Just announced - increased ticket prices, increased parking pass prices, decreased CAF ranks

[BiggsCoug]

The only thanks I want is for you to get off your computer, go to work, quit bitching about individuals who actually contribute, and share a few coins you may have collected in your piggy bank. Remember dimes have more value than a nickel even though they’re smaller.
Also, I’m very appreciative of the capital ‘T’ in turd, I felt disrespected earlier.

How is it I can be on my computer during the day and Im not working but you're on your computer during the day and you are??? Don't project your lack of employment and insecurities onto me.

You have been downgraded to a lowercase t now. Even the original Turd is higher up the list than you are.

 

[taf88]

How is it I can be on my computer during the day and Im not working but you're on your computer during the day and you are??? Don't project your lack of employment and insecurities onto me.

You have been downgraded to a lowercase t now. Even the original Turd is higher up the list than you are.

Oh Lordy son, you have just got to let it go. Unlike you, it’s been established that I’m not living unemployment check to unemployment check, thus my continued support of all WSU Athletics.
Now don’t you have some recyclables you need to return so you can treat yourself to a quart of Old Milwaukee.

 

[BiggsCoug]

Oh Lordy son, you have just got to let it go. Unlike you, it’s been established that I’m not living unemployment check to unemployment check, thus my continued support of all WSU Athletics.
Now don’t you have some recyclables you need to return so you can treat yourself to a quart of Old Milwaukee.

It hasn't been established that Im unemployed. And I don't drink.

You're a loser. WSU doesn't need you or your $500 check. You won't be missed. You'll be replaced.

 

[Loyal Coug]

Oh Lordy son, you have just got to let it go. .

And I don't drink. You're a loser. .

How about you both let it go. Next topic. Poster amnesia. Peace and love.

And Biggs, you sure like to call people losers. You have no idea what any of us do, think, feel or have accomplished outside our stupid comments on this site. I would wager that quite a few people here are pretty f-ing successful, decent upstanding citizens who also donate to the program. Except me - I live under a bridge and panhandle my days away, stealing the wi-fi from the Denny's across the way.

So maybe you should stick to your opinions about football and lay off the personal insults.

 

[taf88]

It hasn't been established that Im unemployed. And I don't drink.

You are and you should....Let me explain something Dum-Dum.
This conversation started w/me expressing the cost for MANY to travel to Pullman. Again, it’s my decision to spend my earned money however I want. I’ve chosen to spend it on Cougar Athletics, however the price to do this costs me $2K per game, which I totaled in an earlier post.
Now get your calculator out:
7 home games x $2K = $14K Of this $14K, $6K is for season tix’s. Point being, the Admin may want to reach into some other pockets beyond adding additional costs to the current contributors.
Between home games, away games, and bowl games, I’ve budgeted around $18K for Coug football and I’m sure I speak for many who physically and financially support the University.
Now get off the computer, go get a job, or a second if McDonalds is not paying you enough, and send our beloved Cougs some dinero.
I am done with you DIII Cash.

 

[BiggsCoug]

You are and you should....Let me explain something Dum-Dum.
This conversation started w/me expressing the cost for MANY to travel to Pullman. Again, it’s my decision to spend my earned money however I want. I’ve chosen to spend it on Cougar Athletics, however the price to do this costs me $2K per game, which I totaled in an earlier post.
Now get your calculator out:
7 home games x $2K = $14K Of this $14K, $6K is for season tix’s. Point being, the Admin may want to reach into some other pockets beyond adding additional costs to the current contributors.
Between home games, away games, and bowl games, I’ve budgeted around $18K for Coug football and I’m sure I speak for many who physically and financially support the University.
Now get off the computer, go get a job, or a second if McDonalds is not paying you enough, and send our beloved Cougs some dinero.
I am done with you DIII Cash.

You're back!!!

You mad bro???

 

[95coug]

How about you both let it go. Next topic. Poster amnesia. Peace and love.

And Biggs, you sure like to call people losers. You have no idea what any of us do, think, feel or have accomplished outside our stupid comments on this site. I would wager that quite a few people here are pretty f-ing successful, decent upstanding citizens who also donate to the program. Except me - I live under a bridge and panhandle my days away, stealing the wi-fi from the Denny's across the way.

So maybe you should stick to your opinions about football and lay off the personal insults.

I’ve read that you can make a pretty fair living at that in some parts of Seattle and Portland.

 

[BiggsCoug]

I’ve read that you can make a pretty fair living at that in some parts of Seattle and Portland.

turd88 should look into it. He says he spends sooo much money on WSU football, doubt it.

 

[Loyal Coug]

I’ve read that you can make a pretty fair living at that in some parts of Seattle and Portland.

