I have to wonder, will Leach survive this?

[CougEd]

You want Leach fired so bad you can taste it.

Leach never should have spoke at that Trump event, the unhinged left coast socialists have never forgiven him. Land of fruit and nuts.

Prepare for more pain.

Not sure why I am unhinged? First I didn't want Leach to leave for reasons you couldn't imagine. There are reasons you can imagine I didn't want him to leave and it was that Leach could probably keep us from hitting rock bottom again.

But after he did leave, it was clear Mike either wanted or needed a fresh start. AS magical as 2018 was, 2019 was a 180.

Now as to introducing Trump, it is a bad idea because you piss off 50% of the people. What would your feelings have been if he introduced Hillary?

I think it is a bad idea for a head coach who is the front man for raising funds to come out publicly. he and they are just asking for headaches they don't need.

Do I want him to win at MSU....yep. But that doesn't mean I can't give a realistic view of the state of affairs in Starkville. It is pretty clear the SEC has watched the tapes of how to stop his air raid. And it looks especially ugly when the "USC's" of the conference not only watch how to stop it, but they have the players to execute it, and then do execute it.

Leach introducing Trump is a one day event. It certainly doesn't overshadow the things he did well in Pullman. But keep preaching the conspiracy idea.

 

[CougPatrol]

I have doubts about Leach's offense succeeding against the power teams of the SEC, but I'm not writing him off yet either. His offense can be frustrating to watch due to his stubbornness, but lost in all of that is his expertise at overall program construction and management.

He will get MSU's offensive line turned around. He will recruit WRs, RBs, and QBs who will torment the programs who can't execute the drop-8 defense, and as we know, half the league can't figure it out. He will build a rock solid strength and conditioning program. He will hold players and coaches to a high conduct and academic standard.

Again, I'm not betting that he'll eclipse Bama, Auburn, LSU (this year doesn't count), Florida, or Georgia, but I'm also not going to predict that Arkansas, Ole Miss, Kentucky, Vandy, Tennessee, South Carolina, Mizzou, or even Texas A&M will boat race him every season.

 

[BleedCrimsonandGray]

I have doubts about Leach's offense succeeding against the power teams of the SEC, but I'm not writing him off yet either. His offense can be frustrating to watch due to his stubbornness, but lost in all of that is his expertise at overall program construction and management.

He will get MSU's offensive line turned around. He will recruit WRs, RBs, and QBs who will torment the programs who can't execute the drop-8 defense, and as we know, half the league can't figure it out. He will build a rock solid strength and conditioning program. He will hold players and coaches to a high conduct and academic standard.

Again, I'm not betting that he'll eclipse Bama, Auburn, LSU (this year doesn't count), Florida, or Georgia, but I'm also not going to predict that Arkansas, Ole Miss, Kentucky, Vandy, Tennessee, South Carolina, Mizzou, or even Texas A&M will boat race him every season.

Its all about match ups.

If teams come out and run base defense, he'll smoke them; the offense is made to do just that. Doesn't matter if its Bama or not. However, if they come out and drop 8 then he'll be screwed simply because he refuses to hand the ball off enough to make the defense adjust. The only thing that could save him is a qb who says screw it and either a) audibles every down to a run or b) tucks it and runs himself.

Our successful AR teams were really smoke and mirrors, simply because other teams refused to defend us effectively, letting us score and putting their offense on their heels, giving our (often times) mediocre defense a much needed edge. Personnel wise we weren't better than most of the teams we faced, but we beat them with scheme.

 

[Flatlandcoug]

Its all about match ups.

If teams come out and run base defense, he'll smoke them; the offense is made to do just that. Doesn't matter if its Bama or not. However, if they come out and drop 8 then he'll be screwed simply because he refuses to hand the ball off enough to make the defense adjust. The only thing that could save him is a qb who says screw it and either a) audibles every down to a run or b) tucks it and runs himself.

Our successful AR teams were really smoke and mirrors, simply because other teams refused to defend us effectively, letting us score and putting their offense on their heels, giving our (often times) mediocre defense a much needed edge. Personnel wise we weren't better than most of the teams we faced, but we beat them with scheme.

I don't think it's going to be as simple as rush 3 and drop 8 to win against the Air Raid once Leach gets it running effectively at Mississippi State. UW got away with it because their D-Line was good enough to get pressure on the QB while only rushing 3 or 4 guys. MSU's OL is struggling to protect Costello right now and that's what killing them. When they get time, the Air Raid can still pick you apart. The problem for MSU is that LSU, Georgia, Bama, Auburn and 'Bama are all going to have the d-line talent that they need to get pressure without rushing extra dudes. I'll be surprised to see MSU finish with more than 9 wins because of that (and Leach's tendency to have a clunker game every year).

