Sounds Like Chun And Schulz have given up!

[Cougsocal]

That last tweet was depressing, they've basically give up. Nothing in it suggests they are in "push the women and children out of the life boat" mode, like we all had hoped.

Gawd could we have picked two worse ADs in Moos (pie in the sky) and Chun (do mothing), and Presidents in Schulz (do nothing) and Floyd (pie in the sky). One duo to put us in a big hole, the other duo to just let us dwell there.

 

[CougSinceBirth]

That last tweet was depressing, they've basically give up. Nothing in it suggests they are in "push the women and children out of the life boat" mode, like we all had hoped.

Gawd could we have picked two worse ADs in Moos (pie in the sky) and Chun (do mothing), and Presidents in Schulz (do nothing) and Floyd (pie in the sky). One duo to put us in a big hole, the other duo to just let us dwell there.

FWIW, Moos had to get some facilities up to snuff or even just average. It's not like his predecessors were keeping things updated and nice consistently before him.

 

[PeteTheChop]

Official statement

 

[Coug90]

That last tweet was depressing, they've basically give up. Nothing in it suggests they are in "push the women and children out of the life boat" mode, like we all had hoped.

Gawd could we have picked two worse ADs in Moos (pie in the sky) and Chun (do mothing), and Presidents in Schulz (do nothing) and Floyd (pie in the sky). One duo to put us in a big hole, the other duo to just let us dwell there.

A. I wouldn’t say they have given up, they had to make some sort of statement. B. Chun has absolutely zero to do with this, nor does any of the other current P12 ADs. This is 100% on the commissioners and the presidents/administrators who hired them. That’s it. There were multiple times this whole shit show could have been avoided. The commissioners sucked and the conference brass sat on their hands and let it happen.

 

[PeteTheChop]

Dr. Schulz states that he and Chung have been preparing for "different scenarios"

Maybe they already have WSU's conference plans narrowed down for 12 months from now.

Still hoping for the Big 12. Cougs can be successful there and make some good money, too

 

[95coug]

Exactly how were they supposed to press UA, UW, or UO to stay in the conference?

Larry Scott bought the Pac-12's tombstone, and tied it around their necks. The presidents let him stay too long.

Probably still could have been fixed until the NCAA rewrote the rules to allow NIL and free agency. At that point, it was clear that the gap between the CFP "haves" and "have nots" was only going to get wider. This wasn't quite inevitable, but it's been the likely eventual outcome for over a year.

The Pac-12 is, for all practical purposes, dead. If it fills out the ranks with a bunch of MWC teams, it's more G5 than P5. We're moving into the superconference era, and anyone who's not in the Big 10 or SEC is not going to be a power conference. We're heading toward G7 and P2.

In the next few years, the bigger draw ACC teams will move to the SEC. Maybe the SEC will jettison some of its bottom feeders and replace them with ACC schools. The Big 10 and SEC may pull replacement teams from the remnants of the ACC and Big 12, but there will be no mistaking which conferences are the powers.

 

[425cougfan]

Check out the replies to that tweet if you want to see how people are feeling.

 

[425cougfan]

That last tweet was depressing, they've basically give up. Nothing in it suggests they are in "push the women and children out of the life boat" mode, like we all had hoped.

Gawd could we have picked two worse ADs in Moos (pie in the sky) and Chun (do mothing), and Presidents in Schulz (do nothing) and Floyd (pie in the sky). One duo to put us in a big hole, the other duo to just let us dwell there.

Of course they aren't doing anything. Chun likely was out the door anyway and Schulz would rather take selfies of himself eating a pizza or something than take bold action, especially because he's in that leadership position in the Pac-12. He's going to go with the flow and try to "reach consensus" and hope for the best with George. I somewhat understand how some might have viewed Schulz's role that he stepped into recently as a positive, but it could have been a massive detriment in the blowup scenario. Man. Just so ****ing pissed.

 

[PeteTheChop]

Of course they aren't doing anything. Chun likely was out the door anyway and Schulz would rather take selfies of himself eating a pizza or something than take bold action, especially because he's in that leadership position in the Pac-12. He's going to go with the flow and try to "reach consensus" and hope for the best with George. I somewhat understand how some might have viewed Schulz's role that he stepped into recently as a positive, but it could have been a massive detriment in the blowup scenario. Man. Just so ****ing pissed.