I'm in the South Sound. I drive by this one guy - big guy, probably 55, he ain't homeless, who has his spot staked out all day, every day. He acts like a traffic conductor from his corner spot. No way is he unable to get a job of some sort.

Remember another guy when I lived in a smaller town. Sat on a bucket at the main intersection day after day. 35-40, big healthy looking dude. Cowboy hat, a "Vet" sign I think. Saw him one day after "work" walking by my place in the neighborhood on his way home.

 

[SDCoug]

turd88 should look into it. He says he spends sooo much money on WSU football, doubt it.

I don’t want to wade into your argument. I will say that the expenses taff88 detailed sound right. I did the same from San Diego for a long time, though my CAF donation was less. Throw in all of the away games in California and Arizona and it adds up. It is much easier on me from Montana.

Biggs, before this thread devolved, you were correct that people will need to step up or step off. It’s all about big money now. In my opinion, it is killing college football. I’m seriously considering stepping off. And it is not because I can’t afford it. It is because I don’t like what it has become.

 

[BiggsCoug]

I don’t want to wade into your argument. I will say that the expenses taff88 detailed sound right. I did the same from San Diego for a long time, though my CAF donation was less. Throw in all of the away games in California and Arizona and it adds up. It is much easier on me from Montana.

Biggs, before this thread devolved, you were correct that people will need to step up or step off. It’s all about big money now. In my opinion, it is killing college football. I’m seriously considering stepping off. And it is not because I can’t afford it. It is because I don’t like what it has become.

If it's something that you don't wanna do that's totally cool.

What I have an issue with is fans that gripe about the price of everything and act like they're doing WSU some huge favor and need their ego stroked. Then they act like they're superior to other fans because of the $500 they donated or their season tickets or the away games they go to. They use their fandom as a way to show superiority over others. Evening going so far as to make claims about someone's employment or list off all the money they spend to show off.

If you wanna walk away because of other reasons I will wish you well. Maybe you and WSU get together on something down the road.

 

[Loyal Coug]

I don’t want to wade into your argument. I will say that the expenses taff88 detailed sound right. I did the same from San Diego for a long time, though my CAF donation was less. Throw in all of the away games in California and Arizona and it adds up. It is much easier on me from Montana.

Biggs, before this thread devolved, you were correct that people will need to step up or step off. It’s all about big money now. In my opinion, it is killing college football. I’m seriously considering stepping off. And it is not because I can’t afford it. It is because I don’t like what it has become.

Yeah it is too bad that the NCAA or feds or states couldn't have intervened before it got to this point. College HC's making millions/year. The thing is, most D-1 programs are state institutions, and all of them get federal money in some form (research grants mostly, which come with an overhead rate of 45%+). Call Athletics self-supporting all you want, but they all get subsidized by the school, thus by the taxpayers one way or another. How about a salary cap on coaches? Too late for that now.

Then, we get certain people who want college to be free, or for all student loan debt to be forgiven. Ok well slow down. Why is college so expensive? Athletics is a reason. The fancy dorms and rec centers and President, etc. salaries are the primary reasons.

It sucks when my meager donation seems like just a throwaway. 1000 Loyal's giving $1,000 barely dents the needs. If you don't have a T. Boone Pickens or Phil Knight then you are behind the 8 ball.

One thing I will say, I'm not seeing an actual "Campaign" for Cougar Athletics. We all know that this is how it works in general for universities. You have a campaign, fire everybody up to make that big donation for project(s) X, then a few years later you do it again. I am still owed my brick for my IPF campaign donation 15 or so years ago. I would be more likely to write at least one big check if it were associated with an IPF campaign, or even a pay down the stadium debt campaign. Rather than just a give today, then give again tomorrow, etc. plea.

 

[CougPatrol]

You have a very positive and supportive attitude about it

I’ve always wanted WSU to build the program, and now that we have, something like this was inevitable. I’ve enjoyed a lot of great seasons in the #1 lot, and also some dreadful ones before Leach arrived.

I’m OK with passing the baton to the upper crust. I’ll find a home in one of the other RV lots. The point that Biggs makes in this thread cuts both ways. WSU won’t miss me in the Beasley lot, especially with Leach on board, but they need to think about donors like me. The midrange donors who trek to the games year after year. I’m not particularly high on the CAF list, but I’m in the top-2000. If all WSU does is cater to the top donors, and they don’t think about the game experience for the next tier, I’ll find another way to spend my $3,000+/year. I’ll goto a couple of road games and watch the Pullman games on TV.

We’ll see how this shakes out. As of today, WSU isn’t big enough to turn their backs on the die hard, working class fans. If I were Chun, I’d have a plan in place to reach out to fans like me who get out outbid for their lot #1 passes, or those who aren’t cool with the parking pass increase. I’m ok with it, but I suspect a lot of fans won’t be. WSU still needs our money. Check the P12 alumni giving rankings for confirmation of that.

