Mik Ramble Thread
- Thread starter Loyal Coug1
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Which is why somebody's comment that Tony's best WSU team, would beat this Smith's team by 10+ points, a inaccurate comment.
Jones, Rice, Wells, Chinyelu were very highly thought of, recruited by blue bloods, etc.
Smith BEAT OUT the Duke types for Jones, Rice, Wells, Chinyelu.
Yes Jones, Wells were not as sought after out of highschool, that is why Jones went to JC, Idaho, and why Wells went D2.
BUT BUT by the time that they transfered to WSU, they were highly sought after, thought of, etc. LOTS OF GOOD, GREAT COLLEGES WANTED JONES FROM UNIVERSITY OF IDAHO. The situation with Jones was like how everyone wanted the EWU big when the EWU big transfered.
And Wells was won a lot of accolades, and was a ALL AMERICAN, that LOTS of GOOD, GREAT colleges wanted from D2 Sonoma.
Smith, WSU, BEAT OUT ALL THAT GREAT COMPETITION for Jones, Wells.
Chinyelu is, was either the BEST, OR ONE OF THE BETTER, BEST players out of the NBA AFRICAN GLOBAL ACADEMY. HE WAS A 4 STAR, 4.5 STAR RECRUIT. HE WAS EXTREMELY HIGHLY SOUGHT AFTER. HE WAS PROJECTED AS A NBA PROSPECT ON PAPER. WSU, SMITH BEAT OUT ALL THE DUKE TYPES FOR CHINYELU
Rice was a 3.5 star recruit out of Georgia. LOTS OF GOOD PROGRAMS WANTED HIM. WSU, Smith beat out those good colleges.
So your assertion that the Duke types did not want Smith's players is a false assertion.
Only RAVELING is equal to Smith's RECRUITING PROWESS, and only STUART HOUSE, who was ranked 2nd in nation that everyone wanted, was, is equal to Chinyelu.
The narrative that Duke types didn't want Smith's recruits is a false narrative.
Not sure about apples and oranges. This team has come together extremely well...but outside of the win against Arizona, this team has had a far easier schedule and one nice win doesn't make a season. As good as the Arizona win is/was, the losses to Cal and Santa Clara are problematic. Right now, it looks like the Pac-12 is a two bid conference for the NCAA tournament. The Pac-10 sent six of its ten teams to the NCAA tournament in 2008. When you say comparing apples and oranges, I would say that the disparity in competition level does make this an apples and oranges discussion, and not in a good way for the 2024 squad.
Ironically, the 2008 team also faced Arizona in the 27th game....and lost by 10 points at home. If we win the game tonight, I may reverse my opinion of the two teams because two wins over Arizona would be pretty darned meaningful. As things stand though, that 2008 squad was a better team overall even if it wasn't as talented as the 2024 squad. Our tendency to go for five minute stretches without scoring would be magnified against that 2008 defense.
I like this team and I hope we win tonight...but I would not bet a penny on the Cougs. Just being realistic, based on what I've seen, I'm expecting to lose by 12 points tonight. I will be thrilled to be wrong.
Should be fun. I’m not expecting a win, Mchale is one of the toughest places in the country and AZ is a legit top 10 team. I fully expect it to be a competitive game though. Should be a wild atmosphere. Weather the initial storm and keep it close at half. Zona is going to be jacked with the home crowd, just can’t let them run out to a big lead.
It's not bullshit.
Chinyelu is, was a 4.5 STAR RECRUIT.HE WAS EXTREMELY HIGHLY SOUGHT AFTER BY DUKE TYPES.
He was back then projected as a NBA PROSPECT ON PAPER. His NBA African Global Academy Head coach, who was a good NBA player, and who was a NBA coach , said that Chinyelu was a NBA PROSPECT on paper, and that Chinyelu was one of the best players to ever come out of the NBA AFRICAN GLOBAL ACADEMY SYSTEM. Chinyelu has been compared to the NBA African Global Academy player that was a NBA LOTTERY PICK(FORGET THE PLAYERS NAME)
The FACT is that WSU Smith BEAT OUT ALL THE GREAT DUKE TYPE COMPETITION FOR CHINYELU.