425, what are you hearing abour Cougs/Beavs and the Big 12?

This is from a West Virginia insider with almost 23,000 followers

 

[MapleStCoug]

425, what are you hearing abour Cougs/Beavs and the Big 12?

This is from a West Virginia insider with almost 23,000 followers

This guy said Arizona and CU applied to the Big 12 last July. He's thrown every possible scenario out there and some have stuck. I seriously doubt a guy in Morgantown has connections at most institutions on the western US. I am also praying he's right lol.

 

[How_did_this_happen?]

Of course they aren't doing anything. Chun likely was out the door anyway and Schulz would rather take selfies of himself eating a pizza or something than take bold action, especially because he's in that leadership position in the Pac-12. He's going to go with the flow and try to "reach consensus" and hope for the best with George. I somewhat understand how some might have viewed Schulz's role that he stepped into recently as a positive, but it could have been a massive detriment in the blowup scenario. Man. Just so ****ing pissed.

It makes perfect sense that Shultz was made the lead of the ADs now.

 

[Cougsocal]

A. I wouldn’t say they have given up, they had to make some sort of statement. B. Chun has absolutely zero to do with this, nor does any of the other current P12 ADs. This is 100% on the commissioners and the presidents/administrators who hired them. That’s it. There were multiple times this whole shit show could have been avoided. The commissioners sucked and the conference brass sat on their hands and let it happen.

What! TV deal for sure, but why aren't we in the Big 12 conversation? That is all on Chun and Schulz. They should have been back channeling with for months, once they got the first inkling that the deal was gone to be a bunch of crap. That is their big failing/ zero back up plan.

 

[Coug90]

What! TV deal for sure, but why aren't we in the Big 12 conversation? That is all on Chun and Schulz. They should have been back channeling with for months, once they got the first inkling that the deal was gone to be a bunch of crap. That is their big failing/ zero back up plan.

Chuns job is to manage the AD (hiring and overseeing staff and coaches) and funding of the AD (schmoozing big donors, etc). Chuns job is not to represent WSU in conference realignment. Where we are at has nothing to do w Chun. He’s got as much to do w it as Dickert, we’d be on the same spot regardless of if every pac 12 member had the 12 best ADs on the planet.

This is on the commissioners and presidents/admins who hired and retained them for FAR too long.

 

[Coug90]

425, what are you hearing abour Cougs/Beavs and the Big 12?

This is from a West Virginia insider with almost 23,000 followers

I think this could very likely be happening. I don’t doubt the legitimacy of this

 

[Cougsocal]

FWIW, Moos had to get some facilities up to snuff or even just average. It's not like his predecessors were keeping things updated and nice consistently before him.

Oh stop it. There is a world of difference between judicious and well timed upgrades and $132 million in spending on a overdone FOB and utterly worthless luxury boxes et al. Moos' job was to think it through. Know his market, conduct a comprehensive risk/benefit analysis of the plan. What happens if the added fans and revenue does not materialize, what if the FOB is a recruiting flop, what if no one wants the Pac 12 network? What is our worst case scenario. It is a business. Tons of businesses foolishly overbuild and overspend and then go out of business because of it, but no one defends their CEOs by saying, well, he built a great factory and a fantastic main office.

We are running a big (hiring freeze level) deficit despite receiving 24 million a year on the current TV deal, because it isn't remotely enough due to our insane debt load. If we are force to join the MWC, which seems likely, we are only going to get about 4 million per year. We are on the edge of the financial abyss as a result, and that is Moos/Floyds doing for spending like Phil Knight went to WSU.

 

[mikalalas]

Chuns job is to manage the AD (hiring and overseeing staff and coaches) and funding of the AD (schmoozing big donors, etc). Chuns job is not to represent WSU in conference realignment. Where we are at has nothing to do w Chun. He’s got as much to do w it as Dickert, we’d be on the same spot regardless of if every pac 12 member had the 12 best ADs on the planet.

This is on the commissioners and presidents/admins who hired and retained them for FAR too long.

The AD's Job, if they are a good AD is to CONFRONT the President on Athletic matters, and help advise them what to do.

