with more than a shred of talent who didn't think that he was great. They are never worried about what scouts would think of them playing in a game. If anything, they want as many snaps as they can to prove how great they are. The players who aren't playing in bowl games are skipping them because they have been told that there is nothing to gain and everything to lose by playing. There's zero fear of getting shown up by better competition.
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This
 
BleedCrimsonandGray said:
I'm contributing ideas to the conversation, not shitting on other people's ideas.

Did you have anything to contribute besides negativity?
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Jesus what's the problem? Just stated it's a loan and not a scholarship. I don't think a shift in that direction will ever be a possibility.
 
Flatlandcoug said:
I'm gonna call Bullsh!t on this one. I've never met a college player with more than a shred of talent who didn't think that he was great. They are never worried about what scouts would think of them playing in a game. If anything, they want as many snaps as they can to prove how great they are. The players who aren't playing in bowl games are skipping them because they have been told that there is nothing to gain and everything to lose by playing. There's zero fear of getting shown up by better competition.
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True or not, it could make sense: over 4+ years you've proven all you could prove, you know your stock is high and you're projected to go in a round you like, and there is very little incremental to gain from playing in a mid- to late-December bowl game but possibly something to lose (off day, injury). But I don't know enough college players to say this is or isn't happening.
 
etowncoug said:
The risk of getting exposed like Justin Herbert is worse than the chance of injuries. Serious injuries are possible every time you give max effort in football. Heck, several players get severely injured every year in non contact drills.
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Some even die. Ask Maryland.

What I don't get is that there appears to be no negative effect on players deserting their teams, when needed most, in the eyes of NFL teams. Personally, I would see this as a huge character flaw, particularly at the QB position, where you are supposed to lead your TEAM into battle. These guys are still battling it out every week, risking injury, even if they are 3-12 and out of the playoffs. How do you trust that your QB is giving it his all when he has proven that it is all about him?

On the scholarship repay angle - I like this concept, but it is unworkable. By the time you sit out your bowl game, the semester is done, and you have earned your scholarship for that time period, and every semester prior to that. You could yank the Spring portion, but these guys are long gone training by then anyway. I sure as heck would not allow them to use my facilities for training or Pro Day, but then they would just go elsewhere. Although being spiteful would just eliminate their motivation to give back to the school - which is probably half the reason why the coaches, etc. wish them the best and support them.
 
Loyal Coug said:
Some even die. Ask Maryland.

What I don't get is that there appears to be no negative effect on players deserting their teams, when needed most, in the eyes of NFL teams. Personally, I would see this as a huge character flaw, particularly at the QB position, where you are supposed to lead your TEAM into battle. These guys are still battling it out every week, risking injury, even if they are 3-12 and out of the playoffs. How do you trust that your QB is giving it his all when he has proven that it is all about him?

On the scholarship repay angle - I like this concept, but it is unworkable. By the time you sit out your bowl game, the semester is done, and you have earned your scholarship for that time period, and every semester prior to that. You could yank the Spring portion, but these guys are long gone training by then anyway. I sure as heck would not allow them to use my facilities for training or Pro Day, but then they would just go elsewhere. Although being spiteful would just eliminate their motivation to give back to the school - which is probably half the reason why the coaches, etc. wish them the best and support them.
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The other side of punishment for leaving is incentives for staying - which I think I saw someone suggest holding onto the awards until after bowl season. I think this may work for some kids, but not all - millions of dollars are possibly on the line.

And that is the part that gets me - most of these kids are ditching out on their team (yes, I believe that unless you are a generational player you are being overly selfish)- won't even have a productive NFL career. Which could possibly be because they went into the league unprepared, but most likely because the NFL is a meat grinder and most players don't make it past their rookie contract. Even so, at the league min, you are talking about $2M over four years. How do you convince a player to make a $2M gamble?
 
chipdouglas said:
True or not, it could make sense: over 4+ years you've proven all you could prove, you know your stock is high and you're projected to go in a round you like, and there is very little incremental to gain from playing in a mid- to late-December bowl game but possibly something to lose (off day, injury). But I don't know enough college players to say this is or isn't happening.
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There's a huge difference between nothing left to prove and fear of being exposed. The post that I responded to was saying that players might skip bowl games out of fear of being exposed as frauds. That is just simply never the case. I've known enough college athletes to know that isn't how they think. I remember a scrub who played basketball for WSU back in the early 90's. Dude was not very good but that didn't keep him from thinking that he was awesome and just not getting the chance to show his skills. There's a little Uncle Rico in everyone.
 
425cougfan said:
What in the everloving hell is it going to take for you to realize that, in great part, the loathing you get on here is due to you asking questions for which the answers are readily ascertainable?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=how+long+acl+heal+football
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The question was asked because it is plain stupid to think on an acl reconstruction you get back at that level in 6 months. Have you ever torn your acl? Anyone close to you? Are you saying Herc should be ready to ball as he is coming up to the 6th month mark.