The ONLY semi quasi knock on, about Chinyelu was that he was, is RAW, hasn't played basketball for that long. But CHINYELU HAD, HAS A NBA BODY, NBA FREAKISH JUMP OUT OF GYM NBA FREAKISH ATHLETICISM, IS 6-11, AND HAS A 7-8 WINGSPAN, IS ABOUT 248. AND HAD, HAS NBA POTENTIAL. AND AS YOU KNOW EVERYBODY WANTS NBA POTENTIAL. THE NBA OFTEN DOES ITS NBA DRAFT LOTTERY BASED OFF THAT NBA POTENTIAL.
That's not BS, ITS FACT.
FACT, JONES WAS A HIGHLY SOUGHT AFTER UNIVERSITY OF IDAHO 3.5 STAR RECRUIT BIG THAT LOTS OF GOOD COLLEGES WANTED JUST LIKE THAT EWU BIG THAT TRANSFERED.
FACT, WELLS WAS, IS A D2 ALL AMERICAN THAT WAS A 3.5 STAR RECRUIT THAT LOTS OF GREAT COLLEGES WANTED.
FACT, Rice was, is a 3.5 STAR recruit that good colleges wanted.
FACT, it's a FALSE NARRATIVE THAT DUKE TYPES SUPPOSEDLY DID NOT WANT SMITH'S RECRUITS.
You can errantly still think it's BS, and you will still be wrong, and the facts will still disagree with you.
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Tony's best WSU team wouldn't have lost by 20+ at Arizona, which is what's going to happen tonight.
BS.
There is about a 23% chance that WSU win.
And the deficit will probably be about 6 to 9,10 to 13 points.
6 point loss at best. 9,10 points loss at average. 13 point loss at worst.
That's the likelyhoods.
Yes technically WSU could theoretically lose by 20+ points. But that is not bloody damn likely to happen.
6 to 9,10 to 13 point loss is likely if WSU loses.
A team does not USUALLY beat Arizona, then win Ten in a row, then get blown out by Arizona by 20+ even if it's on the road at Arizona.
OK, I'll chime in, since the thread has morphed so much.
In football, many charged that Mike Leach's QB's and entire offense were a "system" offense, where both individual and group success were more about the success of the system than the contributions of the individuals.
I would posit that you could say the same thing for Bennett, Sr's teams, both on offense and defense. Pretty much the same arguments.
Tony has moved a bit beyond his dad's system.
I'd further posit that Coach Smith's teams are less system-driven and more molded to utilize the players that he has. And I'd say the same for Raveling, since his name was mentioned earlier in the thread.
I'm not saying one approach is better than the other. I am merely making some observations about coaches and their strategies.
Finally, I'd say that both Raveling and Smith were/are superb recruiters for their time.
In football, many charged that Mike Leach's QB's and entire offense were a "system" offense, where both individual and group success were more about the success of the system than the contributions of the individuals.
I would posit that you could say the same thing for Bennett, Sr's teams, both on offense and defense. Pretty much the same arguments.
Tony has moved a bit beyond his dad's system.
I'd further posit that Coach Smith's teams are less system-driven and more molded to utilize the players that he has. And I'd say the same for Raveling, since his name was mentioned earlier in the thread.
I'm not saying one approach is better than the other. I am merely making some observations about coaches and their strategies.
Finally, I'd say that both Raveling and Smith were/are superb recruiters for their time.
well let's fact check 'ol Mik again. So the "I call BS" was about the whole ramble, not just Chinyelo. So yeah Mik is again just making shit up, and will refuse to back down when presented with facts.
ABC article - Chinyelu did have quite a few P5 offers - but not from Duke, which Mik likes to spew out.
See yahoo article - WSU was Rice's only P5 offer. Cluff's only other offer was Cal. "Other Division coaches did not believe" in Wells.
24/7 article - Washington, Texas Tech, Villanova, and Oregon State did "covet" Jones, but he followed his WVC and Idaho coach to WSU.