 

[Loyal Coug]

. WSU still needs our money. Check the P12 alumni giving rankings for confirmation of that.

Saw this - I'm confused. You mean total giving, correct? Not numbers or %'s of alumni giving, which I assume would be relatively high.

I guess I'm thinking/saying that our giving % is high, but $/giver are low? Way low in that the total lags in the Pac-12 (we know we are 11th or 12th). Or not?

 

[CougPatrol]

Saw this - I'm confused. You mean total giving, correct? Not numbers or %'s of alumni giving, which I assume would be relatively high.

I guess I'm thinking/saying that our giving % is high, but $/giver are low? Way low in that the total lags in the Pac-12 (we know we are 11th or 12th). Or not?

WSU ranks low across all financial giving. We do say Go Cougs a lot though.

 

[BiggsCoug]

I’ve always wanted WSU to build the program, and now that we have, something like this was inevitable. I’ve enjoyed a lot of great seasons in the #1 lot, and also some dreadful ones before Leach arrived.

I’m OK with passing the baton to the upper crust. I’ll find a home in one of the other RV lots. The point that Biggs makes in this thread cuts both ways. WSU won’t miss me in the Beasley lot, especially with Leach on board, but they need to think about donors like me. The midrange donors who trek to the games year after year. I’m not particularly high on the CAF list, but I’m in the top-2000. If all WSU does is cater to the top donors, and they don’t think about the game experience for the next tier, I’ll find another way to spend my $3,000+/year. I’ll goto a couple of road games and watch the Pullman games on TV.

We’ll see how this shakes out. As of today, WSU isn’t big enough to turn their backs on the die hard, working class fans. If I were Chun, I’d have a plan in place to reach out to fans like me who get out outbid for their lot #1 passes, or those who aren’t cool with the parking pass increase. I’m ok with it, but I suspect a lot of fans won’t be. WSU still needs our money. Check the P12 alumni giving rankings for confirmation of that.

It's supply and demand. More people with more money show up and want your seats... You have two choices. Pay or don't pay. Either is fine.

What isn't tolerable is the level of whining WSU has heaped upon it by those that don't wanna pay.

Times are changing. WSU doesn't have the man power, time or energy to maintain relationships with people that are now donating peanuts. Your donation may have been important before. It's not now. They have to invest their time in other people that either have more donating potential or donate more money than you.

What's sad is that some people have tied their ego to this and can't handle the perceived rejection.

 

[Flatlandcoug]

Going back to the original complaint, I think it's good that WSU isn't going to have parking as directly tied to CAF donations. Given our relatively limited number of people that can actually purchase season tickets, a parking pass and a seat cushion provides zero incentive for a fan who can't attend games to go from $100 per year to $500 per year. The small extra cost ($20 per game) for car parking isn't going to keep fans from coming to the games. Unfortunately, without being forced, people in general are going to pay the minimum possible so sometimes you have to force them to pay more.

On the topic of building up our donating fanbase, if WSU wants to increase the donations from fans that don't attend games, they have to do something besides sending them a CAF bracelet and a sticker for the window. For one thing, the bullsh!t way that they sell tickets to bowl games needs to change. The university knows where their seats are going to be for the different bowl games but the way that they distribute them is beyond idiotic. For the folks above talking about their priority level, I simply don't understand the worry. Unless you are in the top few hundred, you're just as likely to get randomly stuck in the endzone as you are the 40 yard line.

For the Alamo Bowl, I bought great tickets at the 35 yard line for less money than a Top 1000 donor who got stuck in club seats in the endzone. Who gives a crap about priority when the university botches the whole damned thing anyway? When WSU went to the 2003 Rose Bowl against Oklahoma, I was told that I was going to have to wait to buy tickets. I bought a pair of tickets from OU where I got to pick my frickin' seats less than 24 hours after the bowl game announcement. That was almost 17 years ago and nothing has really changed. WSU still hasn't purchased the technology to do that and tells you that you'll find out where you are sitting when you get your tickets. What kind of archaic bullsh!t is that? If WSU wants CAF to grow, make it meaningful to be a donor. The amorphous "Are you in?" only goes so far.

 

[cr8zyncalif]

I had dinner last night with my wife's Wazzu roomie & her husband, who is a Husky. He just gave up his Husky tickets due to the UW ticket process. He says the big Tyee donors are currently making a big donation, for which they secure first seat choice. Then instead of their usual 4 seats they get 8 and sell the other 4 on the secondary market for quite a bit over face value. That helps them pay their Tyee donation that enabled them to get the tickets in the first place.

I guess there is more than one way to game the system...

