the wulff era returns
- Thread starter longtimecoug
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How many runs do you believe we had against OSU? Second, JDL didn't pull the ball out against USC. And third when he did run USC made him look like a slow Dan Doornik. USC closed in a hurry on ball carriers and punished them when they got there.
Looking at Bigg's post, since you hold the distinction you have the ability to pass the torch.
A meteor might strike the earth, so we might have nothing to worry about.
Have you again forgotten that college football rosters change every year?
Nice try. Biggs took the title last year. "The 2019 defense is good enough to win the conference."
Remember that you and sponge don't get to run together. It's a not a family competition.
Maybe...my math shows me 4 wins is more than 1 win (08). Might not have been fast enough, but probably shows how low we were after having so many missed evaluations on players late in Doba's reign. Heck it was 4 years before Leach had a winning season. Things take time, I would suspect take even longer for a D2 coach during a total rebuild.
My math shows me that Doba won 5 his last season, and Wulff never reached that lofty goal and went from 2 wins to 1 win to 2 wins.
Based on your own post, Leach never went down. Three wins his first season was the floor. Curious. Are you trying to retake the title from Biggs?
Well if you take over a 4 win program and win what, three, the program went down. Just like at MSU, not sure he is paid a lot of money to win less than his predecessor, that is why the previous guy got fired. And BTW, how many games did Leach win in 13 and then 14?
Kind of like Wulff taking over a five win program and winning two. But hey, why be consistent. It's confining and requires intellectual honesty.
97 and 02 teams would smoke the 2018 team. 2018 was still a very good team.
I said it in another thread, I said it feels like WSU will now have Mike Price-esque seasons with a lower ceiling. That's the vibe I just get. The university/program carries no national clout anymore. All Saturday it was "USC plays tomorrow at the Coliseum" and no mention of WSU (which after the 1Q, it was probably good they didn't mention WSU).
Prior to this season, the last 3 times I saw our defense play was vs. Oregon State, in the Apple Cup, and vs. Air Force. Does anyone need me to post specifics beyond that? I mean, I can add the UCLA game into the conversation if you want.
My point is that with COVID eliminating Spring and most of Fall camp, how much time have the coaches and players had to get on board with each other? Then you have the ridiculous amount of player attrition. Take this year for what it is. Apart from USC, every P12 team has a lot of question marks.
My point is that with COVID eliminating Spring and most of Fall camp, how much time have the coaches and players had to get on board with each other? Then you have the ridiculous amount of player attrition. Take this year for what it is. Apart from USC, every P12 team has a lot of question marks.
I’d add the drop by Travell that would have given us a first down and also that fumble by SC deep in our territory that we didn’t recover as two more first half “MO” plays that hurt us. That being said, good teams make those plays happen imo.
Reminds me of what they said about Kegel before he had a chance to start.
No...have you forgot in our illustrious history that when we entered a new season prior top Leach that when we lost our QB (especially three year starters) the next season was a losing year, and many ways a huge losing year. 08 was like 98. Very experienced QB gone from that five win team, only two DT's we had. Seem to remember with a Rose Bowl coach who was 10-1 in 97, didn't win a conference game the next year. If I am not mistaken, lost his dline and his QB, and the other DT was injured all of 98. So there is precedent for this decline to occur, especially when you have the fallout and bad class management that happened under Doba's watch.
Oh I agree....sort of. One was hired from the D ranks. One had a track record. One had two QB's to choose from that had experience. The other got one QB in three years that had a series against Auburn. One inherited three functional DT's with several years to build on, the other did not. But yes, other than that the situation was similar.
Ah, yes. The magical experienced QB that CougEd covets so. Of course you neglect that Wulff did jack squat to recruit the OL and left a steaming hole there.
This confirms that you don't understand that rosters change every year. Thanks for that.
It's worth noting (
) that, psychrometrically speaking, a fresh pile won't steam down to a pretty low ambient temperature, unless it is really dry outside. I thought I saw some steam in the first quarter...it was cool, but not that cold in SoCal...so I had to attribute it to the Santa Ana conditions (the RH was down pretty low). Since the steam pretty much quit rising by the end of the half, and the conditions got progressively colder and drier, I had to conclude that there were no more fresh piles. That at least was good news. Nothing new for our DB's to step in and slip.It is going to be important to limit the piles against Cal. If we see steam, it is a bad sign.
I don't "neglect" anything. Yeah I do get rosters change. I get for example Alabama turns over one five star kid for another. Clemson and Ohio State as well.
I also understand when a Rose Bowl coach loses his starting DT's, and his QB, at WSU that had been problematic. So when a D1 coach comes in of course I saw what I expected to see in 2008.
And for a guy who didn't recruit numbers at Oline, Leach sure used all that was on campus when he arrived into 2015.