Rueben Chinyelu commits to Washington State basketball
Washington State is winning again thanks to players' development -- and coaches' eyes for talent
Feb. 20—PULLMAN — Jaylen Wells has picked up a favorite hobby on the court. He'll put the ball in the basket for Washington State, maybe via 3-pointer or a midrange jumper, and immediately turn to the opposing coach. "Just to see how mad they get," Wells said. As WSU racks up wins, inching a...
sports.yahoo.com
From tiny teen to college beast: The wild journey of WSU's Isaac Jones
'I kept growing and growing even as I got to college,' Cougar forward says
247sports.com
Imagine that! I’m not saying some of these guys didn’t have other offers. But it ain’t like we wiped the floor with Duke, Kentucky, and Arizona. Get real. This is a really good collection of college players who are well coached and playing well together. Not blue chips or a 90s UNLV team. Not a collection of NBA talent. Hell I hope they all end up in the NBA but we know that’s not happening. Maybe one of them has a 5+ year NBA career. Most will be playing pro ball overseas. Meanwhile the schools that Mik says were all over these guys have 3 guys a year who are one and done first rounders.well let's fact check 'ol Mik again. So the "I call BS" was about the whole ramble, not just Chinyelo. So yeah Mik is again just making shit up, and will refuse to back down when presented with facts.
ABC article - Chinyelu did have quite a few P5 offers - but not from Duke, which Mik likes to spew out.
See yahoo article - WSU was Rice's only P5 offer. Cluff's only other offer was Cal. "Other Division coaches did not believe" in Wells.
24/7 article - Washington, Texas Tech, Villanova, and Oregon State did "covet" Jones, but he followed his WVC and Idaho coach to WSU.
Rueben Chinyelu commits to Washington State basketball
abcnews.go.com
Washington State is winning again thanks to players' development -- and coaches' eyes for talent
Feb. 20—PULLMAN — Jaylen Wells has picked up a favorite hobby on the court. He'll put the ball in the basket for Washington State, maybe via 3-pointer or a midrange jumper, and immediately turn to the opposing coach. "Just to see how mad they get," Wells said. As WSU racks up wins, inching a...
From tiny teen to college beast: The wild journey of WSU's Isaac Jones
'I kept growing and growing even as I got to college,' Cougar forward says
That said recruiting+coaching this is a National COTY level coaching job for Kyle Smith.
Here’s what I will say. In basketball, this is where Duke started. In football, Florida State was a joke before Bobby Bowden showed up. Kansas state, Bill Snyder - All it takes is the right coach who wants to be there for the long haul to build a powerhouse. If Smith wants to stay and build there’s no reason WSU couldn’t be packing a remodeled Beasley and bringing in NBA guys within 5 years. Right Coach, vision, an influx of $, leadership, can happen anywhere.You are welcome 90. But then I am just an idiot according to Mik.....
well let's fact check 'ol Mik again. So the "I call BS" was about the whole ramble, not just Chinyelo. So yeah Mik is again just making shit up, and will refuse to back down when presented with facts.
ABC article - Chinyelu did have quite a few P5 offers - but not from Duke, which Mik likes to spew out.
See yahoo article - WSU was Rice's only P5 offer. Cluff's only other offer was Cal. "Other Division coaches did not believe" in Wells.
24/7 article - Washington, Texas Tech, Villanova, and Oregon State did "covet" Jones, but he followed his WVC and Idaho coach to WSU.
Rueben Chinyelu commits to Washington State basketball
Washington State is winning again thanks to players' development -- and coaches' eyes for talent
Feb. 20—PULLMAN — Jaylen Wells has picked up a favorite hobby on the court. He'll put the ball in the basket for Washington State, maybe via 3-pointer or a midrange jumper, and immediately turn to the opposing coach. "Just to see how mad they get," Wells said. As WSU racks up wins, inching a...
From tiny teen to college beast: The wild journey of WSU's Isaac Jones
'I kept growing and growing even as I got to college,' Cougar forward says
I SAID DUKE TYPES. I DID NOT SAY SPECIFICALLY THAT DUKE SPECIFICALLY OFFERED. I SAID DUKE TYPE.
NEXT A DUKE TYPE DOES NOT HAVE TO BE A P5.
GONZAGA, WICHITA ST, CREIGHTON, VILLANOVA, UCONN, MARQUETTE, AND MANY OTHER SUCH SIMILAR MID MAJORS ARE DUKE TYPES.
NOTE THAT IS NOT SAYING THE ABOVE MID MAJORS SPECIFICALLY OFFERED ANY OF SMITH's recruits, only that DUKE TYPES(NOT SPECIFICALLY DUKE), and some of those DUKE TYPES CAN BE MID MAJORS
REMEMBER BASKETBALL IS NOT LIKE FOOTBALL WHERE THERE ARE NO DUKE, ALABAMA, POWER TEAM TYPES IN G5, MID MAJOR CONFERENCES.