 

[Suudy]

For my part, I'm not perturbed by the additional parking cost. I'm bummed by the new "premium" permit and that Wilson is now re-classified. So my AA permit is far less interesting now. Is it like back in the day when you could use your yellow permit to park in the red or blue lots? So can an AA permit be used to park in an A lot?

What I am hopeful about is this bit:

Effective July 1, 2019, priority on season tickets and upgrades, parking, postseason tickets, away game tickets, and other member benefits will be allocated by annual giving level first then by CAF rank within each giving level. This change allows the CAF to objectively reward loyal and generous annual fund members for supporting WSU student-athletes.​

So, if the RV parking will be priority based on giving and CAF, and they quit doing the grandfathering crap they've done for years, those of us who donate will have a chance to get a lot 1 or lot 2 RV permit. I've been extremely frustrated at the waffling I've got from CAF about how RV permits are allocated. I've straight up asked "How much do I have to donate to get a lot 1 RV permit? $1000? $5000? $10000?" and the response has always been "It depends on where you CAF rank ends up relative to those who already have permits." Well, I know for a fact my CAF rank is higher than several lot 2 people. So, here's to hoping they actually honor this system.

For the Alamo Bowl, I bought great tickets at the 35 yard line for less money than a Top 1000 donor who got stuck in club seats in the endzone. Who gives a crap about priority when the university botches the whole damned thing anyway?

This. I got hosed this last year. My CAF ranking at bowl game time was sub-1500, and I got section 107 tickets at $140/ea. I found section 112 tickets on StubHub for $100/ea. That's right, I got 50 yard line seats cheaper than was WSU got me for being a donor.

I'm on the Flatlandcoug wagon now. No more bowl ticket purchases through WSU.

 

[Loyal Coug]

I had dinner last night with my wife's Wazzu roomie & her husband, who is a Husky. He just gave up his Husky tickets due to the UW ticket process. He says the big Tyee donors are currently making a big donation, for which they secure first seat choice. Then instead of their usual 4 seats they get 8 and sell the other 4 on the secondary market for quite a bit over face value. That helps them pay their Tyee donation that enabled them to get the tickets in the first place.

I guess there is more than one way to game the system...

Being taught to be a cheater in school carries on throughout life.

 

[dgibbons]

I had dinner last night with my wife's Wazzu roomie & her husband, who is a Husky. He just gave up his Husky tickets due to the UW ticket process. He says the big Tyee donors are currently making a big donation, for which they secure first seat choice. Then instead of their usual 4 seats they get 8 and sell the other 4 on the secondary market for quite a bit over face value. That helps them pay their Tyee donation that enabled them to get the tickets in the first place.

I guess there is more than one way to game the system...

This is what happens when you have demand.

 

[dgibbons]

For my part, I'm not perturbed by the additional parking cost. I'm bummed by the new "premium" permit and that Wilson is now re-classified. So my AA permit is far less interesting now. Is it like back in the day when you could use your yellow permit to park in the red or blue lots? So can an AA permit be used to park in an A lot?

What I am hopeful about is this bit:

Effective July 1, 2019, priority on season tickets and upgrades, parking, postseason tickets, away game tickets, and other member benefits will be allocated by annual giving level first then by CAF rank within each giving level. This change allows the CAF to objectively reward loyal and generous annual fund members for supporting WSU student-athletes.​

So, if the RV parking will be priority based on giving and CAF, and they quit doing the grandfathering crap they've done for years, those of us who donate will have a chance to get a lot 1 or lot 2 RV permit. I've been extremely frustrated at the waffling I've got from CAF about how RV permits are allocated. I've straight up asked "How much do I have to donate to get a lot 1 RV permit? $1000? $5000? $10000?" and the response has always been "It depends on where you CAF rank ends up relative to those who already have permits." Well, I know for a fact my CAF rank is higher than several lot 2 people. So, here's to hoping they actually honor this system.


This. I got hosed this last year. My CAF ranking at bowl game time was sub-1500, and I got section 107 tickets at $140/ea. I found section 112 tickets on StubHub for $100/ea. That's right, I got 50 yard line seats cheaper than was WSU got me for being a donor.

I'm on the Flatlandcoug wagon now. No more bowl ticket purchases through WSU.

Here's the thing- the tickets allocated to the bowl participants generally stink. The tickets sold on the open market, given to sponsors, etc. are way better. The priority system isn't going to change that.

 

[95coug]

What I am hopeful about is this bit:

Effective July 1, 2019, priority on season tickets and upgrades, parking, postseason tickets, away game tickets, and other member benefits will be allocated by annual giving level first then by CAF rank within each giving level. This change allows the CAF to objectively reward loyal and generous annual fund members for supporting WSU student-athletes.​

This is actually the part that annoys me the most. It allows the bandwagoner to stand on the sidelines and keep his wallet closed until we have a decent season, then drop the cash to move up the priority list and get ahead of someone who donates every year and actually attends games. And, with the way the AD has operated in the past - sending a late season 'improve your priority by donating now' e-mail - those bandwagoners could actually wait until near the end of the season to decide if they want to write the check.