"Pres Schultz(or Kirk, etc), I know that I'm not the guy in charge like you, but you really should fire Scott because(insert reasons)". " And George is not doing any better and should either demand action, or demand to be in charge, or fire him, because of(Insert reasons)", "And have to get the media deal done now for about 26 to 28 to 30 mil per team, or we lose Colorado, Arizona", "And in case the PAC falls apart, with only us left, we need to start yesterday, now to try to get the Big 12 to take us, if PAC falls apart".

Yes the AD can be dismissed, not listened to, laughed at, fired, etc, but even if it gets the AD fired, the AD has a obligation to advise, pressure, even bully, point out stupidity if necessary.

That's why it's Chun's fault, as well as Scott's, George's, Schultz's fault.

Chun likely didn't do anything like talking to Schultz, George, etc.

If I was the AD in Chun's place, and saw this shit, coming down the pipe, I would bully Schultz, George, to do what needed to be done to avoid it, even if doing so pissed everyone off, got me into trouble, disciplined, fired, etc.

 

[CougSinceBirth]

Oh stop it. There is a world of difference between judicious and well timed upgrades and $132 million in spending on a overdone FOB and utterly worthless luxury boxes et al. Moos' job was to think it through. Know his market, conduct a comprehensive risk/benefit analysis of the plan. What happens if the added fans and revenue does not materialize, what if the FOB is a recruiting flop, what if no one wants the Pac 12 network? What is our worst case scenario. It is a business. Tons of businesses foolishly overbuild and overspend and then go out of business because of it, but no one defends their CEOs by saying, well, he built a great factory and a fantastic main office.

We are running a big (hiring freeze level) deficit despite receiving 24 million a year on the current TV deal, because it isn't remotely enough due to our insane debt load. If we are force to join the MWC, which seems likely, we are only going to get about 4 million per year. We are on the edge of the financial abyss as a result, and that is Moos/Floyds doing for spending like Phil Knight went to WSU.

Remember what Martin Stadium looked like before the renovation. There was a double-wide on top that was a "press box" Was it too much? You can argue yes, but something had to be done and upgraded. Sterk played accountant; Dickson didn't do jack. Now we're almost back to the early 90s with no major renovations. Do you think Leach comes if there's a double-wide press box and no FOB coming in the pipe?

No way in my mind does Floyd let the events of today happen, or even get there. Meanwhile Schulz has watched a university go ranked 140 (in 2018) to 212 (in 2023) and futzed around as "CEO" of the conference leadership. It's not like Chun has absolutely crushed it either. Plenty of blame to go around.

Floyd/Moos actually did something. They can take some of the blame, but there's plenty of other presidents and ADs that dropped the ball, including the two at the helm now.

 

[BiggsCoug]

Remember what Martin Stadium looked like before the renovation. There was a double-wide on top that was a "press box" Was it too much? You can argue yes, but something had to be done and upgraded. Sterk played accountant; Dickson didn't do jack. Now we're almost back to the early 90s with no major renovations. Do you think Leach comes if there's a double-wide press box and no FOB coming in the pipe?

No way in my mind does Floyd let the events of today happen, or even get there. Meanwhile Schulz has watched a university go ranked 140 (in 2018) to 212 (in 2023) and futzed around as "CEO" of the conference leadership. It's not like Chun has absolutely crushed it either. Plenty of blame to go around.

Floyd/Moos actually did something. They can take some of the blame, but there's plenty of other presidents and ADs that dropped the ball, including the two at the helm now.

Schulz and Chun suck.

 

[Coug90]

The AD's Job, if they are a good AD is to CONFRONT the President on Athletic matters, and help advise them what to do.

"Pres Schultz(or Kirk, etc), I know that I'm not the guy in charge like you, but you really should fire Scott because(insert reasons)". " And George is not doing any better and should either demand action, or demand to be in charge, or fire him, because of(Insert reasons)", "And have to get the media deal done now for about 26 to 28 to 30 mil per team, or we lose Colorado, Arizona", "And in case the PAC falls apart, with only us left, we need to start yesterday, now to try to get the Big 12 to take us, if PAC falls apart".

Yes the AD can be dismissed, not listened to, laughed at, fired, etc, but even if it gets the AD fired, the AD has a obligation to advise, pressure, even bully, point out stupidity if necessary.

That's why it's Chun's fault, as well as Scott's, George's, Schultz's fault.