Jones was a 3.5 star recruit that's a fact. And as you pointed out, UW, Texas Tech, Villanova is pretty good offers. WSU, Smith still technically beat out, those pretty good offers.
Rice was a 3.5 star recruit, 3.5 stars is still pretty good, and Rice got some good offers from good semi quasi Duke TYPE mid majors.
Wells was a FREAKING ALL AMERICAN. BEING A ALL AMERICAN IS PRETTY BLOODY DAMN AWESOME. He was, is a 3.5 star recruit that WON A LOT OF ACCOLADES, AWARDS, WHICH IS PRETTY BLOODY DAMN GOOD. AND ALTHO CAL IS NOT GOOD THIS YEAR, CAL HAS BEEN PRETTY GOOD A SEMI LOT IN THE PAST, AND STILL HAS AWESOME RECRUITING CLASSES RIGHT UP THERE WITH THE DUKE TYPES AS ITS LACK OF COACHING, NOT RECRUITING AS TO WHY CAL HAS NOT BEEN GOOD LATELY. SO CAL IS A PRETTY GOOD SEMI DUKE TYPE RECRUITING WISE OFFER
ALSO OFFERS ARE NOT THE ONLY WAY THAT DUKE TYPES SHOW INTEREST. BECAUSE DUKE TYPES CAN GET THE BEST PLAYERS, RECRUITS IN THE NATION, DUKE TYPES OFTEN HAVE PLAN B, C, D OPTIONS, WHERE THEY ARE INTERESTED IN A PLAYER, AND IN OFFERING A PLAYER, IF THEIR PLAN A OR B OPTION FALLS THRU AND THEY DONT GET THEIR PLAN A, B OPTION.
WELLS BECAUSE OF BEING A AWESOME 3.5 STAR RECRUIT AND A ALL AMERICAN ALL AMERICAN ALL AMERICAN, GOT A LOT OF INTEREST FROM BOTH P5, AND MID MAJOR SEMI DUKE TYPES AS THEIR PLAN B, C OPTIONS, IN CASE THEIR PLAN A, B OPTIONS FELL THROUGH.
SO JONES, WELLS, RICE GOT A LOT OF INTEREST, AND SOME OFFERS FROM DUKE TYPES, SEMI DUKE TYPES, BOTH P4,5, AND MID MAJORS, ETC.
THE NARRATIVE THAT JONES, RICE, WELLS, CHINYELU, WERE NOT GOOD RECRUITS, AND THAT THEY DIDNT GET INTEREST, OFFERS, FROM DUKE TYPES, SEMI DUKE TYPES, BOTH MID MAJORS, P4,5, IS A FALSE NARRATIVE.
ALSO DUKE TYPES DONT LIKE TO OFFER RECRUITS AND THEN HAVE THEIR OFFERS REJECTED. AN OR GET OUT THAT THEY A DUKE TYPE WERE, WAS REJECTED.
SO BECAUSE OF THAT DUKE TYPES SHOW UNOFFICIAL INTEREST, MAKE UNOFFICIAL OFFERS, AND THEN IF IT LOOKS LIKE THE RECRUIT IS INTERESTED, THEN THE DUKE TYPE OFFICIALLY OFFERS. AND IF THE RECRUIT IS NOT INTERESTED, THEN THE DUKE TYPE NEVER OFFICIALLY OFFERED SO THE DUME TYPE DIDNT GET REJECTED.
ALSO WHEN A PLAYER COMMITS TO A WSU TYPE, OFTEN A DUKE TYPE WONT OFFICIALLY OFFER A RECRUIT, BECAUSE THEY FIGURE THAT THE RECRUIT WONT ACCEPT THEIR OFFER BECAUSE THEY COMMITTED TO WSU, AND THEY DONT WANT IT TO GET OUT THAT S RECRUIT CHOSE WSU OVER THEM A DUKE TYPE
SO BECAUSE OF THAT A DUKE TYPE WILL UNOFFICIALLY SHOW INTEREST IN A WSU COMMIT, AND THEN IF THE WSU COMMIT SHOWS INTEREST BACK, THEN THEY OFFER THE WSU COMMIT.