I get that they want to encourage donations, and they want to court big donors. But this system gives pretty much zero reward for loyalty. Like someone else said above, WSU isn't so big that they can afford to turn their backs on the mid-level donors and 'working class' fans. And in years of looking, they haven't been able to locate consistent high-dollar donors or a sugar daddy, so they need to figure out where the balance is.

 

[Suudy]

This is actually the part that annoys me the most. It allows the bandwagoner to stand on the sidelines and keep his wallet closed until we have a decent season, then drop the cash to move up the priority list and get ahead of someone who donates every year and actually attends games. And, with the way the AD has operated in the past - sending a late season 'improve your priority by donating now' e-mail - those bandwagoners could actually wait until near the end of the season to decide if they want to write the check.

You aren't referring to me. I've been a season ticket holder since 2004, and have been steadily increasing my donations over the years. My CAF ranking is 1422. It has been steadily improving over the years. Yet despite my years of loyalty, I still can't get an region 1 or 2 RV site because the guy who hasn't changed his donations in 20 years, or bumps it up the minimum amount to qualify, gets to keep his RV permit year after year.

I get that they want to encourage donations, and they want to court big donors. But this system gives pretty much zero reward for loyalty. Like someone else said above, WSU isn't so big that they can afford to turn their backs on the mid-level donors and 'working class' fans. And in years of looking, they haven't been able to locate consistent high-dollar donors or a sugar daddy, so they need to figure out where the balance is.

I do agree that annual donations can leapfrog an individual. But only for that year. Those that have lifetime giving amounts that far exceed some individual annual gift will have priority if that annual gift is not maintained. Perhaps there is too much priority given to a current year's gift. But it is something allow those of us trying to claw our way up to get some benefits.

 

[cr8zyncalif]

Here's the thing- the tickets allocated to the bowl participants generally stink. The tickets sold on the open market, given to sponsors, etc. are way better. The priority system isn't going to change that.

I have an OK rank in terms of giving and can't get inside the 20. Not terrible tickets, but if I wanted to buy them from a local who had access and bought them for resale I could easily get better seats. My wife told me to look at that next time after our last 3 times of going through WSU.

 

[BiggsCoug]

This is actually the part that annoys me the most. It allows the bandwagoner to stand on the sidelines and keep his wallet closed until we have a decent season, then drop the cash to move up the priority list and get ahead of someone who donates every year and actually attends games. And, with the way the AD has operated in the past - sending a late season 'improve your priority by donating now' e-mail - those bandwagoners could actually wait until near the end of the season to decide if they want to write the check.

I get that they want to encourage donations, and they want to court big donors. But this system gives pretty much zero reward for loyalty. Like someone else said above, WSU isn't so big that they can afford to turn their backs on the mid-level donors and 'working class' fans. And in years of looking, they haven't been able to locate consistent high-dollar donors or a sugar daddy, so they need to figure out where the balance is.

WSU isn't so big they can turn down money. They are big enough to tell you that what you're donating isn't enough to get the perks you want.

The price is gonna go up. Things are going to change.

 

[CougPatrol]

Again, changes cut both ways. We’ll see how WSU manages them. I suspect they’ll do fine. The biggest donors deserve first priority, and if the system is structured properly, the middle of the pack donors will have their own priority. All of the lesser RV lots have room for improvement, and that’s what I’d like WSU to act on.

Apart from the Rose Bowl or another NY6 game, my Bowl attending days are over. Just not something I care to spend money on.

 

[CougEd]

You are and you should....Let me explain something Dum-Dum.
This conversation started w/me expressing the cost for MANY to travel to Pullman. Again, it’s my decision to spend my earned money however I want. I’ve chosen to spend it on Cougar Athletics, however the price to do this costs me $2K per game, which I totaled in an earlier post.
Now get your calculator out:
7 home games x $2K = $14K Of this $14K, $6K is for season tix’s. Point being, the Admin may want to reach into some other pockets beyond adding additional costs to the current contributors.
Between home games, away games, and bowl games, I’ve budgeted around $18K for Coug football and I’m sure I speak for many who physically and financially support the University.
Now get off the computer, go get a job, or a second if McDonalds is not paying you enough, and send our beloved Cougs some dinero.
I am done with you DIII Cash.

D III cash...now that is funny. I will say it is inaccurate on several fronts. First, the D3 schools have huge endowments, so there is a ton of D III cash to spread around. Second, in my time knowing Biggs and it is now over 20 years if it was the difference between eating a normal meal or attending Coug games and eating Top Ramen, he would choose the latter.