Chun likely didn't do anything like talking to Schultz, George, etc.

If I was the AD in Chun's place, and saw this shit, coming down the pipe, I would bully Schultz, George, to do what needed to be done to avoid it, even if doing so pissed everyone off, got me into trouble, disciplined, fired, etc.

Well, if we don’t end up getting a miracle invite to the Big12, Chun will likely be gone soon anyways. This will end up being a huge demotion for everyone associated with the department, so Chun will probably be looking for another opportunity.

 

[Coug90]

Remember what Martin Stadium looked like before the renovation. There was a double-wide on top that was a "press box" Was it too much? You can argue yes, but something had to be done and upgraded. Sterk played accountant; Dickson didn't do jack. Now we're almost back to the early 90s with no major renovations. Do you think Leach comes if there's a double-wide press box and no FOB coming in the pipe?

No way in my mind does Floyd let the events of today happen, or even get there. Meanwhile Schulz has watched a university go ranked 140 (in 2018) to 212 (in 2023) and futzed around as "CEO" of the conference leadership. It's not like Chun has absolutely crushed it either. Plenty of blame to go around.

Floyd/Moos actually did something. They can take some of the blame, but there's plenty of other presidents and ADs that dropped the ball, including the two at the helm now.

Didn’t Floyd give an endorsement to Larry Scott several years in?

 

[CougSinceBirth]

Didn’t Floyd give an endorsement to Larry Scott several years in?

Pretty sure the only presidents loving Scott were ASU, OSU, UCLA AD.

 

[CougSinceBirth]

Schulz and Chun suck.

Yep. Haven't had really anything good to say about them in years.

 

[BiggsCoug]

Yep. Haven't had really anything good to say about them in years.

Losing Floyd and Moos crushed WSU.

 

[Cougini5591]

Losing Floyd and Moos crushed WSU.

More so than Coug fans seem to comprehend.

 

[BiggsCoug]

More so than Coug fans seem to comprehend.

Yes.

This is their chance to show off how amazing they are. Let’s see how they navigate this now that they have no conference after this year. Better get to work scheduling.

 

[PeteTheChop]

Losing Floyd and Moos crushed WSU.

More so than Coug fans seem to comprehend.

I thought Mr. Moos made a huge impact at WSU, but it seems like some CougZoners don't think much of him because they thought he spent too much money

 

[ShockandAweWSU]

Schultz and Crow at ASU are the main reasons we had LARRY SCOTT for so long. Pac 12 network can be placed on Schultz' sweater vest shoulders. He loved the equal revenue concept. It ran off USC and UCLA and started this entire debacle. Schultz and Chun both need to go.

 

[PeteTheChop]

Pac 12 network can be placed on Schultz' sweater vest shoulders. He loved the equal revenue concept. It ran off USC and UCLA and started this entire debacle. Schultz and Chun both need to go.

Big 12 schools bent over backwards to give Texas and Oklahoma unequal revenue shares — and they still left

Very possible (likely?) USC and UCLA would've eventually responded the same way

 

[Cougsocal]

Chuns job is to manage the AD (hiring and overseeing staff and coaches) and funding of the AD (schmoozing big donors, etc). Chuns job is not to represent WSU in conference realignment. Where we are at has nothing to do w Chun. He’s got as much to do w it as Dickert, we’d be on the same spot regardless of if every pac 12 member had the 12 best ADs on the planet.

This is on the commissioners and presidents/admins who hired and retained them for FAR too long.

Written like a person who has never worked a minute in college athletics, unlike some of us who have. Admittedly an AD is not the "final say" on conference realignment, that is up to the president and regents, but he is the primary ground work guy, the guy that assesses interest, garner votes and hammers out the details. The president and the regents don't have necessary knowledge of athletic operations to understand the intricacies involved, such as budgets, travel costs/scheduling/front money etc..

The commissioner has no say with whom a school chooses to align. Otherwise George would have vetoed UCLA, USC and Colorado decision to leave.

What Chun should have done is let Schulz know that he intended to send out feelers to the Big 12 office, and to fellow potential sympathetic ADs in the Big 12, the second he suspected negotiations on the TV deal might be an issue. UCLA and USC bolted a year ago so it has been a known problem for some time. The first in the door has the best chance for success. Once viability is established more formal talks can then proceed.