Read the "general answer" you felt important to answer? "To get back at a competitive level." These guys are trying to get back to an elite level, not a competitive level.

You ever read about Adrian Peterson? Yes, that is a question. Here is a quote from what everyone thought about his recovery, that it was almost miraculous. “Adrian Peterson, of the Minnesota Vikings, has made a remarkable recovery, returning to elite level play as a running back just months after ACL reconstruction, "(8 months)” said Dr. Eric Millstein, a board-certified orthopedic surgeon in Beverly Hills. “While this is amazing to witness, athletes must be cautious about returning to competitive sports too early during their own recovery, thus risking repeat injury.”

If it was a six month recovery bball players who are injured in September should be ready to go by March.

Feel free to educate me with another google search of players who came back after six months post surgery.
 
CougEd said:
The question was asked because it is plain stupid to think on an acl reconstruction you get back at that level in 6 months. Have you ever torn your acl? Anyone close to you? Are you saying Herc should be ready to ball as he is coming up to the 6th month mark.

Read the "general answer" you felt important to answer? "To get back at a competitive level." These guys are trying to get back to an elite level, not a competitive level.

You ever read about Adrian Peterson? Yes, that is a question. Here is a quote from what everyone thought about his recovery, that it was almost miraculous. “Adrian Peterson, of the Minnesota Vikings, has made a remarkable recovery, returning to elite level play as a running back just months after ACL reconstruction, "(8 months)” said Dr. Eric Millstein, a board-certified orthopedic surgeon in Beverly Hills. “While this is amazing to witness, athletes must be cautious about returning to competitive sports too early during their own recovery, thus risking repeat injury.”

If it was a six month recovery bball players who are injured in September should be ready to go by March.

Feel free to educate me with another google search of players who came back after six months post surgery.
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You're missing the point. The problem is you being annoying as hell with your constant questions, especially when you use questions instead of making statements. It's an unusual writing style that contributes greatly to 90% of people here getting pissed off at you all the time.
 
425cougfan said:
You're missing the point. The problem is you being annoying as hell with your constant questions, especially when you use questions instead of making statements. It's an unusual writing style that contributes greatly to 90% of people here getting pissed off at you all the time.
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I hold back on Ed because he takes enough abuse, but clearly his "style" is an attempt to soften what he knows many regard as subversive ideas.

"Do you maybe think X is kinda sorta like a German soldier in 1943?" vs. "X is a Nazi."
 
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CougEd said:
The question was asked because it is plain stupid to think on an acl reconstruction you get back at that level in 6 months. Have you ever torn your acl? Anyone close to you? Are you saying Herc should be ready to ball as he is coming up to the 6th month mark.

Read the "general answer" you felt important to answer? "To get back at a competitive level." These guys are trying to get back to an elite level, not a competitive level.

You ever read about Adrian Peterson? Yes, that is a question. Here is a quote from what everyone thought about his recovery, that it was almost miraculous. “Adrian Peterson, of the Minnesota Vikings, has made a remarkable recovery, returning to elite level play as a running back just months after ACL reconstruction, "(8 months)” said Dr. Eric Millstein, a board-certified orthopedic surgeon in Beverly Hills. “While this is amazing to witness, athletes must be cautious about returning to competitive sports too early during their own recovery, thus risking repeat injury.”

If it was a six month recovery bball players who are injured in September should be ready to go by March.

Feel free to educate me with another google search of players who came back after six months post surgery.
Click to expand...

How much wood could a woodchuck chuck if a wood chuck could chuck wood?

Feel free to educate me on the subject.
 
425cougfan said:
You're missing the point. The problem is you being annoying as hell with your constant questions, especially when you use questions instead of making statements. It's an unusual writing style that contributes greatly to 90% of people here getting pissed off at you all the time.
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I hate to answer it with a question but who is it that I annoy? Sam, Bill, Will, Joe, Lori , Susan ? Or some person I don’t know? It is tough to care about what people think when all they are is a screen name?

And google doesn’t answer the question and just cause someone read you could go back to competitive athletics in 6 months it is plain bs. I am dealing in the family with an acl issue as I type this . And no way even though doc says six months, it is really a 9-12 month recovery period . And that is with exceptional pt. There is a reason why players miss the last game of the year . They want to be elite, not competitive . I may disagree playing 12 games and not the 13th, but I understand their rationale
 
CougEd said:
I hate to answer it with a question but who is it that I annoy? Sam, Bill, Will, Joe, Lori , Susan ? Or some person I don’t know? It is tough to care about what people think when all they are is a screen name?