Which I think is his point regarding Alabama. Alabama fans (maybe incorrectly so) would call up Jim Palmer and see if the mortgage company he pitched back before the mortgage crisis was still operational and if they could do a 125 refi so they could afford tickets for the upcoming season. Pay your medical bills or go see Auburn Alabama? Those are the choices it seems like their fans are willing to make.

Here is what i would like to know. Take out the top 10% that attend Tide games, the ones that are buying Suites etc. Take out the students. Would it be incorrect to say there are about 60,000 seats left over for "the average fan"?

What I would like to know the 20,000 fans that buy tickets to Coug games what their net worth and disposable income is in comparison to the disposable income and net worth of the remaining 60,000 fans that attend the tide games?

We probably should do is go back to our old model, cost cutting if you will. Sell a home game back to our opponent like we did to BYU in 1989.

Schedule two huge body bag games a year like they did in 1984 with Ohio State and Tennessee or go back to Michigan in 1983 that cost the team a bowl game. .

Then tell Mike Leach and staff instead of the new indoor facility the new remodel is to paint their office; and they need to be their own painters but the department will reimburse them after Leach and staff buy their own paint.

Everyone has choices to make. The only thing that bugs me is when a fan will say "Price struggled because of this, Doba struggled because of that, Walden was sub .500 because of such and such and people reply, 'those are just excuses". Now when a fan thinks prices are too high and they have just been out priced, those are "reasons".

 

[CougEd]

I have an OK rank in terms of giving and can't get inside the 20. Not terrible tickets, but if I wanted to buy them from a local who had access and bought them for resale I could easily get better seats. My wife told me to look at that next time after our last 3 times of going through WSU.

Yep there is a flaw in the bowl system. I remember in 2003 when i am sitting on the 18 yard line, I look to my left and there is a guy from my health club sitting on the 35. he hadn't been to a game in Pullman in the prior ten years, I have 50 yard line seats.

I will order two tix for bowl games and then go to the open market for better seats at this point.

 

[etowncoug]

Walden, Erickson and mostly Price were under resourced, but were competing against coaches who didn't get new IPF's but had contractors hired to paint their offices. More kids flew under the radar before the combine circuit was up and running, and all three benefitted from much lower academic standards. Heck, the bubble wasn't that bad for practice facilities at the time it was built (and was considered temporary). Unfortunately, we missed a cycle of facility upgrades and by the time Leach arrived they were a major issue.

I don't think it is more difficult to win at WSU now than it was in the 80's and 90's.

D III cash...now that is funny. I will say it is inaccurate on several fronts. First, the D3 schools have huge endowments, so there is a ton of D III cash to spread around. Second, in my time knowing Biggs and it is now over 20 years if it was the difference between eating a normal meal or attending Coug games and eating Top Ramen, he would choose the latter.

Which I think is his point regarding Alabama. Alabama fans (maybe incorrectly so) would call up Jim Palmer and see if the mortgage company he pitched back before the mortgage crisis was still operational and if they could do a 125 refi so they could afford tickets for the upcoming season. Pay your medical bills or go see Auburn Alabama? Those are the choices it seems like their fans are willing to make.

Here is what i would like to know. Take out the top 10% that attend Tide games, the ones that are buying Suites etc. Take out the students. Would it be incorrect to say there are about 60,000 seats left over for "the average fan"?

What I would like to know the 20,000 fans that buy tickets to Coug games what their net worth and disposable income is in comparison to the disposable income and net worth of the remaining 60,000 fans that attend the tide games?

We probably should do is go back to our old model, cost cutting if you will. Sell a home game back to our opponent like we did to BYU in 1989.

Schedule two huge body bag games a year like they did in 1984 with Ohio State and Tennessee or go back to Michigan in 1983 that cost the team a bowl game. .

Then tell Mike Leach and staff instead of the new indoor facility the new remodel is to paint their office; and they need to be their own painters but the department will reimburse them after Leach and staff buy their own paint.

Everyone has choices to make. The only thing that bugs me is when a fan will say "Price struggled because of this, Doba struggled because of that, Walden was sub .500 because of such and such and people reply, 'those are just excuses". Now when a fan thinks prices are too high and they have just been out priced, those are "reasons".

 

[wazzucougs96]

I understand the people that didn't go because they couldn't afford to....or felt that the cost was just too high. My comment was that those same people who were unwilling to make that trip because of cost that were downplaying the difficulty of the drive for Iowa State fans will flip 180 degrees when the Cougs are playing in the Pac-12 championship game. They'll say that the airfare is too expensive on short notice and that the 26 hour roundtrip is too much of a burden and that they can't make it for some reason or another. I hope to be wrong, but it would not surprise me to see 10,000 Coug fans (at most) at a Pac-12 championship game. Not an embarrassing turnout......but pathetic compared to the support that teams in the SEC, Big 12 or B1G get.