Frankly. I don't whether Chun could have pulled it off even if he had been the first to knock on the Big 12's door, we are a small market school. That said, the first inkling anyone had that we were putting ourselves forward as a realignment candidate was a week or so ago. Chun may have done this much earlier, and simply got rebuffed, I hope so because that was the prudent thing to do. But the way it looks now we were simply too little too late.

 

[Wazzubrooz]

Official statement

You suck!

 

[Cougsocal]

Remember what Martin Stadium looked like before the renovation. There was a double-wide on top that was a "press box" Was it too much? You can argue yes, but something had to be done and upgraded. Sterk played accountant; Dickson didn't do jack. Now we're almost back to the early 90s with no major renovations. Do you think Leach comes if there's a double-wide press box and no FOB coming in the pipe?

No way in my mind does Floyd let the events of today happen, or even get there. Meanwhile Schulz has watched a university go ranked 140 (in 2018) to 212 (in 2023) and futzed around as "CEO" of the conference leadership. It's not like Chun has absolutely crushed it either. Plenty of blame to go around.

Floyd/Moos actually did something. They can take some of the blame, but there's plenty of other presidents and ADs that dropped the ball, including the two at the helm now.

Have you ever read the SI article titled "Why won't anyone hire Mike Leach." Ours was a marriage made in heaven. The blackballed coach signs with the school that no coach in his right minded would sign with. So yes Leach was coming regardless. Also, if you look at the time line, Leach signed about a year before the FOB ever got the go ahead. He became coach in 11/2011 and the FOB was approved in 11/2012. We all would have loved something really worthwhile to have come from the 132 million investment, but the next level jump never materialized, even the claim that "at least it got us Mike Leach" doesn't hold water.

Had we spent a more WSU budget friendly 40 million, focusing of functionality, maybe expanding seating instead of decreasing it, for example, which has always been our our DNA, we wouldn't be 100 million in debt, and facing a potential 6 fold decrease in TV revenues this time next year, assuming MWC membership.

Moos and Floyd I'm certain had the best of intentions, but holy cow they we incompetent boobs to buy into the concept "if we build it, it will start raining money and pay for itself."

 

[BiggsCoug]

I thought Mr. Moos made a huge impact at WSU, but it seems like some CougZoners don't think much of him because they thought he spent too much money

They’re dumb.

 

[95coug]

Have you ever read the SI article titled "Why won't anyone hire Mike Leach." Ours was a marriage made in heaven. The blackballed coach signs with the school that no coach in his right minded would sign with. So yes Leach was coming regardless. Also, if you look at the time line, Leach signed about a year before the FOB ever got the go ahead. He became coach in 11/2011 and the FOB was approved in 11/2012. We all would have loved something really worthwhile to have come from the 132 million investment, but the next level jump never materialized, even the claim that "at least it got us Mike Leach" doesn't hold water.

Had we spent a more WSU budget friendly 40 million, focusing of functionality, maybe expanding seating instead of decreasing it, for example, which has always been our our DNA, we wouldn't be 100 million in debt, and facing a potential 6 fold decrease in TV revenues this time next year, assuming MWC membership.

Moos and Floyd I'm certain had the best of intentions, but holy cow they we incompetent boobs to buy into the concept "if we build it, it will start raining money and pay for itself."

Their biggest mistake was taking Larry Scott’s estimates as reality and proceeding with money they didn’t have. But, in the CFB arms race, they were steps that had to be taken. If they hadn’t, we’d be bound for Big sky this afternoon. There wouldn’t be the slightest chance of a late invite to another conference.

 

[Cougsocal]

I thought Mr. Moos made a huge impact at WSU, but it seems like some CougZoners don't think much of him because they thought he spent too much money

Moos had a huge impact. He got WSU to borrow 132 million for football upgrades, convincing it that the upgrades would pay for themselves with increased revenues. The increased revenues never materialized. Leaving athletics with a huge debt load, a shoe string budget, a hiring freeze, and now in 12 months facing a drop in TV revenue from 24 million to 4 million assuming MWC membership. What Bill did is leave a financial mess the like of which few athletic departments have ever faced.