JONES, RICE, WELLS, CHINYELU WERE 3.5 STAR(Jones, Rice, Wells), 4.5 star(Chinyelu), recruits that were semi highly ranked to highly ranked, that won a lot of awards, accolades, that were highly thought of by DUKE TYPES, and that were sought after, had interest from Duke Types, and semi Duke types, and had some pretty good offers from Duke types, Semi Duke types, both mid majors, P4,5.
The Narrative that Chinyelu, Jones, Wells, Rice, were not awesome, highly ranked recruits, that were not highly thought of, sought after, that did not receive interest an or offers from Duke types, semi Duke types in both midmajor, and P5, that they were supposedly unwanted by Duke types, semi Duke types, both midmajor, P5, is a false narrative.
I'm not saying that WSU has, is consistently wiping the floor vs Specifically Duke or even Duke types.
I said that the narrative that Smith's Chinyelu, Jones, Wells, Rice, were not highly ranked, were not 3.5 star(Jones, Rice, Wells), 4.5 star(Chinyelu), recruits, that were not highly thought of, that did not get interest, an or offers from Duke types, semi Duke types, both midmajor ones like Gonzaga types, and P5, that Chinyelu, Jones, Wells, Rice were not wanted by Duke types, Semi Duke types, is a false narrative.
Look I'm not saying that Smith goes around beating out lots of Duke types a lot.
But CHINYELU, Jones, Wells, Rice, were highly ranked recruits, that won a lot of awards, accolades, that were 3.5 star recruits(Jones, Rice, Wells) and a 4.5 star recruit(Chinyelu), that were highly thought of, and did get attention, interest and even offers from Duke types, semi Duke types, pretty good colleges, etc, in both Midmajor, P5, that Smith BEAT OUT for Chinyelu, Jones, Wells, Rice.
The Narrative that Smith's Chinyelu, Jones, Rice, Wells, were low ranked recruits, that were not highly thought of that were not sought after, that did not get interest an or offers from DUKE TYPES, SEMI DUKE TYPES, PRETTY DARN GOOD COLLEGES, ETC, BOTH MIDMAJOR LIKE GONZAGA TYPES, AND P5, that were unwanted by the Duke types, Semi Duke types, Gonzaga types, both midmajor, P5, etc, was, is a false narrative.
Contrary to what some Coug fans believe, Smith, WSU recruits STILL OCCASIONALLY get interests, offers, from Duke types, semi Duke types, Gonzaga types, etc, and that Smith, WSU still occasionally semi beats out Duke types, semi Duke types, Gonzaga types, both midmajor, P5 for the occasional good, high ranked, highly thought of, sought after, interest, offers shown from Duke types, Semi Duke types, Gonzaga types, both Midmajor, P5 recruits.
That is why Smith, Raveling are, were such awesome recruiters, because of occasionally they beat out get the Stuart House's, Chinyelu's etc, over, from the clutches of the Duke types, Semi Duke types, Gonzaga types, both midmajor, P5, etc.
You are welcome 90. But then I am just an idiot according to Mik.....
You were acting like a idiotic rude a hole, jerk, etc, not that you were being a idiot intellectually.
There is a difference between a intellectually challenged person(Idiot(not a nice thing to call such people), and a person acting like a rude a hole jerk(Still not nice to call such people a idiot(two wrongs don't make a right, so it's not nice of me to call you a idiot if you act like a rude, a hole jerk).
Calling people an idiot usually isn't necessary. They usually prove it themselves.
That's always been the struggle for WSU. Can we get a coach who really wants to be in Pullman? All of your examples are great. I'll say that Kansas State is an example of how hard it is to stay at the top if you are a small market program, but once he got the ball rolling in year five, he went on to have 9+ wins in 14 out of the next 19 seasons that he coached at KSU and that included two seasons when he was rebuilding after the Ron Prince debacle. 1995-2003 was an amazing time to be a Wildcat fan. Six Top 10 finishes in eight years is pretty amazing.
It doesn’t happen often. The allure of the big job and big pay day for the coach along with the constant roster turnover w NIL and the portal. Harder to do now than it used to be. But there will be programs in 40 years you’ll look back on and say, where did that come from?! Starts with the coach though. Think Smith has proven he can be a consistent winner no matter the obstacles. Would be fascinating to see where he could take the program in 10, 15 years. Probably won’t happen but we can dream.