And google doesn’t answer the question and just cause someone read you could go back to competitive athletics in 6 months it is plain bs. I am dealing in the family with an acl issue as I type this . And no way even though doc says six months, it is really a 9-12 month recovery period . And that is with exceptional pt. There is a reason why players miss the last game of the year . They want to be elite, not competitive . I may disagree playing 12 games and not the 13th, but I understand their rationale
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Holy shit.
 
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Coug95man2 said:
I think this is a good idea. BTW, welcome to posting!

But here's the thing. ESPN has a death grip on bowl games. Let alone the ones they own. What you've outlined is KINDA like what started all the bowl games. But you're putting the spin on it being about competition for ESPN. I'd be game but the politic'ing would be extreme. NCAA, conference agreements, school agreements with the conference(s) and NCAA... Yikes. I think it would be cool. I don't see a network wanting to take that on any time soon, but that would be cool.

Odd note and find: For those that are wondering how long these lower tier bowls will last... I went to get a list of all the bowl games ESPN owns and they are starting up a new one in 2020. The Myrtle Beach Bowl. The money flow in these games is exceptional, folks. The stands might be empty, but the sales department are these networks know what they are doing. Almost a regional bowl with lesser teams.
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Thanks! Your point about ESPN being a cash cow for the current system is accurate and not lost on me, I was just spit-balling, what in my mind, is an interesting idea/take/spin on updating the current system and maybe a couple schools or leagues who are willing to take a chance and buck the current system IF the money was right, I think it could be far more interesting than just Redbox/Cheez-It/HolidayAlamo bowl norm, imagine if we went to the Alamo Invitational and beat Iowa St., which meant we got to play the winner of Texas A&M/Penn St. in the championship right before the CFP championship, still a 2nd tier tournament, but more interesting, I think it could likely be very good exposure and just generally more interesting.

Anyway, just my weird idea, Ill stop now :)
 
chipdouglas said:
I hold back on Ed because he takes enough abuse, but clearly his "style" is an attempt to soften what he knows many regard as subversive ideas.

"Do you maybe think X is kinda sorta like a German soldier in 1943?" vs. "X is a Nazi."
Click to expand...

I try not to engage in the more general Ed-bashing that is frequent here. Every couple years, I can't take it any longer and attempt to let him know what would make him less reviled.
 
dgibbons said:
How much wood could a woodchuck chuck if a wood chuck could chuck wood?

Feel free to educate me on the subject.
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Here is a free one for you....by the tone of your posts lately it sounds like your wood chucker isn't chucking enough wood.
 
425cougfan said:
Holy shit.
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425cougfan said:
I try not to engage in the more general Ed-bashing that is frequent here. Every couple years, I can't take it any longer and attempt to let him know what would make him less reviled.
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But you are assuming I care what you and others think. Let me know when I break the rules Rivals set forth. And one last question, do you not have the ignore feature on your Wazzuwatch?
 
chipdouglas said:
I hold back on Ed because he takes enough abuse, but clearly his "style" is an attempt to soften what he knows many regard as subversive ideas.

"Do you maybe think X is kinda sorta like a German soldier in 1943?" vs. "X is a Nazi."
Click to expand...
Actually, the question about Peterson is a legit question. Not to soften any subversive idea. We aren;t talking about World war II, politics, or economics we are talking about football. What idea would be subversive? And that question is a legit question as well.
 
CougEd said:
Actually, the question about Peterson is a legit question. Not to soften any subversive idea. We aren;t talking about World war II, politics, or economics we are talking about football. What idea would be subversive? And that question is a legit question as well.
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Not commenting on a specific question - otherwise I wouldn't comment. Commenting on almost 15 years of Ed posts here...
 
BiggsCoug said:
Will Grier wasnt gonna win the Heisman. Thats fake news.

Im not assuming they get hurt at all. Im stating there is risk. If you dont get hurt, good news. If you do, you lit your lottery ticket on fire. Some may take the risk, others may not. I wouldnt fault anyone for protecting their income.
Click to expand...
I can't remember what game it was but the commentators were discussing a kid that had taken out an insurance policy against injury, and he did get hurt. The policy paid out 700k, but he'd been projected to make millions on a rookie contract.
 
chipdouglas said:
I hold back on Ed because he takes enough abuse, but clearly his "style" is an attempt to soften what he knows many regard as subversive ideas.

"Do you maybe think X is kinda sorta like a German soldier in 1943?" vs. "X is a Nazi."
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I believe the phrase you're searching for is 'concern trolling.' He's not bashing, he's merely 'expressing his concerns.'
 
random soul said:
I can't remember what game it was but the commentators were discussing a kid that had taken out an insurance policy against injury, and he did get hurt. The policy paid out 700k, but he'd been projected to make millions on a rookie contract.
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I believe it was Alden Smith of Notre Dame.
 
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