 

[CougPatrol]

Its all about match ups.

If teams come out and run base defense, he'll smoke them; the offense is made to do just that. Doesn't matter if its Bama or not. However, if they come out and drop 8 then he'll be screwed simply because he refuses to hand the ball off enough to make the defense adjust. The only thing that could save him is a qb who says screw it and either a) audibles every down to a run or b) tucks it and runs himself.

Our successful AR teams were really smoke and mirrors, simply because other teams refused to defend us effectively, letting us score and putting their offense on their heels, giving our (often times) mediocre defense a much needed edge. Personnel wise we weren't better than most of the teams we faced, but we beat them with scheme.

I don't think I can agree that our success was smoke and mirrors. As has been the case with most WSU teams historically, certain programs can match up with even our best teams, minus 1997. That was the case with our best teams under Leach, but in our conference, there were only 3-4 programs who had the talent to line up with our offense. We had better QB talent than most teams, better offensive lines vs. their defensive lines, and their back-7 couldn't handle our passing schemes. Oregon State, Stanford, UCLA, Colorado, the AZ schools, Oregon tried dropping 8, but failed miserably. So yes, we beat them with scheme, but that's also attributable to coaching and recruiting. They built their rosters a certain way, and we took advantage of that. I suspect Leach will do the same thing at Mississippi State. Can the bottom 7-8 programs of the SEC field both the back-7, DL, AND the offenses to keep up with MSU? Time will tell.

 

[CougPatrol]

I don't think it's going to be as simple as rush 3 and drop 8 to win against the Air Raid once Leach gets it running effectively at Mississippi State. UW got away with it because their D-Line was good enough to get pressure on the QB while only rushing 3 or 4 guys. MSU's OL is struggling to protect Costello right now and that's what killing them. When they get time, the Air Raid can still pick you apart. The problem for MSU is that LSU, Georgia, Bama, Auburn and 'Bama are all going to have the d-line talent that they need to get pressure without rushing extra dudes. I'll be surprised to see MSU finish with more than 9 wins because of that (and Leach's tendency to have a clunker game every year).

Yup, I just posted essentially the same thing before I read your message. Leach himself joked about how if it was as simple as dropping 8 to stop him, he would have never won a game.

Will Kentucky, Ole Miss, Arkansas, South Carolina, Vandy, Mizzou, A&M be able to drop-8, pressure the QB with 3, and score 28+ against Leach consistently? Maybe, but that's not a given.

 

[dgibbons]

Not sure why I am unhinged? First I didn't want Leach to leave for reasons you couldn't imagine. There are reasons you can imagine I didn't want him to leave and it was that Leach could probably keep us from hitting rock bottom again.

But after he did leave, it was clear Mike either wanted or needed a fresh start. AS magical as 2018 was, 2019 was a 180.

Now as to introducing Trump, it is a bad idea because you piss off 50% of the people. What would your feelings have been if he introduced Hillary?

I think it is a bad idea for a head coach who is the front man for raising funds to come out publicly. he and they are just asking for headaches they don't need.

Do I want him to win at MSU....yep. But that doesn't mean I can't give a realistic view of the state of affairs in Starkville. It is pretty clear the SEC has watched the tapes of how to stop his air raid. And it looks especially ugly when the "USC's" of the conference not only watch how to stop it, but they have the players to execute it, and then do execute it.

Leach introducing Trump is a one day event. It certainly doesn't overshadow the things he did well in Pullman. But keep preaching the conspiracy idea.

You're the same guy that said Leach should have left after the 2017 season. Let's not start from the presumption that you were ever hinged, and those became unhinged.

 

[CougEd]

You're the same guy that said Leach should have left after the 2017 season. Let's not start from the presumption that you were ever hinged, and those became unhinged.

I know the statement has some nuance....1) I said I wish he didn't move on for reasons you would never understand. That is pretty simple. 2) I said KNOWING that he moved on, I wish he left in 2017 for the health of our program and the betterment for Mike Leach. The second statement is done with hindsight. You get the difference, right?

 

[dgibbons]

I know the statement has some nuance....1) I said I wish he didn't move on for reasons you would never understand. That is pretty simple. 2) I said KNOWING that he moved on, I wish he left in 2017 for the health of our program and the betterment for Mike Leach. The second statement is done with hindsight. You get the difference, right?

As previously stated, let's not start from the presumption that you were ever hinged, and thus capable of becoming unhinged.

 

[doggiedoo]

I understand some playful snickering at Leach’s expense, but man, there are a lot of over the top, ungrateful posts being thrown around.