 

[CougSinceBirth]

Have you ever read the SI article titled "Why won't anyone hire Mike Leach." Ours was a marriage made in heaven. The blackballed coach signs with the school that no coach in his right minded would sign with. So yes Leach was coming regardless. Also, if you look at the time line, Leach signed about a year before the FOB ever got the go ahead. He became coach in 11/2011 and the FOB was approved in 11/2012. We all would have loved something really worthwhile to have come from the 132 million investment, but the next level jump never materialized, even the claim that "at least it got us Mike Leach" doesn't hold water.

Had we spent a more WSU budget friendly 40 million, focusing of functionality, maybe expanding seating instead of decreasing it, for example, which has always been our our DNA, we wouldn't be 100 million in debt, and facing a potential 6 fold decrease in TV revenues this time next year, assuming MWC membership.

Moos and Floyd I'm certain had the best of intentions, but holy cow they we incompetent boobs to buy into the concept "if we build it, it will start raining money and pay for itself."

If you don't think those conversations were happening while negotiating, you're kidding yourself.

How long has Chun been here? 2017? Isn't he supposed to be the dynamic fundraiser? Yeah, oh wait, he's been in Pullman 6+ years and done jack.

 

[CameronWV]

This guy said Arizona and CU applied to the Big 12 last July. He's thrown every possible scenario out there and some have stuck. I seriously doubt a guy in Morgantown has connections at most institutions on the western US. I am also praying he's right lol.

He’s totally FOS and we don’t claim him.

 

[425cougfan]

Moos had a huge impact. He got WSU to borrow 132 million for football upgrades, convincing it that the upgrades would pay for themselves with increased revenues. The increased revenues never materialized. Leaving athletics with a huge debt load, a shoe string budget, a hiring freeze, and now in 12 months facing a drop in TV revenue from 24 million to 4 million assuming MWC membership. What Bill did is leave a financial mess the like of which few athletic departments have ever faced.

You're 100% right about the facts, but WSU had to make facility improvements. Having the FOB be $20m cheaper wouldn't have materially changed anything. Most of the high costs owed to Pullman's location (there's that issue again) and having to work with the constrained space by Rogers. The suites and loge boxes sold well and brought in a lot of money.

Yes, Bill left WSU with a shitload of debt, and that now is painful, but unless he was able and willing to listen to guys like me and see Larry was full of shit, which nobody seemed able or willing to do at the time -- and even the relatively few who knew Larry was completely wrong by eschewing a network partner did not, at least in 2011 or 2012, think Larry would screw things up as badly as he wound up doing -- it wasn't unreasonable to get WSU some decent facilities and to raise the coaching staff budget to allow hiring Leach in light of the media deal at the time and Larry's promised revenues. Moos also played a role in keeping the split even, although that role might have been exaggerated.

Moos wasn't the problem. Larry Scott and Pullman were.

 

[PeteTheChop]

Moos wasn't the problem. Larry Scott and Pullman were.

… and Pullman might have been much less of an issue if not for all of Larry’s missteps

That guy seems crooked in hindsight

 

[COUGinNCW]

Schultz and Crow at ASU are the main reasons we had LARRY SCOTT for so long. Pac 12 network can be placed on Schultz' sweater vest shoulders. He loved the equal revenue concept. It ran off USC and UCLA and started this entire debacle. Schultz and Chun both need to go.

Don’t you remember it was Moos who continuously bragged about getting the equal revenue share for conference members? I think he was half full of shyt but no one seemed to think it was a bad idea at the time.

 

[Cougsocal]

Their biggest mistake was taking Larry Scott’s estimates as reality and proceeding with money they didn’t have. But, in the CFB arms race, they were steps that had to be taken. If they hadn’t, we’d be bound for Big sky this afternoon. There wouldn’t be the slightest chance of a late invite to another conference.

In that arms race, did it accomplish anything? We out spent everyone but Cal, and we continued to have bottom wrung recruiting. Cal continued to struggle. Now imagine the alternative. Modest upgrades, kinda like UCLA and USC, with emphasis on liquidity to meet the demands of coaching payrolls. Leach with a war chest to help fight off raiders for assistants. We overspent spent on facilities and then hamstrung Leach's ability to retain staff with the lowest payroll budget in the conference.

Think about it.

Administrators love building monuments to themselves, but hate paying for coaching even though coaching is far more important to success.