Flat and interstate the entire way or 2 lane highways and mountain passes?

But more to the point, would you spend your bowl trip money and vacation time on the CCG or the bowl game?

Iowa State isn't getting the same number of fans in San Antonio if they pack the Big 12 title game just 3 weeks prior.

You also discount the fact that Texas is the hub for graduates of Big 12 schools and that Iowa State has a huge in state presence of alumni that inflate their numbers. They didn't bring 30,000 people from Ames.

 

[Flatlandcoug]

Flat and interstate the entire way or 2 lane highways and mountain passes?

But more to the point, would you spend your bowl trip money and vacation time on the CCG or the bowl game?

Iowa State isn't getting the same number of fans in San Antonio if they pack the Big 12 title game just 3 weeks prior.

You also discount the fact that Texas is the hub for graduates of Big 12 schools and that Iowa State has a huge in state presence of alumni that inflate their numbers. They didn't bring 30,000 people from Ames.

Like I said......there's always an excuse. I'm not sure about your point about Iowa State grads in Texas. What I said is that Coug fans discounted the drive that Iowa State fans made but they would find excuses to not make a trip of equivalent length if we were playing in San Francisco (bowl game or CCG) and I appreciate you stepping up to the plate. FWIW, there are a lot of WSU grads in California.....so your comment doesn't make sense. I'm sure that there are some Iowa State fans in San Antonio, but I'd bet that most of them are likely in the Dallas area, which is a four plus hour drive away in good traffic. It's a six hour drive from LA to San Francisco.....so not insanely different. And you'll think about making some excuse about California traffic, but unless you've driven through Austin, Texas (it's a b!tch) or Dallas, you don't have a clue about how bad it can be to drive in Texas.

So, thank you for making my point and proving that our fans will immediately start making excuses for why they can't support the Cougs instead of looking for ways to overcome obstacles. FWIW, Iowa State fans border on insane in their support of the Cyclones and have a reputation for outdoing everyone else in the Big 12. You are dead wrong about how many of them would show up if they played in the Big 12 championship game. I work with a Cyclone graduate and he shakes his head at how overzealous some of their fans can be. They've kind of gotten to the point where it's a thing for them to be over the top. Their support of the team is similar to our ESPN flag tradition.

So, there really isn't a need to outdo the Cyclones, but it would be nice if our fans spent more time being "Die Hard" and less time voting on polls online and making excuses for why they can't support the Cougs.

EDIT: I wanted to add that there was a ridiculous number of Iowa plates on I-35 on the way back home, so I can attest that a crap ton of their fans made the trip and also, FWIW, just about every Iowa State fan that I talked to was from the upper midwest....not Texas. Even the ones that were from Texas had faimily from Iowa that were there.

 

[Loyal Coug]

Flat and interstate the entire way or 2 lane highways and mountain passes?

.

Like I said......there's always an excuse. I'm not sure about your point about Iowa State grads in Texas. What I said is that Coug fans discounted the drive that Iowa State fans made but they would find excuses to not make a trip of equivalent length if we were playing in San Francisco (bowl game or CCG) and I appreciate you stepping up to the plate. FWIW, there are a lot of WSU grads in California.....so your comment doesn't make sense.

I'm sure there can be weather in December in the Midwest and Texas, but I-5 can be a bear - the pass at the Oregon/Cal border particularly. I'm not sure what 96 is referring to about 2 lane highways though. Spokane and Seattle (home of the vast majority of alums/fans would be interstates the whole way.

ISU is bigger than WSU though, so likely a bigger fan base. I tried to look up stats on our alums/grads, numbers and by state, but can't find anything.

 

[95coug]

I'm sure there can be weather in December in the Midwest and Texas, but I-5 can be a bear - the pass at the Oregon/Cal border particularly. I'm not sure what 96 is referring to about 2 lane highways though. Spokane and Seattle (home of the vast majority of alums/fans would be interstates the whole way.

ISU is bigger than WSU though, so likely a bigger fan base. I tried to look up stats on our alums/grads, numbers and by state, but can't find anything.

Had to be referring to highway 97, through Bend and Klamath Falls. Probably would not be the chosen path for most, but it's the way I'd go. I hate that I-5 trip...and there's a lot of good beer in Bend.

 

[Flatlandcoug]

I'm sure there can be weather in December in the Midwest and Texas, but I-5 can be a bear - the pass at the Oregon/Cal border particularly. I'm not sure what 96 is referring to about 2 lane highways though. Spokane and Seattle (home of the vast majority of alums/fans would be interstates the whole way.

ISU is bigger than WSU though, so likely a bigger fan base. I tried to look up stats on our alums/grads, numbers and by state, but can't find anything.