At worst, Leach is the 2nd greatest WSU head football coach in modern history. His cleansing of the Wulff disaster can never be understated.

Yes, he’s inflexible. No, we don’t “owe him” our allegiance; but good grief, pump the brakes on the petty wishing him the absolute worst posts. It’s a terribly insecure look.

Here’s 3 that we’re better: Jackie Sherrill, Mike Price and Dennis Erickson.

 

[CougPatrol]

Here’s 3 that we’re better: Jackie Sherrill, Mike Price and Dennis Erickson.

Jackie Sherrill and Dennis Erickson combined for 3 seasons in Pullman. I’ll assume you know this and that you’re just being silly now.

 

[doggiedoo]

Jackie Sherrill and Dennis Erickson combined for 3 seasons in Pullman. I’ll assume you know this and that you’re just being silly now.

If you want to move the goal posts so be it.

 

[FnuLnu]

If you want to move the goal posts so be it.

If they are better coaches than Leach....

Jackie Sherrill is younger than Joe Biden
Dennis Erickson and Mike Price are both younger than Tony LaRussa (new Chicago White Sox manager)

If Rolo goes 0-7 or gets cancelled for misgendering somebody in a tweet, would any of these three (Sherrill, Price, Erickson) be viable candidates as the next WSU coach?

 

[425cougfan]

If they are better coaches than Leach....

Jackie Sherrill is younger than Joe Biden
Dennis Erickson and Mike Price are both younger than Tony LaRussa (new Chicago White Sox manager)

If Rolo goes 0-7 or gets cancelled for misgendering somebody in a tweet, would any of these three (Sherrill, Price, Erickson) be viable candidates as the next WSU coach?

If the task is getting swing state voters to see less contrast with an incumbent orange-colored individual, and/or to not have characteristics associated with being extreme politically, that might work. If hiring a football coach to win football games at WSU, probably not.

 

[CougPatrol]

If you want to move the goal posts so be it.

Move the goalposts? I said Leach was, at worst, the 2nd best coach in WSU history. Jackie Sherrill went 3-8 in his one season at WSU, and Dennis Erickson went 12-10-1 in two seasons at WSU, including an Aloha Bowl victory.

Leach's resume at WSU shines far brighter than either one of those short timers. You know that, too.

 

[doggiedoo]

Move the goalposts? I said Leach was, at worst, the 2nd best coach in WSU history. Jackie Sherrill went 3-8 in his one season at WSU, and Dennis Erickson went 12-10-1 in two seasons at WSU, including an Aloha Bowl victory.

Leach's resume at WSU shines far brighter than either one of those short timers. You know that, too.

Their overall bodies of work eclipse that of Leach. Outside of a WSU homer I highly doubt I’d get an argument.
And you might want to reconsider using the word “greatest” to describe a coach with winning percentage of 54% at WSU. Again, outside of a WSU or Tech homer you’re not going to find many people who would consider Leach a “great” coach.

 

[cr8zyncalif]

Let's recognize a few things.

First, Leach has a mediocre but experienced QB.

Second, his WR's are not very deep with the sort of guys he needs.

Third, this looks like the worst O line he has ever had. That might be the guys, it might be the coaching, or it might be some of both. Hard to imagine that the O line coach won't be fired at the end of the season.

Fourth, it is clear that SEC recruiting classes are over-rated, based on the O line and WR units, vs. their class ratings. That calls into question a lot of his roster, but the key will be a better O line and more decent WR targets next year, as well as a better QB.

Finally, we know that Leach will always be susceptible to defenses that look like they will fill the box but then drop 8. However, usually his better O line, WR depth and better QB help him to make it work. This year, he has none of that. Even if he did, the use of the run would still not happen.

Long story short, we are probably into his 3rd season before he can deliver a decent record. He will need every noncon cupcake next year to squeak 6 wins, but will probably manage that much. But how long will it take him to get into the 8-9 win range? That will determine whether he lasts at least 4 years, and certainly he has to be there in 5 or he is gone.

 

[COCoug]

The whole concept that winning a mid-tier bowl game as the basis for evaluating a coach is kind of interesting. Clearly some coaches view it as the biggest game of the year. However, a lot of coaches view it as a reward for the team and fans, a way to get 15 more days of practice, a chance to get some snaps for underclassman who will be starting the next season, and really not the biggest game of the season. I think you can argue that Leach was one of the second group. It was really hard to view Colorado State or Air Force as a super big deal after losing very consequential Apple Cups. So if that is the criteria for firing coaches at MSU, he may be in trouble (assuming at some point he gets to a bowl).