That was my point. We all remember when a 5 point lead during that time was like a double digit lead. The team was designed to win, not blow people out. I'll let the rest here decide which team was better. But, either way, it's a close game.
Take this for what you will, but…with the Bennett teams, if they were up 5 with 2 minutes left I felt the game was in hand. I’d watch to see them finish off the opponent.
Games I’ve watched this year, a 5 point lead isn’t comfortable, and I’ll watch to make sure they don’t blow it.
On the other hand…if a Bennett team was down 5 with 2 to go….we probably weren’t winning.
For the record, from easily found basketball recruiting websites, Myles Rice had offers from: Washington State, James Madison, East Carolina, Iona, Georgia State, Belmont, Pacific, and Bucknell. No other schools that I could find.
Rice is an awesome recruit for WSU and the Cougars are fortunate to have him. Same for Jones, Wells, Chinyelu, and Cluff. It doesn't matter to me one bit who else might have been interested in these guys since it doesn't change a thing. They are excellent ball players for the Cougars and Kyle Smith should be commended for recognizing how good they are when other schools passed them up. It's been a surprising and super fun year.
Now, let's go sweep the Wildcats!
Glad Cougar
Rice is an awesome recruit for WSU and the Cougars are fortunate to have him. Same for Jones, Wells, Chinyelu, and Cluff. It doesn't matter to me one bit who else might have been interested in these guys since it doesn't change a thing. They are excellent ball players for the Cougars and Kyle Smith should be commended for recognizing how good they are when other schools passed them up. It's been a surprising and super fun year.
Now, let's go sweep the Wildcats!
Glad Cougar
Provide a link or two to these sites please? I'm too much of an idiot to locate them.
I blocked Mik a couple years ago. He's an earnest fan who has a lot of thoughts....but just too many for me to try to comprehend.
C'mon, that's no fun! I never block anyone - I want to see who thinks I'm an idiot. Oh wait, I guess that is pretty much everyone.
I try to ignore him, but the nonstop repetitive BS and "I know it all's" and total made up BS just suck me in. Moth to flame.
If it wasn’t for the ignore function, I would have been driven out of here 2,3,4,5 years ago. Not being exposed to a few, some, most, nearly all of the repetitive, barely coherent, ALL CAPS rants has helped maintain my sanity.C'mon, that's no fun! I never block anyone - I want to see who thinks I'm an idiot. Oh wait, I guess that is pretty much everyone.
I try to ignore him, but the nonstop repetitive BS and "I know it all's" and total made up BS just suck me in. Moth to flame.
Oh well, proof that you may not know what you are talking about! Covered by 23+. Time to stop the nonsenses, and start appreciating the qualities that this team possesses.
Patrol is the master of the reverse jinx. Appreciate his work.
Oh ye of little faith - +15 That was the single greatest win in school history -- if they can now hold serve. The 82-83 team did the same only to come out flat against the UW. This team is long, athletic and full of skilled players who can go to bat when some else is having an off night. Everything the Bennett teams weren't, whom relied on Prussian military discipline to win. Sure, the Bennett teams could have beaten this team, it is basketball, that happens, but only at their very best. A Bennett team once beat a #7 Arizona team (in 2007). It is time to accept what your eyes see before you, and give this team the love it deserves.
Strength of schedule isn't there, that is true, but when you actual beat teams rated higher than you, it doesn't really matter, does it? Strength of schedule only minimizes ranking damage caused by losses.
Need him to project another 20 point loss against ASU. That game scares me, because they are kids and may be in "all we need do is show up," mode. Ucla in 83 was followed by the the UW loss, which snatched defeat from the jaws of "conference title" victory.
I said that I was hoping to be proven wrong and they definitely proved me wrong. This team is on track to be the best team in any of our lifetimes if they keep performing as well as they did last night. One game doesn't make a season, but winning 11 out of 12 and knocking off a Top 5 opponent twice in one season is a different kind of thing.
That 2007-08 squad was still great and would give our current team fits, but based on last night, anyone that is objective has to admit that this team is officially special.
I had that same thought going into cal Stanford after they ripped off 3 straight road wins.
This no longer concerns me. These guys are so grounded, I just don’t see that creeping in. Could we have an off shooting night? Sure.