And I believe they had some APR issues because of GPA etc in late 2000's which forced any coaches to be more selective how they spend their capital.
And what you fail to get, until Leach WSU almost always(yes Chad Davis is the exception) took a huge hit when they had to replace a qb. Knowing you are a stickler for detail, yes Matt Kegel was another.
I’m quite aware of what’s happened at WSU. The decline in QB play was apparent to even the most casual fan that tune in only while inebriated.
What your focus on the QB experience neglects is that when, in the annals of history (which means Price's tenure in the land of CougEd), a new QB starts somehow the OL and defense totally disintegrated too. For those that followed the program and were sober realized that is that Price would land a solid recruiting class about 1 out of 3 years. Then he'd get those guys into the starting lineup, lose a bunch of games, plug the gaps with JC guys, pray no one got hurt and go to a bowl game. Then rinse and repeat.
That's why depth was always razor thin. That's why Price would go from a bowl team to a three win season (or seasons), 4 wins or 5 wins, then back to a bowl. It was ten years into his tenure that he actually recruited solid classes consecutively which resulted in sustained success from 2001-2003.
But sure, just keep looking at one position and complaining that we don't have an "experienced QB" every season even though that would be impossible to accomplish.
Not neglecting it at all. I know you saw Lee Harrison and Corey Withrow, and even Ryan McShane as high profile recruit. The QB made the line. How many lineman off that team could have started for other teams in the conference?
I have news for you...depth still is razor thin. They have bodies...the thing about Leach is he was able to keep his starting five healthy.
And as wonderful as Leach was for WSU, at WSU he was still close to being a 500 coach. And maybe that simply is the job.
Why are we talking about the 1997 OL? McEndoo was drafted and Withrow spent nine years in the NFL. Black was gone. Four of the 5 Fab 5 were gone. The defense was gutted. But sure, it was the QB leaving that sent WSU to the bottom on the standings. Totally. That was definitely it.
Since it's all about the QB, why was it that last pieces Price needed to get into place for a bowl run were the OL and the defense?
totally agree, who can forget the multiple price classes that looked good on paper, only to fall apart by signing day when the majority of top recruits didn't qualify
Ed, just FYI- all you have to do is hit the reply button and perhaps the quote depending on your settings.
Please tell us about the defense and the OL in 1987, 1989, 1990, 1991, 1992, 1995, 1996, 1998, 1999 and 2000.
Predictably, you're moving the goalposts. I thought it was about experience too, rather than having an upperclassmen. I mean if the magic solution was just plugging in an upperclassmen Price really blew it by not recruiting a JC QB or transfer QB every year.
Sidenote- how many exceptions to this Iron Law are there? You've established Kegel, Chad Davis and the Leach era. What about Pattinson? What about Birnbaum? Edit to add- on the other side where was big season with Brink? He was about as experienced as a college QB could be.
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One, you are the cute one who comes up with a bogus iron laws. It is about probability.
Two, WSU has or had always been a developmental school. Leon was a 225 DE when he was in high school. Couldnt play as a freshman, and even if he could, more than likely would have way undersized. Leon got to play what turned out to be the last game of his soph year, and dominated. But he still was under 250. Still growing and getting ready for a full reg season. Lost the next yeart cause of grades. By 96 he was physically ready.
Take Leaf. He was physically ready as a freshman. His sophomore year they were 5-6. Two plays against USC and they are at least 6-5. With experience they learn how to win. Alabama, it is plug and play, they are mentally ready, they already know the difference between game winning plays and game losing plays. There is no greater evidence than USC in 96 and 97. All McKenzie had to do was realize the quickest way to the end zone was a straight line. He got cute and cut it back across the field. It probably cost him a winning TD. The next play our LG missed a block on Matt Kennelly and striped the ball from Leaf. Small difference between winning and losing.
They "learn" with experience (cause they don't have that in the program) how to win. It has come when the Coug QB's are typically juniors, third year in the program. The difference between 96 and 97 was McKenzie took it straight up field and McWashington put the free safety in the deck. Small stuff but the difference between winning and losing.
And what is it you want me to comment about Birnie and Pattison? If Bledsoe was around in 93 they would have have gone to a bowl, as would the 98 team despite the teams shortcomings.
"mean if the magic solution was just plugging in an upperclassmen Price really blew it by not recruiting a JC QB or transfer QB every year.". Nope, just how you read stuff.
You're saying the 1998 team was a bowl team if Bledsoe (or Leaf?) was QB?
The AC was the only Pac10 game they didn't lose by at least 10 pts (it was 9 pts).
It’s a lot easier to say that your nonsense about experienced QB is just nonsense.
WSU would have gone to a bowl in 93 had Pattinson stayed healthy. The defense was there. The offense was good enough for a decent QB to step in and win.
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