I drove back from Texas after the Sun Bowl and personally watched three cars wreck on the icy roads (one nearly taking me out with their dumb asses). There were another 15-20 cars in the ditch along the way. Statistically, the odds are higher that the route from Washington could be bad, but then again, I’ve got a friend that’s driven to California and Arizona from Washington for five different bowl games and he’s never had weather issues.

Iowa State has a total undergraduate enrollment of 29,000. According to the internet, WSU has 25,000 (including satellite campuses). So yeah, ISU has 16% more students. That totally explains how they have so many fans show up.

Again, it’s refreshing to see you step up to the plate for our fan base and prove that we will do exactly what I said we would do. When push comes to shove, a lot of our fans will stay home making excuses if supporting WSU is remotely difficult.

To be fair, the outlandish desire for 1998 Rose Bowl tickets and the silliness on ticket prices for Oregon last year when Gameday was announced shows that our fans have the potential to be amazing when they feel that it’s a unique or worthy experience. We are just a run of the mill fan base outside of that. Better than most of the PAC-12 perhaps, but lame compared to the crazy fans of the SEC and Big 12.

 

[wazzucougs96]

I'm not sure what 96 is referring to about 2 lane highways though. Spokane and Seattle (home of the vast majority of alums/fans would be interstates the whole way.

I was referring to driving to Santa Clara for the CCG. If you are driving from Spokane and go to Seattle first, you are doing it wrong.

 

[wazzucougs96]

I drove back from Texas after the Sun Bowl and personally watched three cars wreck on the icy roads (one nearly taking me out with their dumb asses). There were another 15-20 cars in the ditch along the way. Statistically, the odds are higher that the route from Washington could be bad, but then again, I’ve got a friend that’s driven to California and Arizona from Washington for five different bowl games and he’s never had weather issues.

Iowa State has a total undergraduate enrollment of 29,000. According to the internet, WSU has 25,000 (including satellite campuses). So yeah, ISU has 16% more students. That totally explains how they have so many fans show up.

Again, it’s refreshing to see you step up to the plate for our fan base and prove that we will do exactly what I said we would do. When push comes to shove, a lot of our fans will stay home making excuses if supporting WSU is remotely difficult.

To be fair, the outlandish desire for 1998 Rose Bowl tickets and the silliness on ticket prices for Oregon last year when Gameday was announced shows that our fans have the potential to be amazing when they feel that it’s a unique or worthy experience. We are just a run of the mill fan base outside of that. Better than most of the PAC-12 perhaps, but lame compared to the crazy fans of the SEC and Big 12.

We have a tiny fanbase that is pretty much limited to alumni and people close to alumni. We essentially have zero t-shirt fans. Neutrals in WA that don't choose UW are probably just as likely to choose Oregon as they are WSU. So of course we aren't going to travel as well as bigger fanbases. That's not an excuse, that is just reality.

 

[Loyal Coug]

I was referring to driving to Santa Clara for the CCG. If you are driving from Spokane and go to Seattle first, you are doing it wrong.

I was assuming you would take I-90 then 395 to the Tricities, then jump on I-80 (?) in Oregon. Maybe I'm missing a 2 lane segment. Is there a faster way?

We have a tiny fanbase that is pretty much limited to alumni and people close to alumni. We essentially have zero t-shirt fans. Neutrals in WA that don't choose UW are probably just as likely to choose Oregon as they are WSU. So of course we aren't going to travel as well as bigger fanbases. That's not an excuse, that is just reality.

I think WSU travels pretty well compared to other Pac-12 schools. Our away sections always seem to be robust. Comparing us to the schools back in the South and Midwest is kind of a futile exercise though.

 

[Flatlandcoug]

I was assuming you would take I-90 then 395 to the Tricities, then jump on I-80 (?) in Oregon. Maybe I'm missing a 2 lane segment. Is there a faster way?



I think WSU travels pretty well compared to other Pac-12 schools. Our away sections always seem to be robust. Comparing us to the schools back in the South and Midwest is kind of a futile exercise though.

That's the issue though isn't it? We are trying to compete nationally.....not just be better than the PNW schools. All of this comes back together at the end. Our fans do have more work involved in supporting the team and that has lead to a lower average donation when compared to our peer schools and a much smaller pot than schools in the other parts of the country. You can say that it's futile to make comparisons, but to really compete with them, we need to get to the point where our fan support is closer to them, however that happens as time goes on.

If not, you're basically waving the white flag and admitting that our team is likely to suck as soon as Leach is gone and you're ok with that, because it's just too tough for us to try to compete financially and it's ok to rationalize our support because it's just not worth it.

 

[wazzucougs96]

I was assuming you would take I-90 then 395 to the Tricities, then jump on I-80 (?) in Oregon. Maybe I'm missing a 2 lane segment. Is there a faster way?

Yes.